Victim vs accomplice - married friend in an affair

[Red123]

I have a married friend who is in an affair with a married man. She is not aware that my H has been unfaithful in the past but has chosen to share with me. Things have ended and she is heartbroken. Tbh she is painting a picture of her being the victim in the affair. The truth is that they both knew the other was married and both chose to do it anyway, he has decided to work on his marriage and she is devestated. Saying now that he is the bad guy and took advantage of her situation. This chat has made me think of my own situation. The MOW that H had an affair with did the same thing. She stated in emails after the fact that he did this, appearing to not take any accountability. In our case they were both married, both knew and both chose to do it. The difference with my friend and I is that H and I split up before Dday, due to marital problems, so he was free to pursue his AP, but didn't. I guess I can't see where any of them are victims, all consenting adults, no false beliefs that anyone was single. The MOW in our case has had an A before yet still claims victim with my H. I don't get it at all.

[mikeylo]

Most cheaters always in reality see themselves as victims --- with numerous reasons that justify their behavior in their own mind. They love self pity. Of course they have issues that they usually don't like to deal with.

[frogss29]

I think those who are hurt feel like they are victims. I think we all look for reasons and excuses when we feel bad and that can make us appear to be victims.

Perhaps your friend was hoping her AP was the answer to her prayers and now realises she made a big mistake and has made her situation worse not better so she would feel like a victim.

It is always easier to blame others than take a good , long look at yourself and your shortcomings

[Red123]

I think those who are hurt feel like they are victims. I think we all look for reasons and excuses when we feel bad and that can make us appear to be victims.

Perhaps your friend was hoping her AP was the answer to her prayers and now realises she made a big mistake and has made her situation worse not better so she would feel like a victim.

It is always easier to blame others than take a good , long look at yourself and your shortcomings

 

You could be right. During the affair he was the most amazing guy she had ever met, now he's the devil.

[oldshirt]

cheaters getting hurt are like when a back-alley drug deal goes wrong and people get shot.

 

There are no victims and there is no good guy because both were knowingly participating in something illicit.

 

Cheating is bad behavior and bad character. There are no victims amongst the participants.

[Arieswoman]

There are no "victims", they are all volunteers

[Red123]

I would have to to agree. I guess I can understand being hurt but when one married AP acts like a victim that's where I get confused. Both are doing the same thing and yet one feels like they were taken advantage of.

[frogss29]

I think when any relationship ends, the one who is left feels they are the victim and behaves accordingly. They are bitter and angry.

Maybe, APs also feel guilty.

What a perfect mix of emotions!!

Edited October 8, 2016 by frogss29

[MJJean]

I would have to to agree. I guess I can understand being hurt but when one married AP acts like a victim that's where I get confused. Both are doing the same thing and yet one feels like they were taken advantage of.

 

Probably because there was future faking.

 

AP #1 tells AP #2 that they will leave their spouses and ride off into the sunset together. AP #2 foolishly believes it. When the affair ends, AP #2 feels betrayed because those pillow talk promises and plans turned out to be nothing more than verbal daydreaming.

[harrybrown]

so have you encouraged her to get tested for stds and tell her H, so that she can divorce him?

 

If she will not tell her H, then you should.

 

he needs to know that she does not care about him, so he can protect his health.

 

She must not respect her H or care for him, since her emotions are all about the OM.

 

I do hope you tell her H, if she will not.

[Lowrider93]

Victims allow themselves to justify their actions and therefore claim no accountability.

 

Peace

[DKT3]

I would have to to agree. I guess I can understand being hurt but when one married AP acts like a victim that's where I get confused. Both are doing the same thing and yet one feels like they were taken advantage of.

 

Delusion, entitlement and selfishness over rules logic. You have to believe logically both WS know they are twin criminals.

 

The delusion is then somehow thinking their feelings are more important then those of their spouse. So they see the OP betrayal of them as worse the the betrayal of their own spouse.

 

Once the affair ends if it's not by their hand then the entitlement, delusion and selfishness again forces the victim card.

Edited October 9, 2016 by DKT3

[Noirek]

she probably believed they would both leave their spouses and that it was an exit affair. Then he didn't and broke her heart. not all affairs are about a little something extra on the side. Many are people who don't do the right thing and end their current relationship before starting a new one. But sometimes one person can think they are in an exit affair while the other person really is future faking. Or changes their mind when push comes to shove.

 

Did your friend say in her own words that she was the a victim?

 

Or did she express pain and disappointment that the man she fell in love with and had a relationship with and who had promised to be with her had dumped her?

 

Because she may have brought it on herself. But It would still cause her to react in pain and anger.

[dichotomy]

Its difficult these days for many people to hold themselves accountable, to feel shame, regret, disappointment in themselves. They blame others.

