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Reaching the end of my rope


duckrabbit

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Hello everyone:

 

 

We are three months out from DDay now and I still have yet to see effort from my WS to take any true steps toward recovery, let alone reconciliation.

 

 

In this time, she has still neglected to get STD tested, has not followed through on other requests that I have made aside from technological transparency and has even let her previously steady stream of apologizing diminish to almost nothing. We have discussed some of these things in MC and her only response in that arena has been that she is a broken person and doesn't know how to fix herself. To that effect also, she hasn't been to see her IC in almost three weeks now.

 

 

I've been working with my IC to establish boundaries in our relationship and those that I have tried to establish thus far have been met with mostly negative responses. She truly only seems to be interested in rug sweeping this and pretending like everything is normal, perhaps a 'fake it till you make it' mindset. I remain aloof in our dealings, trying to make conversation solely about the kids or work related things. Whenever we discuss the A it doesn't seem to be productive and oftentimes the information discussed seems to be new to her, even if we had talked about it in MC prior. My WS, sadly, is very good at selective memory and it astonishes me to see the extent to which this exists.

 

 

I'm just honestly not sure what else to do. She drowns herself in work and claims that she doesn't have time or energy for much else between working and trying to mask her depression. I think the only recourse I have left right now is to keep establishing boundaries as a protective measure for myself and to try to make changes for my own well being. Next week, I am schedule to see a doctor and will have them run an STD test as part of the meeting. If those results yield anything, I think that might be the dealbreaker for me.

 

 

Does anyone have some constructive ideas here as to next steps? I am definitely not seeing any signs of true remorse and I don't want to be one of those BS that regrets not divorcing after 10 more years of this. All helpful advice is appreciated. Thanks.

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Technological transparency: Is when you get a secret new email account / facebook profile / cheapo SIM card / etc, and you let your significant other have the old one with "full transparency".

 

I have 2 wallets, 2 mobile phones, 2 bank accounts, 2 email addresses, and as a matter of fact 2 bootable hard drives. It would surprise you how cheap and how little effort is required to keep 2 lives completely separated from each other.

 

Man, she shows no remorse and that´s all you should focus on. I bet she is only with you because she doesn´t (yet) have a better offer. I also bet that she doesn´t make enough money to live on her own, and that you share a mortgage...am I in the ballpark yet?

 

From what you write I can tell she is only with you due to logistics and/or gravity. You should definitely divorce her now, but not before consulting with an attorney.

 

We cheaters don´t change.

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I've been on this forum for a few months now. The ONLY thing that seems to work for the spouse who isn't doing the work to R is to do the 180. Prepare to divorce. Either she will get her act together and start the necessary work to repairing the marriage or she won't and thats ok too because then you can divorce and not be married to someone who hasnt recomitted to you and the marriage.

I did not do this after dday. I didn't know about the 180. This is the ONE thing I would have done. If you dont then you drag out uncertainty. Uncertainty about her true reasons for being there. Does she really want the other man? Is she staying until the right time to leave ? Has she been checked out of your marriage for awhile? Will she cheat again? All these questions will run through your head over and over. You know it becomes all about her and not YOU! You can't control another persons actions only your own.

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Was she in love with her OM? Depending on how involved your wife's affair was with her OM she's probably hurting internally which is probably confusing the hell out of her. Perhaps a part of her thirsts for her AP and she has to suppress that to try and show her dedication to you. You are still in the early stages of infidelity. I'd still watch out if she's in communication with OM.

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Thank you, flowergirl. I had neglected to consider the 180 as the next best solution.

 

 

jm2013, she claims that she wasn't in love with the OM and I do believe that she is no longer in communication with him. I do know that she did have an emotional attachment; however, she hasn't clearly stated just how deep that was or if it was reciprocated.

 

 

lifesontheup: I don't have a good answer for that aside from my own fear/inertia, though I am getting closer to being ready for drastic measures.

