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Do you really hate "religion"...


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pureinheart

or is the translation "Christians" only? Over the years on LS, social media and MSM I've seen a trend of hatred towards Christianity. The communication starts out with hatred for all religion/faith-based institutions, but only Christianity is spoken of. Why is this?

 

Christians are considered the "oppressors" …seriously?

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truthbetold

SO funny you mention this Pure, just as I happened to be here! For me, I am learning yeah, I guess I am religious in that the definition is:

 

a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, especially when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, ...

 

I guess my confusion lies in when did "religion" become a dirty word?:confused:

 

I have been accused on this forum of being a religious "nut" :confused::laugh: I'm anything but that, it's hard on a forum especially in this section to not "speak" of it though. In real life, I let my actions talk, I don't bombard with the talking constantly of it, not sure if that makes sense! If approached first to speak of Christianity I will, but I respect all walks of faith/non-faith. I see things through my center of Christ, but I don't push that. ALL our my brothers and sisters. However Jesus does say he will spit you out if you are "luke warm" for him though, so just sayin' ;) So that's where I'm coming from. Others may vary.

 

Like I said I think it's super hard to convey on a forum without getting misinterpretations. LS especially. I find it hilarious that some may think those following Christianity (for me religious principles) is restricted, mundane, stifling, uneducated, and having a non existent exciting sex life (within a marriage), puritan/shaker style life! (from comments I have read on another thread) It's the opposite for me, totally freeing and "full" and deeply, loving in ALL aspects.:love:

 

Like I've said God knows the deepest longings of our heart and will fulfill them. We humans know how to screw things up!:laugh: If we rely on our own foolish judgement. The guidelines (church) free me for God's blessings which is the total opposite of oppression!

 

But yeah, I get what you are saying. Christianity is becoming more the thing people are afraid of and want to shut down. If you are in the U.S. just look at what's happened here in this country through the years. We used to be the land of milk and honey. Purple mountain majesties and fruited plains, why? God shed his grace on thee...now look at things since we've taken him out of the schools and everywhere else. Floods, earthquakes, more hurricanes....oh I know, it's all "only" scientifically explained :rolleyes:;) Don't get me started!!

 

At least we know that God will help even the "one" that believes in him and not destroy us. God only permits evil ONLY for greater good. Only my opinion of course!:p

 

I hope you are doing well Pure! I hope to have some exciting news job wise soon that God is unfolding for me! God is SO Good!

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Yes. I hate pretty much any form of religion, especially the organised kind, because it's about controlling people, restricting their education, molding them to a shape that suits the agenda. It persecutes free thinking and encourages dogma. It's a crutch that encourages weakness and dependency on arbitrary 'morality' that is perceived to be absolute (ie always right).

 

Absolutely hate it.

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The reason I have a strong disdain for mainly Christians and some catholics is they don't understand the difference between faith, I.e. PERSONAL faith, and free will.

 

Most don't hesitate to judge the hell out of you ( I thought you weren't supposed to do that ) and its their way or you're going to hell. If you disagree with them you are going to hell.

 

You have free will, but only the free will to choose what THEY choose and believe how THEY believe.

 

If you have personal faith and personal beliefs, I respect that. However the second you try and push your belief system onto me or anyone else that doesn't want it is when I get offences and resentful. When I say I'm an atheist and the response is " I'll pray for you ", that's an extremely condescending "holier than thou, I'm a better person than you are " kind of bull crap that makes me want to slap some one.

 

If you can respect some one else's right to not believe, I can respect your right to believe, and we can all coexist.

 

Just don't try to make laws with the only reasoning being " because it says so in the Bible ", and we will call it even.

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I don't like zealotry of any kind religion or otherwise. I have no issues with people of faith because many of them are good and intelligent people but I don't like fanatics and religion is not the only place you find fanatics.

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truthbetold

Meant to add Pure, Hate=Fear.

 

Look at what they did to Jesus in the Passion. They "feared" what he was doing and who he was which translates to "hate". They scourged and crowned, and crucified him with venomous hatred. And Jesus overcame with LOVE! The opposite of hate. He loved those that hated him, and we are encouraged to do the same.

 

Hate is always rooted in fear. Likely fear of the truth, because if you come into the light of the truth, the darkness can't keep you any longer as a prisoner and we know "the prince of darkness" is filled with hate and wants to trick everyone he can about the truth and keep them in the "dark".

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God has purposed it for his son, Jesus Christ, to be hated by the world. It was purposed for him to be humiliated and killed. It was a testimony that the world doesn't desire truth or righteousness (in addition to it being our atonement for sin). Secondly, as Jesus himself said, anyone who follows him must EXPECT to be hated. He went so far as to say that Christians should REJOICE when they're hated because the world only loves its own and because those of us who "have the Son" are not of this world.