 

 

My wife was single when she was in PA with MM, then in EA with MM while with me (dating, engaged, married short while). Her inability to feel regret, shame was the most upsetting part of it all. She finally broke down much much later in one or two therapy sessions, and cried about what she did, but it was brief. I remember her saying once to me later on ...."he used me!" to which I responded "yes - and you used him" and she just stared at me with "deer in the headlight eyes" unable to respond.

 

Yep - some people just want to avoid accountability or blame. Then there are some of us - then tend to beat ourselves up all the time - even when we are not at fault or we have been forgiven. I sometimes secretly admire those who can live the first way - it must be peaceful.

Edited October 9, 2016 by dichotomy

[Midwestmissy]

Dichotomy - it does seem like it must be peaceful, but judging by what I've seen, it only appears so. The 'peace' comes from flitting from one distraction to another, leaving a trail of stupidity behind them, never dealing with reality. I'm related to one of these people. She comes off as so together - ashrams, yoga, elevated beliefs. But she's actually a chameleon who becomes whatever she believes the situation needs. What she thinks will make her the shiniest object. She's actually a tiny impotent troll hiding behind the curtain, her whole being held together by insecurity. And her fear is that people will know who she really is. Of course they do, but her denial about her abilities is such that as long as she acts the sparkly gem, the world will see her as a sparkly gem.

 

She talks non stop so no one else can ask her a question she can't answer. You like football? Omg she's the biggest fan! Every meal is the best one ever, every store, everything is the best - because she has shone her light on it. There's no peace, she's exhausted from the show.

[afoolto no end]

If your friend didn't blame her OM, she would have to look at herself and what she did.......

My husband's OW blamed him too, because he made the first move. But she was all in too at that move from him.............everyone has to own their own decisions and actions whether you like it or not........

It's almost like the perception they have of themselves somehow hasn't changed even though they had an affair..........it's like that choice doesn't count...

It amazes me that adultery choices are so easily disregarded and not really seen as part of a cheaters character.

[understand50]

I have a married friend who is in an affair with a married man. She is not aware that my H has been unfaithful in the past but has chosen to share with me. Things have ended and she is heartbroken. Tbh she is painting a picture of her being the victim in the affair. The truth is that they both knew the other was married and both chose to do it anyway, he has decided to work on his marriage and she is devastated. Saying now that he is the bad guy and took advantage of her situation. This chat has made me think of my own situation. The MOW that H had an affair with did the same thing. She stated in emails after the fact that he did this, appearing to not take any accountability. In our case they were both married, both knew and both chose to do it. The difference with my friend and I is that H and I split up before Dday, due to marital problems, so he was free to pursue his AP, but didn't. I guess I can't see where any of them are victims, all consenting adults, no false beliefs that anyone was single. The MOW in our case has had an A before yet still claims victim with my H. I don't get it at all.

 

Red123,

 

Your friend is broken inside. She had no moral base to build on. It is all about what she wants. So this is the second time, I am sure she was a victim with the first one as well.

 

When someone decides to cheat, and then act upon it, they are a willing participant. They could have been impaired, drunk, but in the end they freely engaged in cheating. The first step in reconciliation, and it is to the wondering Spouse for them to realize this basic truth, is that they did this of their own free will, and broke their Vows. If you are the betrayed spouse, one of the first tests in deciding to give them a second chance, is does the WS really realize their responsibility in the cheating and accept it? They can say, they were manipulated, maybe fooled to some extent, but they willing cheated while married. Claiming they are a "victim" is just redoing the history to lighten the impact and responsibility of their act of cheating.

 

Another idea I have, is the cheater must "own" their act, must acknowledge that they willing engaged in cheating. Blaming is just delaying. You cannot reconcile with some one who will not own what they did. This is assuming that they have been honest on the details, so you can know what you are forgiving. Taking the mantel of a victim and then asking for a 2nd chance, are mutually exclusive. I don't think it can be done, for a real and true reconciliation.

 

You friend has a long way to go, and I do not think she will make it. At this point she is better off to divorce.

 

My 2 cents.....

[wmacbride]

women have put in a lot of effort over the years to show that they are every bit as strong and capable as men, so it irks me when they play the victim card in a situation like this.

 

how many time has it been said that a ow/om can't seduce a married person? The married person cheats of their own free will.

 

If this is the case, then the reverse is true. Ow/om aren't seduced, they get involved in an affair because they want to. All the lines about "future faking" and crap like that are just that, crap. They go in knowing it's an affair.

 

Mind you, if a married person lies and says they are not married ( I don't mean that they say they are separated, " staying for the kids", " can't divorce" whatever) that is a different ballgame.

[DKT3]

women have put in a lot of effort over the years to show that they are every bit as strong and capable as men, so it irks me when they play the victim card in a situation like this.

 

how many time has it been said that a ow/om can't seduce a married person? The married person cheats of their own free will.

 

If this is the case, then the reverse is true. Ow/om aren't seduced, they get involved in an affair because they want to. All the lines about "future faking" and crap like that are just that, crap. They go in knowing it's an affair.

