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Husband is reluctant to end EA. To leave or not to leave...


StillFighting

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StillFighting

I discovered that my husband has been having an emotional affair with a woman from work about 2.5 months ago. He swears it has not gone physical...but I accept that chances are good it has and plan on getting checked at the doc just in case. We have been in marriage counselling for one month and individual counselling as well.

 

In my five years with him, he has NEVER been good about expressing his emotions, but in counselling he does a good job of telling me his feelings, what he thinks led to the affair, etc. I knew from the second I found out about the affair that he was obviously dealing with some pretty dark issues and resolved to get to the bottom of it, fight for our marriage, and do whatever I could to make sure we came out stronger in the end. He tells me that he wants to work it out. His actions say otherwise. Despite our marriage counselor telling him he needs to cut off all ties with this woman, he selfishly wishes to maintain their "friendship". I see clearly that he is in the having cake stage...she's waiting in the wings, I am waiting at home. We are both professing our love for him. What a lucky cat.

 

However, I have told him I will not be taken advantage of, giving my 100% to our marriage while he keeps her in his life. I have found an apartment for myself (luckily we have no kids) if he refuses to break ties and am resolved to leave if I have to (I have told him of these plans). However, he still acts as though nothing is wrong at home, talks about his day kisses me hello, shows affection...things I would have cherished several months ago. Whereas, I know that ignoring the situation will not go away. I am always the one to bring up the issue in conversations.

 

I know I can live without him and have a ton of family and friends to support me if that ends up being the case, yet in my heart I still think we can get through this if he would just commit. I cannot help loving him...and despite all this crap, I still look at him and see a spark deep inside and (though it pisses me off beyond belief...) I am still incredibly attracted to him. He has made some efforts, stopped returning her calls and texts (though I do not know details about his work day of course), calling to check in with me every time he is out of the house, bringing me flowers, being affectionate. But still will not take responsbility and tell her directly it is over. It is at the point where everytime he kisses me or tells me he loves me, I get irritated. If you love me so much...why so reluctant to leave her? I told him at this point, I would rather he just come right out and tell me if he doesn't want to be with me so that I can stop killing myself trying. He says right now he is so messed up in the head he really does not know what he wants.

 

Do I bother "waiting" any longer for an epiphany?? Some have told me that since we are in marriage counselling and it has only been a month since we started that I should give it time. Others are saying cut my losses now (we have no kids and are in our late 20's), if he has not left her yet he obviously doesn't want to leave her. I flip flop from one to the next every other hour, not knowing what to do. Prior to this, I was afraid of leaving in that it would send him the wrong message "I love you and want us to fight through this...but I am moving out". If I move out now does that completely kill any chance for us to work on a relationship if he does commit? How long to stay "separated" before it becomes dragging on an inevitability? Unfortunately at this point, my convictions and independence are real strong, but my health has suffered immensely through this ordeal, so I would not be physically able to move out for at least a couple weeks even if that is what I decided to do. (I am not "kicking him out" because frankly, if I start over...I want it to be a clean start in a new place...not the one in which we built our life together.)

 

Would appreciate some insight from others who have been here. Would REALLY like to hear from any men who have been or are in my husband's shoes in similar situations. I cannot get into his head...

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I still think we can get through this if he would just commit.

 

"if he would just commit" - that's a big, fat IF. It's the showstopper in just about every relationship that falls apart. So, yeah, if he would just commit.

 

Personally, I think that by staying and trying to make it work and playing the tolerant wifey, you're making things worse and making the OW look more appealing. If you have an apartment set up, then I would move out. Take back your pride, act on that anger you feel, and show him that you will not tolerate this crap. This is usually the only way to get a man's attention.

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Space Ritual

If you are in marriage counseling and this is coming out, I submit to you by your husband's attitude that this will not change. From what you describe, it seems that your husband is simply going through the motions.

 

MC will only work if both partners are fully committed to it. I am afraid your husband will simply wait for this storm to die town and then start anew. he really does not want to tackle his issues and please don't give him a pass.

