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<Ken Johnson> is a giant among scholars, in my opinion. He is now on my top 10 list of most important Christian authors. So far he has 15 different books on topics which are neglected at large by the modern church yet so important.

 

For example, in this video here, he presents the entire biblical chronology from Adam to present day, giving exact dates. Absolutely incredible.

 

I had to chuckle when he said (in the video) that Isaac Newton's estimate for the date of Adam was 3940 BC and his own estimate is 3925. Lol, talk about stepping up to the plate with the big dogs!

 

Edited by a LoveShack.org Moderator
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I watched his talk on the book of Enoch. Smart dude. I am always skeptical..if I don't touch it, feel it then I don't necessarily 100% trust someone else's statements but I find him offering evidence that folks could if they feel so inclined to go and check out for themselves.

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pureinheart
I watched his talk on the book of Enoch. Smart dude. I am always skeptical..if I don't touch it, feel it then I don't necessarily 100% trust someone else's statements but I find him offering evidence that folks could if they feel so inclined to go and check out for themselves.

 

I understand being skeptical, although do you ever just get that jolt from the Holy Spirit when reading certain writings, or viewing video teachings that scream truth or deception?

 

Most of the time I get a feeling of "oh don't go there", or "this is ok". I really wish I could put this in better words, but it's like the lightbulb thing...or is that what you meant by, "touch it, feel it"?

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Ken Johnson has calculated the date of 1948 AD as 5872 AM (or years since Adam). I have seen others calculate similar dates and they are all in the high 5000s, bordering on 6000. This is significant if you believe that God's timeline for man is on a 7000 year frame. It would mean that we are extremely close to the Lord's return at 6000 year mark. If 1948 AD was 5872 AM, then doing a little math gives us out current date of ~5938 AM. Could there really be about 60 years left? Remember, Isaac Newton believed it was 2060. Jesus himself said that there will be people alive at the time of Israel's rebirth (1947/1948) who would see the fulfillment of the end of the age.

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I had to chuckle when he said (in the video) that Isaac Newton's estimate for the date of Adam was 3940 BC and his own estimate is 3925. Lol, talk about stepping up to the plate with the big dogs!

 

 

 

Isaac Newton was in no position to estimate the age of the earth. You are again dishonestly drawing on the credibility of science to erroneously support faith-based propaganda. Beyond that, Newton tried to do things like make gold out of lead as well. He is well known for his crackpottery in subjects unrelated to mechanics and mathematics.

 

 

Either you reject science and logic, and repeatable scientific evidence, or your don't. You can't have it both ways.

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LOL, same old comment about Newton and alchemy again. Any new ideas? Newton explored all sciences. You are looking back with the comfort of retrospect and saying alchemy was ridiculous. Well how do we NOW know it's false? People STUDIED it. Why criticize study? Should he have known BEFORE studying alchemy that it was untrue? You expect Newton to be clairvoyant.

 

Secondly, the date given of 3940 is when Adam was made. Creation is a separate issue. Nice straw man.

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GorillaTheater

I can't remember how long Adam is supposed to have lived; 900-some-odd years I think, putting his death squarely within the period of Egypt's Old Kingdom and the Mesopotamian civilization. Throw in a flood which occurred a thousand or so years afterwards, and I would think that you'd be looking at some serious timeline issues.

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Jesus himself said that there will be people alive at the time of Israel's rebirth (1947/1948) who would see the fulfillment of the end of the age.

 

Scripture verse please?

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TheFinalWord
Ken Johnson has calculated the date of 1948 AD as 5872 AM (or years since Adam). I have seen others calculate similar dates and they are all in the high 5000s, bordering on 6000. This is significant if you believe that God's timeline for man is on a 7000 year frame. It would mean that we are extremely close to the Lord's return at 6000 year mark. If 1948 AD was 5872 AM, then doing a little math gives us out current date of ~5938 AM. Could there really be about 60 years left? Remember, Isaac Newton believed it was 2060. Jesus himself said that there will be people alive at the time of Israel's rebirth (1947/1948) who would see the fulfillment of the end of the age.

 

You asked about false prophets the other day...should we start applying the standards of false prophets to these people when Christ doesn't return on the dates they prophecy? Or do they get a pass? :confused:

 

You started in another thread that Joel Osteen was essentially akin to New Age...how is this kind of conjecture permitted, but when Osteen preaches about being positive it is heretical?

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GorillaTheater
You started in another thread that Joel Osteen was essentially akin to New Age...how is this kind of conjecture permitted, but when Osteen preaches about being positive it is heretical?

 

Osteen turned one of the premier basketball and concert venues in Texas into another McChurch. So I wholeheartedly support whatever bad stuff M30 says about him. :mad:

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Osteen turned one of the premier basketball and concert venues in Texas into another McChurch. So I wholeheartedly support whatever bad stuff M30 says about him. :mad:

 

Don't care about commenting on the man. Only his message. I don't know him personally.

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Scripture verse please?

