Friends? Sex? How far?

[auntieemm]

I am MW, he is MM.

 

We have been friends for a long time. In fact, we have spent many meals together with our spouses. Over the years we have had a very open relationship. We talk about many things. We both have very stressful jobs and often rant about our jobs, clients etc. We also talk about our desires and goals as well as common interests. Never discuss any particulars about our marriages though.

 

Recently, we were in a situation where the two of us were stuck in a storm together and could not leave. We rode it out for hours, talking about everything under the sun. It was hot and there was no furniture to sit on(dont ask) so we were sitting and laying on the floor, he with his shirt off and me with my button shirt off but an undershirt and sleveless shirt still on. Both of us had terrible headaches and ended up giving each other neck rubs and shoulder massage. It was wonderful.

 

Until this point, we have never made any physical contact other than a brief formal handshake.

 

Without many words, it was expressed between us that we had the same reaction to the interaction. We both liked it very much! In fact, at one point as I rubbed his shoulders, I had an overwhelming desire to embrace him. (but did not) I admit, I liked the feel of his skin.

 

The funny thing is that I cant stop thinking about it. He texted me later that evening thanking for the great shoulder massage.

 

I am the type of person who is uninhibited with friends and love close intimate relationships among my friends. My friends and I have done many things together that many people who are friends probably dont do. (tatoo each other, wax each other-wherever, total body massage, skinny dip, birthing together and etc)

 

I "feel" something a little more. While I may be into a lot of things with friends, sex is not one of them (unfortunately, sigh)

 

I never had a spark like this before ..... Advice?

 

Emm

[TaraMaiden]

Please, please don't do the idiotic thing and follow through with a full-blown sexual affair.

Please, please consider the collateral damage to his wife, your husband and everyone involved (that might include kids).

if there's a spark with this guy, it flashes in replacement of something glaringly obviously missing in your marriage.

Either discuss fixing that gap with your husband (your desire for this guy need not be even alluded to) or divorce.

But don't do the stupid, mindless, thoughtless and totally selfish thing of screwing around (possibly) when your world could collapse around you as a result.

[foreal]

I am MW, he is MM.

 

We have been friends for a long time. In fact, we have spent many meals together with our spouses. Over the years we have had a very open relationship. We talk about many things. We both have very stressful jobs and often rant about our jobs, clients etc. We also talk about our desires and goals as well as common interests. Never discuss any particulars about our marriages though.

 

Recently, we were in a situation where the two of us were stuck in a storm together and could not leave. We rode it out for hours, talking about everything under the sun. It was hot and there was no furniture to sit on(dont ask) so we were sitting and laying on the floor, he with his shirt off and me with my button shirt off but an undershirt and sleveless shirt still on. Both of us had terrible headaches and ended up giving each other neck rubs and shoulder massage. It was wonderful.

 

Until this point, we have never made any physical contact other than a brief formal handshake.

 

Without many words, it was expressed between us that we had the same reaction to the interaction. We both liked it very much! In fact, at one point as I rubbed his shoulders, I had an overwhelming desire to embrace him. (but did not) I admit, I liked the feel of his skin.

 

The funny thing is that I cant stop thinking about it. He texted me later that evening thanking for the great shoulder massage.

 

I am the type of person who is uninhibited with friends and love close intimate relationships among my friends. My friends and I have done many things together that many people who are friends probably dont do. (tatoo each other, wax each other-wherever, total body massage, skinny dip, birthing together and etc)

 

I "feel" something a little more. While I may be into a lot of things with friends, sex is not one of them (unfortunately, sigh)

 

I never had a spark like this before ..... Advice?

 

Emm

 

Before you even see/speak to him again, read as many posts in OW/OM as well as Infidelity.

 

You can read for yourself what you can expect- and if you choose then to continue to explore this OMM, then at least you will not be one of those who just 'happened' into infidelity. You will be a confident, informed woman who consciously makes her own decisions regarding her life.

[fooled once]

You wax with male friends? You give sensual massages to male friends (besides this guy), you skinny dip with other male friends, you give birth with other male friends? Does your husband know you do this?

 

You want him is because it is forbidden.

 

My advice - don't cross the line.

[Devil Inside]

Sounds like you made a connection. Those will happen from time to time. As a MM who was in an A and as a BS who was cheated on...let me give you some advice...it is SO not worth it. Make sure to never put yourself in a position where you will be tempted with him.

