What is "recovered"?

[Owl]

Read a post by Drifter in another thread, asking an excellent question.

 

Drifter noted that people often post "it takes 2-5 years to recover a marriage from infidelity", and asked...what the hell does that really mean? (paraphrased, of course).

 

I'd like to post what it means to me...and ask others to chime in with their thoughts and views.

 

It took about 2 years before I truly felt that my marriage was "recovered". And we did a LOT of the right things earlier/sooner than most.

 

"Recovered" to me at the time meant that her emotional affair was no longer relevent to where our relationship was at that point. It was in the past...it wasn't where we were at then, nor did it really have a huge bearing on where we were at...other than as a catalyst for a lot of the changes that we'd made to get there.

 

I didn't think about it all the time anymore. It didn't pop into my mind with anything near the same frequency it had previously. I no longer worried constantly that she was communicating with OM in some fashion I was unaware of. I no longer felt the need to repeatedly check her emails/phone/etc...

 

I trusted her again. Perhaps that's one of the critical identifiers in my mind.

 

I'd also regained a lot of my personal strength. I'd learned some painful lessons but also realized that if it DID somehow happen again, I knew that I'd deal with it, work through it. (because I'd realized I wouldn't go through that again...she knows well that if it were to happen again, I'd not make any attempt at reconciliation again).

 

Our marriage was happier than it had been for years...still is, in fact.

 

So that's my 'vision' of recovery...simply put, its when you/if your marriage gets to a point afterwards where you can put the affair in the past, where you can trust that it's good in the present, and you've learned how to try to protect it more in the future.

 

For those of you also 'recovered'...what did it look like to you?

 

For those working on it...what do you envision that it should/will be?

[ChooseTruth]

I'm probably not that eligible to reply because we will never recover...but from what drifter often describes I could understand his confusion. I don't think he ever recovered even after 10? years or so. I think he trusts her now but holds a lot of resentment because it was handled badly at the time (rugswept). Harley mentions that there is a debt to be paid when infidelity occurs, it's too great of an offense to just let go. Maybe in drifter's case the debt was never repaid and it eats him up. The relationship is imbalanced.

I'm not sure how I would handle things in his case either. I feel bad for him often when I see his posts

[Owl]

I'm probably not that eligible to reply because we will never recover...but from what drifter often describes I could understand his confusion. I don't think he ever recovered even after 10? years or so. I think he trusts her now but holds a lot of resentment because it was handled badly at the time (rugswept). Harley mentions that there is a debt to be paid when infidelity occurs, it's too great of an offense to just let go. Maybe in drifter's case the debt was never repaid and it eats him up. The relationship is imbalanced.

I'm not sure how I would handle things in his case either. I feel bad for him often when I see his posts

 

Please realize...I'm in NO way calling Drifter out. On the contrary...he asks an excellent and valid question.

 

Not saying that he "doesn't get it" or anything like that at all.

 

It's a good question that I don't think is all that well defined by most folks.

[Betterthanthis13]

Are you asking specifically about feeling personally "recovered", or the marriage being recovered? Do you think personal recovery has a different timeline if D is the choice and not R?

[Owl]

Are you asking specifically about feeling personally "recovered", or the marriage being recovered? Do you think personal recovery has a different timeline if D is the choice and not R?

 

I'm specifically talking about marital recovery. That's what they say takes 2-5 years.

 

I believe that personal recovery is PART of marital recovery, but it's not synomous, and frankly I think it's got it's own timeline and descriptors.

[janedoe67]

Owl, I agree with your definition completely.

 

When the A is still held out like the universal trump card....a couple is not recovered.

[Betrayed&Stayed]

I mark my "recovery" at the 3-year mark. It was at that 3-year mark that I felt that I had reached the light at the end of the darkest tunnel. I had run the course of grieving, and reached the Acceptance phase.

 

At the 3-year mark I was willing to trust again and become more vulnerable in our marriage.

 

I think each person has their own unique vision of what "recovery" looks like. We all have different levels of what is acceptable in our marriage/relationship.

 

Recovery/Reconciling is not a destination, but a process. We will always be recovering/reconciling.

[dichotomy]

Eight years, not fully recovered.

 

Its been a trickle recovery but several key steps and changes made over the years. My self esteme and confidence being a big one for me personally.

