best friend of 20 has just ended the friendship. WTF???

[dobler33]

i've been hanging out in the romantic forums but i'm having some serious trouble w my best friend of 20 years and i thought i'd see what kind of help was available here on the friend forum. i'll try to make it brief.

 

we've been best friends since the age of 14 - we jokingly call each other our "heterosexual life partners". i have a wedding ring from my husband on my left hand and, until recently, a "wedding" ring from her on my right, because we've always looked at this as a kind of marriage - hard work but a committment that's made to last. she's been in a pretty consistent downward spiral for the past 3 years or so; unemployed, terrible relationships with exploitative men, serious depression, heavy drinking. she lost job after job and apartment after apartment to the point where she is now, at the age of 33, living in her high school bedroom in her mother's house. when she moved in there her depression increased tremendously and she wanted help from me, but what she wanted was for me to come over and drink with her in her high school bedroom, like teenagers. i was unwilling to do this, as it seemed like it would only help to keep her in her depression. i offered to let her stay with me as long as she wanted, said we'd go for walks every day and eat well and sit and brainstorm together about how she could pull herself out of her funk - basically i was willing to give her anything she needed as long as it didn't prolong her depression. she got very upset with me and said i was being unsupportive and "trying to be her therapist" (i'm a therapist, so people like to throw this one at me a lot). at that point i took a more hands-off approach and continued to support her from afar but not actively offer help.

 

so a couple of months ago some very, very, very bad stuff went down in my life, and i was utterly devastated - suicidal, unstable, totally without hope. i reached out to her for help and she responded with "i'm sorry you're sad, i'm sad too. i can't deal with your sh*t cause i have sh*t of my own to deal with." at that point we had a row and decided to be apart for awhile. i had felt for a very long time that things were pretty one-sided, that most of our collective energy was focused on her problems and that mine didn't seem to rate. i think she felt that because i am a married woman with a career my problems weren't all that serious or important, compared to her loneliness and lack of direction. and that was annoying but i was willing to put up with it, hoping that with time she'd pull herself together and be able to be a supportive and reciprocating partner again. when my life fell apart and i needed her i assumed that she would be there regardless of her own troubles, as we have always been for each other no matter what. it was a big painful shock that she wasn't.

 

anyway, we spent a couple of weeks apart and when my trauma had stabilized i emailed her just to tell her i love her and i was there for her, that i was back on my feet and hoped she was doing ok with the stuff she was going through. she wrote back and said "i have nothing to say to you, our time together has ended, good luck with your marriage and your life."

 

i am shocked and reeling with loss. i have no idea what happened. i have some theories but they tend toward the clinical and i don't want to collapse a very complex situation into diagnostic data. this woman has been the other half of my soul for two decades, and i can't begin to comprehend what has happened to make her want to throw that away.

 

any advice/insight?

 

thanks.

[xpaperxcutx]

Dobler, when I went through my own depression, I lashed out at my own family and friends, and simply disappeared into my little world because I didn't want them to see that way. But I have never ever told them to go away forever.

 

I don't know exactly know what's going on with your friend ( not even from a clinical point of view) but I think her state of mind is so muich so that shes resenting each and every person in her life, including herself. While her words are harsh, I'm pretty certain you're quick to forgive. If you have to, you have to completely distance yourself from her for her to come to her own recovery.

 

Do you know what kind of depression she was suffering from?

[dobler33]

Dobler, when I went through my own depression, I lashed out at my own family and friends, and simply disappeared into my little world because I didn't want them to see that way. But I have never ever told them to go away forever.

 

I don't know exactly know what's going on with your friend ( not even from a clinical point of view) but I think her state of mind is so muich so that shes resenting each and every person in her life, including herself. While her words are harsh, I'm pretty certain you're quick to forgive. If you have to, you have to completely distance yourself from her for her to come to her own recovery.

 

Do you know what kind of depression she was suffering from?

 

 

if i had to make a guess i'd probably put her at dysthymic depression, based on how long it's lasted. ironically enough this is what i am also diagnosed with, and the fact that i've been on meds and in therapy for years to manage it seems to make her even more angry at me, rather than making her feel like i know what she's going through.

 

this is the overwhelming feeling i've had from her in the last few years - the more i move forward in my life the more angry she seems to be at me, the less she seems to respect me. i haven't been able to figure out how to address this and it seems i have utterly failed.

