Spiritual Discussion

[NoIDidn't]

I am sure that there are people of many faiths on LS. I would love to talk with them about their beliefs and supporting rituals. Some of us were brought up one way, but either turned away from it or just aren't actively practicing right now. I am related (by marriage, in some cases) to a secular Jewish man, a few Nation of Islamers, some Five Percenters (you'll have to look it up), and a few agnostics and atheists. Thanksgiving is always an interesting time, to say the least.

 

Even though I am a Christian, I am intrigued by Buddhist thought and methodology. I used to read everything I could get my hands on about other religions as a child - mostly the stories now called Myths (seriously, that's what they are called now). I don't remember much of them now, though.

 

I think we can all learn from others' spiritual paths. It may deepen our own to learn about theirs.

 

I also have learned much from those with no (actual) religious affiliation, too.

 

I think this forum has much potential for discussion without fear of prosyletizing.

[TaraMaiden]

Well, I am Buddhist. If you have any questions feel free to ask.

 

_/l\_

[NoIDidn't]

Well, I am Buddhist. If you have any questions feel free to ask.

 

_/l\_

 

Why did you become a Buddhist? Preferrably without disparaging your previous (if any) religion.

 

Thanks!

[TaraMaiden]

It wouldn't be disparaging to say that as an Italian raised as a Roman catholic in a country which is the seat of Catholicism, it simply did not work for me. I was brought up as Catholic as anybody could be.

Curiously, it was (among other things) a catholic relative who brought Buddhism to my attention.

Buddhism speaks to me in ways Catholicism never did. it does not require I take anything on faith.

It had too many unanswered questions for me, and I guess I was never cut out to be an accepting person able to suspend her curiosity. I personally could not rely upon something unseen and unheard that to me, made no sense, no matter how hard I tried.

I respect and admire those who adhere to a theistic faith and who are sustained by it.

Buddhism is a Philosophical religion (or religious philosophy) that requires you look inwardly and Know your Mind. the Purpose of Buddhism is to recognise, accept and transcend suffering. And the Buck stops here.

I personally prefer having to be responsible for myself, and accountable to myself for everything I think, say and do....

It's a huge challenge - much greater that that I faced in my catholic days.

At least, this is how I see it.

And I have had 40+ years to look at it from all sides.....

[nobody's girl]

I was raised Methodist but now consider myself atheist. Some of my random thoughts on religion:

 

Over the years man has evolved from believing in multiple gods to the current monotheism the majority of the world believes. Is it much of a stretch to think that in another few generations the single deity will be eradicated altogether? We've already whittled it down to one because we're enlightened enough to know that there isn't a god pulling the sun across the sky and another one making volcanoes erupt. When will people realize that evolution makes a whole helluva lot more sense than this mysterious being creating us

 

And consider some of the different religious "styles" there's those that won't let you dance, those that won't let you drink and, my personal favorite, the one where women are prohibited from cutting their hair and they can only wear skirts. So now this God character has a dress code?

 

I've never been an overly religious person to begin with. I was forced, by my mom, to attend church every week when I was a kid. I just didn't get why I had to spend an hour listening to some old guy express his political views behind the guise of God. Maybe some churches, and preachers, are different, but my church experience was not overly pleasant. I think that's why I admire the teenagers that are so strong in their beliefs; they must go to one great church. Probably because they don't hit them over the head with religion but rather it's snuck in on them in and amongst all the fun stuff they do

 

As I got older I drifted away from organized religion altogether. I can't help but wonder if there's only one God, why are there so many different religions? Nobody's ever been able to sufficiently explain that one to me. I've heard many theological discussions where an individual of one faith will flat-out tell someone of a different faith, "Well, your religion is wrong." Wow, I'm not even religious and I take offense to that. I did hear one woman once say, "I believe in God but I don't feel the need to wear it on a t-shirt." Now THAT'S my kind of thinking!