[ednadean]

oh dear. From the sounds of it, this looks like the sort of person you could get very attached to. It's very hard to have sex with someone with NO emotional attachment coming from it. It's very different to doing non-sexual non-emotional intimate acts with people e.g. waxing.

 

It has the potential to be a disaster. Someone out of the four of you [yes, the four], trust me, is going to get hurt. Keep away while it's still 100% platonic --- would be my advice.

[LucreziaBorgia]

I have a feeling you already know the answer to your own question. You intend to pursue it. That much is clear. If you are going to go into an affair, you must do it with the end in mind. There are a few questions to consider before you go into this.

 

1. When you get caught (and you will), what will the two of you do? You and he need to have a Dday plan set and know what to say to your spouses when you get caught, and need to know that this usually means an eventually permanent 'goodbye'.

2. What will you do when his W exposes the affair to everyone and their brother? Are you prepared for her to make a call to your H with proof that you are sleeping with her H?

3. Are you and he ready to be thrown out of your houses and divorced to the full extent of the law? Do you make enough money to support yourself? Does he make enough money to handle a blistering alimony and child support payments (if he has kids, anyway).

4. Will the two of you lose your jobs when you are reported to HR? (Part of exposure - some BS will write a letter to your company deriding them for having someone with such low morals in their company).

5. What happens if you get pregnant, get an STD or either of you pass one to your spouses?

 

And so on. Not to be a Debbie Downer on your beautiful experience, but affairs are a thin veneer of 'hearts and roses' laid over a deep, dark, dirty, slimy, stinking lump of dirt. People go into affairs coasting on that thin veneer and when it breaks, that lump of stuff hits the fan and the fallout is horrible.

 

As a person who was in many, many affairs - I must tell you this: if you are going into this, go into being honest with yourself and always have the end in mind. Your actions and his are going to hurt others, and you need to understand and accept that affairs are deliberate and thoughtless. So few cheaters own their actions like that. I suspect if they did, and they really thought about it - they probably wouldn't get themselves into situations like this as often.

[BenThereDunThat]

So, where'd OP go? Seems to me we had the makings of a wannabe bodice-ripper author.

 

I was eagerly awaiting her next installment.

[auntieemm]

I have to admit that I am a bit overwhelmed with the response!

Sorry about the delay, I have been busy all weekend.

 

First, let me clear up a few things. I DO all those things, tatoo, skinny dip, wax, birth etc with my friends. Usually, as couples, sometimes just my female friends. NEVER alone with one of my male friends. I have participated in waxing and tatoo parties in which male friends were the recipient of the "favors" but there were always others in attendance, most of the time their girlfriends or wives too. Sex has never been a part of any of these activities. AND my H usually bows out, saying that he doesnt mind if I participate but he isnt into most of these things. He is a bit of a hermit.

 

I am not that interested in having sex with this guy (if you believe that) BUT I am interested in a closer relationship. Is this possible?

 

Thank you, Thank you for all your comments about NOT making a choice that will destroy everything we both have. Especially My life! We do both have kids.

 

 

This is very graphic! It speaks to my imagination and really has made me think it through.

""affairs are a thin veneer of 'hearts and roses' laid over a deep, dark, dirty, slimy, stinking lump of dirt. People go into affairs coasting on that thin veneer and when it breaks, that lump of stuff hits the fan"":sick:

 

 

I HAVE made a connection with a person that I have much in common with and we both find that we think alike and will often say the same things at the same times. AND you are right (I suppose) that I want it because it is forbidden!

 

I read many of the posts you recommended. OW/OM

 

Is there a middle ground? Again, is it possible, if we both agree ahead of time on the limits, to have a "closer" but not "sexual" relationship"?

I can handle that. I cant speak for him though.

 

Thank you for all your input. There is no hiding where my motives are. I prefer (need) deep intimate relationships with all my friends. Just not at the expense of everyone involved.

 

 

Emm

[LucreziaBorgia]

 

I am not that interested in having sex with this guy (if you believe that) BUT I am interested in a closer relationship. Is this possible?

 

 

No. Affairs start with 'boundaries' like this. Invariably they end up going further. It is a bit like shaking drops of gasoline on a fire and expecting the fire not to go out of control.

[auntieemm]

Are there any men reading this? Especially MM that could respond from the male perspective?

 

hmmm

 

Emm

[fooled once]

So female perspective isn't good enough?

 

Would you like me to ask my H his thoughts?

