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A commitment to honesty


katielee

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that's what needs to happen after an infidelity.

 

my husband asked me my most important need and this is it... he said, "are you sure it isnt fidelity?" no it's honesty.

 

People can gut out being faithful, when they maybe want someone else, or think about their AP, or see their AP... but honesty, that's something you can't willpower your way through..it's telling the truth and letting go of the outcome that is my definition of integrity. It's laying your soul bare that is vulnerability. Tell me the truth and let me decide if I want to stay.

 

I see people who say, "I will never cheat on you again.." Promise me honesty. The lies, the dissatisfaction with the marriage, the attraction to another person - those all start before the affair does.

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If there is 100% honesty, there can never be cheating. Think about it. Can't happen.

That's a really good point. Affairs may still occur, but they're open and honest. That doesn't necessarily indicate an affair is healthy, but it is honest. When we were in MC, I found direct confrontation and honesty regarding my EA to be empowering, especially in the directed focus of the MC process. Prior, such honesty was far less productive and far more emotionally loaded. MC really helped focus the honesty in a healthy way.

 

OP, kudos to your H for asking an important relationship question and the same to you for giving him a clear and direct answer. Good luck!

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If there isn't honesty then it really doesn't matter if they cheat or not, because you can't be sure of anything. The relationship is doomed without honesty and trust.

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experiencethedevine

It is the single most powerful element in a relationship.

 

 

Without honesty, survival after the trauma of infidelity is simply a door open for more of the same.......................

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Also honesty might not save the relationship, but it might save you from a ton of pain and misery. It is what we need first.

 

We would like fidelity, but if it's not going to be there WE NEED TO KNOW so we can get out of the relationship and begin anew somewhere else.

 

If it's past infidelity and you have changed, then we need to know that as well. Then there's a chance for reconciliation. On the other hand past infidelity with dishonesty about it points towards future infidelity.

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lilmisscantbewrong

Katie you are on to something for sure. I remember my Xmom saying after dday (the second one) he was done being dishonest - he said he had been that way the entire marriage - in everything - finances, etc and he was going to be honest no matter what that meant - married or divorced. (He still isn't from what I can tell but that doesn't matter to my life anymore). Still doesn't take away the truth of what he said.

 

Same thing for my husband and I trying to recover - I even found where my husband who I thought never lied was not honest either - still now as we rebuild I do not know what the future holds. I try to be extremely honest now in all I do but there is a very hard road that has to be navigated for us.

 

Without honesty you have nothing really.

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You hit the nail on the head. Even though I had three requirements for reconciliation: no lying, no cheating, and no contact - all I really needed was honesty. That would have allowed me to come to grips with reality and make informed decisions accordingly. If she was done, I needed to know. If she wanted an open marriage, I needed to know. If she was really remorseful and prepared to open up, I needed to know.

 

Sadly, I got nothing of the sort. That makes even divorce 50x harder than it needs to be. I still have no way to believe a single thing that she says or to trust that she's not trying to screw me over. Honesty solves all of that.

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and saying anything but the truth is manipulating someone into staying married to you... controlling the information your spouse has is at the very least - only self-serving and the very opposite of love.

I will call myself out on that. did it for a year. Completely unfair, cruel, and pathetic.

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Even if you had honesty right from the start, there are some people that will never trust again. And maybe rightly so, but some cannot ever forgive. I only ever lied to my H about the affair initially, then I admitted it. I never lied after and he did not believe me, even when I was attacked by a sex offender. Never forgave him for that, hence no chance of reconciliation ever. some people do not have it in them to forgive, mostly men,

 

Having a hard time following your point here.

 

I agree that men are less apt to forgive than women; statistically there's about a 10% variance.

 

But what does this have to do with honesty? You'll only be honest if you think you'll be forgiven? I'm not trying to put words in your mouth, just trying to understand. It drives me crazy how many people in this world only do something if it benefits them (like only being honest if it means I'll get something like forgiveness). Why can people not just do things because they are the right (moral, ethical, respectful, healthy, etc) thing to do?

 

I see the same thing when people ask if they should inform the other BS. Posters ask things like, "What will you gain from that?" Well maybe the point isn't always about ourselves; maybe we do some things just because they are the right thing to do by someone else.

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Forgiveness and honest have no relation to each other. If you will only be honest because you want to be forgiven, then you are not letting go of the outcome. Honesty comes from a desire to be authentic to who you are. Some people never get there.

 

Sometimes honesty comes from a place other than that though. I was honest about being unfaithful, before I ever did it.

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AlwaysGrowing

Doing the right thing is rarely the easy thing to do. That is why, the more we can choose the right thing..the easier it becomes. We fear it less. It's really not that scary afterall.

 

We let go of the outcome.

 

Move towards the light.

 

Living life...with eyes wide open.

 

And oh...how we enjoy the little things...so much more.

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Doing the right thing is rarely the easy thing to do. That is why, the more we can choose the right thing..the easier it becomes. We fear it less. It's really not that scary afterall.