[boogieboy]

Ill hazzard a guess what is also upsetting her is you succeeded in life while she consistently failed. You might be a reminder of what is depressing her. She cant deal with success being thrown in her face, which is why she prolly cant talk to you. Since she wants you to drink with her in her room, Im guessing she wants someone who failed like her to hang with to make herself feel better. That wouldnt work in reality, but its my guess.

 

I think shes just speaking out of frustration. After a month or two, she will probably come crawling back to you anyway apologizing.

 

Have you tried to tell her what shes doing wrong in these bad relationships in the past? Im sure thats a big part of her depression, if she doesnt know what shes doing wrong.

[xpaperxcutx]

if i had to make a guess i'd probably put her at dysthymic depression, based on how long it's lasted. ironically enough this is what i am also diagnosed with, and the fact that i've been on meds and in therapy for years to manage it seems to make her even more angry at me, rather than making her feel like i know what she's going through.

 

this is the overwhelming feeling i've had from her in the last few years - the more i move forward in my life the more angry she seems to be at me, the less she seems to respect me. i haven't been able to figure out how to address this and it seems i have utterly failed.

 

 

I've suffered frequent long term and short term bouts of depression myself and whenever I see my friends doing their own things that seemed to make their lives more productive, I get jealous and angry.

 

I remember when I was back in high school, my best friend had went to a different school and she was top of her class. She started making new friends and even gotten her own first bf. Looking at her, while I remain completely stuck in the past without making any progress in my own life, I came to held alot of resentment towards her. I constantly questioned why she was throwing me away when we have had so many memories together, and why spending time with other people seemed to bring her a joy whe i was the only one who had managed to do it in the past.

 

I hated myself for having those feelings, and I pushed her away frequently.

 

I think your friend feels that because your life is so much better than hers, she has came to resent for moving on as opposed to waiting for her. She felt like you left her behind.

[dobler33]

i try not to tell her what she's doing "wrong". she's in therapy and has been dealing with all the classic reasons for crappy relationships - i listen and encourage her progress, but i don't feel like it's my place to tell her what she's doing wrong. i think though that no matter what i say she's going to hear criticism in my words. and i don't really think she's going to change her mind on this. we've spent time apart in the past because we've been in different places or haven't seen eye to eye, but there was always the clear and unquestioned understanding that we'd get it together eventually, that this committment would survive any trial. neither of us has ever called it quits before.

 

by the way, thanks so much for responding. this is totally blowing my mind and getting some outside perspective is very helpful.

[dobler33]

papercut, i have thought the same thing. the thing that is so frustrating though is that she seems to have convinced herself that she's having to do this because i'm somehow bad for her, that she's enforcing healthy boundaries or something. which of course is maddening, because i would love her to set healthy boundaries - with the nasty using men who take her money and only call her for booty. the fact that she has somehow projected all of that onto me, blames me for her unhappiness, makes me kind of want to pull out my hair.

[writergal]

dobler33:

 

I can relate to what you're going through with your friend projecting her stuff on to you, blaming you for her problems b/c you're her closest friend.

 

I've a friend doing the same thing to me now, but over a 5 year period. It's a behavior I never really approved of or accepted. And now I may have to end that friendship which is unfortunate, since its not contributing anything positive to my life. Bad on me for putting up with it for as long as I have.

 

Friendship is a two-way street. Well, healthy friendships are supposed to be, regardless of the crises that happen.

 

I have to agree with papercutx and boogieboy's posts about your friend's jealousy clouding her judgment. Of course she is scapegoating you right now by giving you the silent treatment. The silent treatment is all about power. It's a way for a person to rationalize not taking any action when a conflict happens in a friendship or relationship.

 

The silent treatment is a permanent way to avoid dealing with any interpersonal conflict. It's an escape mechanism. It's a sign that someone has serious communication problems. Maybe your friend is so embarassed by her current circumstances, that she'd rather project her negative emotions on to you, instead of feeling depressed and scared and hopeless about her situation. It's easier for her to blame you for being a bad friend, than it is to hold herself accountable for her current situation and circumstances. Nobody likes to own up to their mistakes, especially when they fear others will judge them or abandon them.

 

I'm sorry that her silence is so frustrating for you. It's horrible when you realize what your friend is doing and why, knowing on some level you're damned if you do, damned if you don't when it comes to asking yourself: How do i respond to this person's behavior AND get my needs met too?

 

All I can offer you is my support. You could always ring her up and see if she's willing to talk to you. Otherwise, perhaps you should leave her be for another week or two and refocus your energy on yourself, your husband and your other friendships and hobbies and work. Maybe distance is what you both need right now, until she can calm down and think more rationally.

