Jump to content

Why does the guy pay (or not)?


CTRL C

Recommended Posts

This is just a general question, not about any particular situation.

 

Why is the guy expected to pay for dinner/date/whatever? Does splitting the check send some sort of signal, like you didn't take the date seriously? What's the correct etiquette, in your mind, on handling the date bill?

Link to post
Share on other sites

First date, whomever did the asking pays IMO. Guy that insists on paying, IMO is being a gentleman ***in my eyes.

 

As for sending a signal 90% of the time yes it does. First date she insists on paying or paying half, most likely the date was a fail or near fail.

 

But everyone is different. I like to let a man be a man, by letting him take the lead, open doors for me, paying the check......also some would say if a woman insists on paying then she is giving off too much masculine energy and isn't feminine enough to be GF material.

Link to post
Share on other sites

It's the way things are....

 

The lady ALWAYS comes first, especially in a newer relationship. Guy pays the bill. He also opens the door for her, lets her order first, and caters to her needs and makes her feel comfortable.

 

I've probably paid for 90% of the dates, entertainment, travel for my lady over the years. And as time goes on, if she invites you out or offers to pay half, let her. She's showing some respect for you and appreciates your company. Also, as time goes on she will give you gifts, make you dinner and do other things where she pays the bill. And you'll buy her gifts, too. But NEVER put the pressure on her that she has to.

 

I just planned a trip for my lady that will cost several grand... and I'm not asking her for a penny, but I'm sure she'll offer. But I don't want her to feel obligated one bit.

 

(also, in the bedroom, the lady comes first, too).

 

That's life.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Ruby Slippers

Going back to caveman days, men are the hunters and providers. In these modern times, anyone is free to deviate from gender patterns. But in spite of what social engineers have trained people to believe, I think most women are most attracted to conventionally masculine men, and most men are most attracted to conventionally feminine women.

 

It definitely turns me on when my man hunts and provides for me - brings home good food, takes me out to eat, gets groceries for us.

 

Women universally seek out and prize the provider family man kind of guy, men who are happy to provide for their woman and children. IMO, these are the most desirable men as romantic partners by far.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
First date, whomever did the asking pays IMO. Guy that insists on paying, IMO is being a gentleman ***in my eyes.

 

As for sending a signal 90% of the time yes it does. First date she insists on paying or paying half, most likely the date was a fail or near fail.

 

But everyone is different. I like to let a man be a man, by letting him take the lead, open doors for me, paying the check......also some would say if a woman insists on paying then she is giving off too much masculine energy and isn't feminine enough to be GF material.

 

That's an interesting concept. Why is it considered masculine?

 

I mean don't get me wrong I appreciate chivalry and whatnot as much as the next gal, but some of it feels... uneven, I'd feel like a bit of a bum honestly if I didn't offer to split :rolleyes:

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
This is just a general question, not about any particular situation.

 

Why is the guy expected to pay for dinner/date/whatever? Does splitting the check send some sort of signal, like you didn't take the date seriously? What's the correct etiquette, in your mind, on handling the date bill?

 

>Why is the guy expected to pay for dinner/date/whatever?

Because it shows class and that you aren't a cheapskate. It's a basic fundamental test.

 

>Does splitting the check send some sort of signal, like you didn't take the date seriously?

If I'm with someone that insists on dutch, I'll split the check, but I've never brought it up myself. I think some women don't want to feel like they owe you anything, especially if they have no intent on starting a relationship.

 

In a case like this when someone is uncomfortable letting you pay for everything, I back down because the desire to not make someone uncomfortable outweighs my desire to be classy and not appear to be a cheapskate. I will try to talk them out of it but try not to be overbearing about it. I just want them to know that I intended to pay, but ok if they insist we can split it.

 

I always just hand the waitress my card when asking for the bill and try to time it when she's in the powder room. Usually that avoids the issue altogether.

 

No matter what I don't feel like someone owes me anything just because I paid for dinner, because they don't. I act accordingly.

 

The flip side of this is that if I met the person online, I ALWAYS go for coffee or meet them out somewhere to talk before going on a "date". If there's no connection, banter and attraction, it never comes to a date. You don't want to be trapped for a couple of hours with someone you can't have a conversation with. It makes the other person as uncomfortable as you.

Edited by dpn4u
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
That's an interesting concept. Why is it considered masculine?

 

I mean don't get me wrong I appreciate chivalry and whatnot as much as the next gal, but some of it feels... uneven, I'd feel like a bit of a bum honestly if I didn't offer to split :rolleyes:

I was making a joke in lieu of another thread.....dating a woman who has masculine energy.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
fitnessfan365

First let me stress that the guy should pay for the first date, and handle the majority of the financial in dating/courting. My comments below are geared towards when you're in a relationship.

 

Whomever did the asking pays IMO. .