 

We let go of the outcome.

 

Move towards the light.

 

Living life...with eyes wide open.

 

And oh...how we enjoy the little things...so much more.

 

I agree. My default position is to be honest. I need a good reason to be dishonest (pretty darn rare but I still lie about Santa and the Tooth Fairy). I find it's an easy position to live from. I don't really care who knows what about me because it's all already out there.

 

But I know others whose default position is to lie and they really are only honest when they trust the other person (which is sadly, usually a partner in crime that is not actually trustworthy). They end up having to consult with one another about who was told what lies so they can back each other up. That sounds exhausting and ridiculous to me.

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AlwaysGrowing

From my own life experience...it is the people who have fallen, took ownership and reformatted themselves..are the most interesting, fun people to be around.

 

There is a joy about them. An aura..if you will.

 

It is so easy to be around them. They hide nothing. And because they don't...you get to see all of them. They accept what they have done..without defensiveness. And because they do not hide that part (not to say they shout it on mountain tops)..they also do not hide the best parts of them.

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I have the best therapist and she explained why honesty is so difficult for some people. For some people they don't see being dishonest as a flaw but an asset to their entitlement. Dishonesty in a marriage or relationship mirrors dishonesty in all aspects of society, whether it's in business, politics, commerce....except that it's not illegal to cheat on your spouse but it's illegal to cheat your customer, cheat on your taxes, cheat on your constituents.

 

Sadly, the very foundation of a healthy society begins in the home and this is where it's crucial to develop future generations that contribute to a healthy and honest society. It's a human condition that throughout history has seen many great civilizations meet it's downfall when it has been overwhelmed by corruptness in it's very own fabric.

 

Human nature both condemns dishonesty but at the same time enables it because many people, multi national companies and weak governments profit in duplicity. For some people being honest means losing their entitlement and control. That in itself for some people is unthinkable.

 

I apologize in advance for my mini rant....maybe it's the Christmas season and it's meaning that has become commercialized that has gotten to me.

 

Honesty is the best policy, too bad some don't practice it.

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that's what needs to happen after an infidelity.

 

my husband asked me my most important need and this is it... he said, "are you sure it isnt fidelity?" no it's honesty.

 

People can gut out being faithful, when they maybe want someone else, or think about their AP, or see their AP... but honesty, that's something you can't willpower your way through..it's telling the truth and letting go of the outcome that is my definition of integrity. It's laying your soul bare that is vulnerability. Tell me the truth and let me decide if I want to stay.

 

I see people who say, "I will never cheat on you again.." Promise me honesty. The lies, the dissatisfaction with the marriage, the attraction to another person - those all start before the affair does.

I agree with this including the subsequent posts, its simplicity is just beautifull. The problem with it is that neither honest nor dishonest people will have any problem saying "I'll be honest with you"

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Honesty is crucial.

 

But I think there is some level of honesty that works for some couples and it may not be the same for every couple.

 

I do think the deepest most intimate relationships are were both love so deeply and also are secure in themselves and that love - that they can share any thought or feeling or past event - and be accepted. That's deep accepting unconditional love and honesty - and tough to find a couple who can deal with it.

 

It has been debated here on LS - about how honest any WS can be - or should be - about some thought stuff like sexual details, if the AP was better in bed, and if a random thought or feeling popped in their head later.....while you both walking down the street hand in hand.

 

Honesty to me is simply being honest that I am the man for my wife and that she wants and needs me only -desires me -and is committed - and shows it (not just words). Also Honesty adhering to NC and being honest and open on that end, and also she expressing her needs and issues with me or the marriage as they come up so we can face that as a couple..

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Cinnimon - your post makes sense in this thread.

 

I'll answer as a former wayward. When I confessed to my husband he said it was one of the most selfish things I've ever done. I relieved my guilt and placed the issue on his shoulders. I didn't see it that way but I see his point.

 

I was ready to drive off a bridge or tell him. It wasn't that I wanted him to hurt, my quest was that I felt so strongly about him knowing the kind of person he was married to. I knew I had screwed up to the point that my marriage would probably end. I loved him enough to put the truth out there to let him decide. It was so selfish of me to hold the information, thus manipulating him. I suppose everything I did was selfish, if you think about it.

 

When ppl start affairs they don't think about any of the ramifications. As an adult, it's our responsibility to see how the decisions we make will affect others. I'm convinced the person we need to be the most honest with is ourself.

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One of the questions my children asked my fWS was: Why didn't you just tell Mom the truth?

 

You two could have separated and gone to counseling while you pursued these feelings for another. Mom could have then had the freedom to date others also while YOU BOTH decided if there was a marriage worth saving?

 

out of the mouths of babes......

 

Would that have hurt me? Of course it would have. I loved the man.

 

But it would have been HONEST and ADULT and I would have handled it so much better than having been deceived for so long. It's the lying and deception that nearly killed us....NOT the feelings developing for another.

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