when your husband won't apologize?

[Aliceislost]

I just found out 3 days ago that my husband has been cheating on me with a coworker for the last 5 months. When I confronted him about it, he said didn't deny. He admitted to all of it. But here's where things get complicated. He said he will break of the affair but won't apologize for it. He doesn't expect me to forgive him. So I can do whatever I want. He will not try to change my mind. He was never forgiven in his life by anyone so he certainly doesn't believe I will either because of our recent past. So if I wanted I was free to divorce him.

He thinks that I only chose to marry him because during our courtship was the only phase in his life where he was "perfect". If there had been even a slight error from his end, I would have rejected him then and there. And I have confirmed his thoughts by the way I have treated him these last 2 years or so.

 

Yes, he has suffered some personal and professional setbacks during this time. And I have not been the most supportive spouse. But I never cheated on him. And it didn't even come to my mind that he will cheat.

 

But I don't want to break up my marriage. I love him with all my being. I want to work on us. But if he refuses to apologize how can I even proceed into reconciliation? Is there any way I can make my husband see that him apologizing is step forward for us and I am not going to leave him?

 

Don't tell me to just divorce him because that is exactly what my husband is expecting me to do. It will only strengthen his sense of abandonment.

[Satu]

You can't make someone apologise.

 

If it isn't heartfelt and sincere, an apology would just be empty words anyway.

 

If you want to forgive, just go ahead and forgive.

 

It seems that you have moved far away from one another within the marriage.

 

How did that happen?

[StBreton]

Hi OP

 

Just trying to understand your situation...

 

How long have you been married?

 

What has "happened" in the past 2 years?

 

What is your husband's age?

 

FYI...you are correct...in order for any reconciliation...I believe an apology is in order.

Edited November 8, 2015 by StBreton

[Grumpybutfun]

You can't proceed without contrition from him and he knows this. He wants out but is too much of a coward to ask for it. The intricacies of his manipulation and gaslighting technique makes him mentally abusive. There is nothing to be done because you are believing and buying into his self imposed victimhood. Time to stop letting him manipulate you, and time to ask yourself if this is really how someone who loves you treats you. He cheats and you aren't even allowed to feel how you feel about it because it will affect his feelings. An apology would mean he felt sorry....he doesn't. He feels nothing except contempt for you and your vows. I truly wish there were a nicer way to convey this stuff to you for you to think about so you can get help.

 

You need a professional therapist to figure out why you have such low self esteem and a general denial of your own reality. You are with a cheater who blames you for his cheating and then tells you how you will process it, leaving him with all the control over the situation. And, if you think he won't do this again, you truly are naive. Don't wear blinders and don't let him manipulate you any further. Remember you teach others how to treat you and he is treating you like you are a child who can't hold him accountable for deceit, duplicity and infidelity. His behavior is typical entitlement cheater behavior.

Get help, you cannot handle this situation with your head in the clouds,

Grumps

Edited November 8, 2015 by Grumpybutfun

[Ladyjane14]

It could be that he's too chicken**** to pull the trigger on divorce himself, so he's put the gun in your hands, so to speak.

 

I wouldn't buy into the "I can't apologize because I know I won't be forgiven" gambit. People apologize all the time without knowing if their apology will be accepted. More likely, he won't apologize because he's not sorry........... yet.

[BetrayedH]

Efff that.

 

He's not the victim here.

[carhill]

OP, IMO make a decision that is healthiest for you. If you require contrition and a plan of penance, or a simple apology, you do. If it's not forthcoming, well, as our very wise MC once opined, you have a decision to make.

 

Is it healthier for you to remain in the marriage or to leave it? Your choice. Your responsibility. H made his choices and bears his responsibility.

[dichotomy]

I am not sure I understand your husbands view.

 

He believes you wont forgive him so why ask for it?

 

Does he believe what he did was wrong ? I sense he is blaming you or holding resentment over how hard he had to work, or be perfect for you?

 

Does he acknowledge your pain?

 

When he admitted all - did he admit what, why the had the affair, how he felt about the OW?

 

 

However for reference....

