I'm pretty sure she cheated on me but Don't have concrete proof

[Arvin_Solheim]

Okej as always I feel silly even asking this question.....

I have been in a relationship for 2 and a half years and I had cheated on my girlfriend around a year ago, she forgave me and we moved on....and recently we got engaged.

a few months ago I began to suspect something but her behaviour went back to normal almost immediately after I approached her about my concerns and everything was fine afterwards but last night something weird occurred that made me suspect her to the point of being "pretty sure"....

I had to travel to Berlin this morning for a business deal that was very important to my company; unlike the previous times that I travelled she did not insist on coming with me and even called my partner and asked him if he can finish his work early so that we can go during the night so that I would have time to pay my mother a visit. My partner agreed and he picked me up around 9 P.M; now what made me suspicious was that usually around that time she goes to her parent's regardless of me being in my flat or not, but whilst I was there she started cleaning the house(which is weird because she's a messy person and our maid always does the house work) and then she made herself very pretty(She's very hot but last night she looked dazzling) she said that she did it so I'd remember how good she looks and won't flirt with other girls While I'm away, she was also pretty weird about the fact that my partner showed up an hour late to pick me up, she always cried whenever I left her but last night she was giddy!

I ignored all that and went on my way, around 11 I called her to see how she is doing and she didn't pick up her phone; 30 minutes later she called me and told me that she was talking on the phone(when I called her it didn't go to call waiting) and that she was still at my place(she had never stayed there alone after 9 P.M), that made me suspicious and I called her when I got to Berlin; I told her that I don't believe her story about "why she stayed over late" etc... she called me crazy and got mad and told me that I have no right to question her loyalty when she has never cheated on me and that if she wanted to cheat on me she had a million chances before(Typical cheater excuse) and that the fact that I accuse her of such a thing breaks her heart, she even nonchalantly told me that I cheated on her a lot of times and if I keep accusing her of it she might consider it!(Huge red flag:D) she cried a little and just to see what her reaction would be I apologised and said that I was worried and non-sense like that and suddenly she became friendly again; that's when I noticed the anger was fake because she never calms down so soon after she becomes angry....

I know if I approach her with this issue she will deny it and I can't be 100% sure whether I am right or not but at this point I know it in my gut that she cheated on me....But before I break up with her I need concrete proof....Any ideas on how I can get my hands on some?

 

 

 

The idea of her cheating is almost ridiculous to me because she just doesn't seem the type and I have been a pretty great partner since the Dday.(before that I was also pretty amazing if you'd leave cheating aside which was nothing other than a few non-emotional one night stands)

[Cpt]

Sorry for the pain you're feeling in your gut. I don't think you will be able to prove that she cheated that time, but if its a continuous affair, you can always do some detective work and find out if she is cheating.

 

At this point, do you really need proof? If the trust is gone, then the relationship is over imo. If you are feeling 100% in your gut that she cheated, then proof is not neccessary really.

 

Now that you have confronted her about it, she may be even more sneaky if she is indeed cheating.

 

Good luck, but remember to make sure you do whats best for you.

[Arvin_Solheim]

Sorry for the pain you're feeling in your gut. I don't think you will be able to prove that she cheated that time, but if its a continuous affair, you can always do some detective work and find out if she is cheating.

 

At this point, do you really need proof? If the trust is gone, then the relationship is over imo. If you are feeling 100% in your gut that she cheated, then proof is not neccessary really.

 

Now that you have confronted her about it, she may be even more sneaky if she is indeed cheating.

 

Good luck, but remember to make sure you do whats best for you.

 

The problem is that I'm 90% sure and unfortunately I can't take action unless I'm 100% sure that she is cheating otherwise some part of me would be always thinking about whether I did the right thing or not...

She is a pretty amazing person but if she did cheat on me I will leave her with no questions or further arguments; that is one thing I can never tolerate. I cannot let her go unless I'm 100% sure, at that moment I won't even waste one second.

[janedoe67]

It could be that she has not really recovered from you affair, and now she is vulnerable as well.

 

If she has cheated, that is absolutely wrong and inexcusable, but you probably want to be careful about being TOO...I'm not sure what the word is, given that you have done the same thing.

[Realist3]

Basically you have nothing but ideas swimming around in your head. You don't even have a red flag of any sort.

[Arvin_Solheim]

It could be that she has not really recovered from you affair, and now she is vulnerable as well.

 

If she has cheated, that is absolutely wrong and inexcusable, but you probably want to be careful about being TOO...I'm not sure what the word is, given that you have done the same thing.

 

 

She forgave me and we decided to move past it; she knows that I will never tolerate cheating on her part and the fact that she over looked my behaviour doesn't mean that she is entitled to behave in the same way without having to face the consequences.....

