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Emotional affair, friend, cheating or am I crazy?


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Hi everyone,

 

This is the first time I have ever written or commented in any forum. I need advice, a slap on the head... something to get me thinking straight.

 

First my back story...

 

I was married to a wonderful man for over 20 years, we had a great relationship. Ten years into the marriage we both were just not really "in love" with each other anymore, but decided to stay together and raise our children as a married couple. The last ten years of my marriage we agreed to have an open relationship, though very discreet, we dated other people throughout the remaining 10 years. As soon as the last child graduated we divorced and I moved to a different town in the same state. We still communicate once in a while to discuss the children. We have a wonderful, civil, relationship.

 

 

About 6 months after I moved I met my now husband, we started dating and dated 2 years before we married. For the first year of marriage, I would say our relationship was fantastic.

 

My suspicion started when I was away on business for 5 days. I noticed when we talked on the phone he had this strange tone to his voice. It was different, enthusiastic, excited... just different. I asked him about the change and he dismissed it as happy to hear from me. The next day we talked again, same thing. I asked again and he said, "I reconnected with a friend that I used to work with in our family business, she is going through some rough times with her husband and daughter and I am helping her sort through some stuff". It didn't concern me at the time because he is a very giving person and likes helping friends. The strange behavior continued so I looked at our phone bill, that I pay, and found out he had been talking to her for hours and hours every day I was gone and still talking to her about an hour a day. Tons of texts and calls both ways all hours while I was gone and once I was back home the calls and texts were just during working hours. I confronted him again and he dismissed it and told me I am insecure, jealous, and don't trust him and she was just a friend. So I put it out of my mind again. A couple weeks later I check the phone bill and no calls not texts. I thought he had cut off communication, but in fact I find out 3 months later he has a second phone he was just using to talk to her. I found out because he butt dialed me while he was talking to her. I listened for over 15 minutes until he noticed and hung up my connection. The whole conversation was about her daughter and her husband. Nothing that sounded in any way he was having an inappropriate relationship with her. Once he got home, we talked, he said he knew that I would be mad if I found out that he was talking to her so he got another phone. He said he was glad I found out because he felt very guilty doing that behind my back. He wanted to tell me what was going on with her, as far as family problems, but I said I don't about her. Why are you sneaking around to talk to her if you are just friends. By the end of the day he had turned it around trying to blame it on my messed up way of thinking because I had come from an open marriage. He also said I was insecure, jealous and not trusting and the hammered up the other phone...LOL. He said I am going to talk to her, she is my friend and only my friend. I dropped it again and we went about everyday life. I checked the phone bill again a week or so later and found a phone call here and there for a couple minutes. So I put it behind me again. I thought that was it.

 

He was having problems with one of his credit card payments not showing up on his account so he asked me to investigate it. He gave me his bank statement file and I began to try to find when the payment was deducted to straighten out the credit card account. I did find the payment. I also found a purchase to Adam and Eve 3 days before Valentine's Day. The store was in town not online. I confronted him and he swore that he did not make that charge and he called his bank and reported it as a fraudulent charge. After a couple weeks they reimbursed him. I thought it was odd that out of 300 or so debits from that account only one was fraudulent and all the others were his. So I let that go.

 

 

I checked up on the phone bill again to see if they had any kind of communication. They have 7 hours of calls in the last 4 weeks. All from his phone, he's doing the calling. She is not calling him, unless she is using app to call him. I see no texts, but there again, they could be using an app. I asked her why he didn't talk to her while he was around me, he said I don't want to rub our friendship in your face. I know you don't approve.

 

I am leaving again soon for another extended business trip. I really want to get the proof I need by planting recorders in my house. I have a feeling he will bring her over here.

 

I need advice. Am I crazy and being a jealous insecure loser?

 

 

Thanks for taking the time to read this.

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he said I don't want to rub our friendship in your face. I know you don't approve.

 

Here's the question you should ask your husband - why isn't this enough?

 

Why isn't the fact you're uncomfortable with the boundaries crossed sufficiently compelling for him to curtail or end the relationship? Why doesn't he place your peace of mind above her validation :confused: ???