 

....But there was alot to work on besides just the specific EA with the OM. Ton of bagage brought into the marriage. My wife was messed up before she met me so much hidden. We have time now to focus on remaining specific issues now that other stuff has been solved. I suspect if I did not have all the other stuff to deal with 5 years would have been more than enough time if it had been a "simple" EA.

Edited October 3, 2013 by dichotomy

[drifter777]

Owl, I agree with your definition completely.

 

When the A is still held out like the universal trump card....a couple is not recovered.

Obviously, this is true. When a BS holds on and punishes their WS in an attempt to grab the moral high-ground in every argument, it is abuse. In that case the BS is triggering themselves so he/she can shame the WS and control them. This is certainly one "test" of judging reconciliation but I think it is an extreme example. More typical examples would be the BS still has to check phones email accounts, etc. for reassurance; when something triggers the BS memory they want to toss their WS out the window for a few seconds until they remember that would put them in jail. Things like this that the WS never knows are still happening. Understanding that the WS wants their cheating to be forgotten ASAP and never brought up again, I think they are quick to declare that they have reconciled. The BS may go along with that declaration if progress has been made and thing feel like they are going in the right direction. But get that BS alone and ask them if they truly feel they are reconciled you are going to get a different answer from many of them.

[Owl]

Obviously, this is true. When a BS holds on and punishes their WS in an attempt to grab the moral high-ground in every argument, it is abuse. In that case the BS is triggering themselves so he/she can shame the WS and control them. This is certainly one "test" of judging reconciliation but I think it is an extreme example. More typical examples would be the BS still has to check phones email accounts, etc. for reassurance; when something triggers the BS memory they want to toss their WS out the window for a few seconds until they remember that would put them in jail. Things like this that the WS never knows are still happening. Understanding that the WS wants their cheating to be forgotten ASAP and never brought up again, I think they are quick to declare that they have reconciled. The BS may go along with that declaration if progress has been made and thing feel like they are going in the right direction. But get that BS alone and ask them if they truly feel they are reconciled you are going to get a different answer from many of them.

 

A lot of that makes sense.

 

I know I declared myself 'reconciled' earlier than the point where I truly, honestly felt that I was. I THOUGHT we were reconciled around a year post d-day, but it wasn't truly into sometime around the beginning of year 2 that I felt the way you describe. No more checking of emails/texts, no worries about whether or not things were still continuing or going to go back to the way they were.

[ladydesigner]

We are far from recovered and not sure we will ever get to 'fully', I hope so, that is the plan

 

I do know that we are in a much better place today at 20 months post Dday. The A is not on the forefront of my thoughts, it doesn't bother me anymore, and I am starting to see Reconciliation as positive rather than a weakness ( that was a huge hurdle for me).

[Snowflower]

Excellent question, what the heck does "recovered" mean?

 

I really like what ChooseTruth said with the great imbalance caused by infidelity in a marriage.

 

Unless a couple finds a way to even out that imbalance, I think the marriage will always be suffering to a degree. I never realized this until very recently but yes, my husband inadvertently found a way to bring things back in balance for us. It wasn't an intentional act by him to right the wrong he did 5 years ago but it this a huge thing that he has done.

 

Even without this "balancing," I knew we were getting close the last few months. Time had moved us forward. I bought another house with him this summer, something I swore I would never do again after he let me down so badly.

 

 

Next month will mark 5 years since d-day for my H and me. However, I would say it was 4.5 years for me to say we were recovered and now I can say with confidence we are completely recovered.

[dichotomy]

Obviously, this is true. When a BS holds on and punishes their WS in an attempt to grab the moral high-ground in every argument, it is abuse. In that case the BS is triggering themselves so he/she can shame the WS and control them. This is certainly one "test" of judging reconciliation but I think it is an extreme example. More typical examples would be the BS still has to check phones email accounts, etc. for reassurance; when something triggers the BS memory they want to toss their WS out the window for a few seconds until they remember that would put them in jail. Things like this that the WS never knows are still happening. Understanding that the WS wants their cheating to be forgotten ASAP and never brought up again, I think they are quick to declare that they have reconciled. The BS may go along with that declaration if progress has been made and thing feel like they are going in the right direction. But get that BS alone and ask them if they truly feel they are reconciled you are going to get a different answer from many of them.

