The questions I'm afraid to ask him...

[sassy77]

I'm new here... I just found LS yesterday and I am addicted. I have been reading and reading... and oh yeah, did I mention... READING... ... everything I can find pertaining to my situation.

 

I'm the OW... never thought I'd say that, but I am. My old BF from high school asked around and got my number and called me a couple of weeks ago after 20 years of not seeing or talking to each other. He's married. I'm divorced. We broke up when we were 17, the summer after graduation, because he was going to medical school. (BTW... we have never had sex.) He was, however, the love of my life and I have thought about him every single day for the last 20 years. I cried when I got married... because I still loved him. I cried when HE got married... because I still loved him!!

 

Anyway... FF 20 years and now he's calling me several times a day, emailing me, and has asked me to fly out to California to spend a week with him when he has to attend a conference in August. It has turned into a full-fledged EA in the matter of a month.

 

Here's where I'm confused... but I don't want to ask him. He doesn't seem to be having any marital problems. He doesn't complain about his wife... in fact, from the things he says, they seem to get along fine. So I'm wondering - for anybody who has been on either side of the fence - what's up with that? Why would he be calling me and wanting to see me if everything is OK at home?

[greengoddess]

Midlife crises. He wants to rekindle his youth.

 

You know better than to meet him. Especially if you've been reading everything here.

 

Either you will be very hurt or his wife and kids will. It's a no win situation. Back off and tell him to call you when he talks to his wife about his EA with you.

[bentnotbroken]

Better yet, call his wife and ask her how things are going at home. That should get you all the answers you need.

[JeezLouise]

His marriage is fine, his life is fine, but it is a little bit boring. His kids are in hectic schedules with sports and activities, and his wife spends a lot of time making sure that they get to their stuff and helping at school and doing things at home. Sex has been a bit the same lately, and he remembers you fondly. Your contact has given him a spring in his step and a twinkle in his eye, and he is more cheerful at home and slaps his wife on the butt more when he passes her in the kitchen.

 

He wants to feel passion and fireworks like he did with you years ago, and like he did with his wife, rather than the comfortable low flaming embers he has with her now.

 

If you go, you will be stepping wide-eyed into a hornet's nest. He shows no indication of leaving his marriage, and you will be the LD bit on the side, sitting and waiting at night for a text, an email, a phone call while he is out walking the dog. It is not a good way to live your life, when you could be happy and content in your own skin, making new friends post-divorce, and living openly in your own community. Don't become dependent on his contacts for your happiness or your self-esteem.

[2sunny]

just tell him that you will not visit or correspond until he takes action on his divorce.

 

you might consider seeing him when his divorce is FINAL.

 

that will allow you to see what his intentions are... does he just want you on the side because he's bored and married now or because he is divorced and available to date you.

 

to see him before the divorce is final shows him that you are willing to settle for crumbs and willing to be his secret while he stays married. you would willingly become the OW.

 

if he intends to be divorced he will get the paperwork finalized and show you what is different than when he was married.

 

besides - there's no hurry... you already have waited 20 years to see him - there's no rush now. he may have changed and you may find that you no longer find him attractive like before. reality and maturity have a funny way of doing that to people.

 

ask him everything you want to! what's the harm in seeing what he'll come up with? ask him why he's contacting you and what he wants or intends to be the outcome.

[IfWishesWereHorses]

It is not a good way to live your life, when you could be happy and content in your own skin, making new friends post-divorce, and living openly in your own community. Don't become dependent on his contacts for your happiness or your self-esteem.

 

You've gotten some good answers on the "whys" of what he is doing. It may be hard to believe but it really is just that simple.

 

Maybe you should spend some time considering why you feel validated by his attentions. What needs you have that would allow you to put yourself into a situation that will only bring you down. No man who loves you would ever expect you to be his OW, and no woman with self-respect and self-love would set herself up for this type of trainwreck.

 

I would be a little ticked that someone would assume I thought so little of myself as to be someones entertainment and ego boost.

[carhill]

OP, some questions...

 

1. Do you think you and he are the same people you were at 17? That's rhetorical. How do you think you've changed?

 

2. If you didn't have a sexual relationship, and desired one, is that the draw? Unrequited attraction? Think about how and why you remember him. That's critical.

 

3. What do *you* want? What would your response be if you weren't currently single?

 

4. Assuming he is now a doctor, is he paying for your plane ticket? Separate hotel room? Etc....

 

I've been down this path, both as an OM and a MM with the same person over a long period of time, so I can give you those perspectives. Each of us and our situations are different. The quick answer is to forget him, but we both know that's not possible for you. The healthy thing is to process this and reflect upon it and learn from it. Accept the feelings as valid.