 

Talk is cheap, and only actions will be able to determine his sincerity. I donmt see any sioncerity on the part of your husband so my advice to you is to see a lawyer right away. Then file for divorce, because you are not giving your husband any consequence for his actions

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Despite our marriage counselor telling him he needs to cut off all ties with this woman, he selfishly wishes to maintain their "friendship". I see clearly that he is in the having cake stage...she's waiting in the wings, I am waiting at home. We are both professing our love for him. What a lucky cat.

 

Expose him at work. One of them will have to leave the workplace. Sustained interaction with OW WILL not help your marriage.

 

Meet all his needs for 6 weeks then do what is called a Plan B. Go home after giving him a love letter explaining what he has to do before regaining your attention (separation with OW, MC, etc). All interaction will be through an intermediary friend and there will be no personal contact with WH at all.

 

The plan is to butter him up, expose his EA affair and leave him wanting you. Check out the Marriage Builder articles.

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He tells me that he wants to work it out. His actions say otherwise.

 

this is the crux of the matter... and something you will need to accept. he can say everything you want to hear - but until he's willing to follow up his actions to meet his words, it means absolutely nothing. it's almost as if he must think you're an idiot - does he think you're not paying attention to what he's doing to you, your marriage and your future?

 

step away, let him deal with what he's created. he may already be in too deep with his OW, most men are physically attached if they won't let the OW go, i think he's lying to you.

 

as long as you make him comfortable, he will have no reason to get rid of her. move money, file for divorce and see if he's still comfy and willing to keep her around. if he is - then you have your answer. meanwhile at least you are set up to move forward.

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Yes, I'm afraid it's walking the talk.

Both for you and for him.

And as he's clearly not doing that - then it's your turn to shimmy, hunny.

If he's hell-bent on saying one thing and doing another, you're simply showing him (by staying) that - so are you.

maybe if you put your money where your mouth is - he might have second thoughts about doing likewise.

but that remains to be seen. Either way, you will have made your point, and shown him the consequence of his actions.....

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silverplanets
What a lucky cat.

He's certainly lucky you are trying to deal with this rationally rather than just kicking him out

 

I have told him I will not be taken advantage of,

 

No you shouldn't be .. you should be treated with basic human respect at least.

 

He says right now he is so messed up in the head he really does not know what he wants.

 

If he's genuine (as opposed to a serial cheater) then he might just be telling the truth here (I've been where he is).

 

If is it the truth then perhaps he just needs to work his issues through in IC or alone. Until he does that he might not be able to answer any big questions with deep honesty.

 

It sounds like you want him to decide for himself (and not be pushed into it) so perhaps let him get on with IC and work his own mind out ...

 

IN the meantime, you can just look after yourself.

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StillFighting

It has been about a week now since I posted and things have certainly been...interesting. First off, thank you to everyone for the feedback. SilverPlanets, you gave me hope...everyone else, you supported my convictions that i needed to think about my own independence and make my own decision. So after reading everyone's posts and really thinking about the situation, I realized I did need to do what was best for ME. I stopped worrying about what he was doing, stopped checking the phone records every ten minutes and made plans with my girlfriends. Talked on the phone for hours with them, went to dinner, hung out and watched movies. And I fully realized I did not need him and that I had to leave. I had given him an ultimatum of "it's break up with her or I am moving out" in writing and received no verbal response or acknowledgement. I decided it was over and started making plans for my future. How many bags I would need for my clothes, who I could call to help me get my stuff out.

 

We went to marriage counselling together and the Doc asked what he was feeling. I was ready for indifference and apathy...and instead: Remorse. Said he had been talking about my "ultimatum" for days, with his counselor, with his friends, etc. and that he realized he did not want to lose me, that 10 years from now he did not want to look back and say he had given up. He apologized for it taking so long and said it killed me to see him suffer, but that he just needed to figure it out for himself and not feel like he was being forced into a decision. Said he was planning on ending it with the OW the next day. You can imagine my shock...here were the words I was waiting for....but I was all set to be gone. Since he said he was ready to act, I agreed that I would stay in the house to see how things played out.

