My boyfriend’s weird friendship with another girl – ?

[flowergrl]

My boyfriend and I have had a problem ever since we began our relationship a year and a half ago. When I met him, he had this very weird friendship with another girl, who he had admitted to me that he was attracted to. And by “weird” I mean that they are very flirty with each other and would often do things like go shopping together, or out for dinner, or to a movie, or out for a Sunday drive to get ice cream....things that would resemble a date. Anytime she was around us, she would only talk to my boyfriend, and no one else (especially not me). She would interrupt my boyfriend and me while we were talking, but he would let her interrupt us and would instead talk to her. She would text him several times throughout the day, every day…more than I would even text him. It was like she was his girlfriend, and I was always the 3rd wheel whenever she was around or as soon as she called. My boyfriend said that nothing has ever happened between them, but I suspect (if that's even true) that it's only because she's had a long-term boyfriend ever since he's met her. And the other interesting thing was that she never invites her boyfriend out with them….my boyfriend only met him once when he ran into the two of them at a hockey game and apparently her boyfriend really hated their “friendship” at first but after a while he apparently didn’t care anymore.

 

Anyhow, I felt so uncomfortable with this whole “friendship” that I was going to break up with him, but I felt that we had such an amazing relationship otherwise that I didn’t want to just throw it away. So about a year ago I told him that I couldn't be in a relationship with someone who had this kind of surrogate girlfriend on the side, and that if she was in his life, I would have to remove myself from his. He told me that I was the most important thing in his life and that he's never had a connection with someone like he does with me, so he reluctantly decided that he would end this "friendship" if it meant losing me. I was happy that he chose this option but was worried that he would resent me. Our relationship was great otherwise, but this was still a constant argument for us. He would always bring up how he wanted her and me to be friends….so I finally suspected that he was still “friends” with her behind my back because otherwise, why would he bother to bring that up? Also the thought of her and me being friends was pretty absurd….she is one of those catty, b1tchy kind of girls, and I am not, I much prefer being kind and respectful to people.

 

So then.....last month, I found out that they actually have still been texting and talking to each other behind my back this whole time. I was devastated….that he would lie to me for so long about something that he knew made me so uncomfortable, but also that he just couldn’t seem to let her go.

 

So we talked about it and he said that they stopped for a while but she just kept trying to contact him, and he always feels compelled to respond to her, so he did. He said he just didn’t know how to tell me, and time just went on and on, and since they seemed to be able to hide it, he figured he would just have the best of both worlds. He said that nothing has ever happened between them, that he would never cheat on me, that their friendship might be weird and flirty but it’s completely platonic. (I think he just loves the attention she gives him, that it feeds his ego, and vice versa) He said that he didn’t want to break up over this, that he loves me more than anything and wanted us to work, but he didn’t want to give up his friend. He said that he still wanted for her and me to try and be friends. I knew there would be no chance for that to happen, especially after all the lying and flirting, and because of all the negative feelings I feel towards her and that she feels towards me. I don’t trust her remotely to be his friend, so why would I trust her to be my friend?

 

Alas, I told him that I was VERY hurt by this all but that I still loved him and wanted to try and work this out. I told him that he basically had two options. That I would really try to be friends with her (even though it broke my heart to say it because I knew it could never work and that it would eventually just break us up anyway). I said the other option was that he would actually end the friendship for real this time, no more lying, and would tell her to stop texting him and calling, and that if she persisted, he just wouldn’t answer.

 

Anyhow, he said that he chose to end the friendship. I am pretty sure that he did because I got numerous rude messages from her afterwards, and am in fact still getting them. She also tries implying that they are still talking behind my back, which sucks because I don’t know what to believe anymore.

 

He shys away from any conflict, especially about this subject now, so I knew he wouldn’t tell me if she tried to contact him. So I finally had to ask him, and apparently she has tried. He said he didn’t respond, but I am sure she will continue trying as she did before.

 

Well, I’ve searched these forums for some insight and find myself feeling that I would be so relieved to just breakup with him and not have to feel like this anymore. I believe that you should not have to give up anything essential for love. Love should add essence to your life, not take it away. I feel that for me to ignore my feelings and to ignore this behaviour and their “friendship”, would be me disrespecting myself greatly and I’ve spent too many years doing that, I simply can’t do it anymore.

 

I am having a really hard time trusting him now and getting past this….I am finding myself caring for him less and less, perhaps in an attempt to protect my feelings from being hurt again.

 

I don’t know what to do. Anyone have any advice?

