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"left over" fears....


frozensprouts

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frozensprouts

sorry for starting yet another thread, but there is something I have been thinking about lately and I was hoping for some input from others who have been a "betrayed spouse"...

 

It's something I really don't like to admit, even to myself. I think because my husband's infidelity really was so "out of the blue" and I didn't see it coming at all, I'm still afraid ( on some deep seated level)that he could do it again and I wouldn't see it until it was too late. That he could be so deeply unhappy that he could make the same bad choice again and I wouldn't see it coming...

 

Now, to be fair to him, he really has worked hard on himself and really does put in an effort to try and talk to me when something is bothering him. For my part, I try and listen to him and not get angry even if i don't like what he says...it's far better to be open mined...this doesn't mean i have to agree with him, but I try to at least listen and understand his point of view. We've made some huge strides in this area ( I really was like that before, but I don't think he realized it, as he was so used to being ignored or belittled by his parents as a kid, he fell back into that pattern as an adult)...

 

This issue really is mine, and I have talked to him about it. He does his best to talk to me when he's unhappy, but deep down, i know that i thought he was happy before, yet he still cheated, what if he does that again? I think maybe I am overly sensitive to changes in his mods now too, as sometimes if he's unhappy about something, or even just quiet, part of me remembers that was the way he acted right before he told me he was leaving to go be with his ex other woman.

 

Again, its is on me, not him. He's worked so hard to make changes in himself, and I really believe that he has....it's just this small part of me that worries...this doesn't mean i'm not happy an it doesn't mean I don't love him....it's just this irrational fear that I wish I could get rid of. I've talked to him about it, and he's tried to reassure me, but even so, it's still there sometimes....

 

does anyone else ever fee this way? if so, what do you do about it? ( my counselor told me that infidelity often leaves "residual effects" that will always be with you...I suppose this is one of them)

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sorry for starting yet another thread, but there is something I have been thinking about lately and I was hoping for some input from others who have been a "betrayed spouse"...

 

It's something I really don't like to admit, even to myself. I think because my husband's infidelity really was so "out of the blue" and I didn't see it coming at all, I'm still afraid ( on some deep seated level)that he could do it again and I wouldn't see it until it was too late. That he could be so deeply unhappy that he could make the same bad choice again and I wouldn't see it coming...

 

Now, to be fair to him, he really has worked hard on himself and really does put in an effort to try and talk to me when something is bothering him. For my part, I try and listen to him and not get angry even if i don't like what he says...it's far better to be open mined...this doesn't mean i have to agree with him, but I try to at least listen and understand his point of view. We've made some huge strides in this area ( I really was like that before, but I don't think he realized it, as he was so used to being ignored or belittled by his parents as a kid, he fell back into that pattern as an adult)...

 

This issue really is mine, and I have talked to him about it. He does his best to talk to me when he's unhappy, but deep down, i know that i thought he was happy before, yet he still cheated, what if he does that again? I think maybe I am overly sensitive to changes in his mods now too, as sometimes if he's unhappy about something, or even just quiet, part of me remembers that was the way he acted right before he told me he was leaving to go be with his ex other woman.

 

Again, its is on me, not him. He's worked so hard to make changes in himself, and I really believe that he has....it's just this small part of me that worries...this doesn't mean i'm not happy an it doesn't mean I don't love him....it's just this irrational fear that I wish I could get rid of. I've talked to him about it, and he's tried to reassure me, but even so, it's still there sometimes....

 

does anyone else ever fee this way? if so, what do you do about it? ( my counselor told me that infidelity often leaves "residual effects" that will always be with you...I suppose this is one of them)

 

Hi Frozen :)

 

I don't think that your fear is irrational at all.

You were blindsided and had your world turned upside down because of the betrayal that you didn't see coming.

I think its normal to have a fear of that happening again, because the first time was so unexpected.

 

I think when you say things like "its irrational" or "this is on me" - you are putting a lot of pressure on yourself to just get over it and be ok with it and it sounds like you almost make yourself feel bad or guilty for having fears and doubts.

 

Your husband may have worked hard to prove his loyalties to you and to prove that he is better and earn your trust again, but because of the nature of how everything happened and the huge ramifications his actions had - I would think that your fears are completely understandable.