 

Good post.

 

You know all marriage have their ups and downs - for example there might be dry spells sexually, that a non affair marriage simply might cause some stress or a bit of an argument - but with an affair in the past- the BS might blow a gasket and go nuclear (because maybe WS was so intense or sexual with AP). I do this now - when something happens - I try to seperate the normal frustration of an issue in a marriage - from the triggers of the affair. At somepoint I as BS need to control tieing anything negative in the marriage - to past hurts instead of looking at it seperatly. Honestly to tell my spouse EVERYTIME you turn me down for sex, or we go a few weeks without - I get angry again at how sexual/passionate/flirty she was with OM. So that at somepoint becomes a burden have to deal with on my own, but it is difficult to not throw down that "A" Trump card when something triggers it. WS may never know how many times I have to deal with this impulse.

Edited October 3, 2013 by dichotomy

[Snowflower]

Good post.

 

You know all marriage have their ups and downs - for example there might be dry spells sexually, that a non affair marriage simply might cause some stress or a bit of an argument - but with an affair in the past- the BS might blow a gasket and go nuclear (because maybe WS was so intense or sexual with AP). I do this now - when something happens - I try to seperate the normal frustration of an issue in a marriage - from the triggers of the affair. At somepoint I as BS need to control tieing anything negative in the marriage - to past hurts instead of looking at it seperatly. Honestly to tell my spouse EVERYTIME you turn me down for sex, or we go a few weeks without - I get angry again at the sex you had with OM....well that a burden I guess I have to deal with on my own, but it is difficult to not throw down that Trump Card of the affair or past.

 

This is very honest!

 

I used the affair as the trump card for a long too. I knew I shouldn't be but somehow I couldn't help it. If we had a regular married-people argument that pre-affair would have been annoying to me, well after the affair this same argument became sinister.

 

This is another reason why I think the imbalance that CT mentions is so appropriate. An affair is a grievous wrong perpetrated on an innocent spouse. It takes a lot to balance that out.

[NotCamelot]

For me, when I don't think about it all the time will be the point where I feel the "recovery" is in full swing.

 

17 months past D-day now. I don't think about it all-day everyday. But I think there is a part of every day that I do. I find that as long as I am with my W, I usually don't. But during the work week, it will usually hit me while we are getting ready for work. Then a few times throughout the day.

 

It is progress compared to where I was 6 - 8 months ago. I am at the point where I still wonder if I'm the one....even though she proves to me that I am. I still hurt at times. Though it does not compare to the first 12 months.

 

So, in answer to the original question, when the thought of her A is not a part of my daily thoughts, and is a distant bad memory, we will be recovered.

 

I long for the day when, if the thought comes up, I think "wow, I have not thought about that in a long time". The sooner the better.

[dichotomy]

This is very honest!

 

I used the affair as the trump card for a long too. I knew I shouldn't be but somehow I couldn't help it. If we had a regular married-people argument that pre-affair would have been annoying to me, well after the affair this same argument became sinister.

 

This is another reason why I think the imbalance that CT mentions is so appropriate. An affair is a grievous wrong perpetrated on an innocent spouse. It takes a lot to balance that out.

 

 

Yes it does, but as you mention we can try to understand when we have played that card too long. Also to focus very hard that any marriage .... even if she married OM would face these issues.

Edited October 3, 2013 by dichotomy

[Breathless]

I hope you don't mind my comment...I'm a WW. It's been a little bit over 2 years since my DDay.

 

My BH and I believe we have "recovered" from my A. It so rarely comes up when we argue, he has stopped checking my phone, email, social media accts etc about a year ago and my whereabouts are no longer questioned. We are closer as a couple - we are friends again...almost best friends again. But just yesterday, I noticed my BH do something that made me realize how far we really are from being actually "recovered". I was home ill for the past 2 days. When my BH came home from work, we went upstairs to our bedroom just to catch up on his day while he changed out of his work clothes. I notice his eyes darting from corner to corner of our room. He was checking to see if there was anything out of place. He did this unconsciously, all the while laughing and smiling as he spoke. I know 2 years is still a bit early to say we have successfully "R'd" but still the lingering memory of my A haunts my BH. And with me, I am always checking myself mentally - making sure that my actions, responses, or words didn't offend or hurt my BH. I am constantly on edge expecting my BH to be triggered by something.

