The Conversation ......?

[Kismetly]

I've been in a complicated "relationship" with a man in a "complicated" relationship for most of this year.

 

We met when we worked together in a very remote indigenous community. His story was that he was "separated" from "the mother of his children", but when he left the community, about every two weeks for the weekend, he stayed at the family home. At the time, it didn't bother me. We never discussed it and it wasn't something I really thought about. He said they hadn't had sex in 6 months.

 

I was content with the relationship as it was. He was a great friend first, we do similar work that we are both passionately committed to. And the big thing was I was leaving. I'd accepted a position in another country and I knew we only had about 3 months - so it wasn't going anywhere.

 

Since I left and have started my new job, we've spoken every day. I have regular "field breaks" back in my own city/country and to date we've met up on most breaks (no small feat given there's now about 3000km between us at any one time).

 

I've been pretty pragmatic about the potential for a future with this man - but unsurprisingly as the emotional attachment has increased I've grown more curious about his circumstances. In the past when he tried to talk about it, I'd shut it down. Recently, he admitted to me he felt jealous of the life I was living and the amount of men I had the opportunity to meet. For the first time ever I showed a little bit of vulnerability and shot back "hey - don't you go there, you've just spent the weekend at "home" - don't talk to me about jealousy." He responded, in a sad way, "yeah, this weekend we talked about selling the property and getting W and the kids a smaller place in town". (was he just saying that to chill me out - or was it the truth? who knows?)

 

I'm such an emotional cripple, I just said "that must have been tough" and changed the subject. I really wanted to ask a million questions "does that mean you will formally be separating?" "does that mean you are making a decision that will make you available?" you know the questions. But I didn't (I think because I'm scared of the answer).

 

I've been a pretty tough "other woman". As far as he's concerned, this arranegment suits me perfectly, I'm fond of him, but I've got lots of other options. He told me once he thought I was "cold". Of course it's all a big defence mechanism. I'm starting to really care for him, but I feel as though if I say that, I'm changing the rules mid stream and for me there's only two options then - either he breaths a sigh of relief, says I wondered how long it would take for you to fall in love with me, I'm working through a full separation from my wife, let's commit to each other and see where this goes OR he says I just can't publically separate from my partner now, there's too much family pressure, it's too hard on the kids.

 

I have absolutely no idea which response he would give me. I've been reading here long enough to know that it's probably going to be the latter - but following the philosophy of believe their actions, not their words his actions indicate to me that it's me he wants and to some extent he's waiting for me to give the word that I'd reciprocate.

 

But I'm fundamentally terrified of the concept that he wouldn't leave his marriage until he had a "sure thing" to go to. That's not healthy. But none of this is terribly healthy.

 

I'm on break at the moment, and he arrives in my city next Monday night. I'm thinking that I might finally open the subject.

 

"So, do you think there might ever be a time when you are available for a committed relationship with me?" - how do you think that would go?

 

Thing is - the terrifying thing is - that once i have that conversation, and his response is that he's not going to be available - I have to be prepared to make a decision about if I'm prepared to continue in this way - and of course the answer is that's not really going to be acceptable. I don't know if I'm ready to lose him from my life.

[fooled once]

I've been in a complicated "relationship" with a man in a "complicated" relationship for most of this year.

 

We met when we worked together in a very remote indigenous community. His story was that he was "separated" from "the mother of his children", but when he left the community, about every two weeks for the weekend, he stayed at the family home. At the time, it didn't bother me. We never discussed it and it wasn't something I really thought about. He said they hadn't had sex in 6 months.

 

I was content with the relationship as it was. He was a great friend first, we do similar work that we are both passionately committed to. And the big thing was I was leaving. I'd accepted a position in another country and I knew we only had about 3 months - so it wasn't going anywhere.

 

Since I left and have started my new job, we've spoken every day. I have regular "field breaks" back in my own city/country and to date we've met up on most breaks (no small feat given there's now about 3000km between us at any one time).