 

He ended it with her this week. Called me after, audibly upset...I could tell he was a wreck, which killed me...but at the same time helped me to believe it really happened and that the "end" was genuine. I hope that is the case. Things have been good at home the past few days. Extra long hugs, emphatic "I love you's", he has not gotten defensive or angry when I have asked about her or the situation. I know we are nowhere out of the dark yet...but I am hoping this is a sign that we have a chance. I have told him that I still intend to leave if I feel he is not really into this or if he goes back to her, and he knows I mean it. I still have my guard up and obviously still have suspicion about things. I also know that just because he says it's over....it may very well begin again. But i am hopeful that is not the case. I am maintaining my independence and making as many plans with my friends and family as possible....looking after me.

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This is the turn-around everyone was praying you'd implement.

I can only congratulate you on your emerging from your chrysalis....

 

Keep going.

Be who you know you are cut out to be.

And know that this will never happen again.

Ever.

Because you have finally not only realised your own worth, you've shown it.

Colours are shining through.

 

Well done.

Take care, keep us posted, and be strong!

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If and when you two have kids, chances are he will do it again. You love him and probably would'nt want your kids to live in a broken home. He knows that, and also that he will have a higher leverage then and get away with his affair. He has done it once, and will likely do it again. Marital counseling is a short term solution to a long term problem.

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I think you jumped the gun too quickly. You should've continued on with your plans and not be so quick to jump back in. It's very possible that he will get bored and contact the OW again. This happens all the time.

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I tend to agree with the last two posters. If you're absolutely certain he will not cheat again, then so be it. Otherwise, I think he'll pick up another woman when things return to normal with you guys. He needs to fully understand why he did so in the first place and have other coping methods when the situation comes up again.

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..... I have told him that I still intend to leave if I feel he is not really into this or if he goes back to her, and he knows I mean it. I still have my guard up and obviously still have suspicion about things. I also know that just because he says it's over....it may very well begin again. But i am hopeful that is not the case. I am maintaining my independence and making as many plans with my friends and family as possible....looking after me.

 

Well, at least she's not wearing rose-tinted spectacles, and is fully aware that it takes a lot more than this, for a leopard to change his spots.

My guess is - my hope is - that if he DOES kick off again, he won't even have a chance to look her in the eye, because he won't see her for dust...the next thing he'll know, will be a letter form her lawyer.....

 

Good one SF......;)

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Have you asked your husband this; what is it that you get from this emotional affair with this other woman that I am not providing? What do the two of you talk about? Emotions Do lead to sex.

 

It may not have anything to do with you. This may be all your H's problem. Then again, it may not be.

 

I would get to the bottom of it though. Don't demand answers if he will not provide them. In doing so, you could drive him closer to her.

 

You need to know exactly what is going on. If he will not be totally honest with you and cut this crap out over this other woman, the decision is yours. I would be so hurt if my wife were having an emotional affair.

 

Good luck. I wish you happiness.

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StillFighting

Thanks. Tara...it is true. I am trying to be as realistic as I possibly can about this whole situation and have been since the second I found out ther was an OW about whom to be worried. The instant I learned, I understood the affair to be an symptom of something much deeper. (Of course, this did not keep me from going through all the emotions/feelings of doubt/jealousy/guilt etc. that every BS experiences).

 

Jeff, yes we have discussed what the two of them talked about for so many hours and what he felt he got from her that he has not gotten from me. There are many of the things you might expect, working together similar experiences/interests/seeing each other often. Then apparently the fact he felt like we were having problems and so were she and her husband. The big issue is that this was the first I found out we were having problems. He puts it all on himself but we are both working individually as well as together to start making some progress...Through all of the counselling, independent and together, I understand of course that we both played a part in our marriage/lack of communication for him to feel the way he did...vulnerable and open to new attention. But ultimately, he made the decision to cheat and to deceive...so that is on him. The thing he has been most open to talking about is what led to the affair.