 

My wife had an EA (but its worse than just a normal EA - long story)...however I will say it took 3-4 years and then couples therapy before my wife admitted what she did was wrong, said she was sorry, and realized how messed up her thinking was.

Edited November 8, 2015 by dichotomy

[bathtub-row]

It's possible that he's using reverse phychology on you by telling you what he expects you to do and then hoping you won't do it because of that.

 

The problem is, if you treated him badly, then it's possible that both of you need to apologize to one another. It's very easy to let an affair take front and center while all other issues take a back seat. That doesn't really work if you want to truly work things out.

 

I would start the conversation that way. Not in order to justify his actions, but to gain understanding about his mindset. And then hopefully the two of you can meet somewhere in the middle. However, if he continues with this arrogant stance, then whether you love him or not, you'd be nuts to stay with him.

[CarrieT]

I think the fact that he won't apologize and expects you to leave him is passive aggressive to the extent that HE really wants out of the marriage but wants you to be the bad guy in calling it quits.

[afoolto no end]

Hi there, first of all I am very sorry this has happened to you and your marriage, no marriage is perfect but no one deserves this either.......that is all on him.

First of all it's been 3 days and your husband is still in affair fog fantasy land where there are no values and rules......he isn't thinking like a real person Yet!!

All waywards feel justified to have their affairs and they do that by blaming the state of the marriage in order to get rid of their guilt......

Does he still work with this AP, because that can't happen if you are going to try to work on your marriage, the affair won't stop if they stay in contact......

A lot of us don't really know if the remorse we see is real or not or if the apology was the truth...waywards lie.

If you truly want to work on the marriage and your issues there, no contact has to be put in place and then you work on spending quality time together. filling each others most important needs.

You get what ever info you need about the affair and then let it go, you trust until he gives you a reason not to.

Both of you need to try though if he isn't willing then there really is no hope but he may be in the affair fog for a little bit and maybe even go through withdrawal.

Lay out what your deal breakers are and then leave the choice up to him, if he won't ask him to leave, see a lawyer, separate your finances.....

Waywards don't really ever consider their lives will be gone, they don't process it that way, the only way he will wake up and try is if you stand strong with your boundaries........

if not concentrate on your own life and move on.........he has to be in 100%

both of you have to be in this 100%

I think you will see after some time when he is out of the fog and thinking like a real human being again, you will get an apology.....

My husband kept trying to say it was a mistake not a choice, until he got it. He also tried to blame the state of the marriage.

A mistake doesn't last months.....A selfish choice to fill your own needs does ..

Give yourself time to consider what you want as well, he doesn't get to call the shots here, and you don't have to just take what he has changed.

This is up to you........

[Aliceislost]

I had to edit this many times before I posted this.

 

We have been married 6 years this August. I am 34, he is 35. We don't have any children.

 

A little background - my husband lost his job around 3 years ago. He found a new job 4 months later, a very tough 4 months. This new job was not as high paying but its better than nothing. But very soon after starting the job he had a fallout with his boss and some colleague. Soon it became tough for him to continue there. I was constantly asking him to mend things. We couldn't afford him to lose this. But suddenly one day when he got his salary, without any prior consultation with me, he quit. I wS stunned, more like shocked. How could he be so careless?

 

This filled me with rage. I was constantly shouting at him for days. When I think of that time now he was constantly repeating how he was loosing his dignity by working there, asked me to calm down, he will make this right. But I was livid. I thought he was just bull****ting me. I thought he had no intention to work. I thought he wanted to piggyback on my money. I was not ready to listen fo anything he had to say.

 

To his credit he did some freelance work as an electrical mechanic. But he wasn't getting enough jobs and the money he was bringing for a week was not enough for weekly groceries. I was totally cilled with resentment during this time. I was working overtime and then doing house chores ( he did his fair share). I was lashing out at him regarding anything. I was rejecting him. I was not talking to him when he tried. I was horrible to him at this period.

