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I got accepted to Law School!


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Old 29th January 2008, 7:53 PM   #46
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You go girl!!!!!

I am sooo happy for you... Congratulations!

You'll do just fine... good luck! You must be proud of you!

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Old 29th January 2008, 8:29 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StillSame View Post
I hope you keep that in mind when it comes down to choosing a school. Some of them have as high as 25%-40% weed out and drop out rate.
Being the optimist that I am, this must mean that they have a 60 - 75% completion rate.
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Old 29th January 2008, 10:33 PM   #48
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they'll weed you out of any school if you do poor enough. And her chosing a higher tiered school over a lower one isnt going to really change her chances of failing out. You should go to the school thats right for you. If location doesn't matter and you cant tell the difference between two school then yes pick the better ranked one. Scholarships can be hard to keep so dont let that weigh to heavily on your decision as you may lose it.
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Old 29th January 2008, 11:14 PM   #49
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Oh dear! Now you'll be ruined!

Congrats, Cutie. I'm rootin' for ya!
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Old 29th January 2008, 11:53 PM   #50
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Hokey, Lizzie, and everyone, thanks.

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Originally Posted by StillSame View Post
I hope you keep that in mind when it comes down to choosing a school. Some of them have as high as 25%-40% weed out and drop out rate.
I don't understand how this affects me. Are you trying to make the following connection:

high drop-out rate => dumb student body => less rigorous program => less prestigious faculty => bad school?

I believe this is true, but I don't need to look for their drop-out rate in order to conclude this. All I have to do is look at the other statistics: bar-passage rate, employment, median LSAT/GPA stats, and the like. The school that accepted me has a high bar passage rate.

Many people lose their motivation anytime between the application process and graduation. I know a person who got accepted into a tier-two law school and never attended it. I would assume the loss of motivation occurs even more frequently once people face the rigor of the program. Besides, 4T schools accept many students with very low LSAT scores and GPA's, especially since the ABA (read: the government) started insisting on enrolling minority students as part of their admission policy. These students have the green light in the admission process with very low credentials, but once in law school, their abilities show. In other words, the government wants to give them a chance, but it's up to them to succeed in law school. Fortunately, most of them do succeed.

Of course, a school whose median LSAT is 148 (less than the 50th percentile) will have a high number of unmotivated students with limited capabilities.
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Originally Posted by Star Gazer View Post
RP - just promise me you won't go to a low ranking school and also incur huge student loans. If you go to a lower-tier school, go to the one that gives you a scholarship. Okay?
I promise.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KMT
they'll weed you out of any school if you do poor enough
Indeed, anyone who would be kicked out of a 4T school within six months, would be kicked out of a top school within six minutes.

I was wondering what SS had in mind when she/he wrote the post, so I tried to compare it to a high school. If 30% of school X drop out by the end of the second year, you'd guess that it's not a decent suburban school for the yuppies' kids, right?

In your typical inner-city HS, half the boys deal crack and half the girls have 2.7 kids by the age of 17 (the stats are improvised for the purpose of dramatization). The thing is ABA accredited law schools are not in this category; they don't want these people in their institutions. And if somehow, some of them wander into the halls of a 4T law school, the deans make sure that their legal careers end before they put a stain on the school's reputation.

Weeding out is a process of keeping up with the demands of the legal profession. They don't want losers in the field. It's similar to the medical profession: the AMA (The American Medical Association) doesn't want doctors who aren't good, because they all have to treat patients and they must meet the highest standards.
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Last edited by RecordProducer; 29th January 2008 at 11:56 PM..
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Old 30th January 2008, 12:43 AM   #51
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What I am saying is that:

1) Forced curve will be used. Meaning certain percentage of students will have GPA under 2.0.

2) Tier 4 law schools have lower median grades (That's how it is, probably, purposely used to weed out certain number of students).

3) Certain tier 4 schools weed out certain consistent percent of students annually.