[dobler33]

thanks, writergal. this seems to be the consensus, both among objective strangers and those who know us both. it just breaks my heart. we've made it through so much - divorces, sexual assaults, abusive relationships, poverty, mental illness, death, addictions, lost loves, lost minds..... to lose it here after 20 years just seems absurdist, like someone's going to wake me up and say "ha! fooled you!" we have matching tattoos on our ankles that we got when we were 19, for christ's sake. thanks to you and the other posters for your support.

[sugarmomma]

if i had to make a guess i'd probably put her at dysthymic depression, based on how long it's lasted. ironically enough this is what i am also diagnosed with, and the fact that i've been on meds and in therapy for years to manage it seems to make her even more angry at me, rather than making her feel like i know what she's going through.

 

this is the overwhelming feeling i've had from her in the last few years - the more i move forward in my life the more angry she seems to be at me, the less she seems to respect me. i haven't been able to figure out how to address this and it seems i have utterly failed.

 

One thing that I have learned after having 20 year friendships is that sometimes we outgrow each other. I realized that in most of my friendships I was holding on simply because we had known each other for so long. Not necessarily that we were healthy for each other but just the familiarity and the history.

 

I had one friend that would call and immediately go into her drama of the day. never would ask how I was or offer anything constructive in my life. These people are what I call "emotional vampires". They simply suck the life out of you.

 

I would detach from her and not take it personal. Hopefully you have other friends that can help get your emotional needs met. If not, I would suggest you make some. Its never good to only have one source of support whether it be a mate or friend.

 

I have promised myself to only have people who bring positive energy and a optimistic outlook yo my life. I don't want friendships with people whose lives thrive on drama. Totally emotionally exhasuting!!

 

Give her some space and reach out to more healthy people. I have had to get rid of so many so called friends that only used me to help solve their problems but when I needed them, I got little to nothing.

 

I wish you the best.

[Chrome Barracuda]

Why dont you just give her space?

 

Sometimes friendships do break apart, people do grow apart with their ideologies and tactics and motivations.

 

Maybe she just wanted a person with an open ear and you wasnt there, so she feels she doesnt need you now.

 

And what's this about a part of your soul??? Sounds too damn close to me.

[dobler33]

Why dont you just give her space?

 

Sometimes friendships do break apart, people do grow apart with their ideologies and tactics and motivations.

 

Maybe she just wanted a person with an open ear and you wasnt there, so she feels she doesnt need you now.

 

And what's this about a part of your soul??? Sounds too damn close to me.

 

none of that was particularly pertinent or helpful, chrome, but thanks anyway.

[xpaperxcutx]

Dobler, isn't there a term in psychology called projection? Your friend is going through depression where she resents herself so much that she's projecting her failures onto those that are closest to her. It's unrealistic of her to blame you, but her frame of mind is unstable right now to process her emotions positively.

 

Have she thought about getting help?

[dobler33]

Dobler, isn't there a term in psychology called projection? Your friend is going through depression where she resents herself so much that she's projecting her failures onto those that are closest to her. It's unrealistic of her to blame you, but her frame of mind is unstable right now to process her emotions positively.

 

Have she thought about getting help?

 

there is indeed such a term, and i believe that is definitely what she is doing. it's just such a crushing bummer that she's convinced herself so efficiently that it's my fault that she's willing to throw away 20 years of hard work and good times. she's been in talk therapy for a while but should probably be on medication to boot - she is utterly anti-meds and will therefore not even consider the possibility, tells me to f*ck myself if i bring it up.

[xpaperxcutx]

Dobler, isn't there a term in psychology called projection? Your friend is going through depression where she resents herself so much that she's projecting her failures onto those that are closest to her. It's unrealistic of her to blame you, but her frame of mind is unstable right now to process her emotions positively.

 

Have she thought about getting help?

[green_tea]

It's possible she may not be jealous of your success like some have suggested, it could be that she thinks you're not being symapthetic to her and comparing your own problems with hers. And that she thought you had nothing to complain about. Hard to explain, but I've kind of been through similar, went through a very bad relationship experience, and one of my married friends started going on about her problems, once that she felt sad because her husband was away on Valentine's day. This made me quite angry - I said to her "at least you have someone!" I couldn't believe she was feeling sorry for herself when I had nobody and had been treated so badly. I was in no way jealous of her for being married, just felt she was being really insensitive and quite childish.

 

Anyway, it's possible your friend has had similar thoughts about you - that your problems don't really compare to hers. I know it may not be fair, but it sounds like your friend has had some pretty bad luck, and she may feel like you are not there for her anymore, and if so, then what use are you to her? I don't mean to come across rudely, just offering an alternative view to others, from what I've experienced.