 

Then last year suddenly his toddler nephew died due to choking on a toy figure he swallowed. This devastated all of us. His nephew was practically like our on son. His sister got pregnant in a casual encounter in a holiday. She had no contact with the guy. So she would keep her baby with us when one of us was home. Me and my husband were beside grief. My SIL practically turned into a zombie. We had to keep her with us in turn with my parents in law to keep 24 hr watch on her. She was suicidal. This put a lot of strain on us. Infact soon I started to resent this arrangement. I thought of my SIL as another burden on me. Though I did not let my mind out loud, but some of my actions clearly reflected what I thought. I will be forever ashamed of myself for this.

 

Things started to look up when my husband found this current job and my SIL was somehow recovering from her trauma. Still we kept checks on her. I was feeling positive after a long time. I was again starting to see the bright side of my husband. I was more receptive to him, more kind, we were talking more, having sex more which I was enjoying.

 

But by then the damage was already done in my husband's mind. He had detached. And now we are here.

[BetrayedH]

Good thing that he wised up and put his penis in that other woman's vagina, because now everything is fixed, right?

 

Your husband had other logical, ethical, healthy, respectful, and moral ways of dealing with marital strife.

 

You can own your share of the marital problems. He gets to own 100% of the choice to have an affair.

Edited November 9, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Redact full quote of immediately preceding post

[MightyPen]

OP, you've both had an extraordinarily difficult past couple of years. I'm really sorry for your loss and I can only imagine how tough it was to get through those times.

 

I'm not defending your husband, as he is in the wrong, but I always try to understand both sides of the equation. He sounds like he was really beaten down by loss of employment, difficult work environments, a wife who was very upset with him, and the loss of his nephew. That sounds like a recipe to really destroy someone. Maybe he really does believe that you won't forgive him. Maybe his self esteem is shot.

 

And I will say this. "Constantly shouting at him for days" = behavior that, if done by a husband against a wife, would be viewed as abuse. Hell, I view what you did as abuse. Nobody deserves that. Both my wife and I have (once each) quit jobs without a backup plan, and although those were tense times with lots of squinty eyes and finger pointing, there was nothing like what you described doing. If my wife had yelled at me nonstop for days for making a poor decision, I would probably never forget that, and I'd have a hard time forgiving her.

Edited November 9, 2015 by MightyPen

[anika99]

Okay so how long ago did you discover the affair? Do you think your husband is emotionally attached to the OW? Do you believe he is really going to end the affair? Given his attitude and lack of remorse I think there is a strong possibility that he will not end the affair he will just get better at hiding it?

 

Your husband was in a vulnerable position. The loss of your little nephew, the worry for his sister and an angry resentful wife all combined likely left him feeling alone. I imagine that the positive attention he received from the OW was very soothing. He really needed someone to talk to and to pay attention to his pain and unfortunately he found that in another woman instead of therapy. You had grief and pain too and your feelings count too but unfortunately it came out in anger and resentment. Both of you needed counselling and probably still do.

 

Hard to say where you should go from here. Why do you think he is being so unapologetic? Possibly it's because he is emotionally attached and right now he feels more loyalty to her than to you. Maybe, as others have said, he just really wants a divorce but wants you to be the one to make the decision. The other possibility is that deep down he knows he did something very wrong and he doesn't want to feel the guilt and shame that comes with that knowledge. To protect himself from feeling more pain he denies wrongdoing and defends his fragile ego by refusing to apologize. Which of these possibilities sound likely to you?

 

In any case, you are correct that he needs to reach a place off feeling remorse before you can work on healing the marriage, but you can't make him feel remorse. A forced apology won't mean anything. How long do you want to wait for him to become truly apologetic? What if he never does?

[OldRover]

Aliceislost,

 

You both have a LOT to do.

 

You do not need his permission to divorce him, but sounds like you don't want this.

 

You need to mend the damage you did when he lost his job. That's when you should be most supportive and helping him. Now, when he quit the second job without talking it over with you, that was a fault of his.

 

With the job situation, and going though the death of the nephew, and NOT supporting each other, I can clearly see what he chose an affair. (It's not an excuse, but certainly a factor). While the affair was his choice 100%.... you certainly put him in a position where he didn't want to resist, because you were not providing him what you promised to do when you got married. (Oh yes, neither did he).

