Is it my fault?

[LikeCharlotte]

I have a friend he is a MM. We have known each other for a long time and have many things in common. I knew him before his marriage and we were always very close but there was never anything but innocent flirtation (if that) before his marriage.

 

Since he has been married he has confided in me a many times. He has asked for advice and he has sometimes talked about his sexual incompatibility with his wife. He loves her and has no plans to leave her. Recently he started to flirt with me and he said some inappropriate things. I avoided them but I encouraged him to talk about what was making him act that way. I also encouraged him to talk to his wife. His talk with his wife didn't go very well.

 

After my recent break up he told me that he has thought about having an affair with me. He also told me that he is in love with me. I have told him that I will not do that and that I will not even think about him in that way because he is married.

 

I feel like I may have encouraged an EA and that was never my intent. He is my friend and I do not want to stop speaking to him. On the other hand I can not handle that he compares me to his wife. I understand that he is going through something right now and I don't want to abandon him but I refuse to participate in any sort of affair or encourage his behavior.

 

In short what I am looking for is a way to say this nicely to him and maybe salvage the friendship we had before. I never meant for him to feel this way about me. I honestly thought that he was just venting to a woman for perspective.

 

I don't know what to do. Please help.

[OpenBook]

I have married guy friends where it's gotten a little weird like that every now and then. I just keep treating them like a kid brother, it all smooths out eventually. Their thoughts are straying, all over the place actually (they act a little spacier than usual), and I'm standing right there, so it's like you're in the path of a speeding bullet. It's one of the kindest things to do for them, as a friend - dodge that speeding bullet but don't reciprocate or react at all. Just keep on gettin' it, like it never even happened.

 

And they've done the same for me, whenever I've "lurched" out of the comfortable boundaries of friendship we've established.

[biffster]

Hi ... hope I can help ... I ended up having an EA with someone who I developed a strong bond with ... the tension built up ... we ended up crossing the line ... which brought me to this board ... which is not where I want to be ...

 

No, it is not your fault ...but you must not talk about what he is going through with his wife at all ... that is their issue to deal with ... do not cross that line ... do not becoming that emotional dumping ground for him ... he needs to see a trained therapist, or a marraige conselor ... please don't go there ... you want nothing to do with the problems he is having in his marraige ... including having an affair with him ... physcially ...

 

... at this point ... since no line has been crossed, which trust me, will be inevitable if this continues, especially since he is already in love with you ... it would be best to seperate from him ...

 

... no need for a big, complicated discussion ... just keep yourself busy with other things, don't LET him lean on you about the marital problems like you are a therapist .. and, if he tries something again ... or hints at an affair AGAIN .. tell him you are not interested ... and while you are happy to be his friend, if he keeps being suggestive like that, you will have no choice but to take a break from the friendship ... tell him that you need space ... no need to be rude to him ... just give youself space, and start getting more actively involved with other people and things ...

 

... please DO NOT let this escalate .. you will regret it ... it will reach the point of no return, and you will never be able to go back to the way things were and doing the right thing ... do the right thing NOW, or else you will have a big giant mess on your hands ... especially since he is happily married and is having no problems with his wife other than their sexual incompatiabilyt ... he should be talking about that with her, and resolving that with her ... you have no place being there ...

 

... no, I am not making a moral judgment, trust me on this one .. but you really will get hurt ... caught in the middle, you will get attached ... this is almost inevitable ... it's all down hill from there ... stop it now before it's too late .. that is my advice ... hang in there!!! This is NOT your fault.

[LikeCharlotte]

I have married guy friends where it's gotten a little weird like that every now and then. I just keep treating them like a kid brother, it all smooths out eventually. Their thoughts are straying, all over the place actually (they act a little spacier than usual), and I'm standing right there, so it's like you're in the path of a speeding bullet. It's one of the kindest things to do for them, as a friend - dodge that speeding bullet but don't reciprocate or react at all. Just keep on gettin' it, like it never even happened.

 

And they've done the same for me, whenever I've "lurched" out of the comfortable boundaries of friendship we've established.