[Enema]

Once bitten, twice shy.

 

Though it certainly sounds warranted.

 

I don't know what sort of advice to give you, if it were me I think I wouldn't have given him a second chance after lying to me so guilelessly the first time.

 

How you could ever trust someone who can do that without any qualms is beyond me.

[popey]

IMO, you may have attacked the wrong issue. Sometimes we may have to deal with people in our loved one's lives that make us feel threatened. The fact that we feel threatened doesn't automatcly mean that it is right to make the other person remove them from their lives. If you were bothered by the relationship, perhaps it would've been more appropriate to ask that the manner about which they carried on, which contributed to your discomfort, be mitigated or eliminated.

 

ie: I'm not saying you can't be friends with someone, but the flirting hurts my feelings, and therefor would both like you to stop, and demand the same of her. ... same deal about her interupting your conversations, etc.

 

As for the trust factor- well, he did lie to you about something which already made you feel vulnerable, so its probably going to be hard. But, if you want to try- your just going to have to tell yourself that people do make mistakes and learn from them and move on.

 

I hope it works out for you. Your agony is apparent, and I know that sucks.

[annabelle75]

What if she was a he? Would you still have demanded he end the friendship if it were a guy that he was always hanging out with but that you didn't get along with?

 

I would never make my SO get rid of a friend because I didn't like he/she. Sounds like you just didn't like her taking any of his attention away from you.

 

And I think his former friend had every right to be pissed at both of you. You for making him chose and him for letting his girlfriend dictate who he is allowed to be friends with. Although I wouldn't waste my time sending you bitchy little messages ... I understand how she feels.

[Carbine]

He told me [...] that he's never had a connection with someone like he does with me

Connections can be broken very easily...

 

He would always bring up how he wanted her and me to be friends

You cannot be friends with someone you simply don't like. So really, the 'friendship' he's proposing would hardly make things easier on everyone in the long run, would it? What he really means is that he wants you all to coexist peacefully, but for his benefit.

 

she is one of those catty, b1tchy kind of girls, and I am not, I much prefer being kind and respectful to people[...]he figured he would just have the best of both worlds [...]I got numerous rude messages from her afterwards, and am in fact still getting them. She also tries implying that they are still talking behind my back.

 

So what does he value more? Kindness and respect or bitchiness and intimidation?? Ask him...

 

...he would never cheat on me, that their friendship might be weird and flirty but it’s completely platonic

 

I said it before and I'll say it again; no heterosexual male/female friendship is ever completely platonic.

 

I don’t trust her remotely to be his friend, so why would I trust her to be my friend?

I feel that for me to ignore my feelings and to ignore this behaviour and their “friendship”, would be me disrespecting myself greatly and I’ve spent too many years doing that, I simply can’t do it anymore.

 

Good call.

 

Anyone have any advice?

 

Yep - for the time being: hold on to your bf, lay off the ultimatums a bit and most importantly watch out for this girl like you wouldn't believe. If, at the end of the day she is after your bf then the last thing you want to hear is "...and now he's with me coz his ex was a controlling b**** who made him get rid of his friends..."

[Brad_from_NJ]

If you are BF & GF, he has disrespected you. Are you really his GF, or just anothr female friend?

He also lied to you, and you don't seem to be a priority to him.

I think telling him to "choose" was wrong.

 

Sorry, this may come across as harsh, but with 6 billion people on the planet, this is the ONE for you?

 

You sure about that?

[LucreziaBorgia]

He will give up this 'friendship' when he wants to. Right now he doesn't really want to, so he will continue to find ways to give you the impression that it is over, and will continue to be her 'friend' on the sly, particularly since this 'friend' is doing everything in her power to keep it going.

 

As long as he wants her in his life, she will be there on some level. Threatening him, forcing NC, and all that isn't going to stop him from wanting her in his life. People don't end relationships like this for altruistic reasons. If he ends this relationship with her, it will be because he doesn't want her in his life anymore. How do you make someone not want someone else in their life? You don't. So, since you can't change him - the only person you can change is yourself. If you don't like this situation, the only option you have as long as he wants this girl in his life is to leave.

[2sunny]

He will give up this 'friendship' when he wants to. Right now he doesn't really want to, so he will continue to find ways to give you the impression that it is over, and will continue to be her 'friend' on the sly, particularly since this 'friend' is doing everything in her power to keep it going.