Edited by M30USA
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I think religion has a valuable place in people's lives, especially those who feel their lives are enriched and empowered by religious belief and dogma.

 

I do, however, despise religious 'panhandlers' who accost me to either solicit for their cause or seek to indoctrinate me into it.

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I think religion has a valuable place in people's lives, especially those who feel their lives are enriched and empowered by religious belief and dogma.

 

I do, however, despise religious 'panhandlers' who accost me to either solicit for their cause or seek to indoctrinate me into it.

 

Was Christ a "religious panhandler" or indoctrinator?

 

Christianity isn't about personal fulfillment or enrichment. It's about truth and its about glorifying God, not man. At least that's how it should be.

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When Christ shows up on my porch looking for money, I'll let you know. So far, all I've seen is humans in minivans and they have a bit of a drive on my property to get there.

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Same response. I made my choices in the 'indoctrination' department as soon as I had the adult freedom to do so and haven't looked back, no disrespect intended to my parents and the dozens of clergy who sought to absorb me on a daily basis. These days, they know their place or I make it abundantly clear to them.

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Same response. I made my choices in the 'indoctrination' department as soon as I had the adult freedom to do so and haven't looked back, no disrespect intended to my parents and the dozens of clergy who sought to absorb me on a daily basis. These days, they know their place or I make it abundantly clear to them.

 

What did your parents try to teach you? (Please don't just say "Christianity" because that means nothing to me.)

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I'm with Carhill. Believe what you want to believe. It's no skin off my nose. But when you try to foist that crap on me, I get downright hostile.

 

Never in my life have I ever had a Jew or a Muslim try to convert me. But Christians? All the freaking time, man.

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pureinheart
SO funny you mention this Pure, just as I happened to be here! For me, I am learning yeah, I guess I am religious in that the definition is:

 

a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, especially when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, ...

 

I guess my confusion lies in when did "religion" become a dirty word?:confused:

 

I have been accused on this forum of being a religious "nut" :confused::laugh: I'm anything but that, it's hard on a forum especially in this section to not "speak" of it though. In real life, I let my actions talk, I don't bombard with the talking constantly of it, not sure if that makes sense! If approached first to speak of Christianity I will, but I respect all walks of faith/non-faith. I see things through my center of Christ, but I don't push that. ALL our my brothers and sisters. However Jesus does say he will spit you out if you are "luke warm" for him though, so just sayin' ;) So that's where I'm coming from. Others may vary.

 

Like I said I think it's super hard to convey on a forum without getting misinterpretations. LS especially. I find it hilarious that some may think those following Christianity (for me religious principles) is restricted, mundane, stifling, uneducated, and having a non existent exciting sex life (within a marriage), puritan/shaker style life! (from comments I have read on another thread) It's the opposite for me, totally freeing and "full" and deeply, loving in ALL aspects.:love:

 

Like I've said God knows the deepest longings of our heart and will fulfill them. We humans know how to screw things up!:laugh: If we rely on our own foolish judgement. The guidelines (church) free me for God's blessings which is the total opposite of oppression!

 

But yeah, I get what you are saying. Christianity is becoming more the thing people are afraid of and want to shut down. If you are in the U.S. just look at what's happened here in this country through the years. We used to be the land of milk and honey. Purple mountain majesties and fruited plains, why? God shed his grace on thee...now look at things since we've taken him out of the schools and everywhere else. Floods, earthquakes, more hurricanes....oh I know, it's all "only" scientifically explained :rolleyes:;) Don't get me started!!

At least we know that God will help even the "one" that believes in him and not destroy us. God only permits evil ONLY for greater good. Only my opinion of course!:p

 

I hope you are doing well Pure! I hope to have some exciting news job wise soon that God is unfolding for me! God is SO Good!

 

Like you, most of my faith-based communication is online. If I'm led, I speak it, if not, then not. You know, the strange thing was, work seemed to be the most acceptable place as far as evangelism went. There was a lot of freedom spiritually at work. I miss that. It might be different now though.

 

In bold- I love this and am brought back various times in history, mostly O/T where other religions had no problem receiving God along with their faiths. If God could produce, they were ok with that. Today the world is unable to see that things are healthier and run more efficient following Gods laws.

 

Thank you so much, and I am doing good…lifting you up right now about that job! (((((hugs))))

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I'm with Carhill. Believe what you want to believe. It's no skin off my nose. But when you try to foist that crap on me, I get downright hostile.

 

Never in my life have I ever had a Jew or a Muslim try to convert me. But Christians? All the freaking time, man.

 

Define what it means for a person to "foist" their views on you.

