Just checking in....

[TheWalkingDead]

I'm still alive. Sorry for the bad news. (Baa boom CRASH!!!)

 

But seriously.....20 months in and it is becoming more and more obvious that I'm never going to get better. Bummer....she got to play, her cyber lover got to play, and I get to live in Hell for the rest of my life. Awesome.

[Bryanp]

You get to live in hell for the rest of your life because you choose to live in hell for the rest of your life. Why do you feel you have no options?

 

If you do not respect yourself then who will?

[BetrayedH]

At some point, we have to own our own happiness, friend.

 

For what it's worth, I'm still working on fully embracing my own advice. It takes time. But you've got to work on it. I would start by asking, why are you punishing yourself? She's the one that screwed up, right?

[TheWalkingDead]

Because I've been doing therapy....it does nothing. I've been reading articles....it does nothing. I have been working out....i get a temporary high, then return to reality that I was not and cannot be enough. I have read books....They do nothing. I have talked to my fWW....because it was "just online" she doesn't remember even the most sweeping details.

 

One of the words that triggered her memories of him when I was still in the dark is one of the most common words in radio, television, fashion, sports, books, etc. My whole damn life is nothing but an enormous string of triggers.

 

I have done everything I possibly can, and it ALL goes nowhere but to someday escaping via the same route that we all eventually take.

[BetrayedH]

...it ALL goes nowhere but to someday escaping via the same route that we all eventually take.

 

You're making an assumption here and it's becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy.

[TheWalkingDead]

A. Yes, we do all die in the end. That's not an assumption.

 

B. No, I won't have any more pain after that day. That is not an assumption.

 

Had I not been doing all I am supposed to, I'd believe that there is something worthwhile before that day. As it is, not so much.

[bigman1]

Deadman,

 

I get that you feel like crap. I get that you feel like she got to play and enjoyed that. I even get the feeling like you are not enough. I, however, do not support your "woe is me" declaration that this is how life is going to be.

 

Let's start with this, while you may love her dearly and think that she is the best thing that did, is, and will ever happen to you, the truth of the matter is that is ABSOLUTELY FALSE. She acted like a piece of sh*t, because that is who she is and was. It may not be who she is destined to be, but that future person has yet to emerge.

 

My point, is recognize that you got duped by her. That does not make you less than, it makes her less than. Get her off the freaking pedestal. You don't have to look down on her, if you don't want to, but believe me, she deserves to be looked down upon. You love her, fine. That's your cross to bear. But for the love of all that is holy and unholy, recognize that YOU are the prize. Honesty, fidelity, love and commitment were the things that you brought to the table. She didn't. You are too good for her. She did not have fun, she needed a fake azz life to try to feel good IRL. How is THAT fun?! It's like saying meth addicts have fun. Sure, they have sex, live wild and crazy, but freaking look at them... hell, smell them sometimes! They stink. Your girl looked like that on the inside!! That was not really fun, it was pitiful.

 

Chin up, Man!!! If being with her causes you too much pain, go without her. It will hurt, but try walking that path for a while.

[BetrayedH]

A. Yes, we do all die in the end. That's not an assumption.

 

B. No, I won't have any more pain after that day. That is not an assumption.

 

Had I not been doing all I am supposed to, I'd believe that there is something worthwhile before that day. As it is, not so much.

 

Well golly gee, aren't you clever?

 

What assumption? You're assuming that you'll feel this way until you're dead, which is why you mentioned it. Quit making that assumption.

 

What you ignored was my bigger point of my post...why are you punishing yourself for a mistake that she made?

[Arieswoman]

Dear Walkingdead, I am sorry you are having such a bad time at the moment.

 

Note that I said "at the moment" because it doesn't have to be a permanent state unless you want it to be.

 

Let's face it, she wasn't as great as you thought she was - right?

 

IMO you need to get out of this situation and leave her.

 

Have you read this book ;- "It's called a 'breakup' because it's broken" by GregBehrendt ? And before you say "Oh no, not another freakin' book", this one isn't full of psychobabble, it contains some straight common sense. I wish it had been written years ago when I got divorced.