 

FWIW, when my friend had first contact again two years ago after 14 years of silence, she congratulated me on my M and announced she was happy in her 8 year LTR. I did the same. The truth began to be revealed for both of us a bit further down the road. So, if MM says nothing about his M or even talks about it positively, remember that time reveals all truths. He wouldn't have sought out your number after 20 years without time and thought, especially considering what a busy man he surely is. He could easily have an affair close by or, since he apparently travels, most anywhere, yet he called you.

 

What do you want to do next?

[sassy77]

Thanks for all the replies... I appreciate every single one... and hearing both sides helps so much.

 

BTW... there are no kids involved. Well, I have kids, but they are teenagers (16 and 18) and they don't know about any of this... and probably wouldn't care.

 

Carhill... thank you, especially! You're right, I can't forget him. I am happily divorced... My life is pretty much the way I want it. I'm not looking for a relationship right now, so I'm not expecting him to leave his wife. I know that sounds terrible. But I miss him so much... as a friend, as everything. I'm sure I've changed as a person since I was 17, but honestly my feelings for him haven't changed at all. And talking to him is like going back in time 20 years... which, of course, is wonderful. Who doesn't want to relive those years? Yes, he is a doctor and he is paying for everything. We live 4 hours apart. I actually did ask him if he were having a midlife crisis... he just laughed and said, no, that he just missed me. I wouldn't be trying to read so much into it, but he calls me two or three times a day... and it doesn't *seem* like he's just looking for a "hook up" to me. But then again, I've been wrong before...

[Owl]

 

BTW... there are no kids involved. Well, I have kids, but they are teenagers (16 and 18) and they don't know about any of this... and probably wouldn't care.

 

Wouldn't your kids care that you were going to see, and potentially "be with" a married man?

[2sunny]

this is an EA. it is cheating on his part when his wife doesn't know that the energy he is spent on you should be directed to her.

 

does she know? if he keeps it a secret from her - then it's considered cheating. is that what you want from him?

[norajane]

But I miss him so much... as a friend, as everything. I'm sure I've changed as a person since I was 17, but honestly my feelings for him haven't changed at all. And talking to him is like going back in time 20 years... which, of course, is wonderful. Who doesn't want to relive those years?

 

I think you feel too much for him already to get involved with him again. You said he's the love of your life and you've thought about him every day for the last 20 years. Do you really want to put yourself in a position where you are pining for him every day, and that life that you are so happy with right now starts to seem unsatisfying and you become unhappy and wishing he'd get a divorce?

 

I wouldn't be trying to read so much into it, but he calls me two or three times a day... and it doesn't *seem* like he's just looking for a "hook up" to me. But then again, I've been wrong before...

 

Well, sure, he's not likely to come out and say he's looking for a hook-up. He's going to pull out all the stops to make you feel special and turn your head, then he's going to fly you out for a week long visit where his wife is conveniently not there, and then he's going to take you out to dinner and compliment and flirt and poof! get you into bed. And then at the end of the week, he'll go back to his wife and family, and you'll go back home counting the minutes until you can see him again, pining for him.

 

He has come out and said he's happily married. If he was ONLY interested in friendship, he'd invite you out to visit him and his family. He'd introduce you to his wife. He wouldn't offer to meet you in some city where you will be kept well-hidden from his real life.

[carhill]

As a man, I'll say this gently. If a doctor is calling you 2-3x daily, there's a big red flag waving. Even if just brief chats. He's carving out time.

 

I think a revelation is due soon. My instinct. Up to you what you want to do about that.

 

I can say for certain, since my friend and I have talked about this in depth, she came to me years ago because, in her words, she felt "a connection" after the period when we initially got to know each other (she was M). I believe it was because she knew I was attracted to her but she never said exactly that. I did similarly recently because I was at a low place emotionally and reached out to someone with whom I had always felt a similar connection. She, superficially, at that time, seemed happy. She contacted me, literally, as she was moving out of her apartment and in with her BF, after I had sent her an unsigned BD card. Similar to your situation, we did not have a sexual relationship. I was a virgin when I knew her in the past. So, there is the reality of unrequited attraction, which we both still seem to feel. IME, acknowledging those feelings and acting in a healthy way (for me, full disclosure and relationship support have been cornerstones) has helped me immensely.

 

My advice is to find your truth and do what you know is healthy for you. That path is as individual as you are. FWIW, many years ago, I had to say goodbye to my friend for, at that time in her life, she couldn't fully disclose our connection to her H. In hindsight, we both handled it poorly, but one learns from their mistakes.

 

You're older and more experienced in relationships than we were at that time. I think you'll figure this out.