 

**HUGS**

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While not a BS, I can tell you that my wife feels the same. She told me she was worried xmw would come back, wave her finger at me and I'd go running. She's also said she fears it would take one little thing to make me unhappy and I'd go out and find a new playtoy.... I can only do my best to show her that is not the case.

 

I understand it as I/we/those of us who cheat and try to make right, have violated a sacred trust and rocked you to the core. There is no way you will ever 'fully' trust and the fear will always be there.

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Sure I do! But he does too!

 

I do not think either of us will ever be 100% secure and that is not necessarily a bad thing.

 

We won't grow complacent about our marriage and each other because, unfortunately yet realistically, there are NO guarantees.

 

Do I trust him now? Yes.

 

Will I ever forget how I trusted him before while in the affair?

 

Never. And it is residual. Because he saw how easy it was to lie to and deceive me, he today lives with fears of my fidelity despite any reassurances I may give him.

 

One of the hardest parts for me to heal from the affair, is that I always trusted my gut; it's how I perceived reality.

 

The affair made me realize my gut went on hiatus BECAUSE of love and blind trust.

 

I think I would feel that way with anyone today.

 

We have given each other permission to express those insecurities any time we need to. We take constant temperatures of the health of our relationship.

 

Nothing wrong with that.

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FS

 

Trust has been broken, how can anyone ever fully trust again, and not leave you second guessing what you see and hear.

 

The fear of it happening again, is that liitle voice inside you that wants to protect you, but where do you draw the line from reasonable distrust and unfounded distrust.

 

For me, I have decided that I cannot control what someone else does but I can control what I do. Focus on you, take time for you, and maybe stop being so nice and understanding, he's a big boy and maybe you should remind him that you're angry at what he's done to you.

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frozensprouts
FS

 

Trust has been broken, how can anyone ever fully trust again, and not leave you second guessing what you see and hear.

 

The fear of it happening again, is that liitle voice inside you that wants to protect you, but where do you draw the line from reasonable distrust and unfounded distrust.

 

For me, I have decided that I cannot control what someone else does but I can control what I do. Focus on you, take time for you, and maybe stop being so nice and understanding, he's a big boy and maybe you should remind him that you're angry at what he's done to you.

 

 

I think because it's been almost three years now, I was "wishfully thinking" I wouldn't feel that way anymore...it's not like I feel it all the time, but that sense of panic still rears it's head sometimes....

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I think because it's been almost three years now, I was "wishfully thinking" I wouldn't feel that way anymore...it's not like I feel it all the time, but that sense of panic still rears it's head sometimes....

 

 

 

I think it's because the WS has moved on, things are back to normal and it's in the past now, but for the BS, it will never be back to normal.

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I think because it's been almost three years now, I was "wishfully thinking" I wouldn't feel that way anymore...it's not like I feel it all the time, but that sense of panic still rears it's head sometimes....

 

The thing is - you were rocked to your core - your entire world was shaken, and the residual from that will be felt for a long time. Forever? Well, forever is even a longer time. I can tell you that I no longer feel that way - BUT, it took an even greater rocking to my and his core - to remove all of the lingering effects.

 

I am completely positive that my husband will never again do anything even remotely like what happened before. Why? Well, for a number of reasons.

1. friends who have affairs he drops immediately (not something I ever would have asked him to do, BTW.)

2. whenever anything comes up, he willingly discusses it, and is usually the initiator of discussions regarding problems.

3. he no longer makes assumptions about why I am acting any particular way, instead he asks me.

4. he has been an absolute rock since my health problems began. He has cried with me and for me. We plan to spend every minute of the rest of our lives dwelling on good and joyful things - not the sad sorry mistakes we have both made in our past.

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When you first became suspicious, did you look the other way? Did you say to yourself, "he/she would never do that to me"?

 

If it happened again, would you be likely to live in denial considering what you know now?

 

I think most of us wouldn't. Wisdom is often gained in very painful ways, but it's gained nonetheless.

 

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

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FS,

 

I was very young and naive when I married at 19. I had total blind trust and love for my H in the early years of our marriage.:o

 

As time went on, and we started socializing with lots of his co-workers and their wives, I had a huge realization of just how different these people were from us.

 

They were wild with their drinking and smoked pot. Later on I found out they were into wife swapping(swinging), and they had lots of parties with friends who shared the same values.