 

Hang on in there, and remember it CAN get better, if you want it to be.

Edited September 22, 2014 by Arieswoman

[TheWalkingDead]

Hey Betrayed, I hear what you are saying and it may be true for others, but I'm TWENTY MONTHS IN, dealing with something that was "only online" 17 years ago, doing all the right things, and have made NO progress. And, because of my fWw's nonsense, I get triggered somewhere between 30 and 40 times a day. Everyone in here always says "Everyone's healing is different". They are correct in that, and mine happens to be impossible.

 

If you are so sure I'm wrong, please tell me what I'm doing wrong and when I might expect a turnaround.

[beach]

Because I've been doing therapy....it does nothing. I've been reading articles....it does nothing. I have been working out....i get a temporary high, then return to reality that I was not and cannot be enough. I have read books....They do nothing. I have talked to my fWW....because it was "just online" she doesn't remember even the most sweeping details.

 

One of the words that triggered her memories of him when I was still in the dark is one of the most common words in radio, television, fashion, sports, books, etc. My whole damn life is nothing but an enormous string of triggers.

 

I have done everything I possibly can, and it ALL goes nowhere but to someday escaping via the same route that we all eventually take.

 

 

When a person does counseling - it only gets different results if the person seeking help is willing to change by implementing a LOT of contrary action.

 

And since your Wasn't been receptive to handing you some peace of mind - why not take action by practicing opposite action than you always have?

 

File for divorce and have her served. That may allow her to understand you don't expect to sit idly by while she conveniently does nothing to heal the marriage!

 

She's left the marriage a broken mess and has no intent to repair the damage she's caused! There's nothing for YOU to do expect either accept that it's a crappy marriage or end that crappy marriage. I vote for the latter.

 

That way you can be done with her lies and cover up and begin to make a happy life on your own.

[BetrayedH]

Hey Betrayed, I hear what you are saying and it may be true for others, but I'm TWENTY MONTHS IN, dealing with something that was "only online" 17 years ago, doing all the right things, and have made NO progress. And, because of my fWw's nonsense, I get triggered somewhere between 30 and 40 times a day. Everyone in here always says "Everyone's healing is different". They are correct in that, and mine happens to be impossible.

 

If you are so sure I'm wrong, please tell me what I'm doing wrong and when I might expect a turnaround.

 

I am 40 months post Dday and about two years post divorce. Yet, I am still here and likely the forum's most active poster. Sometimes I am seeking support and other times, I am giving it.

 

The decision to divorce was a powerful one for me. I'm curious what is stopping you from making that decision. In my experience, most real answers have to do with fear. It's something I'd encourage you to think about. What are you really afraid of? And is it really as scary in practice as you seem to be making it?

 

Beyond that, I keep trying to come back to why you are allowing yourself to feel pain over a poor decision on the part of your wife. To a real extent, I get it. Relationships are supposed to be validating; they're supposed to make you feel valued and desired. An affair is a horrible reversal of that; it's not validation but rejection. But here's the thing...perhaps you shouldn't judge yourself based on the opinion of your wife. Perhaps you should make your own assessment of your value that's not dependent upon her.

 

Even further, perhaps your wife's actions aren't a reflection of you (or her opinion of you) at all but a reflection of something being broken within her. In my view, an affair is a symptom of a wayward having either an excessive need for external validation, an overdeveloped sense of entitlement, or severe conflict-avoidance (or a toxic cocktail of them all). Did you hear anything about the betrayed spouse in there? No. Because her illogical, unethical, immoral, unhealthy and destructive choice to have an affair wasn't about you. It was about her being broken. The extent to which you allow her choice to impact your view of yourself is entirely up to you. Stop doing it. Start using your head instead of your emotions.