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TrustedthenBusted

 

 

Does anyone have some constructive ideas here as to next steps? I am definitely not seeing any signs of true remorse and I don't want to be one of those BS that regrets not divorcing after 10 more years of this. All helpful advice is appreciated. Thanks.

 

Oh man, I don't know what to tell you other than I was RIGHT where you are. To the letter. During the first 5-6 months, my WW told me she didn't have time to read any of the books rr information I got for her, yet during that same time she blitzed through the entire Twilight Book series.

 

Her excuse when I brought this up in MC? " I just needed a break from it all"

 

I seriously don't know how or why I stayed with her through this time. The reality is, this simply doesn't HURT for them the way it does for you, and it will be a long time, if ever, before she really understands what she's done to you.

 

3 months is not far, and NOBODY sees major results in that time. On some level, I was still looking for a quick fix at that stage, and trust me...there are none to be found. At the risk of getting pummeled here, I would lower your expectations a little bit if you want a chance at R. I've come to believe it's very natural for WS's to do exactly what your wife is doing. They struggle to accept the severity of their actions, and it takes YEARS before they can accept the lasting consquences.

 

At this point, she is probably feeling like she'd be better off without you. But eventually you will heal, and go back to being your normal happy self. THEN she will trigger, and realize that she doesn't deserve the healed, happy version of you, as well as recognize the damage she did.

 

My advice. Get Happy any way you can. It won't be 100%, but do the things you love with people you enjoy being around. Get back to your old, happy, confident self, even if you have to pretend. ( because it will come back to you )

 

Living well is the best medicine, and the best revenge. It will give you perspective as well, which at this stage, you sorely need.

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It seems like she doesn't want to deal with her 'reality', which is why she's drowning herself in her work. How do you feel about giving her an ultimatum? She doesn't go to counseling and refuses to make the necessary steps to make things work so what else are you left to do? If she's not willing to put the effort than you're fighting a losing battle. You can't do this alone. If it were me I'd ask her if she still wants the marriage and if she doesn't to stop wasting either of our time. If she does, than tell her you want to see her make the initiative (give her a time frame) and to show you she wants this as much as you do. I wish you the best but if you're the only one fighting than its a done deal.

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I have long respected your story here TrustedthenBusted; I just honestly don't know if I have the patience that you had in your situation. Like I said, I don't want to be the BS who tries to R for years and then regrets not pursuing D after some lengthy period of time.

 

 

The lack of empathy my wife displays is truly disconcerting to me. If that is something that all or many WS' go through then maybe they, as a lot, have deeper issues than merely being unfaithful.

 

 

I'm not looking for major results right now; I am looking for anything that would indicate a real effort on the part of my WW. As a general rule, I come into things with low expectations. That way, any positive outcome can be seen as a true surprise and not what I was expecting.

 

 

I think I will start sending her some reading material. That way at least I can say that I presented her with the information and she refused to do anything with it.

 

 

Thanks for your response again.

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So it was an emotional affair only?

 

What level of spying have you engaged in ?

 

What as the MC (not IC) been saying to her in your couples work?

 

You both going regularly to MC still ?

 

What steps has she agreed on so far (NC, transparency, saying she is sorry)

 

I will say that admitting she is broken and does not know how to fix it - is a actually a good step. Some WS wont even admit that right away - mine did not.

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Dichotomy:

 

 

So it was an emotional affair only?

 

 

 

No, it was a two month EA, which I ended the night it turned physical.

 

 

What level of spying have you engaged in ?

 

 

 

Lots of email and phone spying. I have extensive detailed chat logs that gave me the timeframe and plenty of cell phone record evidence and intercepted videos to establish the definite existence of an A.

 

What as the MC (not IC) been saying to her in your couples work?

 

 

 

She is still mostly in the listening game right now, but has called out my WW several times on various issues, esp. regarding the STD testing and level of detachment from the marriage the she has exhibited.

 

 

You both going regularly to MC still ?

 

 

 

Yes.