[Trimmer]

Dobler, isn't there a term in psychology called projection? Your friend is going through depression where she resents herself so much that she's projecting her failures onto those that are closest to her.

 

there is indeed such a term, and i believe that is definitely what she is doing. it's just such a crushing bummer that she's convinced herself so efficiently that it's my fault that she's willing to throw away 20 years of hard work and good times....

I'm just an armchair psychologist, but it seems to me that it's even stronger, in a way, than "just" projection onto someone close to her. You suffer from, and are being treated for, a similar problem - you aren't just a projection, but a reflection of her. She looks at you as if through a mirror, and she sees an image of herself, only it's the successful self that she is all too aware that she fails to achieve.

 

....this is what i am also diagnosed with, and the fact that i've been on meds and in therapy for years to manage it seems to make her even more angry at me, rather than making her feel like i know what she's going through....

She's angry at herself for failing, especially because she sees - in you, her reflection - her unrealized potential for success.

 

I don't know - I'm just throwing that all out there, but you two are so close, I wonder if she maybe identifies with you so closely that you aren't just someone "close to her" that she's projecting on, but maybe more than that.

 

Jeez, I wish I had some kind of advice. That must be a real trauma to have had her reject you so solidly, and I'm really sorry for that. It seems like you won't be successful forcing your way in, but all I can think of is to leave your heart open to the possibility of her returning to you at some point in the future, so you're ready for it. Or would that be too painful, in view of trying to get past the shock of the current state of things?

 

Do you feel like you might need to "close" this chapter ( I hate the whole "closure" thing, but...) in order to move on and heal, or could you hold a place open for her, even if it imeans accepting a "separation," possibly indefinitely?

[Stung]

While I agree that on the evidence given it makes sense to agree that she is projecting her own jealousies and insecurities wildly, and lashing out because of her depression...because I am familiar with your story from other boards, Dobler (re: the recent traumatic events of which you speak), and I assume that as your friend of so many years she probably knows all of the other people involved...isn't it also possible that she disapproves, or has been getting an earful which is upsetting her or making her question your values? In conjunction with some level of jealousy, this could be a devastating blow against her feelings of empathy and warmth towards you.

[jasminetea]

It seems to me that any situation will come about as a result of many factors and it seems that many if not all of the relevant factors to your own situation have been identified here. Even though you didn't like Chrome's post, I think it's relevant

 

none of that was particularly pertinent or helpful, chrome, but thanks anyway.

 

Is it really healthy to have such a huge reliance on someone else as you and your friend have had with each other? Look at the fallout when the rubbish stuff happens for you both at the same time.

 

Maybe she learnt some independence from her relationship with you when you were unable to help her and maybe that independance felt good enough for her to start viewing the relationship she'd had with you as unhealthy. Or maybe she's just punishing you for not being there for her. But both scenarios demonstrate the relationship you once had isn't really good for either of you as it once was.

 

I suspect that although this isn't the whole truth, it could well be a part of it. I also suspect that if you want, you'll be friends again even if not the same as before - but that it may be far better for both of you.

[dobler33]

While I agree that on the evidence given it makes sense to agree that she is projecting her own jealousies and insecurities wildly, and lashing out because of her depression...because I am familiar with your story from other boards, Dobler (re: the recent traumatic events of which you speak), and I assume that as your friend of so many years she probably knows all of the other people involved...isn't it also possible that she disapproves, or has been getting an earful which is upsetting her or making her question your values? In conjunction with some level of jealousy, this could be a devastating blow against her feelings of empathy and warmth towards you.

 

 

actually, she was one of the loudest voices of support for leaving for the xOM. that was what was so bizarre about her total disappearance when he ended it.

[motive2002]

I don't know if this helps, but I am going through the same thing so I know how you feel.

Knew the guy 20 years. I recently got a new girlfriend and she was awesome! Best gf I had ever had up to that point, and he told me time and time again that she was a keeper. That he wished he could clone her and have one of his own.

Deep inside this friend of mine always held some kind of resentment. I was always the guy getting girlfriends and he wasn't. I could connect with other people and have other close friends and he couldn't.

So what does he do? He sells me out by talking **** about me to my girlfriend, trying to convince her that he's a better catch. They are living together now and in love, and this best friend of 20+ years is no longer my friend anymore.