[greengoddess]

I think even after reading here, after reading all the heartbreak you are still going to do this using as the excuse you are not looking for a relationship and you know he won't leave. You are going into this with your eyes wide open. I can see your future 18 months from now you will be heartbroken. You will be madly in love with the fantasy, you will have a dday and you will not be able to understand why he isn't talking to you and his wife is calling you. You know the drilll, you are reading here.

 

Is that what you want?

 

He doesn't have kids? So why doesn't he separate from his wife if he wants something new? None of those pesky children holding him back. It's just him and her.

[2sure]

YOU cried when you got married. YOU cried when he got married.

This was true LOVE for you? But it took him 20 YEARS to look you up??

 

Hello?

He is happy, but he is bored. He is in love with his wife, but not opposed to something on the side. There is NO ONE more convenient than someone you already know, someone who already has feelings.

 

Better yet even: Someone with whom to relive the glory days of youth

 

The thing is this: In order for the Affair to happen - the other partner MUST be at a disadvantage. Single people do not date married people unless they are, for some reason, at a vulnerable point in their lives.

 

Sometimes, just being middle aged and single makes you vulnerable enough. Typically , the OW in these cases is someone like yourself OR a financially struggling single mother.

 

He HAS TO SEEM LIKE A NIGHT IN SHINING ARMOR for this to work. To get the romance of "forbidden love" lost love, whatever.

 

It is up to him to betray his wife so I dont expect you to automatically take that on. But you are a huge part of that betrayal just by participating in her life anonymously like you are. And for what?

[carhill]

So why doesn't he separate from his wife if he wants something new? None of those pesky children holding him back. It's just him and her.

He's a doctor and, besides the typical social connections for any married couple, he likely has standing in the community. The doctors I know as friends certainly do. They're known widely beyond their group of friends. It's a more difficult task dealing with all that. If he's a path of least resistance personality, he won't want to deal with it.

 

Time reveals all truths

 

There is NO ONE more convenient than someone you already know, someone who already has feelings.

Yes, if he were to want an exit strategy, perhaps; conversely, for something to merely relieve his boredom, conventional wisdom would dictate picking up a stranger in the conference hotel bar, since doctors attend a lot of conferences. NSA, boredom relieved and home to wife and happy home.

[Gamine]

If the two of you really loved one another as you recount, why aren't you his wife? Crying when you married and when he married is a bird's eye view into your heart, however this speaks to a much deeper level of feelings than his. His account is that he's fine but missed you.

 

How does a man 'miss' someone for so many years? Is it really missing you, or is it missing who he was and how he felt about himself when he was 17? Are you caught up in his fantasy?

 

Going back in time to relive a past. Many people wonder where relationships would have gone if things had been different and the draw to rewrite history can be compelling. However, in living out this fantasy via an affair you run the risk of spoiling a perfectly wonderful past. What was once looked upon as magical can become profoundly ugly and hurtful. Are you prepared to be left by the wayside once again as you were when he married his wife? Are you prepared for the possibility that you may continue to fall in love all over again with this man only for him to read you the riot act? Are you prepared to be left by someone you have loved most of you life? Are you prepared to face yourself in the mirror knowing that you have once again put yourself into the very same situation you did once before all over again... despite your wisdom of advanced years?

 

Some things are not meant to be played out. Sometimes they are meant to remain beautiful memories so that they can be held tightly when the world seems cold. We can look back at our innocence and recapture it in our hearts today. However, by going back and rewriting your history you suffer the peril of losing who you were with one another. You risk losing that place in your heart for him and it being filled with disappointment and sorrow.

 

If you love him leave him alone. If you are his friend... be his friend and talk with him about what's going on with him. If you love him do the right thing by him and his family. His wife and children do care. His sons will be fathers someday and give him grandchildren. Be the voice of wisdom in his life if you love him and encourage him to be a better man, not potentially tearing it down. It isn't pretty when a wife finds out and they often do. You will be helping him hurt himself and his family. If you love him you will be noble for him because if you love him you will act out of love for him.

[greengoddess]

He's a doctor and, besides the typical social connections for any married couple, he likely has standing in the community. The doctors I know as friends certainly do. They're known widely beyond their group of friends. It's a more difficult task dealing with all that. If he's a path of least resistance personality, he won't want to deal with it.

 

Time reveals all truths

 

 

There is no social stigma to divorcing. No one would fault him if he told his wife they have grown apart. They can separate amicably. There is social stigma and lots of alienation if he gets caught cheating. Friends will support his wife and he will be labled the lying cheat. He's a doctor. He's been out of high school 20 years so at this point he should have a nice nest egg and separation should be no problem at all. Why risk cheating? Oh I know because he wants some fun on the side not a divorce. She hasn't gone there yet and she should not to protect her own heart and you know this so why confirm the fairytale?

[carhill]

A little review.

