One Way Communication..

[OatsAndHall]

I have been seeing a woman for about six weeks now. We go out once or twice per week and talk on the phone most nights. She jumps at the chance to meet up and we generally speak on the phone for an hour or so.The relationship hasn't progressed very far physically (hugs and kisses). This is fine by me as I think I need a slow-moving relationship at this point. She has two teenage sons that I have met and are nice kids but she hasn't been pushy about bringing me into their lives. This is something that I like and respect as it shows that she's not looking for an add-water-daddy.

 

But, I do have a few reservations... As I have posted in another thread, I have to make all of our plans. She doesn't initiate, at all. She's ecstatic and flexible with her time when we do plan a date but again, I'm doing all of the leg-work here. The communication is very one-sided as well. I have to initiate contact, either via a phone call or a text. She's quick to return phone calls if I miss her and responds to texts within a reasonable amount of time.. Neither of us like texting so I'm not bothered by lags in responses.

 

I have never run into a situation like this before. She had an extremely abusive ex-husband (I posted about this in another thread) and stated early on that dating makes her kind of edgy. But, she's grown more and more comfortable with me as we've chatted and hung out. I'm moving patiently and slowly but I can't figure out if this one-way communication is due to a lack of self-esteem on her part due to her past or if she really just isn't that into me. I'm trying not to read into this too much but it is bugging me.

 

I don't know if I should approach her about it right now given that things are going reasonably well. I don't want to spook her off if this is born out of insecurity. She's a good woman, we have a lot in common and we have a good time together. But, I am growing increasingly frustrated with the one-way communication.

 

Thoughts?

[Redhead14]

Tell her how you're feeling without being critical. But first, I might try not calling her so often first. Give her the opportunity to pick up the ball. If you're doing it all the time, she doesn't really feel the need to do it. Don't call her tonight and see if she calls you tonight or tomorrow. When she does, pick up right away and be happy to hear from her. If she doesn't pick up the ball this time, then talk to her and tell her what you like/need. Leave the ball in her court once in a while -- "hey, I'm free Xday or Xday. Let me know Xday what day works for you and what you'd like to do . . ."

[CptInsano]

Basically what Redhead14 said, but keep in mind that patterns establish quickly Inna relationship, meaning that if you keep on doing what you are doing, it will likely continue that way. There is no magic turn-around point where the relationship will change, you will have to be the driver.

[smackie9]

Abuse is about control.... her being in an abusive relationship, being controlled is all she has ever known or was conditioned to. She is used to the man making all the decisions for her, that's why she doesn't dare make a move for in the past there were repercussions to her doing so. Don't take it personally, work with it.

[hippychick3]

Since you've already set this pattern, you changing it by decreasing phone calls and texts will just make her feel more insecure. She will possibly pull away feeling rejected. The best way to resolve this is to talk to her and tell her gently that you would love for her to initiate calls and plan dates too. Tell her it's important to you, and I bet she will start doing just that to please you. Her receptivity is a very positive sign that she is very much into you.

[kendahke]

I"ve been seeing a guy for about 6 weeks myself and 2 weeks ago, I had to tell him some things that I need from him with regards to communications. He was receptive and has followed through.

 

You have to speak up. You're not in your 20's any more. There is no reason for pussyfooting around. If you need her to do more initiating, then you have to tell her... then you observe if she's arsed enough to follow through.

 

And it's been 6 weeks--how is the forward movement going in general?

[OatsAndHall]

I"ve been seeing a guy for about 6 weeks myself and 2 weeks ago, I had to tell him some things that I need from him with regards to communications. He was receptive and has followed through.

 

You have to speak up. You're not in your 20's any more. There is no reason for pussyfooting around. If you need her to do more initiating, then you have to tell her... then you observe if she's arsed enough to follow through.

 

And it's been 6 weeks--how is the forward movement going in general?

 

 

It's going well, albeit slowly. We had a horrible third date where she was edgy the whole time and I got the dreaded side hug after. I let her be for a few days and then shot a text that made light of the situation by making fun of myself. That's when she said that she has a hard time dating, something that was kind of obvious. I told her that I didn't have any sort of agenda or expectations and that I just enjoyed her company. That, coupled with a few phone calls started to calm her down and we've had a good time.

