Amie56 Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 As I'm sure, everyone is aware that sexual harrassment is a problem in the workplace, I'm sure I'm not the only one going through this at this time, I just thought I'd come here for some advice on my situation..and maybee even start a support forum for the people who have been sexually harrassed in the workplace, or harrassed at all! I have worked at my job for a little over 2 years now! I have been harrassed on a couple occasions! The first time it was by another female...I reported that to my boss, and the girl is no longer there! This 2nd instance I really didn't look at it like it was sexual harrassment...but this guy made me feel very uncomfortable with some of his remarks and some other things. I had some problems with him previously..he was stealing things and I told my boss about it. We didn't get along very well for a few months..but then we started to get along again and thats when the comments started! I did nothing to say that I didn't appreciate the comments so I feel it is partly my fault for not saying anything. The guy told me that nobody liked me there and also that everyone thought I made up the story about the girl harrassing me. so in other words if I would of told my bosses anything that would make them hate me more. He tried to turn me against the people that I work with..which did not work! Just thinking that these people hated me really hurt me...I cried everyday..I love these people..I love my job...and it just killed me to think that nobody their appreciated me or liked me. I was angry and started saying some mean things about my bosses..which I really didn't mean at all! I felt no need to open up my big mouth..for once I just wanted to keep it shut! I didn't feel threatened by the guy at all...I mean I'd even joke around with this guy about things (not regarding sex ofcourse). Anyways, the guy is no longer working there and it seems as if everyone is happy he is gone! But here's where my problem is! A co-worker of mine told my boss about what happened between me and the guy...my boss asked me about what happened and I told him...but I'm afraid that nobody will believe me...if he watched the tapes he won't see much..I mean there were a few times he'd get really close to me and rub my shoulders but thats about it..I got along with the guy just fine..well pretended to anyways! I feel really bad about all this because I always went to my bosses if there was a problem and now I'm afraid they won't trust me! I just truley thought they all hated me..but now I know they don't! I don't know what to do! I'm lost and confussed! Any advice would be appreciated! Link to post Share on other sites
magda Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 He may have manipulated you, but it doesn't sound like he sexually harrassed you. In the future, do not be so naive. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Amie56 Posted October 10, 2005 Author Share Posted October 10, 2005 Well hey made sexual remarks to me..and that is a form of sexual harrassment..but I didn't do anything about it so I kinda understand that since I didn't make it known that I didn't appreciate what he was doing that gave him the wrong message! So I guess it is kind of my fault but this guy knew it was wrong! I mean he only did it when my bosses weren't around and when he'd see them pulling in the parking lot or something he'd immediately stop! Now that he is gone I knid of fear him...I guess you'd just have to be in the same situation to understand! Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 I'm confused.. You mention sexual harrassment in your post but you don't mention that he sexually harrased you .. You seem to complain about people alot and get them fired.. Do you know what sexual harrasment is ?? I suggest you do a google search.. the first thing you will find is that in the shoulder rubbing incident you have to say NO.. that is unacceptable..and if he repeats it then it can be considered sexual harrasment. Unless of course he is your boss then the rules change.. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Well hey made sexual remarks to me..and that is a form of sexual harrassment! No it isn't.. You have to say NO that type of behavior is unacceptable..then he has to continue it.. again unless he is your boss or has power over you. The laws are real forgiving to people who work as equals in the workplace and unless there are written policies you have to forge what is appropiate and what is not Link to post Share on other sites