 

Matthew 24. Read the entire chapter. The context of this chapter is when Jesus is telling his disciples the signs of the end (ie, his return). He uses the fig tree, which is ALWAYS a symbol of Israel, to teach his disciples:

 

“Now learn this parable from the fig tree: When its branch has already become tender and puts forth leaves, you know that summer is near. So you also, when you see all these things, know that it is near—at the doors! Assuredly, I say to you, this generation will by no means pass away till all these things take place..." (*Matthew‬ *24‬:*32-34‬ NKJV)

 

The fig tree "putting forth leaves" is clear reference to rebirth of Israel as nation (1947/1948). When he says "this generation", he is referring not to the generation listening to him but to the generation alive when the fig tree sprouts leaves. He says this generation "will by no means pass away til all these things take place". Of course "these things" means the events which terminate in his return. Some who were alive in 1948 at Israel's rebirth will also be alive at Christ's second coming.

 

TFW, I don't view this as making my own prophecy; I view it as merely reading the Bible. Neither am I setting exact dates. I'm merely undersranding the "seasons", which Christ even encouraged us to be aware of and anticipate! He TOLD us to tell the signs of the season when he will return. Otherwise he wouldn't have told us, correct?

 

I've read every other interpretation of this passage. NONE of them make any sense. Some even use this passage to disprove Christianity because they believe Jesus meant his contemporary generation when he said "this generation". Well, 2000 years has passed and we are still here. Another view is that "this generation" means the human race. Really? Need I even comment?

 

A "generation" in the Bible is open to interpretation but it cannot be less than 30 years or more than 120. Pin these onto the date of 1948. You get anywhere between 1978 and 2068. I believe the correct one is 120. Why? Because this is how much time passed between God warning of the Flood and when it finally came. Even the Book of Jashar, a Jewish history book, confirms this.

Edited by M30USA
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TheFinalWord
TFW, I don't view this as making my own prophecy; I view it as merely reading the Bible. Neither am I setting exact dates. I'm merely undersranding the "seasons", which Christ even encouraged us to be aware of and anticipate! He TOLD us to tell the signs of the season when he will return. Otherwise he wouldn't have told us, correct?

 

You know me, I like to debate with you about minor stuff mainly b/c you're a honest opponent :)

 

If it is merely reading the bible, we know the genealogies of Adam are not that rigid (we've debated this before). It seems this whole argument hinges on this assumption.

 

So in this case, setting dates for the fulfillment of scripture is not prophecy? We are not attempting to predict future events? Often times OT prophets associated time frames with their prophecies. Surely, if this millennial theory is correct, you are giving some bracket of time in which these actions must occur? What is the confidence interval? 7000 years +/- 120?

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You know me, I like to debate with you about minor stuff mainly b/c you're a honest opponent :)

 

If it is merely reading the bible, we know the genealogies of Adam are not that rigid (we've debated this before). It seems this whole argument hinges on this assumption.

 

So in this case, setting dates for the fulfillment of scripture is not prophecy? We are not attempting to predict future events? Often times OT prophets associated time frames with their prophecies. Surely, if this millennial theory is correct, you are giving some bracket of time in which these actions must occur? What is the confidence interval? 7000 years +/- 120?

 

Even without the 7000 year timeline, we still have the prophecy of the fig tree in Matthew 24 (described above).

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I understand being skeptical, although do you ever just get that jolt from the Holy Spirit when reading certain writings, or viewing video teachings that scream truth or deception?

 

Most of the time I get a feeling of "oh don't go there", or "this is ok". I really wish I could put this in better words, but it's like the lightbulb thing...or is that what you meant by, "touch it, feel it"?

 

I know what you are trying to say and I would say I believe sometimes that has happened for me. But most of the time I don't trust those feelings because I can't truly discern whether they are divine guidance or what I may be conjuring up within my own mind and emotions. This gets onto a whole different topic but its for me a challenge when listing to others that say God has spoken to them or that they have felt the Holy Spirit. Don't get me wrong, I do believe people have heard God and that the spirit can very skillfully move us. But I also know enough about the human mind that when someone wants to believe something enough they can "make it happen." And of course there is a segment of society that has to struggle with extreme mental issues. What they believe and hear is absolutely real in their mind...and they too say "God told me to xyz". Again, it would be possible God is talking to them but generally their action is so vile it is difficult to conclude God would provide such direction.

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<Ken Johnson> is a giant among scholars, in my opinion. He is now on my top 10 list of most important Christian authors. So far he has 15 different books on topics which are neglected at large by the modern church yet so important

 

Top 10 most important Christian authors, huh? And he writes about "neglected topics"? There isn't any chance he might also write about UFOs, or at least Nephilim, is there? Oh wait... :p

 

Ay, M30. Doesn't your obsession ever worry you?

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Top 10 most important Christian authors, huh? And he writes about "neglected topics"? There isn't any chance he might also write about UFOs, or at least Nephilim, is there? Oh wait... :p

 

Ay, M30. Doesn't your obsession ever worry you?

 

So far I haven't even brought up that subject. And incidentally Ken Johnson has 15 books, only 1 of which is on that subject.