 

I have established a routine here and it seems to be a routine that she is comfortable with. So, I am hesitant to bring anything up right now as I'm afraid it will spook her. She hasn't opened up about her past and has no idea that I am aware of the abuse. I found out by doing my homework before we started seeing each other. So, I feel like I am toeing a fine line right now. It basically took a month of seeing each other before she really became comfortable with anything other than hugs..

[kendahke]

It's going well, albeit slowly. We had a horrible third date where she was edgy the whole time and I got the dreaded side hug after. I let her be for a few days and then shot a text that made light of the situation by making fun of myself. That's when she said that she has a hard time dating, something that was kind of obvious. I told her that I didn't have any sort of agenda or expectations and that I just enjoyed her company. That, coupled with a few phone calls started to calm her down and we've had a good time.

 

I have established a routine here and it seems to be a routine that she is comfortable with. So, I am hesitant to bring anything up right now as I'm afraid it will spook her. She hasn't opened up about her past and has no idea that I am aware of the abuse. I found out by doing my homework before we started seeing each other. So, I feel like I am toeing a fine line right now. It basically took a month of seeing each other before she really became comfortable with anything other than hugs..

 

Ok, then how much more time are you going to give this before saying something to her?

[BaileyB]

Why don't you give her the go ahead...

 

"Let's get together again next Saturday, but why don't you plan our date this time?" Encourage her to pick something she wants to do and take the lead... with planning and communication. Then, give her lots of positive reinforcement for whatever she plans. Maybe this will help to subtly get your point across in a way that's fun, non-threatening, and hopefully comfortable for her.

[OatsAndHall]

Why don't you give her the go ahead...

 

"Let's get together again next Saturday, but why don't you plan our date this time?" Encourage her to pick something she wants to do and take the lead... with planning and communication. Then, give her lots of positive reinforcement for whatever she plans. Maybe this will help to subtly get your point across in a way that's fun, non-threatening, and hopefully comfortable for her.

 

Lol... Yup, I've tried that already. She still wouldn't make a decision. In fact, she was uncomfortable about it.

 

"Hey, let me know if you'd like to hang out this weekend."

"I'd love to."

"Alright, well, what would you like to do?"

"Hmm... I don't know.."

"Well, I have the weekend completely free and I don't know what your schedule looks like."

"I'm free all weekend too."

"Okay. We could grab dinner, go to a movie, go for a walk on the nature trail; whatever you'd like to do."

"Hmm... I just don't know." (Her voice is getting kind of tense at this point)

"How about dinner on Saturday?"

"That sounds great."

"We haven't tried ____, _____, or _____."

"You can pick, that's fine." (Her voice is getting REALLY tense at this point)

 

 

So, you can see why I am a little hesitant to push the subject with her.

[BaileyB]

Well then, I would give it a little more time. You will know the moment that you can have a gentle conversation and tell her how you are feeling and what you would like from her. She will also come to understand that you are not her husband and she need not be so guarded.

 

Is this a deal breaker for you? Because if it is, you should think about the fact that she is who she is... It is likely that she will come out of her shell with some time and as she feels more comfortable with you. But, she will likely always have this tendency and you need to make your peace with that.

[act00]

Oats, you have a good head on your shoulders and you are very patient. I appreciate this. She definitely has some "baggage," and when you put (slight) pressure on her to make a choice and initiate, it stressed her out, so I appreciate the nudge and then taking the lead. I do agree that you need to let your needs be known. The question is when. I don't agree to ignore her and see if she comes through. I think that will cause more anxiety and damage, and you're a grown man and have no need to play these games.

 

I think if you express to her that it would make your heart happy if she texted/called you first sometimes, and you would really like it if she would choose what she wants to do sometime in the future. You're happy that she enjoys the same things as you and is happy with your choices, but sometime in the future if there's something she's interested in doing/trying, please say something. Then you can drop it. It will be on her mind, and one day she'll hopefully do it, and will be met with an enthusiastic response (not overkill). Hopefully she'll be more comfortable to do it more and more. Baby steps.