magda Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 I guess you'd just have to be in the same situation to understand! I guess so. It sounds like you're more upset that he told you no one liked you than you are about the sexual remarks. Which is understandable but it's not sexual harrassment. Yes I have had people make sexual remarks to me at work but I agree that reporting it should be a last resort after you've made it clear that the behavior is unwelcome and inappropriate. You don't want to get a reputation of being trigger happy about these accusations and you should choose your battles. I think that in your situation, it is very likely that no one will take you seriously. You pretended to be friends with him, and by your own admission did not feel at all threatened by him. At this point, the guy no longer works with you. why is it important for you to report him and the situation to your workplace? I have been sexually harrassed in the past. My situation was a lot different from yours. I understand that this kind of thing can be very traumatic and that is why I am not too sure about your case. In my case, I just wanted it all to be over. Actually having to resort to getting help dealing with the situation and explaining it all was so humiliating and so hard that I do not understand at all why you would even consider doing it if the problem doesn't exist for you anymore. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Amie56 Posted October 10, 2005 Author Share Posted October 10, 2005 No it isn't.. You have to say NO that type of behavior is unacceptable..then he has to continue it.. again unless he is your boss or has power over you. The laws are real forgiving to people who work as equals in the workplace and unless there are written policies you have to forge what is appropiate and what is not Well when I talked to my boss about what happened he said it is sexual harrassment...even something as little as a remark could be sexual harrassment! I really didn't believe it was sexual harrassment...I was just very uncomfortable, I know I should of said something..that is why i don't understand why all the sudden everyone is interested in this...the guy isn't there anymore, why would they bring up the subject? Link to post Share on other sites
Author Amie56 Posted October 10, 2005 Author Share Posted October 10, 2005 I guess so. It sounds like you're more upset that he told you no one liked you than you are about the sexual remarks. Which is understandable but it's not sexual harrassment. Yes I have had people make sexual remarks to me at work but I agree that reporting it should be a last resort after you've made it clear that the behavior is unwelcome and inappropriate. You don't want to get a reputation of being trigger happy about these accusations and you should choose your battles. I think that in your situation, it is very likely that no one will take you seriously. You pretended to be friends with him, and by your own admission did not feel at all threatened by him. At this point, the guy no longer works with you. why is it important for you to report him and the situation to your workplace? I have been sexually harrassed in the past. My situation was a lot different from yours. I understand that this kind of thing can be very traumatic and that is why I am not too sure about your case. In my case, I just wanted it all to be over. Actually having to resort to getting help dealing with the situation and explaining it all was so humiliating and so hard that I do not understand at all why you would even consider doing it if the problem doesn't exist for you anymore. Well I wasn't the one to initiate the conversation about what happened..My boss wanted to know what happened because another co-worker of mine told him about them things! Link to post Share on other sites
RecordProducer Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Wait a minute... you reported this guy for sexual harassment and he was fired? And now you are afraid that he might be vindictive? And you also said some bad things about your bosses to him? I don't get this really, but in any case you should learn to let people know when you're uncomfortable with their comments, touches or questions, because you don't need this reputation of a woman who causes people to get fired. He was also a jerk for tempting you to report him after you made one woman go. You should never talk against anyone with anybody from work! Link to post Share on other sites
jaye Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Its not sexual harrasment, move on Link to post Share on other sites
Author Amie56 Posted October 10, 2005 Author Share Posted October 10, 2005 I guess I should make this a little more clear..I did not get the guy fired! He walked off the job..then a co-worker of mine was talking to my boss and he told him about all the things this guy did behind their back! Nobody found anything out until the guy quit! I didn't get him fired! Link to post Share on other sites