 

What steps has she agreed on so far (NC, transparency, saying she is

sorry)

 

 

 

So far, only what you have mentioned. The STD testing continues to be an issue in that it hasn't happened yet. I also want her to come with me to visit our pastor as an exercise in humility/establishing true repentance, which has also not happened yet.

 

I will say that admitting she is broken and does not know how to fix it - is a actually a good step. Some WS wont even admit that right away - mine did not.

 

 

Please tell me how this is a good thing. I can see that acknowledging that fact is a positive, but not when it doesn't lead to some sort of action.

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JS84: so far, none of any real weight. I know this is fully my own fault and is something that I am working on figuring out how to create and enact. It is part of my own issue with boundaries and holding others accountable.

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Please tell me how this is a good thing. I can see that acknowledging that fact is a positive, but not when it doesn't lead to some sort of action.

 

 

The first step to any resolution of a problem - is to admit you have one. Its a big one. Many times people with major issues from addiction to depression to health issues, pretend they don't have an issue. There is little hope for them to recover.There any many cheaters who justify their cheating, make excuses, deny it was bad, blame their BS or AP, or even think the cheating was ok or good thing.

 

Your wife has bowed her head, sad she is messed up and does not know what to do. One step.

 

 

She has established NC and some transparency - she is going to MC...those are other steps

 

Many WS remain in a fog after dDay. Not knowing what to do. Some still have to deal with feelings for AP and how to cope.

 

 

 

P.S.

 

Frankly with her messed up mind right now - I would say "I made you an appointment on Saturday for a blood test, I will drive you there and wait outside". Many married folks have STD tests for other reasons - such as IVF baby making or health scares. She does not have to be shamed while there or explain why. Or even go to her own doctor or yours.

Edited by dichotomy
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File for divorce and 180. This is your default position until you see remorse sufficient to put a halt to the proceedings. Anything short of this is devaluing yourself and she's devalued you enough already - don't do it to yourself. You walk until she starts doing the heavy lifting. If you let her pussyfoot around, that's exactly what she'll do (as demonstrated by your current "efforts").

 

Quit chasing her. Quit waiting for her. Take steps to move on with your life and if she wants to join you, she can hussle up.

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All good points, dichotomy. Thank you for making them.

 

 

The STD testing is in no way an effort to shame anyone and I have made clear that that is not the case. I have also made clear that she doesn't have to go to any doctor that she has a prior history with and she doesn't have to disclose the reasons for the testing. I have offered to drive her to an appointment, but she doesn't want me to do that, which is fine. I am not, however, going to pick up her slack and schedule an appointment. For me to consider this a genuine effort, I need her to be the one to take that step. This is also something that she knows.

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Time to get a little tough with her. She has to make time and put effort in, especially by doing counseling. To say "I'm too tired, too busy with work" is a cop out and she's avoiding facing what's ahead. She is depressed (aka grieving her exAP) and doesn't have it in her to put effort to reconnecting with you and being more active in recovery. It's not fair to you at all. I say tell her she has to get her act going or she can move out and you two do a trial separation. This doesn't mean divorce, she deserves a second chance when she is ready to give and put in 100%, though right now she seems incapable of doing that, for whatever reason(s) she's given.

 

She needs to understand where you are coming from and stop being so selfish. Once again, she's only thinking of herself.

 

I hope she doesn't have an STD that has been passed onto you. Not sure I understand why she is dragging her feet on this.

 

People don't change unless they have suffered enough consequences, or ready to, she is happy as things are, easy...Comfortable. She gets to stay married, have the life she's used to, have you, the house, comforts of lifestyle. Is it also possible in her mind she thinks everything is fine and no need to do anything else since the A is over?

Edited by whichwayisup
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duckrabbit,

I'm in agreement with TrustedthenBusted. It is a much longer process than you anticipate at first. My mood used to change wildly day by day depending on if I felt there was progress being made that day versus another day where I felt no progress was being made, or worse, was moving backwards. Like you, I also struggled mightily with feeling like my WW wasn't putting any effort into the reconciliation. I resented the fact that even though I was the "victim," I was having to do all the reconciliation work.