 

I told H I didn't want to socialize with them because they were bad influences.

H said he thought they were lots of fun and if I didn't go, he would go without me.:( Needless to say it was only a matter of time until he took up their cheating ways.(I refused to participate in their parties)

 

If I had the wisdom I now have, I would have left him and divorced, when he started getting wild. It would have saved me years of heartache and tears.:sick:

 

But I was a SAHM with 2 young children, who felt stuck because my parents wouldn't let me live with them until I could get a job and get on my feet.

They wanted us to work it out for the children's sake.:rolleyes:

 

Now to answer your question: H was truly remorseful and did change completely, bending over backwards to repair all the damage he had caused.:bunny:

 

He was told he will never get anymore chances if he screws up again.

Quite simply I don't worry about might happen in the future. I now know I will be just fine without him.

 

After d-day, I went back to college, got a good paying job and started saving for MY future. I am now financially prepared/set if it ever happens again, to immediately walk out the door.(or immediately kick him out)

 

I took back my power, happiness, and peace of mind.(forever);)

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The thing is - you were rocked to your core - your entire world was shaken, and the residual from that will be felt for a long time. Forever? Well, forever is even a longer time. I can tell you that I no longer feel that way - BUT, it took an even greater rocking to my and his core - to remove all of the lingering effects.

 

I am completely positive that my husband will never again do anything even remotely like what happened before. Why? Well, for a number of reasons.

1. friends who have affairs he drops immediately (not something I ever would have asked him to do, BTW.)

2. whenever anything comes up, he willingly discusses it, and is usually the initiator of discussions regarding problems.

3. he no longer makes assumptions about why I am acting any particular way, instead he asks me.

4. he has been an absolute rock since my health problems began. He has cried with me and for me. We plan to spend every minute of the rest of our lives dwelling on good and joyful things - not the sad sorry mistakes we have both made in our past.

 

Must be nice. I often wonder if those BS that R have at least some benefit. Having not R'd, I have no such closure to the events. I am in a new relationship (yep, too soon and too heavy). At first, I was somewhat hypervigilant with her (asking probing questions, wanting passwords, etc) until I realized that she was not my WS. I have no such right to invade the privacy of a new girlfriend or to treat her that way.

 

But the problem is that I was so blindsided with my W (that I "knew" for 18 years) that now I think anyone is capable. And I don't have the ability to trust but verify. My W at least might have gone to great lengths to prove herself; I sill have no such luxury with any future SO. Sucks.

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frozensprouts
When you first became suspicious, did you look the other way? Did you say to yourself, "he/she would never do that to me"?

 

If it happened again, would you be likely to live in denial considering what you know now?

 

I think most of us wouldn't. Wisdom is often gained in very painful ways, but it's gained nonetheless.

 

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

 

i never suspected cheating until he told me that what was going on.

 

i was really dumb and naive , as he was spending large amounts of time chatting online with her, but I never, ever thought he would cheat on me...I'd told him, long before we were ever married, about the kind of cr@ppy treatment I'd had from males in the past, and how hurtful it was. Of course he said it was terrible, how he'd never do that, how he hated cheating too ( and i think that when he said that, he did mean it at the time)...

I blamed his change in behavior on stress at work, stress with his parents, stress with our own kids, etc.- and I think part of his behavior was due to those things. I don't think he ever really set out to have an affair, but rather than talk to me about how he was feeling, he chose to talk to someone else, and developed a bond with her. He also had really crappy sense of boundaries , and I think part of him has a poor self image and was very flattered that someone else who didn't "have" to find him interesting and attractive felt he was interesting and attractive.

 

I also honestly never thought there were women who'd rather be with married guys than single guys. His ex other woman is fairly attractive, very personable and works n very much male dominated environment. My thought was that why would a single woman, who could easily find a single guy want to get tangled up with a married guy? So I also trusted her...I'd even "chatted" with her for a few hours online, so I know she knew who i was, that we were married and I was happy, and she told me she wanted us to be friends...

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FS,

 

I was very young and naive when I married at 19. I had total blind trust and love for my H in the early years of our marriage.:o

 

As time went on, and we started socializing with lots of his co-workers and their wives, I had a huge realization of just how different these people were from us.

 

They were wild with their drinking and smoked pot. Later on I found out they were into wife swapping(swinging), and they had lots of parties with friends who shared the same values.

