angie2443 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Please don't. I see these stories over and over. One partner is cheating, their marriage is dead, but they won't divorce because of their children. I grew up with a parent who cheated and know many others who have also. None of us would say our parents should have stayed together for our sakes. To grow up in a home like that is sad, lonely, cold, and loveless. It doesn't do anyone any good and can cause some major problems for the children when they grow up and try to establish healthy, happy relationships of their own. If you end the affair and want to make the marriage work, and put in the effort to make it work, that is one thing. To stay in a marriage though in which there is no chance of the marriage bieng repaired, is subjecting your kids to live through the long, painful death of their familly. It's better to just call it quits. Link to post Share on other sites
Lizzie60 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Please don't. I see these stories over and over. One partner is cheating, their marriage is dead, but they won't divorce because of their children. I grew up with a parent who cheated and know many others who have also. None of us would say our parents should have stayed together for our sakes. To grow up in a home like that is sad, lonely, cold, and loveless. It doesn't do anyone any good and can cause some major problems for the children when they grow up and try to establish healthy, happy relationships of their own. If you end the affair and want to make the marriage work, and put in the effort to make it work, that is one thing. To stay in a marriage though in which there is no chance of the marriage bieng repaired, is subjecting your kids to live through the long, painful death of their familly. It's better to just call it quits. I don't get it.. So.. what about the people who don't cheat.. but are living together as 'best friends' ... I don't think the kids are suffering.. Link to post Share on other sites
hopesndreams Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 I don't get it.. So.. what about the people who don't cheat.. but are living together as 'best friends' ... I don't think the kids are suffering.. There will be suffering regardless but the point she is making is that when there is a betrayal the suffering is worse. Sure, lots of things come into play when 2 people are together for the "kids sakes" but when cheating comes into the equation it is by far worse than if mom and dad had a falling out over differences. Kids can sense, they aren't stupid. They can see when one of their parents are in turmoil and in deep pain, they can't express exactly what the reasoning behind it is (they are just kids) but know it is something very, very bad. Link to post Share on other sites
Owl Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 I don't get it.. So.. what about the people who don't cheat.. but are living together as 'best friends' ... I don't think the kids are suffering.. Do you see the kids learning to model a healthy, loving relationship? Nope. And that's the key issue here. Kids learn about relationships by observing and emulating the ones around them...ESPECIALLY their parents. What do you think they learn by observing mommy and daddy just tolerating each other? When they see no loving interaction, only distance and two people leading two disparate lives, with no true feeling for each other at all? It teaches them that this is what a marriage is (and should be). It sets the stage for their OWN marriage in the future. They may not be suffering now...but there will be long term repercussions. Link to post Share on other sites
Reggie Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Way more resentment and anger in a cheating situation than a marriage where the sprk is simply gone but there is respect. Link to post Share on other sites
65tr6 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 If you end the affair and want to make the marriage work, and put in the effort to make it work, that is one thing. To stay in a marriage though in which there is no chance of the marriage bieng repaired, is subjecting your kids to live through the long, painful death of their familly. It's better to just call it quits. So which scenario are you talking about ? Scenario # 1 ------------ There is affair/cheating going on but couple stays together anyway Scenario # 2 ------------- Affairs all ended but not working on their marriage but both learnt from the affair but stay together - not in an "ideal" marriage however (not "perfect" marriage) Link to post Share on other sites
65tr6 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Do you see the kids learning to model a healthy, loving relationship? Nope. And that's the key issue here. Kids learn about relationships by observing and emulating the ones around them...ESPECIALLY their parents.. Owl, with all due respect - with over 50% divorce rate, kids know one thing...When they marry more than likely they will get divorced if stats are any indication. And people just dont divorce on good terms...rarely. There is lot of resentment built prior to that. I dont buy that theory above. Sounds great but does not work in real life. But on the other hand, if they stay together and work on their marriage, that is different. Yes in that case it could be a lesson. But how many couples actually do that ? Link to post Share on other sites
Lizzie60 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 I don't get it.. So.. what about the people who don't cheat.. but are living together as 'best friends' ... I don't think the kids are suffering.. There will be suffering regardless but the point she is making is that when there is a betrayal the suffering is worse. Sure, lots of things come into play when 2 people are together for the "kids sakes" but when cheating comes into the equation it is by far worse than if mom and dad had a falling out over differences. Kids can sense, they aren't stupid. They can see when one of their parents are in turmoil and in deep pain, they can't express exactly what the reasoning behind it is (they are just kids) but know it is something very, very bad. I have to disagree with this.. A looooott of MM out there are cheating and the W.. absolutely have noooo idea.. My MMs (the ones I'm seeing at this time) are exceptional dads.. and good H... their W have no idea they're cheating.. Link to post Share on other sites