 

At the same point, yes I still love him and could not leave this marriage without believing we at least both tried. There is a lot of work to be done. Trust me, I do NOT believe that just because he ended it that we are out of any danger.

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Jeff, yes we have discussed what the two of them talked about for so many hours and what he felt he got from her that he has not gotten from me. There are many of the things you might expect, working together similar experiences/interests/seeing each other often.

 

Then apparently the fact he felt like we were having problems and so were she and her husband. The big issue is that this was the first I found out we were having problems.

 

Through all of the counselling, independent and together, I understand of course that we both played a part in our marriage/lack of communication for him to feel the way he did...vulnerable and open to new attention. But ultimately, he made the decision to cheat and to deceive...so that is on him. The thing he has been most open to talking about is what led to the affair.

 

And his ego? Getting validation from another woman that he's attractive and desirable? Enjoying the attention? Has he been open about that leading to the affair?

 

Has that come up in therapy? You've been married 5 years, probably together a while before that. Sounds like a "7 year itch" thing - this woman could have been anyone who paid attention to him.

 

Affairs are selfish, self-centered acts. I bring this up because you mention marriage problems you didn't know you had, and it's pretty common for married person to "rewrite history" to make the marriage out to be worse than it actually was in order to justify pursuing an OW out of plain old desire and the pleasure of having his ego stroked.

 

If that hasn't come up in discussions, you might want to ask. If that's part of it, he needs to be honest about that, too. Without that, he's only addressing half the issue, and maybe not even the right half.

Edited by norajane
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So the OW is married too? Does her H know what his W has been up to? Telling him will help ensure they stay apart because then her H will be watching her on his end too. Just a thought.

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StillFighting

He has been very open about what led up to the affair and yes, certainly acknowledges that it made him feel good, etc. Just as a quick note, we have been together for 5 years, married for 2.5. But, the principle is still the same. He left a major relationship right before we started dating that was about 5 or 6 years together.

 

As for the Husband of the OW, yes, he knows. I contacted him shortly after I found out and he was already aware.

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  • 1 month later...
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StillFighting

I know it has been awhile, but just thought I would put in an update for anyone interested. It has been a rough several weeks, I have been very sick and we had a death in the family so it is just one thing after another. I actually felt, as awful as it was, that going through the grieving process together (first time we have lost someone while we have been married) helped us in a way. It put our relationship in perspective about who/what is important. It has not all been sunshine and roses, but we have both been doing counselling regularly, both MC and IC.

 

My eyes have opened to a lot of things in our relationship that had eluded me before. It all boils down to communication. Him not being able to open up to me about how he felt, me taking his silence for not caring, etc. All just lots of awful time spent in our own misconceptions. He has now firmly committed to me and our marriage. I know that my husband is trying. Since he ended it with her, he has been open about doing the best he can to hold up NC (given that they work together). I have not demanded he quit his job, nor has he offered to do so. I know many of you may think I am being naive for not demanding this...but it is what I feel is right for our current situation. Since the A was relatively short, I am doing what I can to see if him staying in the same place is something I can live with.

 

Right now we are just working on talking to each other and spending time together, trying to rebuild a relationship. That part has been great...he never stopped being the man I love and I still want to be with him. He has a very hard time with situations that make him uncomfortable, like my checking his calling records, etc. But I still do what I need to to ensure that he is being honest and I remind him constantly that this is one of the consequences of having lied. Counselling has helped us to really face the emotions we have and acknowledge when the other person has hurt our feelings and though I know how hard it is, he is talking to me about what he is going through. That in itself is a big change. We have gotten kudos from our MC about how much progress we have made which made me genuinely happy. He has started being thoughtful and sweet again...

 

I met her recently. It was good for me to see her in "real life" to make me realize once again how real the situation is. But it did bring back LOTS of emotions, hurt, betrayal, anger, sadness, etc. I am trying now to cope with those and not take them out on him. I know that these feelings will continue to come up for years. My perspective on life and love is forever changed.

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SuburbanOblivion

So they still are and will continue to work together? And you honestly believe he won't continue to be 'friends' with her at work and that they won't talk?