 

Women love to use this line. But since guys plan the majority of the dates, it's a flawed concept. It's a convenient way for women to get out of paying most of the time.

 

I like to let a man be a man, by letting him take the lead, open doors for me, paying the check......

 

Being "a man" in a relationship isn't tied into his wallet. It's tied into his behavior and how he treats his woman. So I definitely agree that a guy should lead, open doors, etc.. But once again, associating always paying the check to being a man, is a convenient way for women to never pay at all.

 

also some would say if a woman insists on paying then she is giving off too much masculine energy and isn't feminine enough to be GF material.

 

Actually, if a woman wants to pay from time to time, it shows that she is GF material IMO. I mean who would want to be in a relationsip w-a woman that takes advantage and never pays at all? After all a relationship involves two people.

Edited by fitnessfan365
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Because men are made to be a provide no matter how you argued on this. This was the way they were built physically, and this IS the way they are educated nowadays, unless you start educating them the sissy way LOL like being a mommy's boy or being treated way too well as a kid.

 

Only if you meet a woman taking your chivalry as granted, that's another story.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Ruby Slippers
some of it feels... uneven, I'd feel like a bit of a bum honestly if I didn't offer to split :rolleyes:

In the wild, the most dominant males fight with other males to establish dominance, often to the point of serious injury or death. The most dominant males win mating rights with most of the females, and it's their job to protect and provide for those females and their offspring. If they fall short, the females and offspring are hunted or stolen by predators and other males.

 

The most dominant males would never expect their female(s) to offer to share in the tasks of protecting and providing for the family.

 

Also consider that the woman bears 99% of the reproductive burden. The man contributes one shot of semen, and her body undergoes a major ordeal to grow and birth offspring. That's about as uneven as it gets.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
...

 

...

 

So this is something the man (you) normally wants to do, not just something he feels obligated to?

Link to post
Share on other sites

The below statement is not black and white.

 

Finances are major part of life - the guy can be as gentlemanly as he wants in the way how he acts, if he acts as an user financially it is a MAJOR turn off.

 

I'm strongly AGAINST women that expect the guy to pay for all in a relationship (even early dating). However, by not taking the initiative to pay the check for going out, the guy:

- gives the impression he doesn't care too much

- is tight with money (if gainfully employed - sign that he's financially irresponsible - a huge red flag for women considering LTR)

- most importantly: doesn't give the chance to his partner to contribute in other ways (e.g. if my guy asks me to pay for our dinner most of the time, I won't have the desire and money to surprise him with presents, cook for him, or do anything initiated by me that requires money/effort - I've already invested more than him by paying for his meals).

 

Being "a man" in a relationship isn't tied into his wallet. It's tied into his behavior and how he treats his woman. So I definitely agree that a guy should lead, open doors, etc.. But once again, associating always paying the check to being a man, is a convenient way for women to never pay at all.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
fitnessfan365
In the wild, the most dominant males fight with other males to establish dominance, often to the point of serious injury or death. The most dominant males win mating rights with most of the females, and it's their job to protect and provide for those females and their offspring. If they fall short, the females and offspring are hunted or stolen by predators and other males.

 

The most dominant males would never expect their female(s) to offer to share in the tasks of protecting and providing for the family.

 

Also consider that the woman bears 99% of the reproductive burden. The man contributes one shot of semen, and her body undergoes a major ordeal to grow and birth offspring. That's about as uneven as it gets.

 

This argument would apply if you lived in the wild, and spent your days being barefoot and pregnant living out of a hut. But in a modern civilized society where women have good paying jobs and higher education, your argument is BS IMO.

 

Don't get me wrong. There are certain masculine traits in dating that are universal in any setting. But what you're referring to was a dynamic based on environment and necessity. That's not the case now.

 

The below statement is not black and white.

 

Finances are major part of life - the guy can be as gentlemanly as he wants in the way how he acts, if he acts as an user financially it is a MAJOR turn off.

 

I'm strongly AGAINST women that expect the guy to pay for all in a relationship (even early dating). However, by not taking the initiative to pay the check for going out, the guy:

- gives the impression he doesn't care too much

- is tight with money (if gainfully employed - sign that he's financially irresponsible - a huge red flag for women considering LTR)

- most importantly: doesn't give the chance to his partner to contribute in other ways (e.g. if my guy asks me to pay for our dinner most of the time, I won't have the desire and money to surprise him with presents, cook for him, or do anything initiated by me that requires money/effort - I've already invested more than him by paying for his meals).

 

Oh I definitely appreciate old school dynamics and believe a guy should handle a good percentage of the financial. But I also believe that a relationship isn't one sided. So when I see women say that a guy isn't really a man if he doesn't pay 100% of the time, or that she makes up for it in "other ways", etc I call BS.

Edited by fitnessfan365
  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
So this is something the man (you) normally wants to do, not just something he feels obligated to?