 

Over the years I've tried getting more religious; or at least trying to give it a shot, but I find it difficult to believe that an all-knowing being created humans then left no proof of "his" existence. Sure, the religious zealots will tell you, "Look at the trees and the sun and the sky, that's proof of his existence." Uh no, all of that, and human life itself, can be traced back to evolution, the big bang theory and other scientific discoveries. The scientific views are a lot easier to believe than the blind faith of the devout

 

I once had someone tell me how great my life would be if I would get married, have kids and go to church. At that time, my life was pretty darned good just the way it was. Not to mention the fact I don't want to be married, I can't have children, and it wasn't until I started to consider religion and the existence of God again that my life started going downhill.

 

You know, I actually considered attending a church service to slowly ease my way back into this whole religious mindset. But then it occurred to me that churches expect a donation and I have no money whatsoever. Hmmm, looks like the unspoken rule of religion is "You've got to pay to pray" I wonder what their God thinks about that. Especially with this new trend of converting old Wal-Mart stores into church centers, "Baptisms are held on aisle 5, funerals at the courtesy desk.

 

"Let Go and Let God" is one phrase the religious nuts love to spew. Funny thing is once I tried that things got even worse than they had been before. "But," respond the religious nuts, "God helps those who help themselves." Yep, tried that one too and got screwed yet again. Funny how they have an answer for everything and each answer contradicts itself. I'm going on the phrase "If it's to be, it's up to me" from now on, 'cause obviously this god character has too much going on, like war, famine, murder, natural disasters, etc. to deal with the needs of an insignificant heathen like me.

 

Then there are the people that will tell you God answers all prayers, but sometimes his answer is no. Well, if he's answered any of my prayers I respectfully request that he do it again and speak up this time because I got no response, not even a "No." "But you have to look for the answers" they'll respond. Um, no if this guy can create an entire universe, he should be able to dial direct when answering a question or a request. I'm not asking for the meaning of life, I'm just asking for some guidance, and maybe a little help, with my own. Hell, didn't he send a burning bush to someone? Why can't I receive a communication like that? Or does he not do those tricks anymore? Why not?

 

"But what about the Bible?" The zealots reply. Well, let's see, it's a book of stories, kind of like the tales of the Brothers Grimm. Someone told stories for a living and they were eventually written down. Can't help but wonder if in another 1,000 years our descendents, who won't believe in any god, will think that their roots are derived from a young boy with magical powers who fought wizards and witches and dragons. Then there will be a new religion, the "Potters" whose number one son will be "The Boy Who Lived.”

 

So let's recap some:

 

A mysterious all-knowing being that hides proof of his existence vs. scientific proof of evolution the creation of the universe

 

"Let go and let God" vs. "God helps those who help themselves”

 

One God but hundreds of different religions (some with dress codes)

 

Please come to church this Sunday, Oh and be sure to bring money to give to our cause.

 

Prayer vs meditation, what's the difference? In either case you're talking to yourself and putting yourself into some kind of trance

 

Oh, and I think my favorite thing is that god forgives all. So I can be as mean and hateful as I want then ask for forgiveness on my death bed and he'll forgive me and let me into heaven. So why should I give up my only day to sleep late to attend a religious ceremony with a bunch of hypocrites who were probably out partying the night before? Why not just have a good time now and, if there really is a god, ask him to forgive my transgressions just before I die?

[quankanne]

a lot of good questions/observations there, NG ... ones to which the answers will vary, depending on who addresses them. I guess the safest thing to say is that you mus know your own heart ...

 

me? Cradle Catholic – if lapsed at the moment – but love everything about my faith because the support system is incredible. Yes, I know there are a lot of things wrong that took place, but I don't see it as failure on God's part, just man's. Or, as my coworker puts it: the Mother Church has outlived 2000 years of idiocy

[knaveman]

I am sure that there are people of many faiths on LS. I would love to talk with them about their beliefs and supporting rituals. Some of us were brought up one way, but either turned away from it or just aren't actively practicing right now. I am related (by marriage, in some cases) to a secular Jewish man, a few Nation of Islamers, some Five Percenters (you'll have to look it up), and a few agnostics and atheists. Thanksgiving is always an interesting time, to say the least.