 

As long as he wants her in his life, she will be there on some level. Threatening him, forcing NC, and all that isn't going to stop him from wanting her in his life. People don't end relationships like this for altruistic reasons. If he ends this relationship with her, it will be because he doesn't want her in his life anymore. How do you make someone not want someone else in their life? You don't. So, since you can't change him - the only person you can change is yourself. If you don't like this situation, the only option you have as long as he wants this girl in his life is to leave.

 

i agree with this as i have a very dear friend who is married. we stay in touch all the time - for many years (10). he gives me support and humor when i need it and i give him support when he does as well. my support for him is probably the only reason he is still married after 32 years.

[flowergrl]

Wow, I really have to thank each and every one of you for reading this long thread and responding! I really appreciate you taking your time to offer me your advice, whether you agree with my thoughts or not.

 

perhaps it would've been more appropriate to ask that the manner about which they carried on, which contributed to your discomfort, be mitigated or eliminated.

 

ie: I'm not saying you can't be friends with someone, but the flirting hurts my feelings, and therefor would both like you to stop, and demand the same of her. ... same deal about her interupting your conversations, etc.

 

In the beginning, I really tried to be okay with it, but found that I was being too disrespected. I finally expressed my discomfort of their flirting and asked him to stop doing that with her. He totally understood and agreed to stop and told her this as well.

 

She was PISSED!!!! She was clearly upset that she wouldn't have her flirt buddy anymore and constantly bashed me to him and his friends. I would've been cool if she could actually have had some decency and respect. But right then, she proved to me that she is just a complete biotch and I can never trust her. I think she's always had other motives other than just friendship and that's why she was so pissed.

 

First let me establish that I do believe men and women can have great friendships. But there has to be boundaries. I am simply not blind to where some people cross the line, which is exactly what I saw in their relationship. I am a very respectful person to my SO, I would not do anything that would ever make him uncomfortable. And I expect the same kind of respect for me from my SO. For me, they clearly crossed this line.

 

Annabelle, obviously I don't mind other people having my BFs attention, but I don't feel comfortable with him having another woman that he also treats like a GF and practically forgets that I exist when she's around. That's where the boundaries thing comes in and I don't think that's unreasonable. And you can't tell me that if she was a guy, that he would be acting the same way. He doesn't text his guy friends 5 times a day every day, or get up when they enter the room and get 2 chairs for them to sit in the corner by themselves, and he certainly doesn't flirt with them and say things to them like “I know you want me”.

 

Brad, yes, I am his girlfriend. We've been dating for a year and half and moved in together about 4 months ago.

 

Lucrezia, I like your quote "You cannot force a person to show you respect, but you can refuse to be disrespected. --Zane". I think this goes hand in hand with what I've been trying to do, I am refusing to be disrespected. I have said over and over again that I think our best option is to break up here, but he VERY clearly doesn't want to do that. In which case, what other option do I have here other than to ask him to remove her from his life so that I no longer feel disrespected? I have tried to be fine with him saying he wouldn't flirt with her anymore, but she wouldn't stop and gave me zero respect. She gave me no option to be fine with their friendship.

 

I don't mind if people think my view point on this is that I am insecure, you're entitled to your opinion and I did ask for it. The thing is that I know I'm not. I know that I'm a great person. I am kind and respectful, smart, attractive, love to have fun and be goofy, I'm easy to get along with....I know I deserve a really great guy. And my boyfriend IS a great guy... except for this whole thing with this other girl. Just because I am secure that I'm a great woman, doesn't mean that I should ignore this kind of behaviour that he's displaying with another woman and allow myself to be disrespected. Maybe I am old fashioned in my thinking, but I've dated other people with this same thinking so I can't be that weird. He has many female friends, some that he used to be friends-with-benefits with, or that he used to date, and their friendship is not like this.

 

I've talked to my guy friends about this situation as well to get a guys view point, and they think my boyfriend is in love with this female friend, but that because she's had a boyfriend for so long she's been the one girl he could never have and has been waiting in line for his turn....but then he met me and fell head over heals. They think my boyfriend is more than just a little naïve, and is confused. I would agree. Some of my friends say that he is just being imature. I don't know. And I could never know what is going on in his heart other than I do know that he loves me. But as Brad said, maybe I don't seem to be a priority for him.

 

Carbine, I intend to likely go with your advice as that is what my heart is telling me is the best thing for me to do. I'm trying to keep an open line of communication about this (and everything) between my BF and me, as I think that's the only way we're going to get through it. I'm really trying to be positive but realistic and I'm keeping my eyes wide open. Plus, I want him to be honest with what he really wants too. If he really does love her and wants to be with her, even if only as friends for now, then I think he should just do that and just let me go....I've said that to him before, and I hope he knows I really meant it. He says that he loves me more than anything and wants me to be happy and comfortable in our relationship. I really love him and really want what's best for us both, no matter what that is.