 

Good luck with that.

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Realistically, they are still seeing each other and just finding other ways to communicate. They arent going to communicate by phone because they know you are looking for it. Also have you ever thought that maybe it was her decision to end the EA because of her husband. Or maybe they decided to call it quits for now and then go back to it when things cool down. When people care for each other its hard to stop talking cold turkey. I dont think you have seen the end of this one. Please be careful. I would be looking deeper than telephone bills. But the bottom line is, you cant control how they feel about each other, which is why i can almost guarantee they are still at least talking in some way....or even more... sorry to seem harsh.

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tell him to get a different job and see how much he's willing to work on the M.

 

even if the A ended - the fact that they see each other at work is too much for an emotional connection to just stop.

 

if he's unwilling to change jobs - you know he's choosing a job and money over your marriage.

 

do not be nice to his OW - she is a cancer willing to eat away at the most intimate part of your M.

 

be aware - he may be nice and cozy with you so you stay unsuspicious and quiet while he gets to do what he wants to do - which is to continue on with her behind your back.

Edited by 2sunny
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I know that my husband is trying. Since he ended it with her, he has been open about doing the best he can to hold up NC (given that they work together). I have not demanded he quit his job, nor has he offered to do so. I know many of you may think I am being naive for not demanding this...but it is what I feel is right for our current situation. Since the A was relatively short, I am doing what I can to see if him staying in the same place is something I can live with.

 

Tell me - How are his feelings for her going to fade away if he sees her 5 days a week and alot during the day? Any sexual tension between them is STILL going to be there.

 

he needs to quit his job.

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His feelings for her will change - because the dynamics have changed.

 

He's shifted his focus back onto his wife, his wife has met the OW and things are out in the open.

If the parameters were still the same as before, then his feelings would be the same, I grant you.

But a lot of water has passed under the bridge, and in this case certainly, you can't look at the same river, twice.

 

He probably feels completely different looking at this woman now, because things are no longer as they were. He now sees her as a no-go area, something to be shunned and pushed aside, rather than something attractive and desirable.

It's amazing how sobering Truth can be. It alters the whole picture.....

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StillFighting

I appreciate folks trying to give me a dose of realism and that is part of why I ventured into this site to begin with. However, the bombardment of doubt is quite stirring. Thanks Tara for some positive support.

 

Now for the novel!!

 

Believe me, I am a realist and an analytical person. A romantic at heart but a scientist by training. I have turned around the whole scenario in a million ways. Realistically, the way I look at life after affair is this: Either one or both of us can give up and leave the marriage, having not learned anything about why the situation occurred or about how our relationship might have been weak to start with OR we can both put up as big a fight as possible and see what we can learn. I like to learn. I think that is why we are put on this earth...to learn as much as we possibly can. I know that I have already evolved so much personally through this process as horrific as it is. Anyway, if we end up together and happy, great! If we don't, we can both change ourselves for the future and be happy with someone else.

 

If we do not repair ourselves and our relationship and work to make it healthier, yeah it is highly possible he would cheat on me again in the future...despite whether he stays working with this particular woman or not! If, however, we CAN learn more about ourselves and our relationship and have the strength to be vulnerable and fix things...then realistically, it should not matter if it is this woman, or the hot chick at the grocery store, or [insert name of super sexy model/actress here], if we have done the hard work and changed our mindset about ourselves and each other...neither of us will ever cheat on the other despite the temptation.

 

So no, I cannot be sure that if he is working with her the affair will not re-ignite. But try to follow some of my thought process:

 

SCENARIO A

Let's say he quits his job and finds a new one which, given his field, will be very hard to do in our immediate area. So let's put it in a different state, which is what we discussed would need to be done if that were the option. (And for now, we will just ignore the economic situation of the US). Six months from now, what if we have gone through counselling and we both start to feel "comfortable" again in our marriage.

 

The future if we have not repaired ourselves and our relationship:

 

1. Say their feelings for each other are still as strong. If he really wants to be with her and vice versa, they will find a way. Technology is persistent. They would still find ways to communicate. Plus, there are always conferences, business trips, plenty of excuses.