 

He may really feel that you will not forgive...seems like you've done that before? That's no excuse for not giving an apology, but a factor.

 

If you want the marriage to survive, I would argue that you accept him, as he is, tell him that you care, and that you're not going to divorce. Tell him that you are going to treat him like you should and apologize for your past. If he really wanted out, he would go.

 

Also, tell him that when he is ready, you will accept his apology. (You will unlikely survive without it). He's in a crazy state of mind now, and you need to get him back to earth. And you'll have to continue to work hard on the marriage to keep him there, and work on things that are meaningful to him. Hope he will come around and realize what he has. And he will have to eventually work on things meaningful to you.

 

Looks like you will have to take the first step on this one, if you wish to survive. Good luck.

[bathtub-row]

I guess I fail to understand why it was such a big deal for him to quit a job that he felt so demoralized at. I'll bet if the roles were reversed, if you had a job like that, you'd want him to support you. I agree with the other poster that your behavior was abusive, not to mention completely unsupportive.

 

I actually have to wonder at the words you used earlier about how much you love him. Really, your love seems to be very conditional. I would never yell at someone day after day and think this would somehow keep the marriage intact. I'm not saying that what he did was ok, but I am saying that you need to take some responsibility for driving him away. Like I said before, it sounds like you both need to apologize to each other.

 

Btw, I'm very sorry to hear about your nephew. That is truly tragic. I'm not sure why you acted that way with your SIL. You may be one of those people who has to have things a certain way and when they don't go your way, if life happens, then you go off the edge a bit. That reeks somewhat as being controlling. Something to be careful about.

Edited November 9, 2015 by bathtub-row

[dreamingoftigers]

I guess I fail to understand why it was such a big deal for him to quit a job that he felt so demoralized at. I'll bet if the roles were reversed, if you had a job like that, you'd want him to support you. I agree with the other poster that your behavior was abusive, not to mention completely unsupportive.

 

I actually have to wonder at the words you used earlier about how much you love him. Really, your love seems to be very conditional. I would never yell at someone day after day and think this would somehow keep the marriage intact. I'm not saying that what he did was ok, but I am saying that you need to take some responsibility for driving him away. Like I said before, it sounds like you both need to apologize to each other.

 

Btw, I'm very sorry to hear about your nephew. That is truly tragic.

 

I am sure five months of jamming himself into another woman's vagina was the only way he could respond to this situation with integrity.

 

And now playing wailing victim is the only recourse he has.

 

 

He just added ANOTHER already sad / traumatic trigger to a wife that was already overburdened with baggage he caused or brought in.

[stillafool]

I'm sorry for what you are going through but I think your husband is trying to push you to divorce him. Are you sure he's over his affair partner? It doesn't sound like it and maybe he's pushing you so he can go back with her.

[anika99]

I guess I fail to understand why it was such a big deal for him to quit a job that he felt so demoralized at. I'll bet if the roles were reversed, if you had a job like that, you'd want him to support you. I agree with the other poster that your behavior was abusive, not to mention completely unsupportive.

 

I actually have to wonder at the words you used earlier about how much you love him. Really, your love seems to be very conditional. I would never yell at someone day after day and think this would somehow keep the marriage intact. I'm not saying that what he did was ok, but I am saying that you need to take some responsibility for driving him away. Like I said before, it sounds like you both need to apologize to each other.

 

Btw, I'm very sorry to hear about your nephew. That is truly tragic. I'm not sure why you acted that way with your SIL. You may be one of those people who has to have things a certain way and when they don't go your way, if life happens, then you go off the edge a bit. That reeks somewhat as being controlling. Something to be careful about.

 

Yeah and the husband sounds like one of those people who go around lying and cheating when things don't go his way. Reeks of him lacking integrity and that's something he should be careful about.