With the above three (probably) correct asumptions, the chance of someone choosing to attending a tier 4 law school end up dropping out is higher than someone who choose to attend a Tier 3, 2 or 1 school.
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Old 30th January 2008, 1:23 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StillSame View Post
1) Forced curve will be used. Meaning certain percentage of students will have GPA under 2.0.
No, this is not true. If 25% of students qualify for an A and 75% qualify for a B, that's the way they are going to be graded. The faculty will NOT create an artificial curve for the purpose of ranking students at all cost and forcing 25-40% out of their school.

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2) Tier 4 law schools have lower median grades (That's how it is, probably, purposely used to weed out certain number of students).
I see that you're convinced that their main goal is to "weed out" a certain number of students. It's not! Their (and every professional school's) interest is to remove the bad apples. If the lowest-ranked student is good enough to obtain a GPA of 2.9, he is not going to be kicked out of the school.

Actually, I found this article about Western State Law School:

Orange County's oldest law school won provisional approval from the ABA in 1998. In 2003, the ABA's Section of Legal Education and Admissions to the Bar recommended that the college lose its status because of low test scores and a high dropout rate.
http://www.lawschool.com/lat-wsu.htm

As you can note, a high drop-out rate means that the school risks to lose its ABA accreditation.


Quote:
3) Certain tier 4 schools weed out certain consistent percent of students annually.
Who wouldn't agree with such a precise statement? Certain (consistent) number of women die during labor in certain number of hospitals.

Quote:
With the above three (probably) correct asumptions, the chance of someone choosing to attending a tier 4 law school end up dropping out is higher than someone who choose to attend a Tier 3, 2 or 1 school.
With my - not probably, but definitely correct - assumptions, the student who chooses NOT to study has a 100% chance of dropping out of law school.

With all the ("probably correct") assumptions and facts you're spilling out, I think you should introduce the nature of your competency to assert this matter. Are you in the legal field or do you just know someone who knows someone who dropped out of law school?
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Old 30th January 2008, 1:28 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StillSame View Post
What I am saying is that:

1) Forced curve will be used. Meaning certain percentage of students will have GPA under 2.0.

2) Tier 4 law schools have lower median grades (That's how it is, probably, purposely used to weed out certain number of students).

3) Certain tier 4 schools weed out certain consistent percent of students annually.

With the above three (probably) correct asumptions, the chance of someone choosing to attending a tier 4 law school end up dropping out is higher than someone who choose to attend a Tier 3, 2 or 1 school.
that still makes no sense, your using the statistic to argue that going to a crappy school will make her more likely to fail, when the reality is a crappy school is more likely to accept people who end up failing. and being in a curve with idiots could only make her grade better in comparison. Though I think she should go to the best ABA accredited school she gets in to. but alot of pressure is off from here foward she now knows she has the option to go to law school if she wants. not every one who wants to go to law school even gets accepted so shes one large step closer to her dream career. I personaly think its horible what Stargazer is doing, even though I doubt she means harm.
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Old 30th January 2008, 7:07 AM   #54
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CONGRATUALTIONS RP !!

I was wondering about you the other day ~ I'm so pleased for you ~ you really do deserve this after all you've been through in the past months.

At the end of the day ~ the world is full of IF'S and MAYBE'S ~ but I prefer to take more of a philosophical view on things ~ if you work hard enough for something ~ you WILL be rewarded ~ in whatever shape or form that might take ~ your destiny comes from the foundations you choose to lay in life ~ you'll be fine RP ~ starting off with a positive attitude is priceless ~ believe me

Dont take too much notice of SS ~ her/his statistics and presumptions are quite often more than a little flakey and her perspective seems to veer towards the negative ~ ~ read some of her other posts (I think she also posted under the name BestAdvisor at one point)

ANYWAY ~~ enough of that ~ fair play to you RP ~ I'll Definitely raise a glass for you tonight ~ !!

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Old 30th January 2008, 8:55 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by RecordProducer View Post
No, this is not true. If 25% of students qualify for an A and 75% qualify for a B, that's the way they are going to be graded. The faculty will NOT create an artificial curve for the purpose of ranking students at all cost and forcing 25-40% out of their school.
I think the point SS is trying to make is that upper-higher education is, essentially, similar to a private club, a private club in which the members get to decide who joins. It doesn't matter whether it's a doctor school, or a lawyer school, or a Student of Plato school, they are very much looking for specific skills and traits, and, I believe, talent. Don't forget that every potential admission is also a potential faculty member because one never knows where their education will truly take them.