 

I've been pretty pragmatic about the potential for a future with this man - but unsurprisingly as the emotional attachment has increased I've grown more curious about his circumstances. In the past when he tried to talk about it, I'd shut it down. Recently, he admitted to me he felt jealous of the life I was living and the amount of men I had the opportunity to meet. For the first time ever I showed a little bit of vulnerability and shot back "hey - don't you go there, you've just spent the weekend at "home" - don't talk to me about jealousy." He responded, in a sad way, "yeah, this weekend we talked about selling the property and getting W and the kids a smaller place in town". (was he just saying that to chill me out - or was it the truth? who knows?)

 

I'm such an emotional cripple, I just said "that must have been tough" and changed the subject. I really wanted to ask a million questions "does that mean you will formally be separating?" "does that mean you are making a decision that will make you available?" you know the questions. But I didn't (I think because I'm scared of the answer).

 

I've been a pretty tough "other woman". As far as he's concerned, this arranegment suits me perfectly, I'm fond of him, but I've got lots of other options. He told me once he thought I was "cold". Of course it's all a big defence mechanism. I'm starting to really care for him, but I feel as though if I say that, I'm changing the rules mid stream and for me there's only two options then - either he breaths a sigh of relief, says I wondered how long it would take for you to fall in love with me, I'm working through a full separation from my wife, let's commit to each other and see where this goes OR he says I just can't publically separate from my partner now, there's too much family pressure, it's too hard on the kids.

 

I have absolutely no idea which response he would give me. I've been reading here long enough to know that it's probably going to be the latter - but following the philosophy of believe their actions, not their words his actions indicate to me that it's me he wants and to some extent he's waiting for me to give the word that I'd reciprocate.

 

But I'm fundamentally terrified of the concept that he wouldn't leave his marriage until he had a "sure thing" to go to. That's not healthy. But none of this is terribly healthy.

 

I'm on break at the moment, and he arrives in my city next Monday night. I'm thinking that I might finally open the subject.

 

"So, do you think there might ever be a time when you are available for a committed relationship with me?" - how do you think that would go?

 

Thing is - the terrifying thing is - that once i have that conversation, and his response is that he's not going to be available - I have to be prepared to make a decision about if I'm prepared to continue in this way - and of course the answer is that's not really going to be acceptable. I don't know if I'm ready to lose him from my life.

 

Regarding what I bolded, I took that to mean that he was moving his wife and kids closer to him; not that he was planning to leave.

 

Good luck.

[BB07]

Kismetly.......I wonder if this man is lying to you about his separated status and of course I don't know that he is, but it sounds off. Anyway you cut it, it does not sound like a simple situation. It also seems from what you describe that it would be quite easy for him to hide the truth from you and you are concerned about that?

 

What I'm having a hard time understanding about your post is that you've been with this man for almost a year but you've held off discussing your feelings for each other and avoided discussions about his real life out of fear about not getting the answers you want, so why is that? Are you really that serious about a man whom you seem to not know a lot about?

 

I'm not sure what you are looking for advice about or maybe you just need to get it out there in an attempt to try to make sense of it yourself. I get that you feel in limbo but yet you are afraid to ask the questions that you need to, but you know that you are gonna have to do it sooner or later.

 

As you know from reading here most of the situations do not turn out well and they bring a lot of pain to yourself and others.

[Kismetly]

Thanks for your replies.

 

Fooledagain, the inference was that he was moving the family into the major town, closer to his in-laws, further away from him. He said some other stuff about it formalising the separation ... but you're right - maybe that's what I wanted to hear.

 

BB07, first of all, I'm a fan. At the time I started reading here, you had just met your x's wife. You dealt with whole amazing situation in the most impressively dignified way. I read along and was amazed by your insight, grace and decisiveness. You've got it together even while you are experiencing what must be a very painful period of your life. I really respect that.