 

Everyone's different. For myself I have a strong work ethic and a strong sense of responsibility to my financial obligations. I would work a demoralizing job while looking for a new job. I have done it before and I'd do it again because to me it's more demoralizing to have no job and not be able to support my family and pay my bills. Also the OP said that when her husband wasn't working she was working overtime and still doing household chores. Do you think maybe that felt a little demoralizing to her too? The OP was hurt by the death of her nephew too. She too had needs and feelings that were going unnoticed while dealing with the all the trauma of the child and the suicidal sister. She showed her pain by becoming resentful while the husband took his pain to the OW. Not excusing the OP's behaviour but her husband is no victim.

[Mr. Lucky]

Things started to look up when my husband found this current job

 

Somewhat ironic since the best chance to recover your marriage will most likely involve his quitting this job to insure NC with his OW.

 

You've already gotten good advice. I'll just add given the events to this point and you husband's PA approach, an uphill climb ahead...

 

Mr. Lucky

[bathtub-row]

I am sure five months of jamming himself into another woman's vagina was the only way he could respond to this situation with integrity.

 

And now playing wailing victim is the only recourse he has.

 

 

He just added ANOTHER already sad / traumatic trigger to a wife that was already overburdened with baggage he caused or brought in.

 

Well, if by your standards sex is merely a matter of jamming oneself into another's vagina, then what's the difference between that and him jamming himself into his wife? However, if sex could possibly have something to with connecting with another human being, then it might be said that if a person continually mistreats their partner, there's bound to be a disconnect and trouble starts.

 

I'm personally not of the school that says that just because one person cheats, the betrayed spouse is off the hook for all fallacies. Not saying that cheating is ok, but it does happen when people feel mistreated, abused, etc. It's a fact of life. So people can dig their heels in all day long and use hard core euphemisms for what that person did but it doesn't change the facts. Humans are animals and when trapped, threatened, cornered, or abused, they WILL lash out. Like it or not.

[ladydesigner]

Well, if by your standards sex is merely a matter of jamming oneself into another's vagina, then what's the difference between that and him jamming himself into his wife? However, if sex could possibly have something to with connecting with another human being, then it might be said that if a person continually mistreats their partner, there's bound to be a disconnect and trouble starts.

 

I'm personally not of the school that says that just because one person cheats, the betrayed spouse is off the hook for all fallacies. Not saying that cheating is ok, but it does happen when people feel mistreated, abused, etc. It's a fact of life. So people can dig their heels in all day long and use hard core euphemisms for what that person did but it doesn't change the facts. Humans are animals and when trapped, threatened, cornered, or abused, they WILL lash out. Like it or not.

 

He should be jamming it into his wife and not some unknown. It's a total lack of respect and integrity on his part and no the BS may not be off the hook, but neither is he. This whole bad BS gets really old from the OW on this board. I know there are some cases like this but I honestly don't think it is as high as many OW claim

[Satu]

You both share the responsibility for derailing your marriage. He did his part, you did yours.

 

Trying to establish who carries the most blame is a pointless exercise, and won't put your marriage train back on the tracks.

 

You both need to do some serious self-reflection.

 

He should look at himself, and you should look at yourself.

 

If possible, individual counselling would be a good idea.

 

Not couples counselling. Not yet.

 

 

To be honest, I wouldn't stay with someone who shouted at me for days, and I wouldn't stay with someone who is unfaithful either.

 

(Those are my rules. Other people have their own, but some lines shouldn't be crossed.)

 

 

Take care and good luck.

[bathtub-row]

He should be jamming it into his wife and not some unknown. It's a total lack of respect and integrity on his part and no the BS may not be off the hook, but neither is he. This whole bad BS gets really old from the OW on this board. I know there are some cases like this but I honestly don't think it is as high as many OW claim

 

By my standards, any man jamming anything into me would be called a rapist. "Jamming" is a really bad word choice. You've conveniently missed my point about what sex actually is and how you describe it. Understanding this difference is key to understanding my point.

 

I never said he was off the hook. They have both screwed up pretty badly and, if it were me, I'd leave the marriage for either one of these reasons. I don't tolerate cheating and I don't tolerate verbal abuse. Game over.

Edited November 10, 2015 by bathtub-row