 

Even though I am a Christian, I am intrigued by Buddhist thought and methodology. I used to read everything I could get my hands on about other religions as a child - mostly the stories now called Myths (seriously, that's what they are called now). I don't remember much of them now, though.

 

I think we can all learn from others' spiritual paths. It may deepen our own to learn about theirs.

 

I also have learned much from those with no (actual) religious affiliation, too.

 

I think this forum has much potential for discussion without fear of prosyletizing.

 

What a great thread! I hope it stays great.

 

Like TaraMaiden I am also a Buddhist. I'm new to Buddhism and am enjoying every second I am learning and practicing.

 

I was raised non-denominational Christian. My family was never very religous and my grandparents may actually be atheists. Not sure on some of that.

 

For me, Buddhism is the first thing in my thirty-three years on this planet that made sense. It all just fit into the things I have come to believe on my own and through my life experiences. It all made sense and I believed without having to try. There are things I don't agree with or understand yet, but everyones path is different. I've actually changed some of my previously held ideas because Buddhism made so much perfect sense to me.

 

I know nothing is perfect and others may not ever understand or want to even try to understand, but different things work for different people.

[Ariadne]

I am intrigued by Buddhist thought and methodology.

 

If you are interested in that, this is not the place to look.

 

You have to go to the sources.

[Ariadne]

Like this stuff (here)

[TaraMaiden]

Actually, that really isn't the best place to start, if I may say so.

This is not direct quotation of the teachings and suttas, but a modernised interpretation and inflection of his words. There are no references or credits for where these teachings or quotations came form, or who adapted them into modern language.....

It's like -

 

“We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world.”

 

 

Everyone who comes across this believes this to be a direct quotation from the Buddha, but he never actually said this...

 

What he actually said was:

 

Mind is the forerunner of (all evil) states. Mind is chief; mind-made are they. If one speaks or acts with wicked mind, suffering follows one, even as the wheel follows the hoof of the draught-ox.

Mind is the forerunner of (all good) states. Mind is chief; mind-made are they. If one speaks or acts with pure mind, AFFECTION follows one, even as one's shadow that never leaves.

 

From here.

 

Perhaps a better place to start if one is earnestly seeking to understand Buddhism in-depth, would be with this document and possibly this website, for Theravada Buddhism. Just one of the Major schools....

 

This is a good website for exploring Mahayana Buddhism, the other major Tradition.

 

Please forgive the 'correction', Ariadne, but if one wishes to start accurately, it's best to go to a certified and authenticated source, first of all....

 

Thank you for your pointer though.

No offence intended.

[sb129]

Hey- NID, great thread. I like the way you are open to talking about other peoples beliefs without being judgemental or rude, may the thread stay that way.

 

Am just reading for now- am thinking about what I may be able to contribute.

[Ariadne]

Please forgive the 'correction', Ariadne, but if one wishes to start accurately, it's best to go to a certified and authenticated source, first of all....

 

No problem.

 

But that's what I meant, to go to the texts. I liked your links.

 

And translations always change. I've seen many different translations of the Tao Te Ching that almost look like different books.

 

(Here is another good database)

[TaraMaiden]

I wouldn't call it good.

I'd call it brilliant!

Thank you so much for that!

 

And I think it important to say (for myself, from my own POV) that this thread was never designed on my part to be exclusively about Buddhism, so thanks for that link.

It spreads the discussion more broadly.

 

[quankanne]

little mama, if you'd intersperse it with baby updates, that'd be WAY cool with me!

 

I know nothing is perfect and others may not ever understand or want to even try to understand, but different things work for different people.

 

this, I like ... I honestly believe that if people would just agree to disagree with respect, a lot of good dialogue can result. And when done right, one's faith perspective (even if you don't claim one) is greatly enriched because we learn more about others AND ourselves.