 

What am I wanting advice on? What's a smart girl like me doing in a situation like this? Does he love me? Is he telling the truth? Am I being authentic to myself by telling myself that a casual, long distance relationship is enough for me? Is it better than nothing? If he is or will be available, do I want him as a serious partner? ... and is it supposed to be this COMPLICATED??

 

I'm asking a whole heap of questions that I know noone here can answer ... but you never know, some Angel sent by God might assume human typing skills and send me a message!!!

 

I guess you're right, I think (and have always thought) he's been less than honest about his "separated" status. I never pressed it because I didn't think it would last this long. I'm a 40 year old, divorced, professional who works in the world's most remote places for long stretches at a time. I'm not prime relationship material myself. And until now, I haven't really wanted a relationship.

 

I think he is having an affair. I think his relationship is probably sex-starved, I think he's going though a midlife crisis, I think they've been having trouble for quite some time, but they are part of a small community and it would be difficult and embarrassing for him - I know the community and I know that is the case. I think that his move to the place he works now was a "separation" of sorts, but probably more in his head than hers. I think he would like to leave, but he's overwhelmed by his community and cultural obligations and he doesn't really believe it's a choice, but he likes the idea and perhaps in his most farfetched fantasies does indulge in thoughts of chucking it all in and taking what I think would be the easier option of living with me. I think he fed me the "separated" line because I wouldn't have slept with him if he admitted he was in a committed relationship. I've always thought that, but I didn't care to call him on it, because it didn't really matter if it was just a fling.

 

Of course I don't KNOW any of that. If I believed every word he said - they live separated in their home when he's there (2 days out of 14 at most), but they haven't told the kids or their families.

 

On the issue of why we haven't talked about feelings .... that's more on me than him. I shut it down whenever it starts. Why? I don't know. There's so much else to talk about.

 

I guess what I'm really doing here is trying to make sense of this in my own head - because I'm really confused. You're right, I don't have a clue if he's told me the truth and the cynic in me suspects he hasn't, the woman whose become emotionally attached to him wonders if it's time to call him out and make it or break it ... so to speak.

Edited October 15, 2010 by Kismetly
I can't spell ....

[unspokenwords]

Thanks for your replies.

 

 

What am I wanting advice on? What's a smart girl like me doing in a situation like this? Does he love me? Is he telling the truth? Am I being authentic to myself by telling myself that a casual, long distance relationship is enough for me? Is it better than nothing? If he is or will be available, do I want him as a serious partner? ... and is it supposed to be this COMPLICATED??

 

I'm asking a whole heap of questions that I know noone here can answer ... but you never know, some Angel sent by God might assume human typing skills and send me a message!!!

 

 

The terrible thing about not being able to ask the questions is that you are never going to hear the answers. I understand how scared you feel about shaking things up when your head is all messed up.

 

All you can do in my experience is keep asking yourself the questions you CAN answer over and over again - in the end it will be clearer to you. It might take a long long time.

 

And believe you aren't the only smart girl to get yourself into this sort of situation. There are plenty of us smart girls out there and we understand what you are going through.

[BB07]

Thanks for your replies.

 

BB07, first of all, I'm a fan. At the time I started reading here, you had just met your x's wife. You dealt with whole amazing situation in the most impressively dignified way. I read along and was amazed by your insight, grace and decisiveness. You've got it together even while you are experiencing what must be a very painful period of your life. I really respect that.

 

:o Well thanks, I'm hanging in and it finally is getting easier, 3+ months out. I think I really turned a corner a couple of weeks ago.

 

What am I wanting advice on? What's a smart girl like me doing in a situation like this? Does he love me? Is he telling the truth? Am I being authentic to myself by telling myself that a casual, long distance relationship is enough for me? Is it better than nothing? If he is or will be available, do I want him as a serious partner? ... and is it supposed to be this COMPLICATED??

 

I'm asking a whole heap of questions that I know noone here can answer ... but you never know, some Angel sent by God might assume human typing skills and send me a message!!!