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pureinheart
Yes. I hate pretty much any form of religion, especially the organised kind, because it's about controlling people, restricting their education, molding them to a shape that suits the agenda. It persecutes free thinking and encourages dogma. It's a crutch that encourages weakness and dependency on arbitrary 'morality' that is perceived to be absolute (ie always right).

 

Absolutely hate it.

 

There are forms that do this, I must agree with you. I find this in the secular also though. Still, no matter the perceived oppression, people still have the free will to receive it or not. I get frustrated concerning the education in the US, but still understand that many are choosing this route.

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I do not "hate" religion. I think humanity would be much better off without it, and I used to get frustrated by it, but I don't hate it. IMO, the reason Christianity is "picked-on" more in America is simply because America is a predominately Christian nation.

 

To analogize: McDonald's has been number-one in America for years. As a result, they get full-length movies showing how poisonous their food is. Meanwhile, KFC makes a sandwich with meat for buns and receives far less condemnation.

 

And so it is with Christianity. Christians wield considerable political power in America. Christian influence -- or attempts at influence -- can be seen over issues ranging from public school curriculum (intelligent design, evolution, sex-ed) to gay-marriage to stem-cell research and now to the "right" to discriminate against homosexual citizens in business matters.

 

Put simply, Christians -- Evangelicals in particular -- speak with the loudest voices amongst religious groups in America. It seems only natural to me that Christians receive the loudest replies.

 

Now for the oppression bit. I don't believe anyone can seriously state that American Christians are as oppressive as Muslims in other nations. I assume this is what the OP was referring to. Furthermore, I've seen other discussions on other boards wherein Christians declare that Atheists are "hypocrites" for not flying to Afghanistan and criticizing the local population.

 

As to that particular claim, the truth is I rather enjoy having my head attached to my body. Some may claim that this is evidence that Islam is more oppressive than Christianity. Sure, if we're taking a per-capita count of oppression and atrocities amongst the major religions, Christianity will not be at the top of that list.

 

However, I do not believe this has anything to do with Christianity being inherently more peaceful or "superior" to other religions. Quite the contrary. History is littered with examples of atrocities committed in the name of Jesus. Some of them as recent as colonial times.

 

Rather, the reason Christianity is less oppressive than Islam is because Christianity has been moderated. I believe the only reason anyone has become "moderated" in regard to their faith is because they have assimilated at least some of the last 2,000 years of progress of human thought.

 

The doors leading out of scriptural literalism do not open from the inside. Religious moderation is the result of secular advancement. Primary among these is the basic tenant that people now value evidence and tend to believe a proposition based on the amount of evidence supported. Having learned something medicine over the last two-centuries, few people still equate illness with sin or demonic possession.

 

For reasons that are beyond the scope of this thread, the Middle East has found itself more susceptible to dogma and less advanced on many fronts that nations in the West. Strip away the advancements of secular-modernity, and America/Europe would be left back in the dark-ages, ruled by ignorance and fear.

 

And so, Christianity is less oppressive, but only because faith has been chipped away by the forces that the faithful resist.

 

Now, if we're speaking in strictly American terms? Yes, I believe some Christians are the oppressors, with oppression being defined in part as "unjust control". Matters of sexuality remain the most apparent example. I believe some Christians act out of fear and ignorance rather than any sort of rationality in these areas. Therefore, by definition, they are oppressive.

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Today the world is unable to see that things are healthier and run more efficient following Gods laws.

 

Which laws? I believe you'll agree that society would not work as well if people stopped making widgets and started killing each other over the slightest heresy?

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When I talk with one of my sisters, I can't express my own views in any fashion related to my faith without her giving me the "please don't bring up religion" phrase. She may not realize what she's saying, but in essence she is saying that I can't be fully who I am around her. It's not like I'm "bringing up religion". I am merely being who I am and, as everybody does and can't avoid doing, I am expressing my thoughts. But to her it seems dogmatic. This is why, from my experience, it seems that when a person says they don't want others jamming views down their throats, it's more a commentary on the person themselves than it is on the one doing the "jamming"--as long as its not truly obnoxious and disrespectful. I don't get offended by atheists and when they speak their views it doesn't offend me. They can say or do what they want because I'm comfortable with what I believe.

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Define what it means for a person to "foist" their views on you.[/QUOTe]

 

When I am clear that I have ZERO interest in religion and someone STILL....

 

1. Constantly pressures me to go to church

2. Plows me with with pamphlets, books, etc

3. Makes non stop comments about how God would 'improve' me in some way

4. Shows up on my doorstep with the intent to 'teach' me about God

5. Attempts to pass laws based on their religous doctrine and ignores separation of church and state.

6. Attempts to convert my children behind my back

7. Acts in an ugly, harassing or abusive manners towards those with differing beliefs.

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pureinheart
The reason I have a strong disdain for mainly Christians and some catholics is they don't understand the difference between faith, I.e. PERSONAL faith, and free will.