I'm not a very moral person and don't believe in right or wrong, anyone can do anything but I cannot accept, that just because I cheated the other person gets to cheat as well....at the end of the day she's not going to earn my scold or hate but I would never stay with someone who takes other men to bed.

The fact that it makes it unlikely for her to confess if I confront her is that she knows very well how easy it is for me to let go of the people I love(she has heard what happened to my ex and has seen how I cut off my ties with my father for minor annoyances) she knows that if she tells me that she cheated she won't see me surprised, shattered or angry, she'll just hear a good luck with your new friend and receives a handshake and after that I'm moved on.

Edited April 20, 2014 by Arvin_Solheim

[janedoe67]

She forgave me and we decided to move past it; she knows that I will never tolerate cheating on her part and the fact that she over looked my behaviour doesn't mean that she is entitled to behave in the same way without having to face the consequences.....

I'm not a very moral person and don't believe in right or wrong, anyone can do anything but I cannot accept, that just because I cheated the other person gets to cheat as well....at the end of the day she's not going to earn my scold or hate but I would never stay with someone who takes other men to bed.

The fact that it makes it unlikely for her to confess if I confront her is that she knows very well how easy it is for me to let go of the people I love(she has heard what happened to my ex and has seen how I cut off my ties with my father for minor annoyances) she knows that if she tells me that she cheated she won't see me surprised, shattered or angry, she'll just hear a good luck with your new friend and receives a handshake and after that I'm moved on.

 

I never stated it was okay for her to cheat. It is not. Cheating is wrong, period.

 

Just pointing out that she may not have completely healed. There are a high percentage of BS's that go on to have revenge affairs or cheat later because they left themselves vulnerable by not healing.

 

It does strike me as interesting that you state that you are "not very moral" and yet you hold her to a higher standard than you hold yourself.

[BetrayedH]

Getting all dolled-up before you left sounds a but sketchy but otherwise, I don't think you really have very many red flags here (certainly not enough to be 90%). I tend to think that you're a bit paranoid about cheating (as most cheaters are). Your blase' attitude about your own ONSs, her forgiveness, and your double standard also makes it really hard to empathize.

 

If you want to know if she's cheating or not, you did yourself a big disservice by confronting her with nothing. If she wasn't covering her tracks before your trip, she is now.

 

Typical investigations start with checking her phone. Look at the bill for frequent numbers (especially if they've been deleted). Check internet history, search history, and financial statements. Look at social media accounts and so forth. These things are free.

 

Beyond that, placing a voice activated recorder (VAR) under the steering column can reveal phone conversations on the way to/from work (which are common). You could also GPS her car, get keyloggers for her phone or PC, or even hire a PI. Of course, these things are more invasive and expensive. And since you're not married, many or all of them may be illegal.

 

Regardless of what you decide, quit confronting her without proof. At minimum, you sound like an idiot. At worst, you are one.

[Arvin_Solheim]

 

It does strike me as interesting that you state that you are "not very moral" and yet you hold her to a higher standard than you hold yourself.

 

 

In principle cheating is for me nothing more than mere "Human condition" and logically I know it should not be as soul shattering and morally frowned upon as it is but in practice I know that I can't live with someone who would give the privileges I possess to other men....in her head or some other person's head it may be okay or bad or out-right unacceptable; but I'm not responsible for how other people feel about something....She may not see cheating as a deal breaker if the perks of the relationship outweigh the bad things but for me a loyal woman who listens to me and meets my standards doesn't sleep with other men. I don't believe in all encompassing morality and find what's bad and good relative to different people from different tiers of society.

[italianjob]

In principle cheating is for me nothing more than mere "Human condition" and logically I know it should not be as soul shattering and morally frowned upon as it is but in practice I know that I can't live with someone who would give the privileges I possess to other men....in her head or some other person's head it may be okay or bad or out-right unacceptable; but I'm not responsible for how other people feel about something....She may not see cheating as a deal breaker if the perks of the relationship outweigh the bad things but for me a loyal woman who listens to me and meets my standards doesn't sleep with other men. I don't believe in all encompassing morality and find what's bad and good relative to different people from different tiers of society.

 

Well, maybe she doesn't agree and feels entitled to treat you in the same way you treated her, or maybe she, like you, thinks that an "unemotional ons" is allright. You are not inside her head the same way that she isn't in yours.

Anyway, I don't think you have any element to accuse her, if you want to find out or get a confession you'll have to confront with better proof.

[Spectre]

I'm on the fence about this one. Since you cheated in the past..it COULD be she is just..more or last trying to get you to feel what it might be like, without actually cheating on you..if that makes sense? Like kind of getting you to worry a bit just to teach you a lesson. Not that I would say that is exactly right. On the other hand, yes I admit I did find some things a bit odd. The dressing up bit is weird to me. She did it so you will "remember her" and not flirt. It's weird that one this one occasion she would make a big deal about it.