[NoIDidn't]

Actually, that really isn't the best place to start, if I may say so.

This is not direct quotation of the teachings and suttas, but a modernised interpretation and inflection of his words. There are no references or credits for where these teachings or quotations came form, or who adapted them into modern language.....

It's like -

 

“We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world.”

 

 

Everyone who comes across this believes this to be a direct quotation from the Buddha, but he never actually said this...

 

What he actually said was:

 

 

 

From here.

 

Perhaps a better place to start if one is earnestly seeking to understand Buddhism in-depth, would be with this document and possibly this website, for Theravada Buddhism. Just one of the Major schools....

 

This is a good website for exploring Mahayana Buddhism, the other major Tradition.

 

Please forgive the 'correction', Ariadne, but if one wishes to start accurately, it's best to go to a certified and authenticated source, first of all....

 

Thank you for your pointer though.

No offence intended.

 

Wow, how interesting.

 

I've always been told that Buddhism isn't a religion but a discipline of sorts. I can't find the right word, I'm sorry.

 

Now to display my ignorance on the subject, though. I think everyone knows that entertainer Tina Turner is a Buddhist. Anyone that's watched her movie What's Love Got To Do With It (Angela Bassett) remembers her chanting (Angela did it so unnaturally, lol).

 

Anyway, that, and George Lucas put so many Buddhist concepts into the Jedi Knights teachings. He's actually a Presbyterian, I think. He calls himself a Buddhist Presbyterian, or something like that.

 

My roundabout way of getting to my point is this: given the people I mentioned, is do Buddhist sometimes pair it with another religion?

[NoIDidn't]

Hey- NID, great thread. I like the way you are open to talking about other peoples beliefs without being judgemental or rude, may the thread stay that way.

 

Am just reading for now- am thinking about what I may be able to contribute.

 

Thanks. I love family traditions/rituals. Some families do them around a religious basis. And some others do them around other activities.

 

Iyanla Vanzant is a Yoruba Priestess and used to be a regular guest on Oprah before starting her own short-lived talk show. She's an author of some pretty deep books as well. I purchased "In the Mean-Time" but took it back once I found it wasn't appropriate for what I wanted it for. But I love the anecdotal stories that she told.

 

I know you will have a lot of new experiences to talk about with the baby on the way. Strange dreams and all, being pregnant. I remember those days. LOL

 

Isn't that how the "Chicken Soup" series was started? A bunch of stories that were inspirational to some degree.

 

Sorry, I'm rambling. LOL

[GorillaTheater]

My roundabout way of getting to my point is this: given the people I mentioned' date=' is do Buddhist sometimes pair it with another religion?[/quote']

 

I'm no expert, but my understanding is that, in the Far East, Buddhism is frequently practiced by the same people who also to varying degrees practice Shintoism, Confucianism, Taoism, etc.

 

I might be something of a Taoist Baptist.

[NoIDidn't]

It wouldn't be disparaging to say that as an Italian raised as a Roman catholic in a country which is the seat of Catholicism, it simply did not work for me. I was brought up as Catholic as anybody could be.

Curiously, it was (among other things) a catholic relative who brought Buddhism to my attention.

Buddhism speaks to me in ways Catholicism never did. it does not require I take anything on faith.

It had too many unanswered questions for me, and I guess I was never cut out to be an accepting person able to suspend her curiosity. I personally could not rely upon something unseen and unheard that to me, made no sense, no matter how hard I tried.

I respect and admire those who adhere to a theistic faith and who are sustained by it.

Buddhism is a Philosophical religion (or religious philosophy) that requires you look inwardly and Know your Mind. the Purpose of Buddhism is to recognise, accept and transcend suffering. And the Buck stops here.

I personally prefer having to be responsible for myself, and accountable to myself for everything I think, say and do....

It's a huge challenge - much greater that that I faced in my catholic days.

At least, this is how I see it.

And I have had 40+ years to look at it from all sides.....

