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When is it healthy to proclaim a 'relationship'?


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Old 5th October 2017, 6:43 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by elaine567 View Post
I think the problem here is not that he is not actively saying "You are my gf", sometimes that is just assumed after dating for a while, but the problem here is the fact he has made an issue of it and he is actively saying that he will NOT put that label on it.

No-one really thinks that the bf/gf label is a big deal, only those with "issues" do.

If he is going to counselling over the "guilt" he feels over his last relationship, he is obviously not nearly over it.
The "pull" of long term relationships, even bad ones, can be intense for a very long time. Old habits die hard and a shared history bonds people together, and that bond can be difficult to break, even if it makes complete sense to split up.

He still, I guess, sees his ex as his real "gf", and he would be somehow "betraying" his last relationship of 15 years, if he suddenly started calling the OP "his gf".

I think this is quite the stretch, sorry.
He certainly does not feel like he is 'betraying' her.
I mean, I will bring this up and see how he reacts, but I do think it's quite a stretch. He has no romantic feelings for her anymore, and he was more of a caregiver to her for 5 years, rather than a partner.
They had no intimacy, they were just living as roommates, basically.
She was very ill and he felt bad for leaving, even though he wanted to for a long time. I think what it ultimately comes down to, is that he wishes he'd left earlier. That's about it. He lost a lot of himself in this relationship, she took a lot from him and he got nothing in return, at least in the past 5 years.
He was wrung out. He spent the past 9 months regaining agency and I think meeting me was a good thing for him. I do believe he genuinely loves me, and the GF label has nothing to do with thinking he is betraying his ex of some sort, or that she is still his 'real' GF. If that were the case, I'd be really fudging blind... I mean, come on.

As he explained it, the label to him means 'unconditional commitment'. He said he'd take a bullet for me, basically. Protect me. All that stuff. I think to him it truly is like a marriage commitment to other people.

Last edited by heavenonearth; 5th October 2017 at 6:45 AM..
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Old 5th October 2017, 7:02 AM   #62
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As he explained it, the label to him means 'unconditional commitment'. He said he'd take a bullet for me, basically. Protect me. All that stuff. I think to him it truly is like a marriage commitment to other people.
OK but is that not really weird and distorted thinking?
...and why are you buying into it?
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Old 5th October 2017, 7:12 AM   #63
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He has no romantic feelings for her anymore, and he was more of a caregiver to her for 5 years, rather than a partner.
Im sorry but that's quite a BS. Basically what cheaters tell to their affair toy girls. Hope that's just something you're coming up with, not something he blabbed.

The Occam's razor is living together = having sex. It doesn't matter how 'broken' they were in the end.

Also - it is now irrelevant. Just annoys me because it is utterly deceitful statement .
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Old 5th October 2017, 8:02 AM   #64
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As he explained it, the label to him means 'unconditional commitment'. He said he'd take a bullet for me, basically. Protect me. All that stuff. I think to him it truly is like a marriage commitment to other people.
That's HIS excuse. If he was from another culture and it was the norm in his culture to think that way I'd say OK, but he's not right? He's just a regular joe-blow that decided to come up with that because it suits him.

Also, everything he told you about his ex is HIS side of the story. You may get a different story from her. Don't be so quick to believe every word he says. You've just been dating 4 months, he could be lying through his teeth concerning everything.
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Old 5th October 2017, 9:02 AM   #65
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Im sorry but that's quite a BS. Basically what cheaters tell to their affair toy girls. Hope that's just something you're coming up with, not something he blabbed.

The Occam's razor is living together = having sex. It doesn't matter how 'broken' they were in the end.

Also - it is now irrelevant. Just annoys me because it is utterly deceitful statement .
Well she would not want physical contact for their last year or two together. I do not see how that makes him deceitful.
Gosh if you guys would just know him the way I know him, this man has no deceitful bone in his body... I am just frustrated on this thread bc it's almost laughable to me what some of you come up with. I do appreciate valid concerns, but now you are basically making him out to be a lying, cheating, deceitful bastard.... which is just so ridiculous!
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Old 5th October 2017, 9:14 AM   #66
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That's HIS excuse. If he was from another culture and it was the norm in his culture to think that way I'd say OK, but he's not right? He's just a regular joe-blow that decided to come up with that because it suits him.

Also, everything he told you about his ex is HIS side of the story. You may get a different story from her. Don't be so quick to believe every word he says. You've just been dating 4 months, he could be lying through his teeth concerning everything.
What do you mean from another culture? We do not come from the same culture, I am German, he is Dutch.
And it is common in the NL to live together without marriage.
He does not like the idea of marriage, he did not get married to his ex of 15 years, so he likely won't get married to me either. He's the kind of guy who'd go live in a farm house far away from everything, because he hates the suburban nightmare. He's unconventional in that way, and I am that way as well. I would rather die than live in a gated community of some sort.

He even said that 5-10 years ago, he would have made me his GF in an instant, but he looks at it as something else now, to him, it means much more than just 'dating'. I think it didn't make sense to me at first, but my therapist tried to explain it to me as well, and she found the right words that helped me understand him better. Just because he has his way of defining a commitment doesn't mean he is not capable of loyalty. Honestly, this man is definitely more loyal than most married dudes out there. Just saying...

And I do realize that what he tells me about his ex is only his side of the story, but I do not need her side of the story in the context of what he tells me. He is just trying to make me understand what the last five years with her felt like, and I do believe his feelings are valid without her side of the story. Don't you think?