 

If he continues to value contact with her above marital harmony with you, then there's a message there you'll have to pay attention to :( ...

 

Mr. Lucky

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I really need to see or hear proof. If I get proof, I will file for divorce that day!

 

Do you think it would be wrong to secretly tape in our house while Im gone? I know I have read in other posts that it is a felony. But if I am only using it for my peace of mind. Maybe I am going nuts!

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MrsBilliethekid

Proof of what? You have proof. You've seen phone bills, you've heard a call. No-one invests that much time in a friendship. They probably do talk about her husband and daughter but not for hours at a time.

 

What exactly do you want proof of cos the evidence you already have is pretty compelling. Added to the fact he knows you don't like it but he's so arrogant that that doesn't appear to matter to him.

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Proof of what? You have proof. You've seen phone bills, you've heard a call. No-one invests that much time in a friendship. They probably do talk about her husband and daughter but not for hours at a time.

 

What exactly do you want proof of cos the evidence you already have is pretty compelling. Added to the fact he knows you don't like it but he's so arrogant that that doesn't appear to matter to him.

 

 

 

Agreed. You have sufficient evidence. Enough proof. He is cheating.

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butterfly1958

Your frustration, hurt, pain and emotional distress are apparent. My heart aches for you. What would it look like if you took time to really be together and talk......truly communicate? How would a weekend away feel for the both of you? What has pulled you both together in the past? What was the last really fun memory you have had together? Life is such a challenge to navigate through. Treasuring each other has to be a top priority to hold us like glue together. What are you willing to do to make this marriage work? What would counseling do to help you as a couple? Obviously there is boundary disparity between the two of you that needs to be addressed. Cameras........not sure if that really helps......communication and counseling helps in most cases. Praying you find the right answers.....

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I really need to see or hear proof. If I get proof, I will file for divorce that day!

He got a second phone specifically to talk to her without you knowing anything about it.

What more proof do you want?

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He said I am going to talk to her, she is my friend and only my friend.

This is the clincher, right here....

 

Usually, one's spouse is their best friend and the fact that he sees this other woman as his ONLY friend means your marriage is compromised and if he is unwilling to let her go, you have to let the marriage go....

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I want to talk to him and have tried but he gets defensive and tells me I am insecure and don't trust him.

 

Thank you all for the support! I really needed to hear all these comments.

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I want to talk to him and have tried but he gets defensive and tells me I am insecure and don't trust him.

This is known as blame-shifting and gas lighting. Very common phenomenon when a partner is cheating. They will say things that make you question reality...

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hippychick3

What he has already done so far is grounds enough to leave this "marriage."

 

He has already betrayed you.

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I want to talk to him and have tried but he gets defensive and tells me I am insecure and don't trust him.

 

Thank you all for the support! I really needed to hear all these comments.

 

 

 

 

Being insecure and not trusting someone are two very different things.

 

 

As far as the first, I can't answer. As far as the second, you are right not to trust him.

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aliveagain

Truth is by the time you start suspecting it's already too late. There are enough red flags on your post to stampede a heard of Spanish bulls. Most cheaters communicate from the comfort of their cars driving to and from work. A voice activated recorder heavily taped to the underside of his front seat should do the job. Don't get one that beeps when it records.

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This is known as blame-shifting and gas lighting. Very common phenomenon when a partner is cheating. They will say things that make you question reality...

Oh Wow! I just googled gas lighting. That is exactly what I am going through!

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I want to talk to him and have tried but he gets defensive and tells me I am insecure and don't trust him.

 

Thank you all for the support! I really needed to hear all these comments.

and you were intimidated and shutdown by this? Of course you don't trust him! He's hidden things from you. The fact that he can get to you with this remark says a lot about your relationship. The gaslighting and blame shifting - same.

 

Many of us here were betrayed by spouses who insisted they were "just friends." Get those VARs in place now.

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Truth is by the time you start suspecting it's already too late. There are enough red flags on your post to stampede a heard of Spanish bulls. Most cheaters communicate from the comfort of their cars driving to and from work. A voice activated recorder heavily taped to the underside of his front seat should do the job. Don't get one that beeps when it records.