 

I don't know how I missed this. Thanks. And there is that phrase I was looking for "religious philosphy".

 

I know most Christians don't think of Christianity in this way, but stripped of all of the "Law" much of what Christ taught sounds very similar to Buddhism. I think a meshed version of the two might be suitable for me.

 

I love the self-control that usually exhibited by the Buddhists I've watched on TV. I know that's weak, right?! LOL. But seriously, my favorite actors are Buddhists, so that's why I say "watched on TV". I love Jet Li.

 

Unfortunately in my part of the country, Buddhists are rare. Or they just rarely ever say that they are here in Bible Country.

[Eve]

 

SO good to see this thread!

 

I will have to think carefully about what I could possibly contribute and will just enjoy reading it!

 

Thanks for this.

 

:)

 

Take care,

Eve xx

[TaraMaiden]

Wow, how interesting.

 

I've always been told that Buddhism isn't a religion but a discipline of sorts. I can't find the right word, I'm sorry.

 

Now to display my ignorance on the subject, though. I think everyone knows that entertainer Tina Turner is a Buddhist. Anyone that's watched her movie What's Love Got To Do With It (Angela Bassett) remembers her chanting (Angela did it so unnaturally, lol).

 

Anyway, that, and George Lucas put so many Buddhist concepts into the Jedi Knights teachings. He's actually a Presbyterian, I think. He calls himself a Buddhist Presbyterian, or something like that.

It is said - though there are other versions - that Yoda was based on this guy.

 

"His humble, wise manner and gentle humor made him appear like the archetypal sage of fables. This quality did not escape the notice of Westerners who met him. Upon seeing him in Dharamsala, for instance, the makers of the popular film Star Wars decided to use him as the model for Yoda, the spiritual guide of the epic".

 

But different stories abound, so I'm not going to pin this as a definite. But yes, there is definitely a strong Buddhist overtone to Yoda and the Jedi.....

 

My roundabout way of getting to my point is this: given the people I mentioned, is do Buddhist sometimes pair it with another religion?

 

Because Buddhism is singular amongst world religions in that it has no deity or primary Omnipotent Godhead, it's teachings and ethics are universally adaptable and 'usable' within any other religion. For example, the Five Precepts - Undertaken by Buddhists in general - have nothing in them to denote a specific calling.

The only difficulty arises if somebody wishes to adhere exclusively to Buddhism and incorporate aspects of other religions.

The Buddha's teachings indicate an abstention from a belief in a God, and in fact, point towards scepticism...... so a person wishing to follow Buddhism, will at one point or another have to bring their beliefs and tenets under scrutiny....and lay them aside. So it works in one direction, but perhaps with more difficulty, in the other.

Note that Buddhism does have Gods, Devas and deities... but they are as subject to impermanence, change and transitoriness as anything or anyone else.

 

I don't know how I missed this. Thanks. And there is that phrase I was looking for "religious philosphy".

Buddhism is counted as one of the world's six major religions,but even Buddhists at times, are somewhat confused as to how to refer to it. I'd ask the monks and nuns, myself.....

 

I know most Christians don't think of Christianity in this way, but stripped of all of the "Law" much of what Christ taught sounds very similar to Buddhism. I think a meshed version of the two might be suitable for me.

Buddhism would regard Jesus as a Boddhisattva, perhaps....

 

I love the self-control that usually exhibited by the Buddhists I've watched on TV. I know that's weak, right?! LOL. But seriously, my favorite actors are Buddhists, so that's why I say "watched on TV". I love Jet Li.

The thing I find curious, is that Richard Gere is a well known even renowned Buddhist. But some of the roles he adopts have far from buddhist ideals.... Steven Seagal's films may be B-level and pastiches, but he doesn't initiate violence and always defends the weak, and has a Buddhist thread to his characters.....he's always carrying a mala (prayer beads) around with him.... he has been recognised as a reincarnated Tulku of a previous Lama.....