 

Yes, I WANT to do it. However, I do like to see some consideration and I don't like being taking advantage of.

 

I have always paid for the majority of what I'll call everyday common dates. And ALL of the ladies I've dated have reciprocated at times. If we go out five times, she will usually pay for one, or a few drinks and that's fine with me.

 

When it comes to big items, like thousand dollar vacations, expensive toys, etc., I could argue to be in a much more committed relationship, and have some understanding of where the dollars are coming from. I have paid for several thousand dollars items and just enjoyed it, largely because she couldn't afford it and I had the dollars. But she contributed where she could.

 

I did have a lady that pushed it a bit... and I often paid for the big ticket items, and I did somewhat resent that. Especially when I took her to see her friends and I paid the bill for every meal and drink the whole time. So I quit going out with them.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
Versacehottie

It's typical that a guy in love or capable of that, in a way women typically appreciate, likes to take care of his girl. Make sure she is protected, etc. The chivalry comes really naturally. A guy in love generally enjoys doing chivalrous things. Because the impression it makes is how they want to be perceived by the girl they like. That's why even as early as a first date the gesture of paying is something a lot of guys do to exhibit that this is the type of guy they are. To me, it's not about the money but it is something I would always pay great attention to. Also most girls don't like stingy guys. So someone who is willing to go against the norm on a first date (that he asked for) is letting you know something about his values. And a lot of women won't find the stingy-ness in line with their own.

 

Let's say for sake of argument that the dinner costs $100. If they split it, her half is $50. I don't think most girls mind spending that. And the guy who would risk offending her to save $50 is someone a lot of women don't want to be with. So in some ways it's a test. The benefit of showing good manners is huge and the cost of the not showing them is huge. It's really not about the money. As someone said above, it's awkward to be on a date you don't want to be on--so contrary to what a lot of guys think, most girls are not just out for a free meal. They are excited to see the best side of the guy---which is why it should be shown.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
fitnessfan365
Yes, I WANT to do it. However, I do like to see some consideration and I don't like being taking advantage of.

 

I have always paid for the majority of what I'll call everyday common dates. And ALL of the ladies I've dated have reciprocated at times. If we go out five times, she will usually pay for one, or a few drinks and that's fine with me.

 

When it comes to big items, like thousand dollar vacations, expensive toys, etc., I could argue to be in a much more committed relationship, and have some understanding of where the dollars are coming from. I have paid for several thousand dollars items and just enjoyed it, largely because she couldn't afford it and I had the dollars. But she contributed where she could.

 

I did have a lady that pushed it a bit... and I often paid for the big ticket items, and I did somewhat resent that. Especially when I took her to see her friends and I paid the bill for every meal and drink the whole time. So I quit going out with them.

 

Good post. I've always had the same mentality. I like being old school and taking care of a good percentage. But I won't tolerate a woman that expects me to pay 100% of the time.

 

That one woman that expected you to pay for all the big items and for all her friends as well, sounds like she is spoiled and entitled.

 

It's typical that a guy in love or capable of that, in a way women typically appreciate, likes to take care of his girl. Make sure she is protected, etc. The chivalry comes really naturally. A guy in love generally enjoys doing chivalrous things. Because the impression it makes is how they want to be perceived by the girl they like. That's why even as early as a first date the gesture of paying is something a lot of guys do to exhibit that this is the type of guy they are. To me, it's not about the money but it is something I would always pay great attention to. Also most girls don't like stingy guys. So someone who is willing to go against the norm on a first date (that he asked for) is letting you know something about his values. And a lot of women won't find the stingy-ness in line with their own.

 

Let's say for sake of argument that the dinner costs $100. If they split it, her half is $50. I don't think most girls mind spending that. And the guy who would risk offending her to save $50 is someone a lot of women don't want to be with. So in some ways it's a test. The benefit of showing good manners is huge and the cost of the not showing them is huge. It's really not about the money. As someone said above, it's awkward to be on a date you don't want to be on--so contrary to what a lot of guys think, most girls are not just out for a free meal. They are excited to see the best side of the guy---which is why it should be shown.

 

I actually really like this post from Versa. It comes from a place of making a woman feel special, and not from entitlement. As she says, when a guy is into a woman he enjoys taking care of her. I've said plenty of times that I'd never make a woman pay for a first date, and I even enjoy handling a good percentage of the financial in dating. My GF and I were on a date yesterday and she said "Thank you so much for treating me today" and I told her "It makes me feel good to take care of you baby, and it's sexy when you take care of me in private". This got a giggle out of her which made my day. But when you're in a relationship especially, a woman should not get to act like a freeloader under the guise of "chivalry" IMO.

Edited by fitnessfan365
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
Good post. I've always had the same mentality. I like being old school and taking care of a good percentage. But I won't tolerate a woman that expects me to pay 100% of the time.