 

I told H I didn't want to socialize with them because they were bad influences.

H said he thought they were lots of fun and if I didn't go, he would go without me.:( Needless to say it was only a matter of time until he took up their cheating ways.(I refused to participate in their parties)

 

If I had the wisdom I now have, I would have left him and divorced, when he started getting wild. It would have saved me years of heartache and tears.:sick:

 

But I was a SAHM with 2 young children, who felt stuck because my parents wouldn't let me live with them until I could get a job and get on my feet.

They wanted us to work it out for the children's sake.:rolleyes:

 

Now to answer your question: H was truly remorseful and did change completely, bending over backwards to repair all the damage he had caused.:bunny:

 

He was told he will never get anymore chances if he screws up again.

Quite simply I don't worry about might happen in the future. I now know I will be just fine without him.

 

After d-day, I went back to college, got a good paying job and started saving for MY future. I am now financially prepared/set if it ever happens again, to immediately walk out the door.(or immediately kick him out)

 

I took back my power, happiness, and peace of mind.(forever);)

 

This might be the most important point of all: SELF-Empowerment.

 

I, too, would never go through this again, either with him, or with someone else.

 

I do not have to. I, too, would be just fine without him or anyone I sensed was acting in a less than trustworthy manner.

 

I mourn the blind trust and innocence I lost, but I gained self-trust, self-love and self-empowerment.

 

Nothing can hurt me the way his betrayal hurt me, not even if he, or anyone else, were to betray me again.

 

I'd be gone and I know now, I'd be just fine.

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This might be the most important point of all: SELF-Empowerment.

 

I, too, would never go through this again, either with him, or with someone else.

 

I do not have to. I, too, would be just fine without him or anyone I sensed was acting in a less than trustworthy manner.

 

I mourn the blind trust and innocence I lost, but I gained self-trust, self-love and self-empowerment.

 

Nothing can hurt me the way his betrayal hurt me, not even if he, or anyone else, were to betray me again.

 

I'd be gone and I know now, I'd be just fine.

 

I gotta agree with this 100%. This is where I'm at.

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i never suspected cheating until he told me that what was going on.

 

i was really dumb and naive , as he was spending large amounts of time chatting online with her, but I never, ever thought he would cheat on me...I'd told him, long before we were ever married, about the kind of cr@ppy treatment I'd had from males in the past, and how hurtful it was. Of course he said it was terrible, how he'd never do that, how he hated cheating too ( and i think that when he said that, he did mean it at the time)...

I blamed his change in behavior on stress at work, stress with his parents, stress with our own kids, etc.- and I think part of his behavior was due to those things. I don't think he ever really set out to have an affair, but rather than talk to me about how he was feeling, he chose to talk to someone else, and developed a bond with her. He also had really crappy sense of boundaries , and I think part of him has a poor self image and was very flattered that someone else who didn't "have" to find him interesting and attractive felt he was interesting and attractive.

 

I also honestly never thought there were women who'd rather be with married guys than single guys. His ex other woman is fairly attractive, very personable and works n very much male dominated environment. My thought was that why would a single woman, who could easily find a single guy want to get tangled up with a married guy? So I also trusted her...I'd even "chatted" with her for a few hours online, so I know she knew who i was, that we were married and I was happy, and she told me she wanted us to be friends...

 

So, think of it this way FS....

 

You will NEVER be that dumb and naive again.

 

You will never allow your spouse or SO to have an opposite sex friend who is NOT a friend to the marriage.

 

You will visit the workplace and know the work colleagues so that they know you. You will call, text and email your spouse and expect a response as quickly as possible.

 

You will not accept the old excuses of job stress, life stress from him or anyone else as a reason to not devote time to each other and the marriage.

 

If something doesn't jive for you, you will express it and reserve the right to examine it together more closely as a couple.

 

You will be able to spot a woman or man on the prowl in a heartbeat now.

 

So yes, there was loss and both of you must live with it.

 

But think of all the power and confidence you've gained.

 

I too wish I didn't have a PH. D. in Affairology.;)

 

But those of us who have survived infidelity are --or will be-- so much stronger because of it.