 

And I thought my obsession was Joel Osteen, no? :)

 

I have a laser-like personality. I have a need to exhaustively understand something or do something. I've been criticized for being "obsessed" with each of the following: guitar, baseball, UFOs, and Bible. For example, I have gone days where I've pretty much done nothing except play guitar, even skipping meals, until I figure out a song I like.

Edited by M30USA
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I have a laser-like personality. I have a need to exhaustively understand something or do something. I've been criticized for being "obsessed" with each of the following: guitar, baseball, UFOs, and Bible.

 

Guitar!? :love: Bring back the guitar obsession...and post us a song!

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TheFinalWord
So far I haven't even brought up that subject. And incidentally Ken Johnson has 15 books, only 1 of which is on that subject.

 

And I thought my obsession was Joel Osteen, no? :)

 

I have a laser-like personality. I have a need to exhaustively understand something or do something. I've been criticized for being "obsessed" with each of the following: guitar, baseball, UFOs, and Bible. For example, I have gone days where I've pretty much done nothing except play guitar, even skipping meals, until I figure out a song I like.

 

awww I knew I liked you M30...what kind of guitar? If you say Les Paul...:cool:

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awww I knew I liked you M30...what kind of guitar? If you say Les Paul...:cool:

 

I know! Who would have known :). I'm guessing he can do a Rush song or two. ;)

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pureinheart
Osteen turned one of the premier basketball and concert venues in Texas into another McChurch. So I wholeheartedly support whatever bad stuff M30 says about him. :mad:

 

This is funny GT- McChurch...love it...

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pureinheart
I know what you are trying to say and I would say I believe sometimes that has happened for me. But most of the time I don't trust those feelings because I can't truly discern whether they are divine guidance or what I may be conjuring up within my own mind and emotions. This gets onto a whole different topic but its for me a challenge when listing to others that say God has spoken to them or that they have felt the Holy Spirit. Don't get me wrong, I do believe people have heard God and that the spirit can very skillfully move us. But I also know enough about the human mind that when someone wants to believe something enough they can "make it happen." And of course there is a segment of society that has to struggle with extreme mental issues. What they believe and hear is absolutely real in their mind...and they too say "God told me to xyz". Again, it would be possible God is talking to them but generally their action is so vile it is difficult to conclude God would provide such direction.

 

Please know that I'm speaking of personal experiences and not making comparisons, nor inferring anything.

 

I think the most incredible experience that occurred in my life was, while living with my ex fiancé, in desperation I called two of my Christian friends and both of them told me if I didn't get out of his house I would die. I bore a witness in my spirit and I could feel myself literally dying. Right after that the Lord did some amazing things. He led me to some people that would literally change my life forever- they all operated in the Spirit on some very high levels.

 

The Lord continued to bring people in my life that were literal powerhouses in the Spirit. I got to see the real deal so when a counterfeit was presented to me it was easy to tell.

 

Now to tell me that I would die sounds rather drastic, correct? I was in some drastic sin and these two Christians had no idea how deep I was in. When hearing these words, they were penetrating- it was the Spirit of Truth.

 

When a person sincerely goes to the throne and asks for truth, God will come through every time, I have never seen a time when He hasn't. It's been my experience that God can use anyone to deliver His Word.

 

Bottom line is when one gives a word from God, it must line up with the Word. I think I get you on the mentally ill. In my area there are many street people that I do believe are not all there if you will...IMO they desperately need a touch from the Lord. And then there are those in the churches and I think because they see the Prophetic as such a seemingly wonderful gift that they acquire a covetous spirit due to wanting to stand out and be recognized...lol, little do they know what a true Prophet has to go through, just ask some of the O/T Prophets...not all of them had such wonderful tidings to bring. Not to mention the cleanings, attacks, fires and so on.

 

I've also seen many prophets for profit. These types avoid me like the plague because our spirits clash and they know it. I see so many people desiring a word from the Lord, and I'm not speaking of those who sincerely seek divine guidance, I'm speaking of those who want their ears tickled, as the word they seek is probably not what God would actually tell them.

Edited by pureinheart
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awww I knew I liked you M30...what kind of guitar? If you say Les Paul...:cool:

 

It's funny, most of the musicians I like play an LP but I have a Telecaster (the same one as Andy Summers of the Police). Teles are most often used in country music, but you see it used in even harder rock. I love the clear tone of teles. LPs are nice and full but they can get a bit muddy at times.

Edited by M30USA
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TheFinalWord
It's funny, most of the musicians I like play an LP but I have a Telecaster (the same one as Andy Summers of the Police). Teles are most often used in country music, but you see it used in even harder rock. I love the clear tone of teles. LPs are nice and full but they can get a bit muddy at times.

 

Yeah, I'm a Fender guy myself :) Haven't played in a few years, but would like to get it out again!!

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Yeah, I'm a Fender guy myself :) Haven't played in a few years, but would like to get it out again!!

 

Nice! I've been a hobbyist for almost 20 years now. I tend to play in binges. Might not touch the git for weeks, the I'll play for several days straight. I realized early on that I do it primarily for personal enjoyment and expression. When I'm in the zone, I'm convinced it's actually similar to a trance, lol.

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