 

Most don't hesitate to judge the hell out of you ( I thought you weren't supposed to do that ) and its their way or you're going to hell. If you disagree with them you are going to hell.

 

You have free will, but only the free will to choose what THEY choose and believe how THEY believe.

 

If you have personal faith and personal beliefs, I respect that. However the second you try and push your belief system onto me or anyone else that doesn't want it is when I get offences and resentful. When I say I'm an atheist and the response is " I'll pray for you ", that's an extremely condescending "holier than thou, I'm a better person than you are " kind of bull crap that makes me want to slap some one.

 

If you can respect some one else's right to not believe, I can respect your right to believe, and we can all coexist.

 

Just don't try to make laws with the only reasoning being " because it says so in the Bible ", and we will call it even.

 

Because this is online, and I was not there when the person said they would pray for you, I must believe that this was said in a condescending manor. That is not cool and I've seen that before. I'd just chalk that up to lack of knowledge and the inability to say it, or communicate it right. Had it been me, I would think it, and not say it, that is better. To my knowledge the only time Jesus was condescending (is that the word for his interactions with the Pharisees?) was with the Pharisees and there was a good reason for that.

 

Concerning laws, for me it's both. I wanted to know why God said certain things weren't good for us. Some things are a no brainer, but being as hard headed as I am, the hard way was the teacher:o

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My philosophy is and has always been to never let religion get in the way of my relationship with God. I find many times that is exactly what happens. There is so much confusion and pressure that results from how one flavor of Christianity views or weights something verses another. And as I understand it, this happens within the Jewish faith and I will assume others.

 

I think what has made Christianity as a whole distasteful to many is simply their experience has only been of the extreme. The preacher standing on a milk crate with a megaphone preaching for hours outside of a student union. The chat with a stranger that 10 minutes in drops the "have you accepted Christ as your savior" who then insist on bombarding you with bible quotes...even after you politely say you aren't interested.

 

That is NOT how anyone should be introduced to the concepts of Christianity and when a Christian becomes dismissive or judgmental because someone doesn't want to hear it, well then they really don't get what it is all about.

 

"But in your hearts honor Christ the Lord as holy, always being prepared to make a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you; yet do it with gentleness and respect"

 

I will never force my beliefs on someone, I will accept what other's believe even if I do not approve (obviously my approval ain't squat anyway)...I think that is part of respecting and loving one another. I have no problem making reference to God and his blessings or thanking him publicly nor do I have an issue sharing my beliefs if a conversation goes that direction. I think how you live is really the best way to evangelize what it means to be a Christian, not the fact that one can spout Bible verses.

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pureinheart
Which laws? I believe you'll agree that society would not work as well if people stopped making widgets and started killing each other over the slightest heresy?

 

I could bring up a few and will later, but what I meant to say was more on the lines of trusting Him whether one believes in Him or not. Thank you for bringing this thought to this thread, because it is the direction I was hoping for- spin from the other thread. I need to do some research and redirect my brain to answer your question thoughtfully.

 

I was brought back to the life of Joseph. The Pharaoh had his gods already, but trusted the God of Joseph due to the interpretation of the Pharaohs dream. Egypt prospered by this trust, and intern so did the surrounding civilizations.

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pureinheart
When I talk with one of my sisters, I can't express my own views in any fashion related to my faith without her giving me the "please don't bring up religion" phrase. She may not realize what she's saying, but in essence she is saying that I can't be fully who I am around her. It's not like I'm "bringing up religion". I am merely being who I am and, as everybody does and can't avoid doing, I am expressing my thoughts. But to her it seems dogmatic. This is why, from my experience, it seems that when a person says they don't want others jamming views down their throats, it's more a commentary on the person themselves than it is on the one doing the "jamming"--as long as its not truly obnoxious and disrespectful. I don't get offended by atheists and when they speak their views it doesn't offend me. They can say or do what they want because I'm comfortable with what I believe.

 

This is part of my issue also, mostly online. My mother who is deceased now, detested any acknowledgement of my God. My mother was, besides my kids, was the closest person to me, yet I could not talk about my faith, which was the most important thing to me.

 

I wasn't offended by her "lack of faith", of which she talked about here and there. Sometimes my faith did make a difference especially with my kids. A friend of hers gave her some books teaching how to practice witchcraft by casting spells and such. She put them in the same area as my kids toys. I asked her to move them, she wouldn't…hummm where was the lack of respect?

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