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Even though I am no longer with my serial cheating ex, and do not trust ...oh, anyone:

 

I still do not believe once a cheater always a cheater ..and also want to share with other BS here who have stayed -

 

It takes a really sick kind of WS to be a repeat offender , especially after the work of reconciliation and rebuilding has been done.

Your WS took it on, held themselves accountable and worked with you on your marriage. Thats a real Investment.

 

 

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Betrayed&Stayed

I think because my husband's infidelity really was so "out of the blue" and I didn't see it coming at all, I'm still afraid ( on some deep seated level)that he could do it again and I wouldn't see it until it was too late.

 

does anyone else ever fee this way? if so, what do you do about it? ( my counselor told me that infidelity often leaves "residual effects" that will always be with you...I suppose this is one of them)

 

FS, I feel the exact same way, so I'll go with it's a "normal" residual effect. My wife disclosing her past affair to me was like an atomic bomb. I call it a "WMD". It made me feel as though everything that I valued in life was a big facade. I never ever thought that she was even remotely capable of being an adulteress.

 

Anyone watch Toy Story and the scene when Buzz enters the toy store and comes to realize that he isn't real, he's one of 1,000s of toys. Man, that pierced my heart, because I could totally relate, and I was still in the early phases of healing.

 

My rational mind tells me that my W would never ever cheat again, but my emotional side says "but you thought that before". For me it's more of a "never say never" view of life and marriage.

 

Like others have stated, I'll never blindly trust anyone again. I am more cognitive of non-verbal communications and what is not said. Before d-day I was more likely to take statements and discussions at face value. Now I find myself analyzing the communication between me and my wife (and others, it all overflows into other relationships).

 

For me it boils down to one thing: If the totally unexpected happened in the past, it can happen in the future. Never say never.

 

What do I do about it? I remind myself that she is a wiser, more mature woman. That was then, this is now. We have come a long way over the many years. I make the choice to trust (to a certain extent) her again. I remind myself that she has done everything that I've asked of her over the years.

 

She's not the same person. I'm not the same person. Our marriage is not the same marriage. It is all ever evolving.

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FS,

 

You made a comment that very much reflected exactly what I thought about single women!

 

All of my H's OW were young, attractive, and single and probably had many single guys lined up to date them. Why did they deliberately set their sights on my H?:confused:

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Must be nice. I often wonder if those BS that R have at least some benefit. Having not R'd, I have no such closure to the events. I am in a new relationship (yep, too soon and too heavy). At first, I was somewhat hypervigilant with her (asking probing questions, wanting passwords, etc) until I realized that she was not my WS. I have no such right to invade the privacy of a new girlfriend or to treat her that way.

 

But the problem is that I was so blindsided with my W (that I "knew" for 18 years) that now I think anyone is capable. And I don't have the ability to trust but verify. My W at least might have gone to great lengths to prove herself; I sill have no such luxury with any future SO. Sucks.

 

 

BetrayedH

 

It's one thing if they confess, it's another thing when it's discovered and then to be put through all the lies and gas lighting they dump on you.

 

Sure, you'll never blindly trust someone else again the way you trusted your ex, but don't let what she did to you bleed into your future with someone new.

 

I admire you, and know you will get through this, it just doesn't happen as fast as we'd like, but you will get there, I'm sure.

 

((((hugs))))

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Boy, I can relate to everything that has been written here!

 

I have recently read a book that seems to really address these fears that so many BS have, I love you but I don't trust you by Mira Kirschenbaum.

 

Now, I am not a self-help book person AT ALL. Those types of books make me feel worse, somehow. But this book was very good and very matter-of-factly written. It felt like the author was speaking directly to me as I read it. I'm glad I picked it up.

 

I realized what I did wrong as attempted to forgive my H and work through all my issues. It is likely too late for my H and I and I wish the book had been available a few years ago.

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sorry for starting yet another thread, but there is something I have been thinking about lately and I was hoping for some input from others who have been a "betrayed spouse"...

 

This issue really is mine, and I have talked to him about it. He does his best to talk to me when he's unhappy, but deep down, i know that i thought he was happy before, yet he still cheated, what if he does that again? I think maybe I am overly sensitive to changes in his mods now too, as sometimes if he's unhappy about something, or even just quiet, part of me remembers that was the way he acted right before he told me he was leaving to go be with his ex other woman.