[OatsAndHall]

Oats, you have a good head on your shoulders and you are very patient. I appreciate this. She definitely has some "baggage," and when you put (slight) pressure on her to make a choice and initiate, it stressed her out, so I appreciate the nudge and then taking the lead. I do agree that you need to let your needs be known. The question is when. I don't agree to ignore her and see if she comes through. I think that will cause more anxiety and damage, and you're a grown man and have no need to play these games.

 

I think if you express to her that it would make your heart happy if she texted/called you first sometimes, and you would really like it if she would choose what she wants to do sometime in the future. You're happy that she enjoys the same things as you and is happy with your choices, but sometime in the future if there's something she's interested in doing/trying, please say something. Then you can drop it. It will be on her mind, and one day she'll hopefully do it, and will be met with an enthusiastic response (not overkill). Hopefully she'll be more comfortable to do it more and more. Baby steps.

 

Yes, I certainly won't ignore her or stop making contact to try and resolve the situation. I don't play head games and that certainly is one of them. I have had it done to me and I just called it quits. She would respond in the same manner; she'd be anxious and upset and just call it off.

 

This is uncharted waters for me in many ways. I am used to a much different scenario when I've been dating someone for a month and half. To be blunt, I am accustomed to the opposite; the woman making contact more often than I do. It's not intentional or due to any head games; it's just the way it's panned out. This situation initially brought up some insecurities when we were first dating (something I am REALLY not used to..) as I just couldn't get a read on her.

 

So, I am thinking about nudging her out of her shell a little more. We have a date planned for the afternoon so I might bring it up then.. But, I think I have figured out a way to casually bring it up without being pushy. Most nights, I end up getting a hold of her while she's working up at the school. Some nights, she's very busy so the conversation is pretty short and sweet as I don't want take up too much of her time. So I am thinking about approaching it like this:

 

"Hey, I know that I've been calling when you're working and I don't want to be an imposition. Why don't you give me a call when you're not busy with work? I know you have a lot to get done."

 

In most dating situations, I would be more straight forward about it but I think she would be put off by that approach. Again, she's comfortable with the way things are going right now but I think it would be good for the relationship if she made more contact. And, I can continue to be patient about everything as this isn't a deal-breaker for me; just something that's weighed on my mind.

[live2ndin]

@oatsandhall, it is always important to be as open and honest as you can in a relationship. With your relationship being very new, it is even more important to open up those lines of communication as soon as you can so I would let her know what is bothering you, gently of course, so that you can speak about it. I respect you for taking the relationship slow, I think you are on the right track.

[kendahke]

Keep in mind the fact that she's got low investment in you going on.

 

You say you don't want to push, but it's obvious with each subsequent post, you're getting more and more frustrated with her reluctance to be arsed enough to take some initiative. If that's what you need in a partner, understand that she's not that one and you're going to have to plan all itineraries with her... unless you speak up for yourself. If she gets mad at that, then step back and reconsider the wisdom in pursuing someone like this. 0

 

Reciprocity is a clear indicator of genuine interest and initiative.

 

I mean, we're all busy with our lives and most of us have no problem making a plan once in a while in order to be fair.

 

There's a universe of difference between taking things slow and being glacial about it.

[Maggie4]

Maybe you should be clearer why this bothers you. I have girlfriends who are like her. And my niece is like that too. But it doesn't bother me. I have enough ideas to share so we still have fun. There are people who really cannot come up with ideas and they tend to be passive. Sounds like a bunch of boring complacent people? Think again. They can be lovely easy going people too, depends on how you look at it.

So do you need her to initiate because that indicates a high interest level, and you just want the reassurance. Or do you need her to initiate because you want her to be a more interesting woman who will surprise you. In the latter case, I'd say you're simple incompatible.

[Chilli]

Yeah , sorta agree. To me it just sounds like more her nature than anything , combo'd with having been in an abusive thing.

 

Some people are really outgoing in these ways, some aren't .

She'll probably improve a little bit with time and confidence but l think you'll be the driver most of the time.

Bit peed with her intro'g you to the kids already though ,6wks , man , too soon.