 

Unfortunately in my part of the country, Buddhists are rare. Or they just rarely ever say that they are here in Bible Country.

 

I've got several I could introduce you to! Not sure where they live, but there's a whole forum I could get to say hello to you!

 

Please be advised, as a final note, that unless I provide a link to support what I recount, what I say is my opinion, and should not be taken as the general consensus or view of all Buddhists.

 

Thank you for reading!

[Moose]

Great Thread!

 

I'm a Southern Baptist, (Christian if you will).

 

When I accepted Christ, my life turned a 180. Granted, I was only 4 years old, but there was a physical, spiritual change instantly! I can't explain it except for the fact that it was on Easter Sunday and I missed out on the egg hunt.

 

It would've normally ticked me off, instead, I had this awesome sense of peace and contentment that took over and I've been this way ever since, my whole family couldn't explain it either. I behaved, I listened, did what I was told to do even if it wasn't pleasant....I'll expand more later if possible....

 

Also, I love science and how it fits into the whole grand scheme of things, if you google "laminin" you'll get an idea of what I'm talking about. Or check this link out:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_e4zgJXPpI4

[NoIDidn't]

Please be advised, as a final note, that unless I provide a link to support what I recount, what I say is my opinion, and should not be taken as the general consensus or view of all Buddhists.

 

 

You're funny. LOL. I should give the same disclaimer for my views on Christianity. LOL.

 

I think I read about the guy that Yoda was based off of. I love his character.

 

I'm going to rent a Star Wars movie tonight! LOL.

[NoIDidn't]

Also, I love science and how it fits into the whole grand scheme of things, if you google "laminin" you'll get an idea of what I'm talking about. Or check this link out:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_e4zgJXPpI4

 

I didn't listen to the sermon in the youtube link, but I did google it.

 

Interesting stuff, to say the least. I think I'd heard of this many, many years ago and its stuck in the cobwebs of my mind somewhere.

 

I met a guy in college with, I think, muscular dystrophy and it appears that people with his illness don't have the laminin to hold their muscle fibers together (rough paraphrase on my part).

 

You know the one question I would have for God is why did the rainbow only come after the Ark situation? I think I could answer my own question though. I think the story says that it had never rained on the Earth yet, so rain was a new phenomenon.

 

Growing up I was told that science and religion were incompatible. I disagree. I recently read Take The Risk by Ben Carson. I don't agree with his attempts at analyzing our economy but he mixed religious belief and neuroscience together very well.

[NoIDidn't]

a lot of good questions/observations there, NG ... ones to which the answers will vary, depending on who addresses them. I guess the safest thing to say is that you mus know your own heart ...

 

me? Cradle Catholic – if lapsed at the moment – but love everything about my faith because the support system is incredible. Yes, I know there are a lot of things wrong that took place, but I don't see it as failure on God's part, just man's. Or, as my coworker puts it: the Mother Church has outlived 2000 years of idiocy

 

Just wanted to say quank, I've always loved your insights on matters spiritual. I had a very negative view of Catholic beliefs growing up, don't know how as noone in my family ever spoke about it. It might be because their services looked so much more boring than the ones I was accustomed to - that just couldn't have been Christianity lol. Foolish child, I was.

 

I once had a Nun for a therapist. I loved her. Whoever said that Nuns were sheltered hadn't met my therapist.

[NoIDidn't]

On a personal note, I've been hurt by people in Christian churches over the years. Many different things over the years.

 

I've had to learn not to blame the Church, but the people. And even then, to not blame the people but make an attempt at showing them the compassion they denied me.

 

The very behaviors that turn off people outside of churches, turn off and turn away many of the people in them. I stopped attending church for a few years. Unthinkable for a person that grew up practically attending every service offered if the doors were open (mostly when mom forced me though).

 

But since I've stopped going as much, I think I've grown to understand Christianity as Jesus intended it a little better. Of course, since my family is full of ministers, deacons, and trustees, they just think I'm apostate and tell me "You need Jesus". LOL.