 

Again, its is on me, not him. He's worked so hard to make changes in himself, and I really believe that he has....it's just this small part of me that worries...this doesn't mean i'm not happy an it doesn't mean I don't love him....it's just this irrational fear that I wish I could get rid of.

 

Hold on - do you know what an irrational fear is? It's a fear that has no basis in reality. Your fear is understandable - even reasonable - since your husband betrayed you before. He has proven that under some set of circumstances he will choose another woman over you. Why would you consider your fear of this happening again is irrational?

 

No matter how much he has changed and how much time passes you will always be a little bit afraid because the betrayal has scarred you. Your mind is trying to protect you from another horrific event crushing you when you least expect it. I think this fear is warranted and is now something that is simply part of who you are.

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BetrayedH

 

It's one thing if they confess, it's another thing when it's discovered and then to be put through all the lies and gas lighting they dump on you.

 

Sure, you'll never blindly trust someone else again the way you trusted your ex, but don't let what she did to you bleed into your future with someone new.

 

I admire you, and know you will get through this, it just doesn't happen as fast as we'd like, but you will get there, I'm sure.

 

((((hugs))))

 

Much appreciated. Fortunately, it hasn't impacted my current relationship in a tangible way. I guess I feel it's more insidious. Part of that whole, "I'll be ok by myself if it ever happens again" business seems to keep you de-invested (or at least for me, right now). I will hope that lessens with time. Anyway, thanks for the support. Hopefully those words help everyone.

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I think it's because the WS has moved on, things are back to normal and it's in the past now, but for the BS, it will never be back to normal.

 

As a fWS no, not always the case. I know our marriage will never be the same (in some ways good, in other ways bad - but more than good enough to make it worthwhile :))

 

 

 

FS

 

For myself, I "worry" more about us. I am more aware that if things are not right, they could go very wrong. The result is that if my mood is not confident then I may start thinking negatively about what may be the reason that my Wuggle is not his usual self. I know he can feel the same about me. We have learnt from past experience and understandably are alert to potential/imaginary warning signs.

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PhoenixRise

I thought about it long and hard before I replied to this thread because I wasn't sure I could deliver what I wanted to say in the spirit that I intend.

 

 

What many of the people who responded said is true. Your fear is not irrational. Not at all. Your husband betrayed you in the worst possible way and In a way that you never previously though he was capable of.

 

Now, no matter how much things get better you know he IS capable of this. You will always know that. That knowledge will never go away.

 

But here is the thing that I recognized about my own situation. Under the right circumstances, my husband was always capable of cheating. I didn't know it. I would not have believed it. Maybe even HE didn't think he was capable of being so deceitful, but he was.

 

Especially when you consider the unexamined way we lived in our relationship. Especially when you consider the unexamined way we just assumed previously that cheating wouldn't touch us.

 

I don't believe my husband will cheat again, in part because now we examine the Hell out of everything.

 

And I don't have any residual fears anymore regarding his potential to cheat (it took me YEARS to get here). Mainly because the one major thing the aftermath of our dday taught us both is that I can have a very happy life without him. I know it. And he knows it too.

 

Don't get me wrong, I would be hurt, devastated in fact if he ever did cheat again. He adds a great deal of joy to my life now and I love him dearly, but my ultimate happiness is not dependent on him.

 

Maybe I feel the way I do because I did leave and started to build a damn good life on my own before we reconciled.

 

Frozensprouts I have been reading your posts here for a long time. You are a very strong woman and your husband is damn lucky to have you. Believe it.

 

You will get to the point where you are no longer have those flashes of fear. Just accept for now that you feel the way you feel and know that you are not wrong for feeling that way.

 

I don't know what the rest of your life looks like and I understand that these feelings of fear only happen sometimes, but I have found that the more you develop confidence in yourself as an individual, the more confidence you can invest in your relationship.

 

I wish you the absolute best.

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I think because it's been almost three years now, I was "wishfully thinking" I wouldn't feel that way anymore...it's not like I feel it all the time, but that sense of panic still rears it's head sometimes....

 

 

 

Does your husband ever bring up the affair, does he come to you sometimes without you asking if you'd like to talk?

 

I think if he did that, you'd feel a whole lot better.

 

Unfortunately, I don't think many WS's do this. If they did, no matter how many years have passed, it would really show the BS their sincerity and leave no room for fear and doubt.

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