[Miss Peach]

Lol... Yup, I've tried that already. She still wouldn't make a decision. In fact, she was uncomfortable about it.

 

"Hey, let me know if you'd like to hang out this weekend."

"I'd love to."

"Alright, well, what would you like to do?"

"Hmm... I don't know.."

"Well, I have the weekend completely free and I don't know what your schedule looks like."

"I'm free all weekend too."

"Okay. We could grab dinner, go to a movie, go for a walk on the nature trail; whatever you'd like to do."

"Hmm... I just don't know." (Her voice is getting kind of tense at this point)

"How about dinner on Saturday?"

"That sounds great."

"We haven't tried ____, _____, or _____."

"You can pick, that's fine." (Her voice is getting REALLY tense at this point)

 

 

So, you can see why I am a little hesitant to push the subject with her.

 

This woman sounds a lot like me and some men don't get that I won't chase them. I will reciprocate more and more over time but it needs to be once we are official; not in the phase where a guy is supposed to be wooing me.

 

From what you posted here, it sounds like she wants the 'man' experience. She doesn't want the polite 'what do you want to do' man. Notice how if you ask her for something specific she says yes? She's interested but wants to see what you do on your own.

 

I'm not really sure where the abusive thing comes into play with this at all. The only thing is that she might still want a dominant man but dominant and abusive are two different things IMO.

[KBob]

This woman sounds a lot like me and some men don't get that I won't chase them. I will reciprocate more and more over time but it needs to be once we are official; not in the phase where a guy is supposed to be wooing me.

 

From what you posted here, it sounds like she wants the 'man' experience. She doesn't want the polite 'what do you want to do' man. Notice how if you ask her for something specific she says yes? She's interested but wants to see what you do on your own.

 

I'm not really sure where the abusive thing comes into play with this at all. The only thing is that she might still want a dominant man but dominant and abusive are two different things IMO.

 

I agree with this with the exception of the expectation of being wooed and chasing. If six weeks of wooing isn't enough for you to pitch in on making a plan then in my experience that sets you and her away from most women in the dating world and drops this into the realm of her and Oats being right for each other.

 

I'm with him on this one, I wouldn't like this situation either. Who wants to be the one always taking the initiative and making all the plans with no input or suggestions from the other party? BORING. Dial tone is what I'd be thinking. I'd say talk to her about it and tell her what you like/expect in a relationship and see how she reacts. If it's not what she wants, you know what to do.

[SwordofFlame]

Basically what Redhead14 said, but keep in mind that patterns establish quickly Inna relationship, meaning that if you keep on doing what you are doing, it will likely continue that way. There is no magic turn-around point where the relationship will change, you will have to be the driver.

 

Interesting thought. Are you saying that women who are very passive in the beginning don't ever change much?

[Miss Peach]

I agree with this with the exception of the expectation of being wooed and chasing. If six weeks of wooing isn't enough for you to pitch in on making a plan then in my experience that sets you and her away from most women in the dating world and drops this into the realm of her and Oats being right for each other.

 

I'm with him on this one, I wouldn't like this situation either. Who wants to be the one always taking the initiative and making all the plans with no input or suggestions from the other party? BORING. Dial tone is what I'd be thinking. I'd say talk to her about it and tell her what you like/expect in a relationship and see how she reacts. If it's not what she wants, you know what to do.

 

I do see your point.

 

For me it would depend on the guy. If he seemed serious about me and was moving towards wanting a relationship in his actions and/or telling me so, then it's time for both people to put their feet in and figure things out. If a guy is putting out the casual, I don't know what I want vibe with a woman, then he can woo me more and the better guys who are really into me will rise to the top. I'm not going to make things easy for those guys.

 

As far as input, I'll give them feedback and tell them what I enjoyed about each date. But I like it when men have a plan - especially at the beginning. I do understand it from the man's side - he wants to plan a date the woman will enjoy and so many women out there are opinionated and only say when it's wrong. I've dated women so I get that. But there are so many men who can't even be bothered to look up a restaurant in yelp it's hard to know which guy you're dealing with (the polite one or the lazy one). Which is why I would recommend putting some idea out there so it gives the impression you are an alpha, take-charge type and are thinking about the date.