 

Simply put: dressing up nice isn't going to prevent a man from cheating. That logic doesn't make any sense. Men with beautiful wives cheat, it happens. Look at the number of celebrities who have cheated on their gorgeous wives with other women. Hell, Tiger Woods wife was stunningly beautiful and he STILL cheated on her. So..it is weird to me she would think it would make a difference..and would suggest to me maybe she was getting dressed up for another occasion. What that occasion was? I can't say.

 

I just want to point out one thing you said that is a mistake most people make, you said she doesn't seem like the cheating type. Well the thing is most people do not like to be cheated on, right? So most people would not get into a relationship in the first place with someone who seemed like they would cheat. That is part of what is so devastating about being cheated on..you thought this person loved you and they show otherwise.

 

Honestly, you cheated on her so if I were her I would of dumped you and never looked back, but she did take you back so that means she agree's to not cheat as well and something does seem fishy about this situation. I think either she is cheating OR she is really going out of her way to make you think she is..as some weird form of payback? Either situation isn't exactly good, although obviously you would probably prefer if she wasn't actually cheating on you. I think you really need to sit her down and have an honest talk with her, try to be understanding of how badly you hurt her in the past, but also make sure you make it clear it doesn't give her the right to try to even the score by hurting you. If it turns out she isn't cheating..I would think maybe she might be glad you were so worried about losing her? It just depends on who exactly you phrase things.

Edited April 20, 2014 by Spectre

[troubadour]

I have a very funny feeling about this thread and the OP.

[Arvin_Solheim]

I'm on the fence about this one. Since you cheated in the past..it COULD be she is just..more or last trying to get you to feel what it might be like, without actually cheating on you..if that makes sense? Like kind of getting you to worry a bit just to teach you a lesson. Not that I would say that is exactly right. On the other hand, yes I admit I did find some things a bit odd. The dressing up bit is weird to me. She did it so you will "remember her" and not flirt. It's weird that one this one occasion she would make a big deal about it.

 

Simply put: dressing up nice isn't going to prevent a man from cheating. That logic doesn't make any sense. Men with beautiful wives cheat, it happens. Look at the number of celebrities who have cheated on their gorgeous wives with other women. Hell, Tiger Woods wife was stunningly beautiful and he STILL cheated on her. So..it is weird to me she would think it would make a difference..and would suggest to me maybe she was getting dressed up for another occasion. What that occasion was? I can't say.

 

I just want to point out one thing you said that is a mistake most people make, you said she doesn't seem like the cheating type. Well the thing is most people do not like to be cheated on, right? So most people would not get into a relationship in the first place with someone who seemed like they would cheat. That is part of what is so devastating about being cheated on..you thought this person loved you and they show otherwise.

 

Honestly, you cheated on her so if I were her I would of dumped you and never looked back, but she did take you back so that means she agree's to not cheat as well and something does seem fishy about this situation. I think either she is cheating OR she is really going out of her way to make you think she is..as some weird form of payback? Either situation isn't exactly good, although obviously you would probably prefer if she wasn't actually cheating on you. I think you really need to sit her down and have an honest talk with her, try to be understanding of how badly you hurt her in the past, but also make sure you make it clear it doesn't give her the right to try to even the score by hurting you. If it turns out she isn't cheating..I would think maybe she might be glad you were so worried about losing her? It just depends on who exactly you phrase things.

 

 

I don't think she would go through that much trouble just to make me feel like ****....

 

I have a very funny feeling about this thread and the OP.

 

I know, my situation sounds pretty lame....I hate being in this state, I can't prove anything and I can't accept what she said....so....yay me

I'm still going to come out fine out of this...that much I'm sure but until then, I guess I have to put up with these stupid feelings....

[SCAATY]

Spend some time treating her like a women you love and want to be with for the rest of your life. If not then break this off and let her find happiness.

 

I get this feeling that you overvalue what you give to a women. If your money and possessions were that wonderful she would not cheat. If you treat her like she is a prostitute that you pay for, then I would be worried.

[Arvin_Solheim]

Spend some time treating her like a women you love and want to be with for the rest of your life. If not then break this off and let her find happiness.

 

I get this feeling that you overvalue what you give to a women. If your money and possessions were that wonderful she would not cheat. If you treat her like she is a prostitute that you pay for, then I would be worried.

 

 

Seriously? That's supposed to help? where did I mention that all I give her is money and possessions? I'm not the type of guy who impresses women with his money....

[SCAATY]

What type of guy are you?

 

You cheat on a women and then what?

 

Did you go to IC to determine the cause?

 

Did you go to joint counseling to try to better your relationship?