 

The reality is that I still have triggers - things that remind me of my exwife's affair. I don't know how I couldn't. I spent nearly 20 years making every decision towards one goal - the betterment of my nuclear family. Suddenly, that nuclear family had a nuclear bomb dropped on it. It's history and never coming back. Now I've had about 10% of that time to readjust my life, to find a new goal for my life. Every decision every day now has to have some different focus behind it. I'm constantly reevaluating the impetus behind my decisions and so I'm constantly reminded of what happened. But the key is that it doesn't own me because it's not a reflection of me. The trigger happens and it's now just an intellectual exercise to acknowledge it and move on because I don't allow it to have a negative emotional impact. My brain is smart enough to know that it shouldn't have an emotional impact anymore. Frankly, that stupid woman gave up a great husband because SHE was stupid. Hell, she still is stupid. But I'll be damned if I'm going to let her piss-poor choices and stupidity ruin so much as one more minute of my life because they were her choices, not mine.

 

If your wife is no longer a broken person and she has true remorse for the mistakes that she made, then I encourage you to forgive her for having been such a broken person at the time. And if she's not truly remorseful and is still a broken person, then I think you should get the eff out of there and start rebuilding your life. Either way, you should forgive yourself because you didn't freaking cause any of this.

 

When you really start to get that, you'll start healing.

[TheWalkingDead]

Beyond that, I keep trying to come back to why you are allowing yourself to feel pain over a poor decision on the part of your wife. To a real extent, I get it. Relationships are supposed to be validating; they're supposed to make you feel valued and desired. An affair is a horrible reversal of that; it's not validation but rejection. But here's the thing...perhaps you shouldn't judge yourself based on the opinion of your wife. Perhaps you should make your own assessment of your value that's not dependent upon her.

 

Precisely. That is what relationships are supposed to be. *I* am not punishing myself or "allowing myself to feel pain". It is happening to me to be sure, but I would give ANYTHING for it to stop.

 

And, you all have this feel-good stuff about it having nothing to do with me. Nice try, but here is reality--I wasn't exciting, or interesting, or talented, or lovable enough to keep her attention. Period. It can't even be debated. She committed, then reversed course--by default that means I didn't hold her attention.

 

As for why no split, she is TRULY remorseful, and wants to make it work, and I love her even though she destroyed me. And, even if I wanted out, I couldn't...I'm in a, ahem, sensitive position with my work....a split would likely mean a job loss as well.

 

That all said, I maintain that I am truly stuck in the rut. I will continue to act like I give a crap about living to see another day in order to not upset those around me.

[dichotomy]

After my first marriage ended terribly due to a betrayal...I spent about two years in heck, therapy pills, working out, etc... it just took time. There was no magic bullet - maybe there was because I remember the switch flipping for me for a stupid reason, but it was my turning point and unexpected.

 

I sense in your post self esteem issues? That your not enough to keep her attention. I hope you focus on this. It was a major issue for me that also took a long while for me to work on. There are only two responses to your "I am not enough for her" 1) You aren't but you would be to someone else (i.e. some people like apples some like oranges) 2) You are on fair reflection - a little lacking in some areas - so work on it - NOT for her - but because YOU feel you could improve a little for yourself.

 

You got to find what gives you and your life meaning, even if staying in a difficult marriage, after dDay is your choice (for what ever reason) you got to do for you. Take a very long goal look at what you want and chase it.

 

Always realize there is a lot of bad stuff than can happen in our lives, lots of different losses, and it could always be worse for you in other ways. find joy or happiness in what ever little places and things and people you can.

[bigman1]

Deadman,

 

You are letting your mind play tricks on you. That you could not hold her attention is bullcrap. The problem with betrayal is that it hits you so hard that your mind is loopy and you can't think straight. Here's some facts for you: Cheaters cheat. Thieves steal. Liars lie. Thieves don't steal because victim's were to flashy, they steal because they are thieves. Liars lie not because the hearer didn't demand or command the truth. Its just what liars do. Cheaters cheat because they are cheaters.

 

If your wife cheated on you because you could not hold her attention, then she is still a piece of sh*t. Why? Because the golden rule of being married is that you don't cheat. Not you don't cheat on good spouses or pretty spouses or sexually awesome spouses. You. Don't. Cheat. So, you can wallow in all of your self hatred and self blame because it is "all your fault" and fine. If that get's you through the night crying, then so be it. The simple fact is that your wife was a POS. She was a liar. She was a thief with your heart. If it was not 100% on her, why should she feel any remorse? After all, you brought this on yourself, right?