Author Amie56 Posted October 10, 2005 Author Share Posted October 10, 2005 I found this on a website: Unwelcome jokes, gestures or comments of a sexual nature Unwelcome displaying of sexually-suggestive objects or pictures Unwelcome flirting Repeated and unwanted sexual advances Touching and other unwanted bodily contact, or impeding or blocking movements It was sexual harrassment..but since I did not do anything about it, it is my fault and nothing can be done...I guess we all learn from our mistakes..I should of stood up for my rights..but I didn't! ..I guess I'm just angry at myself! Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 I found this on a website: Unwelcome jokes, gestures or comments of a sexual nature Unwelcome displaying of sexually-suggestive objects or pictures Unwelcome flirting Repeated and unwanted sexual advances Touching and other unwanted bodily contact, or impeding or blocking movements It was sexual harrassment..but since I did not do anything about it, it is my fault and nothing can be done...I guess we all learn from our mistakes..I should of stood up for my rights..but I didn't! ..I guess I'm just angry at myself! The keyword is UNWELCOME .. You have to say NO first before it becomes UNWELCOMED. If you did not say NO first then it was NOT sexual harrassment Link to post Share on other sites
RecordProducer Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 If you did not say NO first then it was NOT sexual harrassment This is not true. Sexual harassment is sexual harrassment. It is assumed that no sexual innuendoes will happen at the work place. Just because she didn't have the courage to tell him "no" didn't give him any right to touch her body. If every guy was allowed to touch us UNTIL we say "no," they would be touching us all the time and we would keep saying "no" only after they managed to touch our tits and asses. Men are supposed to know what is sexual harrassment and what crosses the boundaries of appropriateness and I believe at least 99% of men know them. The rules are set for those who don't behave and victims who can't handle the situation independently. Besides, you are not always in a position to say "no." Once I had a boss who discussed sex and girls with his friends/business partners in front of me. How could I say "no" to that? Should I have told him "Excuse me guys, you're making me feel uncomfortable, please stop talking about sex"? Now how many would really do that? He also asked me to go out with him twice so I simply quit the job after two weeks. Many women don't have the spine and guts to oppose to men for various reasons. We shouldn't punish them for that and say "you didn't say NO so it's your fault!" That's a theory that favors women who are bitches - the more she stands up for her rights the better off she is. We should protect those who are weak, not make them feel even worse. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 This is not true. RP it is true.. Read my other posts that go along with that one. She is in a equal coworker situation, Not a boss situation.. The rules and laws are different if the indivual has power over the person. In your situation he was the BOSS..So it was sexual harrasment. Also in company where there are no written policies that managers and employees have to sign the law is real forgiving when it comes to the FIRST time someone says something sexual.. YOU have to say NO in those situations for it to become sexual harrassment.. You have to say NO I donn't apprieceate that kind of talk . Link to post Share on other sites
lindya Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 It was sexual harrassment..but since I did not do anything about it, it is my fault and nothing can be done...I guess we all learn from our mistakes..I should of stood up for my rights..but I didn't! ..I guess I'm just angry at myself! Sexual harassment isn't always the easiest thing to define. If someone tells a supervisor that they feel harassed, then that does place a responsibility on the supervisor to look into matters and take some action if necessary. Although you shouldn't suffer a detriment in the workplace for asserting your legal rights, in reality you often will - in ways that may be very difficult for you to actually prove. You don't really want to get into the habit of referring to your rights as soon as someone or something is bugging you at work. Apart from anything else, you'll lose credibility because bosses will start to see you as someone who can't resolve problems without adopting a sledgehammer approach An office octopus will always look for an easy target - eg someone who isn't clear about their boundaries and therefore doesn't really know when to say "don't touch." Telling people that they're encroaching over your boundaries needn't be a huge deal. Just flick his hand away as if it's an annoying fly and say "too expensive for you." If he responds in a hurt or offended way, ignore. He'll get over it. Link to post Share on other sites
RecordProducer Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Okay, I guess I took a more general rather than legal approach. I am disgusted and actually have felt humiliated by men who would harass me in one way or another. I did gigs with a guy who talked about his sexual experiences (using the F word) and commented my breasts every time and even tried to kiss me twice, although I told him twice that I feel very uncomfortable about it, that it's not professional or acceptable and that I will have to stop working with him. He didn't stop so I stopped working with him. Cases like that make me feel like a sexual object every time a collegue tries to hit on me. I never give them reasons, I always tell them that I have a BF, and I act totally professional, but they are still trying. Once a guy touched my knee while my BF was in the bathroom. They are just trying to touch me in any possible way (not touching anything intimate though) and that makes me feel very bad. Regardless of how I react, in my opinion, it's still sexual harassment. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Amie56 Posted October 10, 2005 Author Share Posted October 10, 2005 Ok, let me ask something else! Would the age difference matter? I'm 19 and the guy is in his mid 50's. Link to post Share on other sites