 

The MM does not have children

 

The OP took no proactive measures other than accepting contact

 

The MM claims to be happy in his life and marriage

 

The OP acknowledges that her contact with him is considered an EA by her

 

 

OP, questions...

 

1. Other than saying he "missed you", did he give any reason for contacting you out of the blue?

 

2. How long after you got married did he get married? Did he know you got married? How long have you been divorced? Do you see where I'm going with this?

[carhill]

There is no social stigma to divorcing. No one would fault him if he told his wife they have grown apart. They can separate amicably. There is social stigma and lots of alienation if he gets caught cheating. Friends will support his wife and he will be labled the lying cheat. He's a doctor. He's been out of high school 20 years so at this point he should have a nice nest egg and separation should be no problem at all. Why risk cheating? Oh I know because he wants some fun on the side not a divorce. She hasn't gone there yet and she should not to protect her own heart and you know this so why confirm the fairytale?

That's your perspective. Men process things differently. It's kinda like what women tell us guys here on LS, that there's no way we can think like a woman. I'm giving the OP a man's perspective. I'm assuming the MM is a typical man.

[greengoddess]

That's your perspective. Men process things differently. It's kinda like what women tell us guys here on LS, that there's no way we can think like a woman. I'm giving the OP a man's perspective. I'm assuming the MM is a typical man.

 

So from a man's perspective you think she should take a chance on this man? WHY?

[carhill]

I think she should reflect upon who she is and what she wants in life. The process I'm working through is similar to what we did in MC with our psychologist. He helped me work through the unrequited attraction to get to a healthier place, a place where I could see how it was inappropriate and to process my feelings differently.

 

I don't think the OP wants to "take a chance" on this MM. She's trying to understand the dynamic and her emotions are inhibiting that clarity. She's swimming against the tide. She sees the beach but the rip has got her. How does she get out of the rip? IMO, that's what she's seeking here and will have to find it in her own way and in her own time. The fact that she's acknowledged this is an EA speaks volumes to her health. She's not denying. So, let's move forward with understanding and processing it.

[sassy77]

Thank you, again, Carhill. That's what I want... a man's perspective. I'm just trying to figure out what he's thinking! He just said that he missed me, that he had been thinking about me and wondered how I am... and then it snowballed from there.

 

A little more history...

 

I've been married twice. He's been married twice. The first time I got divorced, he was getting ready to get married. When he divorced his first wife, I had been married 6 months. He told me all of this when we talked the first night... so he had obviously been keeping up with what I was doing through the grapevine. I've been divorced for a year and a half.

 

For the record... this is the first time I've ever even considered doing anything like this. I've never cheated... nor have I, to my knowledge, been cheated on.

 

And with all due respect to all the people who keep telling me, "don't do it!!" - that really has nothing to do with my original question. I mean, feel free to express your thoughts, but understand that I'm not looking for permission, acceptance, or confirmation that what I'm doing is either right or wrong.

[2sure]

Here's where I'm confused... but I don't want to ask him. He doesn't seem to be having any marital problems. He doesn't complain about his wife... in fact, from the things he says, they seem to get along fine. So I'm wondering - for anybody who has been on either side of the fence - what's up with that? Why would he be calling me and wanting to see me if everything is OK at home?

 

Right-o! Back to the original question.

If he is happy with his marriage and wife - why would he be eager to enter into an affair?

 

To get some strange.

To have his ego stroked.

 

Since he doesnt say he has any problems in the marriage - he doesn't feel the need to justify his infidelity.

 

He seems pretty comfortable with it.

[norajane]

If you really think you have a chance of ending up with this guy, that he contacted you because he wants to get a divorce so he can finally be with you after 20 years, then DO NOT start an affair. Only when he is divorced should you start seeing him.

 

He's gone through one divorce. If he really wants to be with you, then he can do it again and end his marriage and be free to actually have something to offer you instead of an affair. If you make it easy for him to engage in an affair with you, he has NO incentive to get a divorce.

 

If you're playing for keeps and not just playing, then expect more and demand more from him than a roll in the hay.

[sassy77]

Hmmmm... ok... let me rephrase this - or maybe just RETYPE this...

 

Why would he be calling ME and wanting to see ME if everything is OK at home?

 

There are a gazillion other people in the world... and most certainly, many more convenient to him... so I guess that's my question... which I know that only he can answer, but then again... I'm not stupid. My chances of getting a straight answer are probably better here as they are if I ask him.

 

And, further... he never said he was "happy" in his marriage... he just didn't talk about any problems. But he never went so far to use the word "happy" - he was just kinda neutral and didn't really speak negatively of his wife... which is why I assumed that they "get along" Ok. But I don't think I ever said that he had a "happy marriage"... I don't know what kind of marriage he has. I have not asked him that.