 

I guess things on the surface has settled down and we are good...its the deeper unsaid things that are still festering. But maybe with more time...I will be able to say are fully recovered and reconciled.

[AlwaysGrowing]

Good post.

 

You know all marriage have their ups and downs - for example there might be dry spells sexually, that a non affair marriage simply might cause some stress or a bit of an argument - but with an affair in the past- the BS might blow a gasket and go nuclear (because maybe WS was so intense or sexual with AP). I do this now - when something happens - I try to seperate the normal frustration of an issue in a marriage - from the triggers of the affair. At somepoint I as BS need to control tieing anything negative in the marriage - to past hurts instead of looking at it seperatly. Honestly to tell my spouse EVERYTIME you turn me down for sex, or we go a few weeks without - I get angry again at how sexual/passionate/flirty she was with OM. So that at somepoint becomes a burden have to deal with on my own, but it is difficult to not throw down that "A" Trump card when something triggers it. WS may never know how many times I have to deal with this impulse.

 

I don't think letting our spouse know how we are feeling/doing is a bad thing. What is highlighted could be shared without the affair added in. I think that by not sharing we are robbing the other person of the chance to meet that need, be there and to build trust.

 

I also dont think that all because there are still triggers or discussion about the affair, that one is not R.

 

Allowing ourselves to be vulnerable is the toughest hurdle.

 

Its in the interaction, the sense of team, the openness, the willingness of each party that speaks to R.

 

 

For me, R is a life long commitment. It is a way of life.

[drifter777]

I hope you don't mind my comment...I'm a WW. It's been a little bit over 2 years since my DDay.

 

My BH and I believe we have "recovered" from my A. It so rarely comes up when we argue, he has stopped checking my phone, email, social media accts etc about a year ago and my whereabouts are no longer questioned. We are closer as a couple - we are friends again...almost best friends again. But just yesterday, I noticed my BH do something that made me realize how far we really are from being actually "recovered". I was home ill for the past 2 days. When my BH came home from work, we went upstairs to our bedroom just to catch up on his day while he changed out of his work clothes. I notice his eyes darting from corner to corner of our room. He was checking to see if there was anything out of place. He did this unconsciously, all the while laughing and smiling as he spoke. I know 2 years is still a bit early to say we have successfully "R'd" but still the lingering memory of my A haunts my BH. And with me, I am always checking myself mentally - making sure that my actions, responses, or words didn't offend or hurt my BH. I am constantly on edge expecting my BH to be triggered by something.

 

I guess things on the surface has settled down and we are good...its the deeper unsaid things that are still festering. But maybe with more time...I will be able to say are fully recovered and reconciled.

I appreciate the honesty of your post. Most WS's are only too happy to ignore their BS's scars and deny that they exist. They pray that their BS will get over it and let the past be past and would never notice what you noticed. You are not a typical WW.

 

It's really unlikely that you can reconcile a marriage in only two years, but I suppose it depends on your definition of reconciled. In those early years after d-day - after the initial explosion - most BS's are anxious for the pain to end and for things to get back to normal. They offer cheap forgiveness and hope time will heal the wound and try to move forward with their life. It never works, it just breaks down in different ways. Maybe the BS starts drinking a lot, maybe he/she begins to feel contempt toward the WS, maybe they develop depression or an anxiety disorder. Or maybe they just look at the whole situation in a different light one day and say "wait - this is not right; I feel cheated! I haven't forgiven and I want my WS to earn back all that he/she took from me". You seem like you are a truly remorseful WW. Don't let your husband hide behind cheap forgiveness because it's easier and a lot less painful than facing the truth. Trust me that it only gets worse with time.

[beatcuff]

"recovered" --- the process starts with the facts and circumstances: the baggage you started with (insecurities); the state of the relationship - good v rocky; the length of A; type of A (e v p); what was done (in one thread BS was more upset that WS performed certain acts, WS told BS were repulsive).

 

could it be our age --- or did we forget when we were younger the almost musical chairs of relationships we had.