 

2. OR...he will find someone else...in another job, in another state, it wouldn't matter because the breeding ground for the affair is still present. The fact of the matter is, we need to resolve the situation that created the affair and the vulnerability for it in the first place. IF we don't do that....jobs and location will not matter. There will just be different women, different opportunities.

 

3. OR...we just decide it isn't going to work between us.

 

Any of the above: We get a divorce. If we are geographically relocated, then we are also away from all of our friends, family and my support system in the healing process. I now have to add the turmoil of all of this on top of healing from an affair and a divorce.

 

Future if we do repair our relationship:

 

1. He has had to choose a new career and drop all of his work up to this point and basically start fresh (if he is even able to get into the same field again). I have to start completely over as well. Far from family, friends, our home, etc. But away from this woman.

 

5. OR... We love the new jobs, the new state, don't mind being away from family and friends. Happy happy happy.

 

SCENARIO B

He is genuinely happy with this job and I am happy for him in it. Like it or not, I still am madly in love with this man and I love to see him happy in his career and successful in it. Plus, it is convenient for our families, my place of work and our home. So, we both suck it up for the next few months/year while we go through counselling. All parties acknowledging the situation these two have gotten themselves into (risking jobs/families/etc.). Yeah, it will be hard to know she is there every day, but this whole affair ordeal is the hardest thing on earth to deal with regardless whether SHE is physically present day to day or not. SHE is not the issue. She is a temptation. Our relationship/lack of communication is the issue. At least with her being close by and my developing relationships with other individuals at his work, I can be a little bit more in the loop. (Still, knowing I cannot completely prevent it if they want to find their way back to each other.) Plus, it helps me to heal when I can see how visibly uncomfortable the two of them are together now. Selfish? Yes.

 

The future if we have not repaired ourselves and our relationship:

 

1. He starts his affair with her again, or with another woman. I find out, either right away like with this one, or he gets better at hiding it and it takes longer.

 

2. OR...We just decide it is not going to work for either of us.

 

In either...we get a divorce. I still have my career, my friends, my family. My support system is still in tact. My daily routine and interests and hobbies are still in tact. Now I just have to focus on recovering from the affair and getting through the divorce.

 

The future if we have repaired ourselves and our relationship:

 

1. We can handle it. He can resist the temptation. We get to continue on our career paths, stay in our home, be near our family and our friends. We get to enjoy being married to one another again and KNOW that even despite this temptation being present...we did it and we are committed to one another.

 

2. OR...after six months/year, whatever...one or both of us decides that the negatives of them working together outweighs the negatives of picking up and starting a new life somewhere else...then we still have that option. He could start applying for transfers to other regions.

 

3. OR...it could be too hard for HER to bear...she could quit. She could decide to reconnect with her husband, he can force her to quit.

 

The moral of the story is, if WE are not "fixed" then it won't matter where we are, who is working where, which women are available...the relationship is still vulnerable to affair. Plain and simple. I weighed my options. We discussed the weight of the options. For ME, selfishly, dealing with him seeing her every day is less difficult that trying to start a new life without support. For many, maybe that would not be the choice...but for me, now, it is.

 

Think about mosquitos:

If you don't want them around your house, you don't just go around killing all the individuals. You waste a lot of time and energy without getting to the root of the issue. If you really want to get rid of mosquitos, you find the pool of stagnant water and you drain it. You fill the hole, you add some turbulence, you do what you need to to ensure that no more mosquitos breed there. SHE is an individual mosquito. I am trying to fix the pool...

 

Or maybe I am just like those women who choose not to have an epideral because they want to prove they are strong enough to handle the pain of childbirth au natural. I want to be tough and get through this with little miss temptation dangling in the background. Who knows? Maybe I am just so delusioned and naive that I will sit here and hope and pray everything will work out while they are messing around during the work day. Every one is entitled to his/her own opinion. Only time will tell. I will make sure to check in ten years from now and let y'all know ;).

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