Lizzie60 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Do you see the kids learning to model a healthy, loving relationship? Nope. And that's the key issue here. Kids learn about relationships by observing and emulating the ones around them...ESPECIALLY their parents. What do you think they learn by observing mommy and daddy just tolerating each other? When they see no loving interaction, only distance and two people leading two disparate lives, with no true feeling for each other at all? It teaches them that this is what a marriage is (and should be). It sets the stage for their OWN marriage in the future. They may not be suffering now...but there will be long term repercussions. Not all 'loving' couples are all 'lovey-dovey' .. some men rarely who affection to their W.. except in the bedroom.. do you think the children will turn bad because they've always seen their parents on good terms except no kissing.. I don't think so.. Link to post Share on other sites
CaliforniaGirl Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Frankly, I'm not so sure that divorced parents teach their kids fabulous things about relationships either. Watching Daddy hopelessly chase giggling 22-year-olds and pretend to like Dr. Dre to keep up, seeing Mommy crying because again the child support is late and KNOWING she hates Daddy for it even though she insists she doesn't, being in the center of a battle for custody that has more to do with getting back at one another than any actual love for the child, moving to a new home...a new town...a new state...a new country, trying like hell to back Daddy in his new marriage to a woman you can't stand even though the fact that Daddy previously cheated and left leaves you NO confidence (even at your respective tender age) that this marriage will work out either...these are all way healthier than living in a house where the parents don't cuddle? I don't really believe the old adage that it's "better" or "healthier" for the children if the adults split up v. staying together with an arrangement. I'm not saying adults therefore should stay together just for the kids. I'm just saying I don't believe there's a "healthier" element to going v. staying in a majority of cases. I know it's not very "evolved" to say that, but it's reality. That's just how I see things. There is NO law of psychology to show that two adults who couldn't work things out even in a legal and supposedly committed marriage, will suddenly act in a healthy way in their new relationships (or toward the kids, for that matter) once they're divorced. Link to post Share on other sites
Citizen Erased Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 I know in my experience, I would have preferred my parents to have split well before they did. My siblings and I grew up without a real home. There were the physical things; shelter, food, clothing... but it was never home, no matter where we were. Instead it was a place everyone floated around each other, always cold and emotionless and lonely. We were never a family because we were split down the middle, mother and father. I grew up wanting my parents to divorce. All of the resulting things after my mother cheated and they finally split was nothing in comparison. I will never in my life put any child of mine through that. I used to see my friends get hugs from their mothers, praise from their fathers. Mine were too emotionally dead to provide anything even remotely close to the sort of comfort apparently children are meant to receive. Of course this was just my experience, I'm sure not all people are as screwed up as the two people that created me and can at least have a decent go at lying to their children, friends and family. Link to post Share on other sites
marlena Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 I'm sure not all people are as screwed up as the two people that created me Well, they at least got one thing right ...and that was having you. Link to post Share on other sites
Citizen Erased Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Well, they at least got one thing right ...and that was having you. Aw thanks Marlena. Link to post Share on other sites
CaliforniaGirl Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 I will never in my life put any child of mine through that. I used to see my friends get hugs from their mothers, praise from their fathers. Mine were too emotionally dead to provide anything even remotely close to the sort of comfort apparently children are meant to receive. This is awful, and I am so very, very sorry. But not every situation where the parents are staying together for the kids results in the parents being cold toward the kids. My husband and I basically function as roommates at this point but we are ALWAYS hugging, playing with and loving our kids. My husband commutes and gets home very late and if one of the kids is in bed before he gets home, he's crushed. As for me, I think I must kiss each child a minimum of five times an hour, seriously. I do most of the talking because they are both speech delayed and one has serious special needs, and I work from home, but I am right there, accessible to them and constantly taking breaks to see to their needs or just pick them up and hug them. I also take them outside, take them to the park...we go shopping...neither adult leaves this house, generally, without taking along at least one child just to get out and do something. I am saddened by your situation. After they split up, was each respective household warm then, with affection and praise? Link to post Share on other sites
Author angie2443 Posted March 23, 2009 Author Share Posted March 23, 2009 So which scenario are you talking about ? Scenario # 1 ------------ There is affair/cheating going on but couple stays together anyway Scenario # 2 ------------- Affairs all ended but not working on their marriage but both learnt from the affair but stay together - not in an "ideal" marriage however (not "perfect" marriage) Some people have one affair or a one time one night stand and then regret what they did, come clean with they did, and really try to work on their marriage. If the couple can then make it work, I do think that might be best for the kids because then they can have an intact familly. If one or both partners has no interest in making the marriage (partnership)work and is/are both staying for the kids, then I think they should just divorce. I think in the latter case, they do more damage to the kids by staying together. Link to post Share on other sites
Author angie2443 Posted March 23, 2009 Author Share Posted March 23, 2009 I don't get it.. So.. what about the people who don't cheat.. but are living together as 'best friends' ... I don't think the kids are suffering.. You mean like an open marriage? Link to post Share on other sites
Lizzie60 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 You mean like an open marriage? No..no.. CaliforniaGirl.. described very well what I meant. When I was with my first ex.. there was no love (from my side) at all.. I couldn't stand him anymore.. Did my children suffer? Not at all.. We've always been great parents.. still are... Unless the parents are 'crazy' and fighting.. and being jerks IN FRONT of the children.. I don't agree that the children are suffering.. I would say that they hurt a lot more when the parents split. Link to post Share on other sites