 

But guess what? Part of the demons that are being battled by your wife right now are the doubts that are haunting her just like you. She's not sure right now if she wants to stay, if she wants to do the work, if she is just wasting her time in the marriage with you. She may be feeling trapped in her marriage. She may be feeling depressed that she's never going to feel those " falling in love" feelings again. She's worrying that's she's never going to experience romance again. She's wondering if she just gave up the love of her life.

 

I guarantee you she is 100% telling you the truth that she is a broken person. Part of being broken is being depressed, which has a tendency to lock a person into a rut of inactivity. It is perfectly natural to be broken and not take steps to fix herself, because part of the "broken" in her is the part that would normally take steps to improve her situation.

 

Your issue, like mine, was that you probably read threads here about WW's that are doing everything by the book that they are supposed to be doing to reconcile--all the heavy lifting. And then you compare that to your own wife who doesn't seem to be doing anything at all and you're like, "if it's hard for the BS's to reconcile with WW's who are doing everything perfectly, how will I ever make it with my wife?"

 

To be honest, except in rare cases of one night stands or brief out-of-character cheating, a WW that seems to be the perfect reconciliation spouse is most likely just faking it. It might feel good for the BS for a while, but he will start to see through the facade over time and it just delays true reconciliation and puts off attacking the real problems. I'd much rather have a wife like mine or yours that is open and up front about their problems. That means a lot of cold hard truths are told to me by my wife, but I prefer the honesty. My wife is depressed. I think she is still grieving and missing her AP. I think she is still adjusting to getting back to her boring "normal" life without all the excitement of the affair. Go read the OW/OM forum about how strongly the feelings for their AP run and how long those feelings last. A woman doesn't just get over a relationship that fast. So she either lies and hides her grief and suffering from you or she is open about it. Almost all women lie about it. They want to protect their spouse from the hurt. As much as it hurt I demanded and received the truth. Now it's my choice to stay or go and as of now I'm still in the "stay" camp. So it can be done.

 

I'm not nearly as long into the reconciliation process as Trusted, but I've been in it long enough to tell you it is very very hard. If I didn't have kids, I doubt I would have lasted until now.

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PPS.

 

Glad you have done extensive spying and evidence gathering. If you have shared this spying with her - stop sharing your spying activities. If you can add more forms of spying she is not aware of (such as a VAR or other means) do it.

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+1 to dichotomy's post about spying. Spying is worthless if your spouse knows about the spying.

 

That's why total transparency after a reconciliation is such a joke. If I know my text messages are being monitored for example, I'll make sure there's nothing incriminating in those text messages.

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Thanks be strong. One of the problems is that the depression has been so prevalent for so long I am really getting tired of it especially in light of all this. I really think I am reaching the threshold of my patience.

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Thanks be strong. One of the problems is that the depression has been so prevalent for so long I am really getting tired of it especially in light of all this. I really think I am reaching the threshold of my patience.

 

I hear you. I'm in the same boat. Generally, I'm an optimist and I like to think this is just a temporary thing that will eventually pass and everything will be good, but my deep fear is that she'll never get better and do I really want to stay with her like this for the rest of my life. Being married to a depressed person is rough. A part of me thinks that she has always been this way, but just faked it for years.

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How long has she suffered from depression? After being caught it long before.

 

Also with your extensive spying results can't youbcome to some conclusions on the nature and depth of the affair. Was there " I love you" or degrading remarks towards you or marriage, was there any expressions of guilt in her messages. Etc ?

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You're probably right about that last part, be strong. Some hide it better than others. It's always been a very open part of our relationship that hasn't really annoyed me until now because its taken a very palpable toll on us. I ask myself that same question every day: do I want to stay in this relationship if she can honestly not change. It's vexing.

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