I can do that to a degree. Has has gone way beyond the boundaries. He told me he was in love with me. He wants to have an affair with me and even has offered to stage a weekend away to something she wouldn't want to attend so we could see if it would work out. I was nice about all of that and told him I'm just not comfortable but he continues. He has gone very far and if I was his wife I would divorce him.

 

I want to keep trying to help him but I really feel like I might be making it worse for him. I can't even imagine the pain his wife would feel if she knew what he has said and done.

[LikeCharlotte]

Hi ... hope I can help ... I ended up having an EA with someone who I developed a strong bond with ... the tension built up ... we ended up crossing the line ... which brought me to this board ... which is not where I want to be ...

 

No, it is not your fault ...but you must not talk about what he is going through with his wife at all ... that is their issue to deal with ... do not cross that line ... do not becoming that emotional dumping ground for him ... he needs to see a trained therapist, or a marraige conselor ... please don't go there ... you want nothing to do with the problems he is having in his marraige ... including having an affair with him ... physcially ...

 

... at this point ... since no line has been crossed, which trust me, will be inevitable if this continues, especially since he is already in love with you ... it would be best to seperate from him ...

 

... no need for a big, complicated discussion ... just keep yourself busy with other things, don't LET him lean on you about the marital problems like you are a therapist .. and, if he tries something again ... or hints at an affair AGAIN .. tell him you are not interested ... and while you are happy to be his friend, if he keeps being suggestive like that, you will have no choice but to take a break from the friendship ... tell him that you need space ... no need to be rude to him ... just give youself space, and start getting more actively involved with other people and things ...

 

... please DO NOT let this escalate .. you will regret it ... it will reach the point of no return, and you will never be able to go back to the way things were and doing the right thing ... do the right thing NOW, or else you will have a big giant mess on your hands ... especially since he is happily married and is having no problems with his wife other than their sexual incompatiabilyt ... he should be talking about that with her, and resolving that with her ... you have no place being there ...

 

... no, I am not making a moral judgment, trust me on this one .. but you really will get hurt ... caught in the middle, you will get attached ... this is almost inevitable ... it's all down hill from there ... stop it now before it's too late .. that is my advice ... hang in there!!! This is NOT your fault.

You are right. I will tell him to stop again and then I will avoid him. He needs to figure these things out and I can't be the one to help if he has fallen in love. Thank you. I need to put a hard line on this. Now.

I feel just awful.

[White Flower]

Hi ... hope I can help ... I ended up having an EA with someone who I developed a strong bond with ... the tension built up ... we ended up crossing the line ... which brought me to this board ... which is not where I want to be ...

 

No, it is not your fault ...but you must not talk about what he is going through with his wife at all ... that is their issue to deal with ... do not cross that line ... do not becoming that emotional dumping ground for him ... he needs to see a trained therapist, or a marraige conselor ... please don't go there ... you want nothing to do with the problems he is having in his marraige ... including having an affair with him ... physcially ...

 

... at this point ... since no line has been crossed, which trust me, will be inevitable if this continues, especially since he is already in love with you ... it would be best to seperate from him ...

 

... no need for a big, complicated discussion ... just keep yourself busy with other things, don't LET him lean on you about the marital problems like you are a therapist .. and, if he tries something again ... or hints at an affair AGAIN .. tell him you are not interested ... and while you are happy to be his friend, if he keeps being suggestive like that, you will have no choice but to take a break from the friendship ... tell him that you need space ... no need to be rude to him ... just give youself space, and start getting more actively involved with other people and things ...

 

... please DO NOT let this escalate .. you will regret it ... it will reach the point of no return, and you will never be able to go back to the way things were and doing the right thing ... do the right thing NOW, or else you will have a big giant mess on your hands ... especially since he is happily married and is having no problems with his wife other than their sexual incompatiabilyt ... he should be talking about that with her, and resolving that with her ... you have no place being there ...

 

... no, I am not making a moral judgment, trust me on this one .. but you really will get hurt ... caught in the middle, you will get attached ... this is almost inevitable ... it's all down hill from there ... stop it now before it's too late .. that is my advice ... hang in there!!! This is NOT your fault.

A very wise and cautionary post. And let me repeat, 'You really will get hurt and you really will become attached.'