 

Mind you, if a married person lies and says they are not married ( I don't mean that they say they are separated, " staying for the kids", " can't divorce" whatever) that is a different ballgame.

 

I recall a thread were it was asked were you groomed by mm to be in the affair, it was shocking how upset some of the MW were about that. Many refused to accept it as a possible. Shocked because many claimed to be victims. I guess having someone ask if you were conned into something is hard to take.

[MidnightBlue1980]

I recall a thread were it was asked were you groomed by mm to be in the affair, it was shocking how upset some of the MW were about that. Many refused to accept it as a possible. Shocked because many claimed to be victims. I guess having someone ask if you were conned into something is hard to take.

 

When I hear groomed, I think of a sociopath and it does happen but I don't see a lot of that here except for a few cases where the guy is much older and in a position of power (teacher, doctor, etc). Usually it's the same old story over and over again. I was lied to but I was not a victim, just stupid and gullible. On the flip side though, men play the victim card as well. I was portrayed as the aggressor and he played the helpless victim role and she bought it.

 

The problem IMHO of playing the victim card and not owning your behavior is that while it helps you in the short run with your BS, you have now established yourself as weak and able to be controlled and manipulated by anyone who might be interested in you. You have now set yourself up for a lifetime of monitoring as you cannot be allowed or trusted to even go to the grocery store by yourself. It's better to just own your own crap.

[Lion Heart]

Reeks of common behaviours of cheating spouses lol apparently it's NEVER their fault! It's very comical actually lol

 

BLAME SHIFTING that's primarily what it is.

 

Anyone along the scale of NPD just HAS to fight to hold uo their false facade of the "good guy". Absolutely play the victim.

 

Everyone else made them do it EXCEPT THEM.

 

So to elicit YOUR good opinion of her, your Wgf just has to blame anything else.

It's the disorder speaking, not the reality of the situation AT ALL.

 

Unless MOM raped her she consented.

 

I know that exWH WAS AN EXPERT at "grooming" HE COULD GROOM just about ANY woman and keep them stringing along! Then mostly THEY woke up and dropped him on his head.

 

Ugh it's sickening the garbage these people do to others.

It's all just an immature game to them.

Then when it goes all sour in any way they want people's SYMPATHY.

Don't give her this.

DON'T ENABLE this mindset of your gf.

 

My D is studying the psychology of Narcissists. Apparently it's a SOCIAL CONSTRUCT.

IN many.societies it just CANNOT EXIST because NO ONE ENABLES the Narcissists.

 

Be a frank and honest mirror to gf and any others who reek of NPD and do not enable them.

 

Lion Heart

[ladydesigner]

Reeks of common behaviours of cheating spouses lol apparently it's NEVER their fault! It's very comical actually lol

 

BLAME SHIFTING that's primarily what it is.

 

Anyone along the scale of NPD just HAS to fight to hold uo their false facade of the "good guy". Absolutely play the victim.

 

Everyone else made them do it EXCEPT THEM.

 

So to elicit YOUR good opinion of her, your Wgf just has to blame anything else.

It's the disorder speaking, not the reality of the situation AT ALL.

 

Unless MOM raped her she consented.

 

I know that exWH WAS AN EXPERT at "grooming" HE COULD GROOM just about ANY woman and keep them stringing along! Then mostly THEY woke up and dropped him on his head.

 

Ugh it's sickening the garbage these people do to others.

It's all just an immature game to them.

Then when it goes all sour in any way they want people's SYMPATHY.

Don't give her this.

DON'T ENABLE this mindset of your gf.

 

My D is studying the psychology of Narcissists. Apparently it's a SOCIAL CONSTRUCT.

IN many.societies it just CANNOT EXIST because NO ONE ENABLES the Narcissists.

 

Be a frank and honest mirror to gf and any others who reek of NPD and do not enable them.

 

Lion Heart

 

LOL my WH is an expert at grooming too. I place little blame on the AP's because my WH was a master manipulator. He still acts like a victim after everything has been said and done. He needs to find a new audience

[Betrayed&Stayed]

I guess I can't see where any of them are victims, all consenting adults, no false beliefs that anyone was single. The MOW in our case has had an A before yet still claims victim with my H. I don't get it at all.

 

In many cases I would think playing the victim card is a way to resolve the cognitive dissonance of cheating. By being a "victim" your friend can still consider herself a "good" person.

[ladydesigner]

In many cases I would think playing the victim card is a way to resolve the cognitive dissonance of cheating. By being a "victim" your friend can still consider herself a "good" person.

 

Yes the "good person" syndrome! Do all WS's suffer from this?

[TrustedthenBusted]

Yeah. My wife called OM a "predator" once.

 

I very politely told her that I had read dozens of their emails to eachother, and she is never to use that term with me again. Ever.