He will say what any male would say -- if a woman is going to throw herself at him, and if he isn't married, sure he would go for it.

 

As for a MM who is a cheater -- my guess is yes, he would be more than willing to accommodate a woman who has the hots for him.

 

What are you looking for? someone to tell you to go for it?

 

ETA: What do you want? Just oral sex, but not penetration? WHY would you want a close intimate relationship with a man who isn't your husband?

[auntieemm]

Interested in a male perspective on HOW close a friendship a man can have with a woman and NOT cross the line.

 

I love getting female perceptions too. Afterall, I am NOT a typical female and it is refreshing to know how other women see the world and relationships.

 

Honestly, I am not interested in physical sex in any form. But, I am not naive to the facts that some form of physical contact would most likely be unavoidable. (too late already. remember massage in the storm)

 

Seems to be too risque' to attempt or even "allow"

 

 

Am I to gather, that even if one feels that she can control her physical impulses and keep it on one level, that a MAN cannot do that?

 

So, from a female perspective. This is totally forbidden because there is too much risk of an inappropriate relationship developing, both physically and emotionally. right?

 

FWIW I suppose I like his company and our conversation and sense of humor.

 

I am honestly trying to sort it out BEFORE anything happens that I may regret. I am NOT looking for permission, rather, trying to see all sides. Trying to make a "choice" not just "fall into" something. I see that I am at a cross roads. I can continue or I can take a hard right turn.

 

Emm

[auntieemm]

I did the time... hence the late hour!

And read many of the articles suggested about EA on this and other threads.

 

I will admit that YOU GUYS ARE RIGHT

MANY danger signs.

None have really been crossed, but still bad news.

 

I can cool this immediately. No problem.

 

But, I have to admit that it is really nice to have a 'friend' who you know will always be there for you and listen... (now, I know this IS a sign of EA)

 

And, as I read in some of the articles, it IS SO TRUE, that he probably sees less in this than I do. That when push comes to shove, BOTH of us are not going to give up our SO for anything. That we are treading on really dangerous grounds.

 

NOW...for the hard part.

 

I am thinking it would be best for the two of us to discuss it in person and just make a conscious effort to put a stop to any further actions. Just acknowledge a "problem" and vow to purposefully avoid it!

We do have to see each other on a regular basis in social and work situations, this may ease any tensions there better than trying to go nc.

 

What do you think ?

[soda]

INOW...for the hard part.

 

I am thinking it would be best for the two of us to discuss it in person and just make a conscious effort to put a stop to any further actions. Just acknowledge a "problem" and vow to purposefully avoid it!

We do have to see each other on a regular basis in social and work situations, this may ease any tensions there better than trying to go nc.

 

What do you think ?

 

 

I think that you're trucking toward an affair, and your plan to meet him in secret to talk about how to "avoid it" is anything but smart.

 

If you don't want to cheat, walk away from it. Create distance, not closeness.

 

Your situation is not unique. Like everyone has smartly told you, you will get caught and there will be damage on a massive scale. Be prepared for that.

 

I've never cheated but I lived with one and she always thought that she would get away with it. In the end, she ended up being a needy mess who told so many lies to keep her cover that she'll never permanently fix the issue of trust with her family, friends and coworkers.

 

Don't be so stupid. It's not worth it. It honestly never is.

[TaraMaiden]

Agreed, completely.

The thing to do now is to purposely create distance between you, not huddle together.

And find a 'girlfriend' who can fill the post of " a 'friend' who you know will always be there for you and listen... "

They are far better than male friends, unless the man is gay (and I mean that most sincerely) because girl/gay friends will never bulls*hi*t you. They'll tell it like it is.

This guy has a vested interest in you.

Getting you laid.

Not a good friend from that standpoint alone, at all......

[Devil Inside]

Are there any men reading this? Especially MM that could respond from the male perspective?

 

hmmm

 

Emm

 

As an MM that had an A...I had boundaries with my xOW. They went out the door when we started getting physical. Trust me...when you have chemistry...that raw, rip off my clothes now chemistry...as a man...it is hard to resist.

 

I say create the external structure of not putting yourself in a bad position...don't be alone, don't be tempting each other, don't get drunk together, hang out with your spouses and kids.

 

It is so not worth it. Trust me.

[freestyle]

Read the book,"Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass. She maps it out very comprehensively.Someone else here made a great post,"How to Prevent an Affair" that I would also recommend reading.