[LikeCharlotte]

A very wise and cautionary post. And let me repeat, 'You really will get hurt and you really will become attached.'

I have absolutely no intention of getting involved with him physically. I've never seen him as anything but a friend and I completely respect his wife. Although this has made me feel very much like I've lied to her even though I did not initiate this. I really hope I haven't lost a good friend because he is confused right now. Do you think he will ever understand that he has hurt me and that I really can't continue to help him? How do I say it?

[White Flower]

I can do that to a degree. Has has gone way beyond the boundaries. He told me he was in love with me. He wants to have an affair with me and even has offered to stage a weekend away to something she wouldn't want to attend so we could see if it would work out. I was nice about all of that and told him I'm just not comfortable but he continues. He has gone very far and if I was his wife I would divorce him.

 

I want to keep trying to help him but I really feel like I might be making it worse for him. I can't even imagine the pain his wife would feel if she knew what he has said and done.

Sweetie, the trouble with some men (I said SOME:cool:), is that they think by your sitting there and smiling that you are attracted to them. You are spending time with him and any man who spends time at ANYTHING means he is truly interested in it. Women will spend time on things because it is polite, the right thing to do, an obligation, etc., so by you sitting there and spending time with him he feels you are saying no but meaning yes. Try to avoid him more often so he gets the subtleties along with your statements that you are not confortable partaking in an A with him. It is not a requirement to be polite to him or to feel obligated in any way.

 

I am also concerned about his behavior. You've repeatedly assured him you're not interested yet he keeps approaching you as if you'd said nothing. He may be a narcissist that only cares about what he wants. You NEVER want to end up with someone like that. Trust me.

 

Is it Spring Fever or something? These boards are chock full of affair offers like I've never seen!

[White Flower]

I have absolutely no intention of getting involved with him physically. I've never seen him as anything but a friend and I completely respect his wife. Although this has made me feel very much like I've lied to her even though I did not initiate this. I really hope I haven't lost a good friend because he is confused right now. Do you think he will ever understand that he has hurt me and that I really can't continue to help him? How do I say it?

If you're afraid to hurt him by saying, 'I just can't get involved, I'm sorry.', then try telling him in other ways by avoiding his presence. When he walks in you walk out, etc. Is he a neighbor who comes into your home? Does he always socialize with you with his W? Or does he come over alone? What are the circumstances with which you meet for these kinds of conversations? Whatever it takes, start sending him the messages that he needs to understand you.

[biffster]

I have absolutely no intention of getting involved with him physically ... Although this has made me feel very much like I've lied to her even though I did not initiate this. I really hope I haven't lost a good friend because he is confused right now. Do you think he will ever understand that he has hurt me and that I really can't continue to help him? How do I say it?

 

 

LC ... we know you have no intention of getting involved that way ... but things happen ... no one ever thinks they will, but along the course you are going now the bond just strengthens, you get in over your own head before you really realize it ... and then one day ... it starts with an innocent kiss ... and things change ... then it escalates from there ... then you will feel horrible ..

 

... you also talk about losing a good friend when he has made you feel as if you lied to his wife? I woman you know, like and respect ... who he has no intention of leaving???? I am sorry, but he is luring you into this, making you his partner in crime .. and preying on your kind heart and understanding ... no, I don't think he is intentionally disrecpecting you ... i think that he is confused and in love, but that is not the point ... even with good friends, we have to draw the line, especially when they are luring us into something and trying to make you a co-conspirator to alleviate their own guilt ... Trust me ... if he really is a good friend, then he will continue to be one ... after you have had your space and cleared your own head ...

 

If he doesn't understand that he is hurting you and continues along this path, he is not a good friend and you will have lost nothing ...

 

It is not your job to help him in this ... I refer to my earlier post ... make this perfectly clear to him, and if he doesn't get it, doesn't want to, and disrespects your wishes and boundaries in the situation ...then he is not a good friend ....