I have to say that I am generally a person who finds it hard to trust people (hence I am in therapy, too, amongst other things), especially because I have been hurt so much in the past. But this man, out of all the men I could have been with, really is one that's worth trusting. That I know in my heart.
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Old 5th October 2017, 9:27 AM   #67
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What do you mean from another culture? We do not come from the same culture, I am German, he is Dutch.
Do Dutch in general view gf/bf title the same as a complete commitment like a marriage or a common-law couple? Because that's what he's telling you. My point is I doubt he thinks that way because of his cultural background, I think he just made it up because it suits him.

It's not about marrying or living together, I am talking only about calling you his girlfriend, do all Dutch think like him?
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Old 5th October 2017, 10:03 AM   #68
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Do Dutch in general view gf/bf title the same as a complete commitment like a marriage or a common-law couple? Because that's what he's telling you. My point is I doubt he thinks that way because of his cultural background, I think he just made it up because it suits him.

It's not about marrying or living together, I am talking only about calling you his girlfriend, do all Dutch think like him?
From my experience living in NL, yes - registered partnership is equivalent to marriage. But registered partnership is obtained via a legal process, not just verbal statement of gf/bf titles. OP's guy is mixing the two. Either he's confused, or it's convenient to him...

E.g. this is a brief explanation of the sstem in NL: https://www.government.nl/topics/fam...ion-agreements
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Old 5th October 2017, 10:08 AM   #69
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From my experience living in NL, yes - registered partnership is equivalent to marriage. But registered partnership is obtained via a legal process, not just verbal statement of gf/bf titles. OP's guy is mixing the two. Either he's confused, or it's convenient to him...

E.g. this is a brief explanation of the sstem in NL: https://www.government.nl/topics/fam...ion-agreements


I am talking about dating. Do Dutch people think the same about gf/bf title when *dating* as OP's boyfriend think?
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Old 5th October 2017, 10:11 AM   #70
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I am talking about dating. Do Dutch people think the same about gf/bf title when *dating* as OP's boyfriend think?
From what I've seen - no. What he describes is normal only for cohabitating or legally registered couples, i.e. the couples that are equivalent to married ones.
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Old 5th October 2017, 10:26 AM   #71
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From what I've seen - no. What he describes is normal only for cohabitating or legally registered couples, i.e. the couples that are equivalent to married ones.
That's what I thought, he is pulling this out of his nostrils.

I am sure they have a word to Identify couples that live together but not married. Where I am we don't marry either so we have a special name for live-in couples that are not married. We call ourselves co-joint. I am sure the Dutch have progressed to name these couples. I am 99% sure these couples don't call each other girlfriend and boyfriend once they live together as life partners.
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Old 5th October 2017, 10:31 AM   #72
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Do Dutch in general view gf/bf title the same as a complete commitment like a marriage or a common-law couple? Because that's what he's telling you. My point is I doubt he thinks that way because of his cultural background, I think he just made it up because it suits him.

It's not about marrying or living together, I am talking only about calling you his girlfriend, do all Dutch think like him?
He never said that this is what he wants because of cultural customs. He does not claim this is because of his cultural bg. This is just what he believes for himself.
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Old 5th October 2017, 10:43 AM   #73
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This man has even said that 5-10 years ago, he would called her his gf in an instant, so it is not some deep ingrained cultural custom.

It is just some nonsense he has made up to suit himself basically.
A guy just out of a bad relationship is not going to want to commit anyway, straight out of the frying pan into the fire...

OP
He is getting heat on here because what he is telling you about his old relationship sounds awfully like what married/attached men tell their other women. Why is he even telling you about their sex life?
That is what is triggering the comments you are getting as regards his honesty.

Last edited by elaine567; 5th October 2017 at 10:45 AM..
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Old 5th October 2017, 11:10 AM   #74
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This man has even said that 5-10 years ago, he would called her his gf in an instant, so it is not some deep ingrained cultural custom.

It is just some nonsense he has made up to suit himself basically.
A guy just out of a bad relationship is not going to want to commit anyway, straight out of the frying pan into the fire...

OP
He is getting heat on here because what he is telling you about his old relationship sounds awfully like what married/attached men tell their other women. Why is he even telling you about their sex life?
That is what is triggering the comments you are getting as regards his honesty.

Because when we started to be intimate back in June, he told me that he had not been intimate with someone in 'a really long time' and when I inquired further he told me that it was over a year (I think he did not want to say at first bc maybe he was embarassed?) Anyway, it's not like he is telling juicy stories about their sex life or anything like that.

I also don't see why what he says is 'nonsense' when it makes sense to him? He gave reasons for as to why he wanted to wait with the title (which I mentioned in this thread)
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Old 5th October 2017, 11:11 AM   #75
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He's still hung up on his ex. the guy is in therapy . . . He probably compares you to her etc. in his head. And those are huge shoes to fill because you love him and want sex with him but he's wondering why his ex did not. He wasn't good enough for her, so she is better. It's crazy reasoning but it's often how it goes.

I think he is unsure so he's not fully commiting. That's the only reason I can think of for actively avoiding a label(that's all it is).He doesn't want to feel stuck by 'officiating' the relationshipZ You took a big risk with a guy not fully over his last relationship and only a few months out. I've never been sure how these things turn out. I hope it works out for you.

Last edited by Cookiesandough; 5th October 2017 at 11:22 AM..
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