 

but as i stated in the thread Is this too much to ask for? at some point is the effort worth it. and we can see it some of these responses. is the BS trying to make it work more because of their own fears/insecurities: its scary to be single (again). OR could the 'napalm' woke up both to what they want.

 

and how long should the sentence be for the WS.

 

sorry to ramble.

 

 

 

 

[Breathless]

Don't let your husband hide behind cheap forgiveness because it's easier and a lot less painful than facing the truth. Trust me that it only gets worse with time.

 

D - Thank you for your kind words and sound advice. We went through that whole hysterical bonding and ignorance is bliss stage in the beginning. He would explode every couple of weeks and then pretend everything was normal again. It happened for over a year. Until one day, we realized that we were killing each other and then things started to turn around. Now when he is triggered, he tries to control it...He lets it hit him, stays silent for a minute and then shakes it off. If I am around him when it happens, I stay silent, wait for it to pass, then grab his hand and hold it in mine and not say one word. It works for us bc my BH is not the type of person who wants to talk about his emotions.

 

Driffter777 is right though. I know in my heart if you got my BH alone and he will say we are good but not recovered. He believes that our marriage prior to the affair is dead and gone now. He will always mourn that part of us - but is learning to love our new M slowly but surely.

[janedoe67]

I think WS's who want their BS to "get over it" or "put it in the past" before they are ready are able to really just short circuit recovery. Grief takes time, trust takes time. It cannot be rushed. When I lost someone very close to me a few years ago unexpectedly, it took me over a year to really be okay, and that was just a friend. I think that sometimes WS's are too quick to push their BS to recover and "jump on" a few good weeks as a sign that "it's all over." My first A was quite a few years ago, and when we went car shopping a year or so ago my H made it very clear that there was a certain color car he did NOT want - it was the color of OM's car.

 

Recovery is a process, and the process is not a straight line.

[drifter777]

...

Now when he is triggered, he tries to control it...He lets it hit him, stays silent for a minute and then shakes it off.

He's not controlling it or shaking it off, he's just swallowing his pain, anger, shame - the whole spectrum of emotions. Understandable because boys are taught that the strong, silent types are real men. Its likely he is one of those people who is trying to put the whole thing behind him and pray that time will heal him.

It works for us bc my BH is not the type of person who wants to talk about his emotions.

This is a big red flag regarding the state of your reconciliation. He must find someone he can talk to (counselor) to express how he really feels and learn how to discuss it with you. Help him do this, make him understand that what he is doing is not healthy for either of you. Right now you really have no idea how he feels which means you have no idea as to the state of your reconciliation. I'm telling you this from hard, painful experience. Perhaps you are willing to ignore his behavior so you can convince yourself that things are getting better. Maybe you fear that if he does get down to his true emotions he will divorce you. You should have a greater fear that this is going to have a negative effect on every phase of your marriage. It will be gradual, but over time he may grow to resent you and even feel contempt for you. Those emotions can be nearly impossible to overcome, and leaving you may be his only remedy.

You can encourage him to see a counselor, but it's up to him. Get the book "How Can I Forgive You" and read it. Urge him to read it. Most of all, when you are with him and he triggers, don't just sit there while he white-knuckles it though the memories - gently point out that holding back his emotions is not healthy for him and is not going to help his recovery or your attempts to reconcile.

[busdriver]

For all appearances, my M looks "recovered." My W rarely if ever brings it up, and we have settled into our old routine. I have given her every assurance, tackled every task she has asked, and nothing is even the tiniest bit changed from before. That's how she wanted it, because she was happy before.

 

For me, "normal" was the whole problem. I won't have another A, but I do wish there were some way for us both to be REALLY happy. I wish she was interested in growing and evolving together out of this, making something new and better. But she is not, and I am the one who strayed, so I don't really have any room to complain. Instead I have made it my mission to make (and keep!) her happy again.

 

If it were up to me, my own vision of recovery would be re-working the M from the ground up, starting over. More like a re-invention than a "recovery."

[dichotomy]

We talk about affairs, but how does one reconcile from any huge loss - death of family, childhood abuse, cancer, loss of body part functioning, and other rough stuff.

 

Sometimes reconciliation looks sometimes like solemn perseverance and not happiness and forgetting.