 

... Also, I am sorry to say, but if he doesn't "get it" or understand, that IS NOT YOUR PROBLEM! It is HIS ... being a responsible friend to someone doesn't mean disregarding your own boundaries ... and any "good friend" will respect your boundaries, regardless of weather or not they agree with or understand them ... PERIOD. It is not your fault that he is confused ... nor is it your job to explain it to him ... tell him to go seek a counselor if he needs help ... I am sorry ... but NONE of this falls on YOU .. Just don't let it happen ... and don't think that "It" can't happen to you ... that is what we ALL THINK!

[LikeCharlotte]

I am going to avoid him for now. If I talk to him again I will make it even more clear and let him know that I wont be speaking to him at all if he continues. It's going to be hard to lose a friend but if he continues then I think he must not really care about my feelings as well. That isn't a friend at all. That is someone who is using me for validation outside of his marriage. It hurts to think that way. I should certainly not be the focus of his romantic feelings and how could someone who supposedly cares about me want to drag me into that?

[White Flower]

I am going to avoid him for now. If I talk to him again I will make it even more clear and let him know that I wont be speaking to him at all if he continues. It's going to be hard to lose a friend but if he continues then I think he must not really care about my feelings as well. That isn't a friend at all. That is someone who is using me for validation outside of his marriage. It hurts to think that way. I should certainly not be the focus of his romantic feelings and how could someone who supposedly cares about me want to drag me into that?

You're absolutely right!

 

The very title of this thread suggests that he is making you feel like this is your fault when HE is pursuing you. Don't let him do that to you.

[LikeCharlotte]

Speak of the devil. Just as I was writing this he sent me a message telling me that he wants to take one of his vacation days this coming week before they expire and spend the day with me. I said "I'm sorry its a busy week for me. You should take your time off and spend it with (your wife) or (good friend). I'm starting to get really uncomfortable and I need a little break. I'll see you at (event) hopefully by then you'll understand."

Is that clear? Should I just not have responded?

[biffster]

You're absolutely right!

 

The very title of this thread suggests that he is making you feel like this is your fault when HE is pursuing you. Don't let him do that to you.

 

 

DITTO!!!!!!!!!! You have no OBLIGATION to him whatsoever ... Steer Clear and STAND YOUR GROUND ... do not let him drag you into this AT ALL!!!

[Nemo]

Speak of the devil. Just as I was writing this he sent me a message telling me that he wants to take one of his vacation days this coming week before they expire and spend the day with me. I said "I'm sorry its a busy week for me. You should take your time off and spend it with (your wife) or (good friend). I'm starting to get really uncomfortable and I need a little break. I'll see you at (event) hopefully by then you'll understand."

Is that clear? Should I just not have responded?

Good call. One way or another, you needed to tell him in no uncertain terms to get off your fresh butt!

 

Well done. Props to you.

[White Flower]

Speak of the devil. Just as I was writing this he sent me a message telling me that he wants to take one of his vacation days this coming week before they expire and spend the day with me. I said "I'm sorry its a busy week for me. You should take your time off and spend it with (your wife) or (good friend). I'm starting to get really uncomfortable and I need a little break. I'll see you at (event) hopefully by then you'll understand."

Is that clear? Should I just not have responded?

I think it was pretty clear. You suggested he go with his wife or buddy and you clearly stated that you are uncomfortable with the situation. You are willing to keep him as a friend (see you at the event) and you are asking him to understand your stance on this issue.

 

If he still doesn't get it, hit him over the head with a baseball bat! Just kidding. Next time he broaches the subject tell him that you still feel uncomfortable and you wish he wouldn't see you in this light. Tell him you just can't do that to his W and you only see him as a friend.

 

Good luck:)

[Nemo]

I guess he's been picturing you naked. You'll be laughing about this over ice cream in a few decades.

[whichwayisup]

I'm sorry its a busy week for me. You should take your time off and spend it with (your wife) or (good friend). I'm starting to get really uncomfortable and I need a little break. I'll see you at (event) hopefully by then you'll understand."

Is that clear? Should I just not have responded?

 

Leave it at that and if he STILL tries to contact you and push you into hooking up with him, tell him, "You are leaving me no choice but to walk away from this friendship. How you've been in the past xx amount of weeks is making me feel very uncomfortable and it's ruining our friendship. It is disrespectful to your wife, let alone to ME, so if you continue to make passes at me verbally and flirt with me, I WILL say goodbye to you forever."