[Spoonandfork22]

if you can find threads of started, please do. i was in this same situation. its sad to see that this happens more often than i thought, but i suppose it makes me feel better that im not the only one!!!

 

that aside....i was in teh same situation about 7 or 8 months ago. my bf had a friend, whom he used to fool around with, who was still in his life. i had no problem w. it until she started displaying some qualities that a friend wouldnt do if she had any respect for the person at all. unlike your situation, my bf would nto treat me diff. around her or text her 5 times a day. they spoke at work and random drunk dials, but it all became too much for me b.c. i know what she was trying to do. she actually confronted me and told me my bf was trying to get with her and calling her saying how much he missed her and liked her. looking back im dissapointed i believed every word she said, b.c. she tried the act on my bf's roomates gf as well. either way, she nearly destroyed our relationship. he was and still is a fantastic boyfriend, that was our ONLY PROBLEM - her. she just wouldnt go away and i began resenting him for letting her walk all over him. he began talking to her behind my back and when i caught him in a lie over her we broke it off. i knew i had to do it.

 

 

weeks later we had a 2 hour talk about how we were going to handle this. i chose a new route. i told him sure, be friends with her, but think about what you are doing. think about why you want someone in your life so bad whos out to ruin your relationship and above all else, think about ME and how i feel about the situation. for whatever reason this logic worked. for a few more weeks he spoke with her, not much, but he did. then slowly but surely they stopped hanging out, stopped talking...she persisted and he told her to take his nunber out of her phone.

 

moral of the story: he has to make the decision. no matter how much you harp or bitch about it, he has to be the one to say, ok, this IS threatening my relationship and i dont want to do that to the person i love. my bf did that months ago and we have been fantastic ever since. i know she still talks to him at work and maybe a week or two ago she 'accidentally' called him at 3am (he took care of it) but in all this time i have learned to trust him and learned that he IS capable of making good judgement.

 

i wish you the best of luck...i know this is thee hardest thing to go through. i chose to stay with him and work on it, i knew a good man was in there and i knew that this girl was a thing of the past he was having a hard time letting go. dont let people dictate what decision you make for yourself. you know in your heart what to do. i listened to mine and i have one of the greatest relationships. we are now more honest and open and have truly come such a long way since those dark days (and they were SO DARK!)...good luck and if you want to talk to me at all about this, Im here. i know what ur going through.

[flowergrl]

Wow, thank you so much for that SAF! I'm really surprised at the similarities! I was able to find a few of your previous posts on the after effects of this subject and it really helped me. I really thought I was the only one to have this happen, so I too am sorry that this happens more than often but am glad that I'm not all alone. All my friends tell me that they've never heard of this kind of problem before and that they don't know what they would do...some say they would leave, some say there's still hope. I think they're all right, I think it really is a personal choice.

 

After reading all this I felt really overwhelmed. I balled my eyes out and lied awake for hours that night, trying to wrap my head around all this....what should I do next? Should we even try to fix this? Is it all too tainted now? Should I have broken up with him when I found out she was still talking to him? And if we do try, how can we rebuild trust and respect between us? How can we rebuild this into a wholesome relationship? All I could come up with was that 1, I had to stop crying, and 2, that my BF and I really needed to talk about it. I didn't want to keep bringing it up though (saw your posts on that too), but I figured I should think about this all a little more anyway. So we talked a little last night finally.

 

I asked him if he was just having a hard time letting go of this girl and he said yes, that he was having a hard time letting go but realized when I found out that they were still friends, that he didn't want it to ruin our relationship and decided to let go of her. I said that I understood that. I suggested that we take some time apart from each other, so we can think about what each of us really wants. He said he already knows what he wants, that he knows he wants to be with me, and doesn't want to spend time apart. I suggested that we try time apart anyway because I want him to REALLY think about it and be totally honest with himself and with me. This is a very personal choice for him too. If he really feels that he can't let go of her, then he should let go of me out of love and respect for me. He still thinks the time apart is a bad idea. The other suggestion I had was for him to call her again and re-establish that he doesn't want to continue their friendship because he doesn't want to ruin his relationship with me, and to ask her to stop with the calls & texts to him, and to stop with the rude messages to me. He thinks this would be a bad idea because he thinks it will only piss her off more and the messages will only get worse because it will be confirmation for her that it's getting to me.

