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What is it? How do you define it? Many definitions seem to suggest that you shouldn't get angry when someone crosses your hard boundaries (standing you up, letting you down, betraying you, etc). Is that possible? Should you even strive for that? Even if you keep reinforcing that boundary? I know there is no point trying to control people's actions but of course when someone matters to you it's hard not to try? Is it even good to pretend you are completely independent emotionally of others? Accept that 'people come and go'?

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I define emotional independence as being able to be stable while relying only on myself. Getting mad/upset for someone standing you up, letting you down, betraying you, etc. should not be looked upon as emotional dependence.

 

For example, you are stood up by a potential business partner: I assume you'd be upset for having taken the time to plan, get things together, etc. I look at it the same way for friends, potential lovers, and significant others. To further that, I think there's also a fine line between trusting people to do the right thing and being fully dependent on them (i.e. depressed for prolonged periods, fully focused on them, etc.)

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Up until very recently, I've been thinking of emotional independence as involving a suit of armour that you can put on at short notice when you need to...and I still think that to a certain extent. However, it's just as important to know when to take it off.

 

As far as being laid back about people crossing boundaries goes, again up until recently I've felt that that's kind of a positive thing. Related to not holding grudges. However, that's not necessarily how the people crossing your boundaries will see it. They might take the view of "this person lets me away with things because I'm so important to them." People will often adopt whatever perspective flatters them most.

 

I would generally regard emotional independence as meaning that you're not reliant on one or two other people for your happiness. Important people who you're closest to might be a big part of your happiness, but you maintain that ability to form new bonds and bring new additions into your support network.

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I've had a chat about this as well with my sister today because part of some of the mantra is that you should be responsible for your own emotional reactions while others are responsible for theirs. This seems to come up a lot in various definitions. I think however that consequences are indeed there for a reason and you can't go around doing stuff to people just because supposedly they are responsible for their reactions, not you. I also think negative emotions serve the purpose of drawing attention to your boundaries.

 

Hm I guess the purpose of this thread is to contemplate the overt rationalisation of emotions that appears to be on trend at the moment. It seems to me that we are often told emotional reactions are bad and immature. Agree?

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Hm I guess the purpose of this thread is to contemplate the overt rationalisation of emotions that appears to be on trend at the moment. It seems to me that we are often told emotional reactions are bad and immature. Agree?

 

I think if a person consistently reacts in a very emotional way and expects others to indulge or manage it in a manner that requires those others to be "the mature one" then yes. However, experiencing emotion is normal. I think that angry outbursts of emotion sometime happen when a person has been trying to deny certain emotions for too long. Then maybe one thing will happen, and it can be a relatively small thing - but it's that one straw that breaks the camel's back.

 

One time I was on a plane. There was a little girl next to me, and then her dad was on her other side. The little girl was very well behaved, but the kid sitting behind her dad wasn't. I was vaguely aware, throughout the journey that this kid behind was behaving badly. Then just was the plane was about to descend, the dad in my row stood up and railed at the kid's mother.

 

"He's been kicking behind my seat for the entire journey!"

"Well you should have said something earlier!"

"My God, woman! Are you so lacking in awareness that you need to be told to stop your kid from kicking the seat in front of them?"

 

You could understand his annoyance. He brings up his own daughter to be beautifully mannered and considerate of others, but this mother behind him just doesn't give a damn. I remember exchanging a sympathetic glance with him, and thinking "next time I'm on a flight and a kid behind me starts kicking, I will be speaking up immediately. Before I've had time to get wound up about it."

 

I didn't have many flights to wait for that to happen. I remember saying very nicely and calmly to a woman "could you tell him to stop kicking my seat please?" She gave me this outraged look, and I just smiled and said "thanks, much appreciated" and sat down again. She probably sat there and fizzed for several minutes, but at least I had a relatively peaceful journey.

 

When you try to pretend to yourself that you don't mind bad/inconsiderate behaviour - that it doesn't upset you, or leave you feeling disrespected etc - you're pushing those feelings aside. There's the danger that like the man on the plane, when you do decide to confront them the emotional energy you're feeling will make it a really unpleasant confrontation.

 

There's nothing wrong with being emotional. I think it's just about getting the emotional side work and the logical side work co-operatively (emotional intelligence, I suppose). For that to happen, you do have to let yourself feel and own the emotions as they arise.

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Maybe the obese guys dressed up as vulcans at a star trek convention poo poo emotional reactions, but I've honestly never heard something like that from anyone out of a starfleet uniform. What bollocks I say.

 

I was proud of you when you wouldn't even acknowledge me by name a while back because you were so annoyed Emilia.

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By the way, people don't care about talk really. =/ They respect action and consequence, and if you don't allow your emotions to impose that kind of thing on other people when appropriate there's just no way you can have any kind of relationship that's going to work long term. Romantic or otherwise.

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When you try to pretend to yourself that you don't mind bad/inconsiderate behaviour - that it doesn't upset you, or leave you feeling disrespected etc - you're pushing those feelings aside. There's the danger that like the man on the plane, when you do decide to confront them the emotional energy you're feeling will make it a really unpleasant confrontation.

 

There's nothing wrong with being emotional. I think it's just about getting the emotional side work and the logical side work co-operatively (emotional intelligence, I suppose). For that to happen, you do have to let yourself feel and own the emotions as they arise.

 

you are not supposed to care because you can't control others' actions. While I believe that you should care very much. Motivation and intent behind actions are everything. They reveal someone's character.

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you are not supposed to care because you can't control others' actions. While I believe that you should care very much. Motivation and intent behind actions are everything. They reveal someone's character.

 

You can't necessarily stop somebody from showing you disrespect, but that doesn't mean you're not entitled to feel hurt or offended by their disrespect - and to act on that by cutting them out of your life if it seems to be a habitual thing that isn't going to change.

 

There's a quote from Stephen Fry that gets my goat:

 

“It's now very common to hear people say, 'I'm rather offended by that.' As if that gives them certain rights. It's actually nothing more... than a whine. 'I find that offensive.' It has no meaning; it has no purpose; it has no reason to be respected as a phrase. 'I am offended by that.' Well, so ****ing what?"

 

My answer to that would be that first off, it doesn't give them any rights they don't already have. However, they do have a right to their feelings and they have a right to express their feelings. If they exercise that right to express them, and Stephen Fry continues to offend them, then the answer to his 'so f*cking what?' question is probably that next time he's suffering from the bouts of serious depression he's prone to, he might find himself a bit short of genuine friends. The most genuine friends are often the most sensitive...and sensitive people do tend to be easily offended.

 

What's the story behind the thread Emilia? Behaviour from an old friend? New one? Boyfriend?

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What's the story behind the thread Emilia? Behaviour from an old friend? New one? Boyfriend?

 

Agree on the Stephen Fry thing, he is a bit of an old idiot who thinks he knows best. Yawn.

 

Not person specific as such. I always try to understand how relationships work and how best approach finding the right person. I've had to overcome codependent tendencies over the years as recorded here so I suppose I'm quite vigilant about how I behave, whom I attract, etc. as I've been reading, emotional independence came up in different places, here on LS too. On religious sites, etc. I'm trying to sort what is useful from psychobabble. I suppose I'm amazed by the rationality drive of late.

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