[Miss Peach]

Interesting thought. Are you saying that women who are very passive in the beginning don't ever change much?

 

I can speak to myself.

 

I am very much an open book in person. I have no issues telling someone how I feel or what I enjoy.

 

I am passive with men in the beginning. I will put more and more effort in but I never want to get to the point there I'm butting heads with a guy. Especially if I sense the guy is an alpha type I will stay more passive. My ex BF picked nearly all our dates and I was totally fine with that. He liked to be the head of the household type and I was fine submitting to him.

 

Lately I've dated a lot of beta men and with them I have to go more in between. I have to make them feel like that man but I have to get a little more aggressive about things.

 

In both cases I have to provide a lot of feedback but the manner I've done it was very different for each guy.

[clia]

Lol... Yup, I've tried that already. She still wouldn't make a decision. In fact, she was uncomfortable about it.

 

"Hey, let me know if you'd like to hang out this weekend."

"I'd love to."

"Alright, well, what would you like to do?"

"Hmm... I don't know.."

"Well, I have the weekend completely free and I don't know what your schedule looks like."

"I'm free all weekend too."

"Okay. We could grab dinner, go to a movie, go for a walk on the nature trail; whatever you'd like to do."

"Hmm... I just don't know." (Her voice is getting kind of tense at this point)

"How about dinner on Saturday?"

"That sounds great."

"We haven't tried ____, _____, or _____."

"You can pick, that's fine." (Her voice is getting REALLY tense at this point)

 

 

So, you can see why I am a little hesitant to push the subject with her.

 

This would drive me bonkers. I understand wanting the man to lead, but you ARE leading here by asking her out and coming up with suggestions. I don't think it's too much to ask after six weeks of dating that she offer an opinion on something. It makes me wonder if she will always be this passive and you will always be the one to have to make every plan and choose every restaurant. It just seems really strange that she couldn't even say above that she'd prefer to meet for dinner or that she was in the mood for Italian food or something. Anything!

[KBob]

I do see your point.

 

For me it would depend on the guy. If he seemed serious about me and was moving towards wanting a relationship in his actions and/or telling me so, then it's time for both people to put their feet in and figure things out. If a guy is putting out the casual, I don't know what I want vibe with a woman, then he can woo me more and the better guys who are really into me will rise to the top. I'm not going to make things easy for those guys.

 

As far as input, I'll give them feedback and tell them what I enjoyed about each date. But I like it when men have a plan - especially at the beginning. I do understand it from the man's side - he wants to plan a date the woman will enjoy and so many women out there are opinionated and only say when it's wrong. I've dated women so I get that. But there are so many men who can't even be bothered to look up a restaurant in yelp it's hard to know which guy you're dealing with (the polite one or the lazy one). Which is why I would recommend putting some idea out there so it gives the impression you are an alpha, take-charge type and are thinking about the date.

 

I see your point of how it would weed out the non-hackers. The casual "don't know what I want" type would be the one who wouldn't put much effort into a date. The ones who do would be the type that are looking for a relationship and are willing to put in effort, or player types that have a system down to magnetise women to their bed sheets.

 

I actually had a situation recently with a woman who didn't initiate either (I should have mentioned this in the last post), and I was actually quite proud of myself for how I handled it. Instead of being suggestive about her planning something I just told her flat out (but in a funny way) that I had planned the first three dates so date four was on her. So I still got to take the manly role of taking control of my situation by putting her in control of that situation. And it worked, we had a nice date of ice cream and a walk in the river valley followed by sex. Win win for KBob.

[leogirl876]

I'm thinking she's really old fashioned. I understand it's 2017, but there's women out there, me being one of them that feel more comfortable with a man initiiating in the beginning part of the relationship. Maybe with her being a single mom, she doesn't have a lot of money to spend either and that's why she's not initiating dates. Who knows. I guess it wouldn't hurt to gently talk to her about it. For me, I probably wouldn't initiate a date until after the 5th date, and even then, I'd still want the man to do more initiating than me. I'm not saying I wouldn't at all, but I'm thinking this is where she's at, she's probably more on the old fashioned side.