 

I'm not your friend and we don't have any history together and I don't go around trying to make strangers feel good just for the heck of it. The simple fact is your wife sucked as a wife. You loved her and still love her, but she sucks as a wife. She's a cheater. She will always be a wife who cheated. Why? Because she is a cheater. Not that you deserved it, but because it was inevitable. Liars lie. Thieves steal. Cheaters cheat. It's cool for you to hurt and feel pain, but stop believing the lie. You could have been the best, most loving, attentive, and responsive husband and you know what....she'd still have banged some other dude. Sorry to break the news to you, but she sucked, probably still sucks, and unless she does what she needs to do, will still suck.

[BetrayedH]

you all have this feel-good stuff about it having nothing to do with me. Nice try, but here is reality--I wasn't exciting, or interesting, or talented, or lovable enough to keep her attention. Period. It can't even be debated. She committed, then reversed course--by default that means I didn't hold her attention.

 

What you are missing is that it's perfectly possible that NO ONE could have been interesting, talented, or lovable enough to keep her attention. Some people always want MORE such that nothing and no one is ever "enough" for them. Again, they have an excessive need for external validation. Or perhaps she has an overdeveloped sense of entitlement (feeling that she "deserves to be happy" and if that involves multiple men, then so be it). Or perhaps she was so conflict-avoidant that she couldn't even tell you what she 'needed' and thus, left you to be a damn mind-reader. Again, these things aren't about you. They are about her. Yet you sit here torturing yourself as if you just weren't good enough. Look pal, SHE'S the one that wasn't good enough. She made a phukked up decision that probably violated her own standards. Are you able to acknowledge that or are you just going to keep her up there on some ridiculous pedestal?

 

As for why no split, she is TRULY remorseful, and wants to make it work, and I love her even though she destroyed me.

 

Ok, fine. I see no problems reconciling with a wayward spouse that is truly remorseful, provided that the betrayed spouse is also truly forgiving.

 

And, even if I wanted out, I couldn't...I'm in a, ahem, sensitive position with my work....a split would likely mean a job loss as well.

 

What an absolutely freaking ridiculous reason to stay in a torturous marriage.

[bigman1]

Job loss for divorce, what are you, a Southern Baptist preacher? Come on. Take care of yourself.

[TheWalkingDead]

I said that I didn't WANT to leave, but if I did it would cause professional problems. That means it is the secondary reason.

[Arieswoman]

^^^^^

 

Could you expand a bit more on this WD?

 

Divorce is no longer a stigma like it used to be, this is 2014. It seems to be you are finding excuses to be miserable.....

[TheWalkingDead]

No offense, but I think those who say, "it has nothing to with me" are hopefully, cheerfully, delusional. Let me explain....

 

You said, "liars lie, thieves steal, cheaters cheat". While true on the surface, that in NO way refutes that I am a complete loser for not being enough. Liars, with the exception of the pathological, do not invent new stories for fun--they invent stories that are more attractive than the truth. Thieves, with the exception of the pathological, do not steal something because they are happy or content with what they have. If that were the case, the rusted out 1976 Ford Pinto wagon would be just as likely to be stolen as the late model Corvette. This is what the idiot therapists lie through their teeth about--Cheaters almost ALWAYS cheat up....the OM/OW is ALWAYS offering something the betrayed cannot, except in cases where the cheater is pathological.

 

I was the unattractive truth of my fWW's life, so she came up with a more attractive lie. I was the 1976 Ford Pinto wagon, and she wanted the 'vette. I was the lacking, uninteresting, unintelligent, unattractive me, but he was all of that and more, and especially because it was online and he could lie through his teeth, I will NEVER measure up.

 

I believe that if the betrayed folks out there unmasked their pain, they'd almost ALL find this to be true--With the exception of those married to someone who is pathological and/or sadistic. My fWW isn't, so the obvious is true--I was terribly, tragically lacking, and the OM was not.

 

Aries--I don't know what WD means.