So are there forced/artificial curves? Of course there are. Weeding out is, quite simply, a given.

Meanwhile, congratulations are certainly in order. Please let us know as you receive other acceptance letters because the only institutions that are off the table are those that have said so.
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Old 30th January 2008, 12:04 PM   #56
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CONGRATULATIONS RP !!

I was wondering about you the other day ~ I'm so pleased for you ~ you really do deserve this after all you've been through in the past months.
Thank you very much, Missy and everyone.

Regarding the question that SS raised, I think it's time to close that subject. A person who is ambitious, hard-working, realistic, intelligent, has good credentials and high motivation to succeed has no business fearing the worst-case scenario. My success will depend on me. In the meanwhile, I will keep fearing only the things that I can't influence.

But speaking of being realistic, I have to mention some posts that I read on a forum. A law student says: "I was extremely excited about going to law school, and after suffering through the LSAT, I thought the worst was over." Apparently, anyone who thinks that the hard work is over at the moment of enrollment is going to have a rude awakening in the very first semester of law school.

Another student wrote: "And if you're like me -- an English major who likes movies, books, and music -- you will find little of interest in legal subject matter. I find all the various areas of the law tedious, boring, uninspiring, and mind numbing."

Movies, books, and music?! People who think that everything in life should be easy and fun and who can't discern the difference between a "hobby" and a "job" are good candidates for major disappointments. The had-I-known-law-school-would-be-so-difficult-I-would-not-have-applied profile of students doesn't belong in law school or medical school or anything that demands sacrifice. The majority of drop-outs quit voluntarily! They are not stupid because they lack IQ; they are stupid because they think that law school is a vacation.

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Old 30th January 2008, 12:13 PM   #57
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Another student wrote: "And if you're like me -- an English major who likes movies, books, and music -- you will find little of interest in legal subject matter. I find all the various areas of the law tedious, boring, uninspiring, and mind numbing."

Movies, books, and music?! People who think that everything in life should be easy and fun and who can't discern the difference between a "hobby" and a "job" are good candidates for major disappointments.
that is one person's opinion.

what concerns me the most about this statement is assuming a person can't juggle both hobbies and a job, and if they like things like 'movies, books and music', they must be challenged idiots who take the easy way out.

for some, those words are interchangeable. some people's hobbies are other people's jobs, and likewise.

and still, some of us love those things, as well as an entire host of other things, and manage to enjoy them and still find time to kick ass in law school. so, yeah.

good luck.
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Old 30th January 2008, 12:42 PM   #58
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for some, those words are interchangeable. some people's hobbies are other people's jobs, and likewise.
Creation and consumption of art or any goods are two different things. I love cheese, but don't wish to buy a cow and make my own cheese. If you like movies, books or music, you better be able to create them, go through the pain of producing them, be able to market them and fight with the fierce competition and the "gods" in the publishing/show business. Otherwise, you're just a consumer. Paying and being paid are the opposite poles on the scale of effort; the (under)paid party sweats to provide the goods, while the buyer gets it on a silver plate.

I've learned that in life you will always get less than you think you deserve. And you will NEVER get anything on a silver plate for free. If it appears to be free, it means you will pay later - with interest! The good news is that it's exactly the difficult times in life when we strain our capabilities and become creative. No challenge - no movement.

Quote:
and still, some of us love those things, as well as an entire host of other things, and manage to enjoy them and still find time to kick ass in law school. so, yeah.
good luck.
Thanks. I will benefit from some luck with the future responses from other schools. Are you in law school?
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Old 30th January 2008, 12:48 PM   #59
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I'm not at all surprised. It's what you wanted. It's what you did. I knew you would!

Congratulations, RP. Let the good times roll.
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Old 30th January 2008, 5:58 PM   #60
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SS, I found something that confirms your assertion about the rate of expelled students. This is just for one school though. St. Thomas University in Miami actually got sued by one of his students. I didn't apply to that school anyway, but I know a person who attends first year in that school as we speak.
http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1157030383798
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