 

I guess you're right, I think (and have always thought) he's been less than honest about his "separated" status. I never pressed it because I didn't think it would last this long. I'm a 40 year old, divorced, professional who works in the world's most remote places for long stretches at a time. I'm not prime relationship material myself. And until now, I haven't really wanted a relationship.

 

I think you should trust your gut. When I think back on my situation, I know that there were times that I should have listened to my intuition because it was telling me he was a liar. I almost hate to admit how foolish I was, but if it helps you then so be it. There were times he would be talking to me and I noticed that he wouldn't look me in the eye, (clear signs that someone is lying, right?) so why did I deny that sign, convince myself that it didn't apply to him.

 

 

I think he is having an affair. I think his relationship is probably sex-starved, I think he's going though a midlife crisis, I think they've been having trouble for quite some time, but they are part of a small community and it would be difficult and embarrassing for him - I know the community and I know that is the case. I think that his move to the place he works now was a "separation" of sorts, but probably more in his head than hers. I think he would like to leave, but he's overwhelmed by his community and cultural obligations and he doesn't really believe it's a choice, but he likes the idea and perhaps in his most farfetched fantasies does indulge in thoughts of chucking it all in and taking what I think would be the easier option of living with me. I think he fed me the "separated" line because I wouldn't have slept with him if he admitted he was in a committed relationship. I've always thought that, but I didn't care to call him on it, because it didn't really matter if it was just a fling.

 

Of course I don't KNOW any of that. If I believed every word he said - they live separated in their home when he's there (2 days out of 14 at most), but they haven't told the kids or their families.

 

I tend to think that you have a good handle on where he is coming from as you wrote above and you know that it's probably not likely to have a good outcome for you. Again it's about trusting your intuition and trusting yourself.

 

On the issue of why we haven't talked about feelings .... that's more on me than him. I shut it down whenever it starts. Why? I don't know. There's so much else to talk about.

 

I guess what I'm really doing here is trying to make sense of this in my own head - because I'm really confused. You're right, I don't have a clue if he's told me the truth and the cynic in me suspects he hasn't, the woman whose become emotionally attached to him wonders if it's time to call him out and make it or break it ... so to speak.

 

I think you are scared.........scared of knowing the truth because you will know he lies and scared that it's gonna hurt more because reality hits harder. The way things have been for you two so far, it's seems to have a lot of fantasy involved and a dreamlike status and hey it sounds very romantic.

I feel like I've done a lousy job of conveying my thoughts here, but maybe there is some little piece of it that's useful. I guess the most important thing I can say is listen to your gut.......and then decide how to proceed from there.

[Kismetly]

Thanks for your replies.

 

And believe you aren't the only smart girl to get yourself into this sort of situation. There are plenty of us smart girls out there and we understand what you are going through.

 

Unspokenwords, it is actually ridiculously comforting to read the stories here, and know that there are lots of women, just like me, suffering through this difficult stuff and taking the opportunity to use the time to grow into stronger, wiser women. I aspire to all of you.

 

The terrible thing about not being able to ask the questions is that you are never going to hear the answers. I understand how scared you feel about shaking things up when your head is all messed up.

 

It's a corker isn't it? I can ask people living in ancient cultures to comply with imposed leases on their land or tell Chief's their sacred land is going to be cleared for housing (...looking hard for the Community Bulletin Board where I can deal anonymously in cyber space with that angst!!!) but I don't want to have an honest conversation with the man I've been sharing a big part of my life with for 8 or 9 months. What's wrong with me?

 

I think you are scared.........scared of knowing the truth because you will know he lies and scared that it's gonna hurt more because reality hits harder. The way things have been for you two so far, it's seems to have a lot of fantasy involved and a dreamlike status and hey it sounds very romantic.

 

Yep. Because the alternative is to just keep on as we've been and frankly it's been VER good. It could continue to be good for quite some time I suspect. I just worry that it's not going to be enough for me ... and the longer it goes on, the harder it's going to be to stop. And the liturature also tells me that it's probably so good because it is so much fantasy. It's not real life. Maybe I wouldn't like real life with him?