[dichotomy]

If you read the BS stories here - people cheat up AND down. From the guy side - I am talking all sorts of down - from looks to smaller penis in the OM. It happens. Also alot of affairs are better (sexually or attraction wise) because it is a bit of "strange" not only the OW/OM but the WS gets to be strange themselves.

 

I suspect your self esteem issues have turned from depression to anger.

 

I get it - believe me - I had to deal with some self esteem issues you could not imagine dealing with (it could always be worse for you OP), but I had many qualities that other women would admire or be attracted too. I also worked hard in therapy and in self improvement areas on myself - it took years.

 

Channel your anger - turn it to a force to elicit positive changes and drive you to the place you need/want/deserve to be.

Edited September 23, 2014 by dichotomy

[BetrayedH]

Cheaters almost ALWAYS cheat up....the OM/OW is ALWAYS offering something the betrayed cannot, except in cases where the cheater is pathological.

 

Wrong. Cheaters often "affair-down" much to the confusion of their betrayed partner. It happens all the time and doesn't mean the wayward sas pathological. My exwife's AP was balding with glasses and frankly, not at all her type. It was far more about the extra attention.

 

As for the betrayed not being able to offer what the WW needed, what many WWs want is a second penis to play with. Good luck meeting that expectation by yourself.

[RightThere]

Wrong. Cheaters often "affair-down" much to the confusion of their betrayed partner. It happens all the time and doesn't mean the wayward sas pathological. My exwife's AP was balding with glasses and frankly, not at all her type. It was far more about the extra attention.

 

As for the betrayed not being able to offer what the WW needed, what many WWs want is a second penis to play with. Good luck meeting that expectation by yourself.

 

Agree with this 100 time over.

 

All of my WW's other men were huge steps down. Fat, balding, old, erectile dysfunctions, drunks, violent behaviour.

 

I don't think that I walk on water, but I could definitely figure out she wasn't trying to "affair-up". They latch onto men with even lower self esteem issues than your WW. Then these losers can't believe they get such a women out of their league to take their clothes off for them so they shower them with affirmation and gifts and attention. Mostly because they have nothing else going on in their lives.

 

And your WW gets all the positive self esteem from knowing they are the better one in that relationship.

[dichotomy]

P.S. Who wants a vette? Sure they are fast, with a big ..engine, and flashy and fun for a spin - but everyone knows what it stands for, its unsafe, unsecure in on rough roads, can't handle stormy weather conditions, is too loud, too fast, costly to ride, and not made to last. That's why personally I like Subaru's.... now help me load my kayak into the outback ...and we will stop for a latte on the way out to the forest preserves, there are some rapids I want to show you how to handle.

 

 

Be your own man.

Edited September 23, 2014 by dichotomy

[bigman1]

deadman, you want so desperately to be right that you ignore facts. New and interesting, younger, in shape, etc., are all temporary things. New becomes routine. interesting, becomes boring, etc. When I was dating, the best pu##y was new pu##y. Thing is, it all got old. You can believe that you lost the dog and pony show to a smarter more interesting dog, if you want. Thing is, you are a man, not a dog.

 

Let me let you in on a my past doggishness. I used to hook up with this lady in college. Her bf was the starting power forward in NCAA DIV I hoops. Built like a Greek god, hung like a bull (she told me), ended up going pro. She was creeping with me. I was an athlete, but seriously, I was no physical specimen, I wore glasses and had a little gut. I did have lots of positives like intellect and humor. Thing is, we weren't sitting around having erudite funny conversations . We were getting busy. No real meaningful conversations. I said what it took to get what I wanted, but it was truly flimsy BS. Why? We were cheaters. I know cheaters, former cheaters, and players. Bottom line, a cheater is gonna cheat. Nothing to do with you.

 

Therefore, trust me when I tell you, you didn't lose out because you suck.

You just got played by a cheater. Oh, and thieves will steal anything of street value. The vette might get stolen, but the Honda Accord is THE most stolen car. Your girl was like the thief who risked death by electrocution to steal copper wire... stupid. Nothing to do with you. Face it, you picked a bad one. You thought she was awesome and figure you lost her to a better man, when in fact she was crap and she cheated with crap and you feel like crap.