 

That one woman that expected you to pay for all the big items and for all her friends as well, sounds like she is spoiled and entitled.

 

Apologies ff365, I meant to tag you as well in the previous question :)

 

(and any other men I may have missed, but I think all the other responders are female... appreciating female perspectives too, it was just a question about personal motivations.)

Edited by CTRL C
Link to post
Share on other sites

I like to let her set the tone.

 

I would ask would you like me to pay?

 

If she says yes, I pay, if she says no, then she pays, if she wants separate checks, that's fair too.

 

It's easier that way.

 

It also tells you some things about the woman.

Link to post
Share on other sites
PrettyEmily77

Don't have an answer to that question but IME, the guy doesn't always pay.

 

 

I went on a few dates before I met the BF and always made a point of alternating. The 'whoever invites pays' meant I was the one who took my wallet out as I was the one inviting, which I didn't mind at all. I'd make it clear before the actual date and by the end of date, most guys who suggested a second date would also offer to pay for it. That set the trend for future dates.

 

 

Meeting the BF was a completely new experience as he refuses full stop for me to pay for anything at all whenever we go out, and that's non negotiable. He knows I can look after myself financially but he sees it as his stuff to do. He loves to go to expensive restaurants and that's really not my thing so our compromise is that we go to low key places or experiment with cooking at his or mine - that's the only way he'll accept me treating him to a nice meal.

 

 

To me, accepting that my BF pays for me is a big deal, kind of like a sign I can trust him and can potentially see him look after me in general (not necessarily financially, as I have a good job); luckily, he sees it that way too, and it also helps that he's a complete gentleman.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
I like to let her set the tone.

 

I would ask would you like me to pay?

 

If she says yes, I pay, if she says no, then she pays, if she wants separate checks, that's fair too.

 

It's easier that way.

 

It also tells you some things about the woman.

 

What would each response tell you?

 

Personally if asked, I'd do what i think is courteous and split the check, rather than push the expense of my meal on you.

Link to post
Share on other sites
First let me stress that the guy should pay for the first date, and handle the majority of the financial in dating/courting. My comments below are geared towards when you're in a relationship.

 

 

 

Women love to use this line. But since guys plan the majority of the dates, it's a flawed concept. It's a convenient way for women to get out of paying most of the time.

 

 

 

Being "a man" in a relationship isn't tied into his wallet. It's tied into his behavior and how he treats his woman. So I definitely agree that a guy should lead, open doors, etc.. But once again, associating always paying the check to being a man, is a convenient way for women to never pay at all.

 

 

 

Actually, if a woman wants to pay from time to time, it shows that she is GF material IMO. I mean who would want to be in a relationsip w-a woman that takes advantage and never pays at all? After all a relationship involves two people.

My post was geared towards the first date.

FYI: I had asked guys out on dates and that was over 25 years ago....I paid 100% for each one....more women are asking for dates today, but how men feel about it is another thread. For the last 25 years, I have and still do pay for half of everything 50/50, bills and all, with my husband....I insisted on it right from the start, even if he makes more money than I do.....

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Financial obligations or common courtesy seem to make their way into the dating scene.

 

I have no idea why a guy must pay. Seems like he is being fined, Double!

 

Instead a gracious dutch treat suits my taste buds and keeps things from being assumed. Why burden his account when I am equally capable of paying for my portion. I like getting to know people and relax when doing so, I'd hate to think I was buying their time or company.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Men should offer to pay because women like a generous man who takes the lead. That's just the way it works. If guys try to go against the grain and not pay, your dating success will take a serious nosedive, I would not recommend it.

 

That said, the best women take turns.....if you find one of those, marry her.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
I like to let her set the tone.

 

I would ask would you like me to pay?

 

If she says yes, I pay, if she says no, then she pays, if she wants separate checks, that's fair too.

 

It's easier that way.

 

It also tells you some things about the woman.

 

On a first date... no way... just pay the bill and be done with it.

 

I could argue, if you meet someone on line or it's blind date and you really don't know them at all, do a simple lunch and pay for it. Neither is obligated for a long expensive evening, and there's little chance of the invite over to their house, just a comfortable meeting. If it just doesn't go well, neither has much time or money invested. If you want the second date, do a simple dinner and drinks... and STILL pay for that meal.

 

After you get to know each other you can figure out each other spending thoughts and hopefully come to a good way to handle.

 

However, I'd take the stance that I'd pay for it, unless it was quite expensive. If she does the invite, allow her to pay. But it doesn't hurt to offer to pick up the tip or drinks.

 

I feel that when the guy takes the role of paying, he sets the tone of "I'm going to take care of you" as a first image. As time goes on and things go well, he needs to back that up with other action.

Link to post
Share on other sites
×
×
  • Create New...