Citizen Erased Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 This is awful, and I am so very, very sorry. But not every situation where the parents are staying together for the kids results in the parents being cold toward the kids. My husband and I basically function as roommates at this point but we are ALWAYS hugging, playing with and loving our kids. My husband commutes and gets home very late and if one of the kids is in bed before he gets home, he's crushed. As for me, I think I must kiss each child a minimum of five times an hour, seriously. I do most of the talking because they are both speech delayed and one has serious special needs, and I work from home, but I am right there, accessible to them and constantly taking breaks to see to their needs or just pick them up and hug them. I also take them outside, take them to the park...we go shopping...neither adult leaves this house, generally, without taking along at least one child just to get out and do something. I am saddened by your situation. After they split up, was each respective household warm then, with affection and praise? You both sound like fantastic parents and I'm happy for your children, they deserve that. No, neither household was like that, at least not for me. I never let them near me and when I graduated from High School it was very surprising to them that I did well, it became a habit of theirs to not intrude on my life. My brother has been protected from a lot of this stuff, he's only 17 now and he's very affectionate. My sister built a good relationship with my father and I am quite close with my mum but she's not exactly a normal mother. It's hard to be I guess when you're 40 and have a 21 year old daughter, you become more like friends. I can see only three ways my family could have been like. Either I had a happy family, my parents stayed together and made things miserable until it got to the point that they now hate each other and can't be in the same room as each other, or they could have divorced well before they did and could have at least tolerated being near each other and supported their children together. Only two of those seem possible and I would have much preferred the last path. Link to post Share on other sites
Author angie2443 Posted March 24, 2009 Author Share Posted March 24, 2009 No..no.. CaliforniaGirl.. described very well what I meant. When I was with my first ex.. there was no love (from my side) at all.. I couldn't stand him anymore.. Did my children suffer? Not at all.. We've always been great parents.. still are... Unless the parents are 'crazy' and fighting.. and being jerks IN FRONT of the children.. I don't agree that the children are suffering.. I would say that they hurt a lot more when the parents split. Did you guys have other partners though? If not, did you just do without or were you intimant with your husbands even though there was no love? I guess I'm still not understanding how living with your partner but just bieng friends works. I'm curious about both your's and Californiagirl's situation. Link to post Share on other sites
Lizzie60 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Did you guys have other partners though? If not, did you just do without or were you intimant with your husbands even though there was no love? I guess I'm still not understanding how living with your partner but just bieng friends works. I'm curious about both your's and Californiagirl's situation. With my first ex.. sex with him was a sacrifice.. I didn't feel any love or desire for him... he was more like a brother.. I even told him he could have a mistress.. he was insulted.. I had to say it was a joke.. We were intimate.. like once or twice a week.. I never cheated.. I stayed many years not really for the children.. but I thought it wouldn't be any better on my own.. I wasn't making a lot of money.. we had many friends.. a beautiful new house.. cars.. we were financially comfortable. We never fought.. I was just bored.. We were great parents.. very close to all our children... They never ever saw this coming.. (when I left)... I never ever regretted it... I should have left waayy sooner. Link to post Share on other sites
hopesndreams Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 have to disagree with this.. A looooott of MM out there are cheating and the W.. absolutely have noooo idea.. How did this get into a discussion about the wives not knowing? I don't see that in the original posting. What am I missing? Link to post Share on other sites
Lizzie60 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 have to disagree with this.. A looooott of MM out there are cheating and the W.. absolutely have noooo idea.. How did this get into a discussion about the wives not knowing? I don't see that in the original posting. What am I missing? because you said: when there is a betrayal the suffering is worse how could the suffering be worst if the partner has no idea they're getting cheated on.. like goes on.. 'normal' you'd be surprised at the % of partners who have NO clue their spouse is cheating... Link to post Share on other sites
hopesndreams Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Who says they didn't know about a betrayal? Reread what you posted before I commented. Link to post Share on other sites
hopesndreams Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 you'd be surprised at the % of partners who have NO clue their spouse is cheating... Yeah, yeah, I get it. Congrats on keeping it hidden, well done. Kudos. Link to post Share on other sites
CaliforniaGirl Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Did you guys have other partners though? If not, did you just do without or were you intimant with your husbands even though there was no love? I guess I'm still not understanding how living with your partner but just bieng friends works. I'm curious about both your's and Californiagirl's situation. Oh god no, no other partners, at least not for me. I'm pretty certain about DH too. We do have sex occasionally, but very, very occasionally. I think the last time we had sex was about a month ago. Maybe three weeks ago. I don't know where it's going from here...I don't really have a "plan" per se. In other words, we definitely didn't sit down, say "let's stay together for the kids" and develop it this way or anything. This is just how it is right now and it's been this way for several years. As for libido...embarrassing to say, but I do take care of business, er, independently. I mean I'm human, alive and breathing. I also fantasize a lot. A LOT. I know my DH does the porno thing. It's pretty obvious that he does. So...that's him. Link to post Share on other sites
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