[Nemo]

Leave it at that and if he STILL tries to contact you and push you into hooking up with him, tell him, "You are leaving me no choice

Sometimes having sex with someone is being cruel to be kind. When left with no choice, make it a quickie.

[biffster]

Hey ... yes, I agree with Nemo ... it was fantastic that you said that to him!!!!!! I am soooo happy you did that ... good job!!!!!!

 

You must always state how you feel and be assertive about it!!!! NEVER, EVER walk on egg shells with anyone!!!! If they don't understand or get it ... that is their f-ing problem!!! You must speak in a bottom line kind of way .. and be direct and to the point ... no wavering ... rocking the boat is good ... telling them like it is - is good ...

 

Keep going!

[LikeCharlotte]

Update:

Text messages-

Him: "I'm really sorry. I never wanted to make you uncomfortable. Is it because you are still in love with (x) or are you really busy? I did not mean to imply anything sexual I just thought we could hang out."

 

Me: "I'm sure you didn't plan to tell (wife) that you were taking a day off. It's hard enough to know I have to see (x) eventually, please don't things harder for me. Yes, I am busy. I'll see you both (day). Please just understand."

 

Him: "I am an a***** I apologise."

 

at this point I'm not saying anything. I'm not answering him at all until the day we will all be together. This is exhausting.

[LikeCharlotte]

Thank you all so much. I was very confused. All the advice and encouragement helped.

[whichwayisup]

Update:

Text messages-

Him: "I'm really sorry. I never wanted to make you uncomfortable. Is it because you are still in love with (x) or are you really busy? I did not mean to imply anything sexual I just thought we could hang out."

 

Him: I sort of am sorry, but not really. I am saying sorry because this is what I have to do to keep you in my life. I DO know what's what, so me asking if you still love your ex really doesn't apply because I DO get the fact that I am married and you're not into me because of that, but I still am going to pursue you .. .. (Thinks to himself - I'll just back off abit and then wait till the right moment to make another move or drop afew more hints, see if she'll take the bait this time...

 

Me: "I'm sure you didn't plan to tell (wife) that you were taking a day off. It's hard enough to know I have to see (x) eventually, please don't things harder for me. Yes, I am busy. I'll see you both (day). Please just understand."

 

I need to ask, have you met his wife? Does she even know you exist? Maybe being friends with him, having a one on one friendship and getting close isn't a good idea either way. I'm sure if his wife was close to another man, talking to him, he would be freakin' upset as heck!

 

Him: "I am an a***** I apologise."

 

He's trying to make you feel sorry for him...

[OpenBook]

Something's not adding up here. It sounds like this guy is assuming that you're easy. Do you know why he would assume that? I can't think of any other reason why he would behave this way... unless he is completely arrogant and clueless - in which case you wouldn't have been friends with him in the first place... right? Has he ever exhibited this kind of persistent, obnoxious, and emotionally manipulative behavior before?

[biffster]

Yes! I agree with Whichwayisup's translations ... now he is trying to act like "Ok, cool baby ... sorry about that ... nothing sexual ... " .. whatever ... total and complete BS!!

 

Now he has to fine tune his approach ... work on another angle to lure you in ... waiting to catch you off guard and think you are in the clear ..

 

... then he will sniper you .. BAM! No more discussions like this with him again ... EVER ... use this as a rule of thumb: If you are discussing something, or about to discuss something with him that you or him (or both) wouldn't say in front of his wife ... then the discussion is off limits!

 

Confine your discussions with him, from now on, to only topics that you would be comfortable sharing with his wife ... out in the open... if you don't want his wife to know about something ... you shouldn' t be discussing it with him ... THAT will keep him in check ....

 

Next time he broaches a subject with you that you deem inappropriate ... eg., something you wouldn't want the wife to know about ... just say, "Well, why don't we ask your wife what she thinks????" and then, make sure that any discussion you have with him is appropriate material for the wife ... keep in contact with her ... and keep your friendship with him totally in the open ... have no secrets between the two of you that she can't know about