 

I'm not sure what exactly to do, but I know we have to do something. I'm thinking the time apart would be good.....what do you think SAF?

[underpants]

Flower girl,

 

I am not sure how old you two are, or really if that even matters.

 

You sitch reminds me of (gosh, I am such a slut) another past relationship I had.

 

He had a female /friend/, there were not love letters but there was a painting she painted for him as well as some serious flirty behavior.

 

I made a stand. I was even open to the painting but just not in the bedroom. I guess I thought of it as a compromise. She had a fiance so her flirting was just sideline fun for her. It did bother me and I let it be known. We dated for another year or two after but it was a patch. In hindsight maybe a flag.

 

If you can risk ending the relationship I might suggest confronting this girl on your own. Just woMAN up and say to her. I appreciate the fact that you and my bf are friends however, I would really like to know from you that you will not be a threat to 'our/you and bf' relationship. I hope we can all be friends however, I just have to tell you that the flirting and non inclusion feeling I get makes me uncomfortable. Be nice but lay it out there. Being territorial is okay and sometimes just neccessary.

 

I have even had guy buddies girlfriends do this to me. I met it with a chance to clear the air. I am not after anybody's man. Heck, just recently I was told by a wife that I am cool because I am a woman that a wife can trust. I took that as a heart felt compliment.

 

Resolving conflicts should be cool and good. If it is met with resistance then that is not so good and should be considered.

 

Now, the love letter thing. I used to do this. I even had the ones from high school that were folded up all oragami like. I eventually threw them all away for myself. I can't even tell you why I did it or what provoked it. I can tell you that it was a choice to let go of the past and focus on my future. That is all.

 

Some of your problems may also be in the presentation and communication styles. It is hard to have your bearings when emotions are in the mix. That being said it is alway better to have a calm discussion then rantings/ravings that can be forgotten. I am not suggesting this is your style just offering an approach.

 

Good luck...

[Spoonandfork22]

sorry it took me so long to respond! my internet has been on the fritz.

 

as you i also suggested my bf and myself spend time apart...he wanted nothing of that idea. he cried how he had made up his mind and knew who he wanted to be with...he was just having a hard time letting go. However, i told him that it is in no way fair to ME that he hes dating me while enjoying the afections of someone else. im no third wheel!!! i forced us to take a few days off. he called me nonstop and the hardest thing for me was to refuse taking to him. its amazing what guys realize once you seperate yourself from the situation.

 

as much as we are ok now, it is still very hard. i have a very hard time believeing he is over it, even though its been 8 or so months, once someone decieves you its very hard to believe they are being true. deep in my heart i know he isnt doing anything wrong but i have a very thick wall up at the moment. and like you i wondered if i should just throw in the towel because i cant even begin to wonder how i am going to trust again. the biggest thing for me was talking to him. and i didnt do this until i had everything gathered in my head because i dindt want to continue to bring it up over and over. and yes, he got annoyed and still does. but i tell him in order for ME to be ok with everthing and trust him ( and this is about ME now, and what I will tolerate and handle) he needs to be able to communicate with me on a level where i feel safe and where i know he understands my position. recently i told him i want to know when she calls him. he said he didnt know why but if it made me comfortable then he would. and i have to trust him to do that. the little things that he does, like calls me and tells me where hes going or whos hes with, those are little things that build up trust. and you NEED those little things, you dont want to be left wondering about ANYTHING. and yes, he may feel like hes smothering you with information and being a little too open but he needs to know this is how it goes if he wants to make it work.

 

above it all, honesty is the only thing that will get the both of you through this stage, he cannot not tell you something b.c. you will 'get mad'. this is the thing that took my bf the hardest thing to learn. he just would avoid things b.c. he didnt want conflict, but we had conflict when he lied b.c. i always found out. HONESTY IS THE BEST POLICY. i cant preach that enough.

 

 

as far as speaking with the girl, he needs to do that. i see his side that she will know its getting to you and that will fuel it...my bf and i opted not to involve the other girl b.c. we saw that the more she knew it affectd us, the more the BS happened. so maybe it WONT be the best idea for you to confrot her. BUT, that being said, he should confront her with boundaries. he doesnt need to let her know you two are rocky or you are upset, he needs to just man up and do this on a him and her level. it doesnt have to have anything to do with you and him, and she doesnt need to know that. he is right, that will only make her want it more and make her try harder. but, as i stated, he needs to set boundaries just on a friendship level with her so she sees that he is serious about you.

 

good luck & get back to me!!!