I really want do the VAR but read in so many posts that it is a felony. I am leaving for an extended business trip next week. I know what he is doing to me, as mentioned earlier, is gas lighting. I guess he has gas lighted me so long I really don't know what is reality. I want to hear it... I don't know....

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I really want do the VAR but read in so many posts that it is a felony. I am leaving for an extended business trip next week. I know what he is doing to me, as mentioned earlier, is gas lighting. I guess he has gas lighted me so long I really don't know what is reality. I want to hear it... I don't know....
exactly. It's a pattern and he won't stop the gaslighting until you stop being silenced by it. That's all he wants when he's doing it - to divert the spotlight. When he says you're just insecure, you say, "Yes, of course, I am because you did x, y, z. Anyone would be. But I'm not stupid. Time after time, excuse after excuse isn't normal or acceptable and you know it." But save this. Actually now you do want to appear unsuspecting

 

If you find something, obviously there would be no apologies for how. If you don't and he knows about the VARs, still no apologies. He hasn't kept his word and has given every reason for you to mistrust. He even scapegoated you.

 

And if you're really afraid he'll have you sent to jail, then there's an even bigger problem.

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Sunnycalb808

You can only gaslight a person when they are asking questions and expecting answers from you. If you stop trying to get a confession or admittance from him, he cant gaslight you.

 

You know he is having an affair. He talks hours daily to this lady. He bought a present atvAdam &Eve a few days before Valentines. These are facts you know.

 

Your best move now is to go ahead and file. If he truly wants to save the marriage he will probably confess but only if you file. Otherwise he will deny and deny.

 

Even if you get proof ie VAR recordimgs, he will just lie and minimize it. Or deny its him or that its taken oit of context or whatever. Cheaters often continue to deny even in the face of clear evidence.

 

You already gave proof.

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I really want do the VAR but read in so many posts that it is a felony. I am leaving for an extended business trip next week. I know what he is doing to me, as mentioned earlier, is gas lighting. I guess he has gas lighted me so long I really don't know what is reality. I want to hear it... I don't know....

 

You are only using this to remove what little bit of doubt that you have. You are not going to be submitting it as evidence for a criminal trial in court. This is for your usage only.

 

 

Get a few VARs and put one in his car (cheaters often talk in the car during their commute) and also put others in places that he may be likely to be having a private conversation.

 

 

You will have all you need to know very shortly.

 

 

The fact you are leaving on a trip is the perfect bait. Get the VARs now so you can hear him making plans for when you are gone.

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This is also very important - Do NOT confront him or discuss this with him at all anymore. You want him to think that you are no longer suspicious. You want him to think that you have fallen for his story.

 

 

The more you discuss it with him, the deeper underground they will go

 

 

(as evidenced by the fact that after you confronted him about the phone bills, he got another phone)

 

 

The more you confront, the deeper they will go. You want them to feel secure as that is when they will get sloppy.

 

 

If you are serious about divorcing if you get conformation, then there really is no need to confront all. Get the confirmation you need and then you can do whatever you need to do.

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remember, you do not need to convince him that he is cheating and you do not need to get a confession out of him.

 

 

You only need enough evidence that you accept it yourself.

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Is there some reason you haven't hired a PI? Even if you put a VAR in every room you won't get anything if he's somewhere else with her.

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Yes if you can afford it get a PI, that way you will definitely not be breaking the law and they will get the "evidence" you seek.

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Don't bother with the "evidence", you really already have all the evidence you need. I'm sorry but if my H put another woman above me...buh bye! Think about it: This woman is soooo important that he refuses to stop talking to her, even though you don't like it?? That's putting her above you. Period. THAT is all the proof I would need. No man is going to put a "friend" above his wife, no man would risk tearing up his marriage, or possibly losing his wife for "just a friend".

And the Adam and Eve purchase was NOT fraud - :rolleyes: Seriously? Does he think you are that stupid? The secret phone alone would have done it for me, but add in the sex toy store and the confirmed hours and hours of phone calls - girl, please - you already know!

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