 

After she accepted you back did you think everything is fine?

 

Are you so naive as to think that her first response is the way it will be forever?

[SCAATY]

How many time have you cheated on your girlfriends?

 

You want this board to help you do what?

 

Catch your girl friend cheating after you have cheated on her how many times?

 

Somewhere it is written that you reap what you sow. I am sorry that this board is not designed to help you cheat and then give you support when you partners feel that they need to cheat.

 

Something is just wrong with your thinking.

[aliveagain]

Time to install a keylogger on her computer. Would your neighbours notice any visitors coming to your home? Always trust your gut. Too many red flags.

[forbidden_love]

Evil thinkers are evil doers. What I always find is that your behaviour is paying you back in that you are imagining that she thinks how you think. A price to pay.

[Buckeye2]

Get her panties from the hamper when you return from your trip. You can get a kit or send them off for semen testing. She needs not to have sex with you for at least 3 to 5 days or you might be detecting your own semen.

[lolablue17]

Trust your gut.

 

Arrange another business trip and this time be prepared.

[10thengineerharrison]

The problem is that I'm 90% sure and unfortunately I can't take action unless I'm 100% sure that she is cheating otherwise some part of me would be always thinking about whether I did the right thing or not...

She is a pretty amazing person but if she did cheat on me I will leave her with no questions or further arguments; that is one thing I can never tolerate. I cannot let her go unless I'm 100% sure, at that moment I won't even waste one second.

 

It sounds like you both could use a little growing up before making a commitment like marriage.

 

This is a no-brainer. Trust your gut and cancel the engagement. Learn how to be truthful with one another and see where the relationship goes from there. Maybe get married in a few years, if you both can be faithful for that long.

 

-10th Engineer Harrison

[Arvin_Solheim]

She came over today and was pretty upset at me for accusing her and told me that if I don't trust her, then what is the difference between me (who used to cheat) and her (who never cheated), I faked my acceptance of her excuses...She emphasised it on and on that she would never ever cheat on me and said things that she usually says "You're better than anyone I know" etc.....

She told me that I'm being paranoid because whenever I do something out of the ordinary I am cheating and that she has come to understand it well; she basically asked me not to judge her by my own personality.....

 

Still......I wasn't convinced knowing that she's a pretty smart person who is capable of lying well.....

I've already talked to a PI - I had never been embarrassed in my entire life; I guess there's a first time for anything, eh? I'm going to put her under constant surveillance while I'm not around....

I'll just sit and wait....I've decided to stop thinking about the issue and it worked with no difficulty; if some evidence turns up then I'll move forward with it, I'm just glad we haven't made any plans for the wedding yet and we're likely not going to do so before 2015....that would've over complicated things.....

 

 

What I find odd about her behaviour is that if she is cheating, there's clearly not an obvious reason for it because she invests a lot in our relationship; both emotionally and financially, she's always around, always nice, our sex life is pretty great after all this time and just a few days ago she bought me a ridiculously expensive Omega watch because I had lost mine in a boat trip we made a few months back. I always bought my girlfriends expensive things when I was cheating just to make them ignore my change in behaviour, is it the same for women? (I wouldn't have thought it to be since I can't get distracted by gifts and nice gestures)

Edited April 21, 2014 by Arvin_Solheim

[Spectre]

I don't think she would go through that much trouble just to make me feel like ****....

 

You'd be surprised at the cruelty some people are capable of inflicting on their spouses.

[henson]

Getting all dolled-up before you left sounds a but sketchy but otherwise, I don't think you really have very many red flags here (certainly not enough to be 90%). I tend to think that you're a bit paranoid about cheating (as most cheaters are). Your blase' attitude about your own ONSs, her forgiveness, and your double standard also makes it really hard to empathize.

 

If you want to know if she's cheating or not, you did yourself a big disservice by confronting her with nothing. If she wasn't covering her tracks before your trip, she is now.

 

Typical investigations start with checking her phone. Look at the bill for frequent numbers (especially if they've been deleted). Check internet history, search history, and financial statements. Look at social media accounts and so forth. These things are free.

 

Beyond that, placing a voice activated recorder (VAR) under the steering column can reveal phone conversations on the way to/from work (which are common). You could also GPS her car, get keyloggers for her phone or PC, or even hire a PI. Of course, these things are more invasive and expensive. And since you're not married, many or all of them may be illegal.

 

Regardless of what you decide, quit confronting her without proof. At minimum, you sound like an idiot. At worst, you are one.

 

"quit confronting her without proof" I pretty agree with this. You shouldn't just sit here and think about she is cheating with someone or may have an affair with another man, stop being an idiot and get hard evidence by check her phone calls, sms with a mobile keylogger.

Edited April 22, 2014 by henson