RecordProducer Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Ok, let me ask something else! Would the age difference matter? I'm 19 and the guy is in his mid 50's. I've had men of all ages acting in an inappropriate way with me. He can be Ricky Martin's twin brother, he has no right to touch me! Link to post Share on other sites
New_Wife Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 I think one of the toughest things to do sometimes, is define your personal boundaries and stick to them. Whether or not it was sexual harassment, there were behaviors and comments that you were not comfortable with. Should a situation like that come up again, perhaps you could say something to the effect of "I'm not really comfortable with this sort of talk." That's it. Or if someone is rubbing your shoulders, a simple "Thanks for the thought, but I'm really not a very touchy-feely person." From there, if the person continues - it's a harassment issue. It's hard to say things like that, because you don't want to be the "bad guy" however, most people with innocent intentions will simply move on and make a mental note about your preferences. If someone said to you "Hey, I like you fine, but I don't really want to discuss this with you" while it might sting, odds are good you'd just respect that and move on. Link to post Share on other sites
Mz. Pixie Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 AC is right. I've been the victim of SH. I once had someone ask me what color panties I had on. I called him on his inappropriate comments and asked him not to do that again. I've also had several other situations like this, but this one in particular. I totally think you should have told him it made you uncomfortable and not to do it again. You have to set your boundaries. As a professional woman, you cannot always run and tell when you think someone is sexually harrassing you. Otherwise many times that's all we'd be doing. If it's unwanted and you tell them and it continues, then by all means, report it but you have to judge what's sexual harrassment and what's not. You can't sit around and make sexual jokes and laugh about them and later when someone says something about you or to you say, "Well they are harrassing me". Make sure that your professional demeanor is above reproach before you start throwing those charges out. Link to post Share on other sites
Outcast Posted October 12, 2005 Share Posted October 12, 2005 This is not true. Actually AC and others have it right. In some workplaces, folks give each other backrubs or hugs or touch and it's all ok and everyone knows it's friendly and other people don't like it. In order for the world not to become totally PC, you're obliged to tell someone if a comment or behaviour disturbs you. Of course, grabbing an important body part is always a problem but there is a wide area of latitude between what bothes some people and not others. Once I had a boss who discussed sex and girls with his friends/business partners in front of me. How could I say "no" to that? Should I have told him "Excuse me guys, you're making me feel uncomfortable, please stop talking about sex"? Yep. That's exactly what you are supposed to do. Link to post Share on other sites
sami Posted October 12, 2005 Share Posted October 12, 2005 "...Unwelcome"????!!!!! I just don't see any " Unwelcome" thing here. Link to post Share on other sites
RecordProducer Posted October 12, 2005 Share Posted October 12, 2005 Well I don't live in the States or Canada where a woman can sue a man for everything, get all of his money, kick him out of work, etc. In North America you really have laws that protect women so I understand why you guys are having this attitude. Theoretically, if someone squeezed your breasts and ass at work (and you didn't dare say anything, but didn't act like you enjoyed it either) wouldn't it be sexual harassment? The "no" law just helps women defend themselves legally from aggressive men. In reality men DO KNOW very well what's appropriate behavior. Link to post Share on other sites
Woggle Posted October 12, 2005 Share Posted October 12, 2005 It's not just harrassment. Anybody can sue anybody over anything in America. People sue fast food chians because they eat too much and gain. It's absurd and the real shame of it is that it hurts people who really do have a case. I am a natural flirt and I have never once been accused of harrassment. Because of all the false accusations by some women with an agenda judges are getting tougher on false claims. Link to post Share on other sites
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