 

He always whined about being the nice guy and why couldn't he get girlfriends.. in the same breath he would take jabs at me and my shortcomings.. and make it sound like he deserved a girlfriend more than I did because in his mind he was a better person than I was.

 

Maybe your friend is dealing with the same issues. Resenting you for having a husband and career while she's going through crappy relationships and having to live at home etc. I'm finding out the hard way that years and years of this type of jealousy and resentment will really rear it's ugly head in a way you hadn't thought possible. My best friend just stabbed me right in the back and didn't think anything of it. In his little mind he thinks he deserves my ex-gf more than I did, so he literally feels justified in screwing me over.

 

Sorry to rant, but having been through a similar situation I can at least empathize with you. It's hard to make sense of it all when it happens.

[dobler33]

I don't know if this helps, but I am going through the same thing so I know how you feel.

Knew the guy 20 years. I recently got a new girlfriend and she was awesome! Best gf I had ever had up to that point, and he told me time and time again that she was a keeper. That he wished he could clone her and have one of his own.

Deep inside this friend of mine always held some kind of resentment. I was always the guy getting girlfriends and he wasn't. I could connect with other people and have other close friends and he couldn't.

So what does he do? He sells me out by talking **** about me to my girlfriend, trying to convince her that he's a better catch. They are living together now and in love, and this best friend of 20+ years is no longer my friend anymore.

 

He always whined about being the nice guy and why couldn't he get girlfriends.. in the same breath he would take jabs at me and my shortcomings.. and make it sound like he deserved a girlfriend more than I did because in his mind he was a better person than I was.

 

Maybe your friend is dealing with the same issues. Resenting you for having a husband and career while she's going through crappy relationships and having to live at home etc. I'm finding out the hard way that years and years of this type of jealousy and resentment will really rear it's ugly head in a way you hadn't thought possible. My best friend just stabbed me right in the back and didn't think anything of it. In his little mind he thinks he deserves my ex-gf more than I did, so he literally feels justified in screwing me over.

 

Sorry to rant, but having been through a similar situation I can at least empathize with you. It's hard to make sense of it all when it happens.

 

thanks, motive. i can't really offer any greater insight than what has already been suggested here. i haven't tried to communicate w my bf in a week or two, have been trying to collect my thoughts and figure out how i feel about it. i'm still really torn. on the one hand, i know that she is in a very sick place and that nothing i say or do is going to get through to her, that nothing is going to change in her life until she makes a choice to confront her addictions and self-destruction. but at the same time, this is someone who has been - yes, regardless of how strange it sounds - the other half of me for two decades. my sister, my partner, the one i always knew was fighting back to back w me. i'm just trying to mourn her and hope the best for her, hope that she pulls herself out of this nosedive and starts working for all the stuff she perceives i have that she doesn't. maybe when she does that, when she realizes that nothing has fallen into my lap and that i've fought tooth and nail for all of it, she'll be able to let go of the deep resentment she seems to feel toward me.

 

that's the best stance i can think of right now, so that's the only advice i can offer. what kind of conversation have you had w your friend? any? i really love the fact that you posted, motive, because i think men are sometimes encouraged not to express love for their friends or pain when a friendship is in jeopardy. obviously this guy means a LOT to you and his betrayal and departure has hurt you deeply. 20 years is nothing to sneeze your nose at.

 

keep me updated, buddy.

[motive2002]

If you have time to hear my story, it's in a couple threads.

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t190396/

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t191795/

 

I haven't heard from either of them in almost a week, which is a relief. Last time she messaged me she said some pretty awful things... I didn't even do anything wrong!!! He's got her brainwashed into thinking I'm some kind of monster. I can't believe someone I knew for so long could do these things to me and feel justified. I don't know who to trust anymore.

[dobler33]

If you have time to hear my story, it's in a couple threads.

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t190396/

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t191795/

 

I haven't heard from either of them in almost a week, which is a relief. Last time she messaged me she said some pretty awful things... I didn't even do anything wrong!!! He's got her brainwashed into thinking I'm some kind of monster. I can't believe someone I knew for so long could do these things to me and feel justified. I don't know who to trust anymore.

 

 

oh, honey. i am so so sorry. you must be in so much pain. that is a far worse betrayal than my whacked-out alchoholic bf losing her mind. my heart goes out to you. more than you know.

[motive2002]

oh, honey. i am so so sorry. you must be in so much pain. that is a far worse betrayal than my whacked-out alchoholic bf losing her mind. my heart goes out to you. more than you know.

 

Thanks for your kind words. It's been the hardest thing yet. Sorry to hijack your post. I hope your friend comes around