Space Ritual Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 Lately I have been reading in this and other forums about people who scheduled a polygraph for their wayward spouse or partner. In a few cases the wayward either did not think that the betrayed would go through with it and schedule it, or knowing the jig was up, gave their spouse a confession in the parking lot of the Testing site. In many cases the polygraph went through and came back "inconclusive", thus letting the Wayward off the hook temporarily Anyone here ever taken one, scheduled one, or gotten a parking lot confession before one? I find it interesting as having some experience with them in my legal past, and being in most if not all States they are inadmissible, that people would rely so heavily on them. I have taken them before, for legal reasons and passed when I was lying my ass off...so I don't have a lot of faith in them, regardless of how they are administered. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
jah526 Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 I guess it's a combination of power of suggestion and obedience to authority (in this case, "scientific" authority) that convinces people that these things really work. I read of a case where the police had arrested a man for a crime and, not having a polygraph handy, put a metal colander on his head and hooked him up to a Xerox machine that printed out "lie" after each of his statements. He confessed everything. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Space Ritual Posted July 17, 2017 Author Share Posted July 17, 2017 I guess it's a combination of power of suggestion and obedience to authority (in this case, "scientific" authority) that convinces people that these things really work. I read of a case where the police had arrested a man for a crime and, not having a polygraph handy, put a metal colander on his head and hooked him up to a Xerox machine that printed out "lie" after each of his statements. He confessed everything. Yeah I can relate to that. More than once in my former life as a miscreant, I literally have been given the "Good Cop/Bad Cop routine more than once, with promises of long term imprisonment, and all the accoutrements that come with it. But since I'd already been there I wasn't falling for it. In my case, I kept a level head because I knew well enough that a Cop could not guarantee any type of plea deal and that only a Prosecutor could offer one and a judge approve it. And since that was never happening I was more than happy to take a Poly. It worked in my favor but if I had really thought more abut it I would have refused Link to post Share on other sites
RecentChange Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 great timing, listened to an excellent and entertaining This American Life regarding lie detectors this weekend. FASCINATING! And yes, I am convinced they are WORTHLESS. (I always cringe when they are recommended by people on this site for infidelity) https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/618/mr-lie-detector (Doug Williams is an entertaining character - totally worth a listen) Long story short, acclaimed lie detector test administrator comes out staying that they are a crock, teaches people how to pass them, and goes on a crusade to have them eliminated. According to the American Psychological Association: "Most psychologists agree that there is little evidence that polygraph tests can accurately detect lies." http://www.apa.org/research/action/polygraph.aspx 3 Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 Maybe their strength lies in those last minute confessions, rather than in the test itself? 7 Link to post Share on other sites
DKT3 Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 For the most part, a cheater will try to control the information so they are most likely to give what they feel is enough. Best results come from asking them to submit to one. However, if they aren't doing anything......well. I read that people who are on the scales of one of those words that end with path can usually pass them. Also controlling the breathing can throw them off Link to post Share on other sites
BluesPower Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 You have to understand their purpose... No they are not admissible in court. But here is the deal. Many, many people are not good liars. And they cannot fool the machine. And what they are good for is "Do you love your husband?" And "have you been sexual with any one in any way, besides your husband/wife since you have been married/dating." Now some sociopaths can always beat the machine. But if that is what you are dealing with, you have bigger problems. They also help confirm what you think you know in many cases. And draw attention to things you are unaware of. They are no where near perfect, but they give you some indication of truthfulness or the lack there of. And the parking lot confession is not always complete, but it can help with some level of clarity... 1 Link to post Share on other sites
RecentChange Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 It's not just sociopaths that fool the machines, many experts have proven they are easy to fool. Innocent people also get called "lairs" by these machines (that use 1920 science). They aren't admissible in court, they aren't allowed to be used in the course of employment any more. Listen to Douglas Williams talk about them, he is very convincing and has taught many people simple methods that baffles this "machine". I work never agree to take one of these tests, even for something I knew I was innocent of. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Space Ritual Posted July 17, 2017 Author Share Posted July 17, 2017 I have been doing some additional reading on this and other forums today and from what I have been able to read, many couples put a lot of stock into passed Polygraphs. There is another site dealing with Infidelity, which will remained unnamed, that the Lion's share of Betrayeds take a passed test as Gospel as far as chances of Reconciliation and only then are they advised that they have "all the answers". I shudder to think of that. Again I lied my ass off on a Poly many years ago and passed with flying colors, and all I though of it at the time was "I can't believe they are buying my Spiel". Looking back maybe I was dead set on Passing it, or more than likely I had a George Costanza moment when he quipped "It's not a lie, if you believe it." 2 Link to post Share on other sites
somanymistakes Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 You really can't believe a poly's results, but the threat of getting one and what that makes people do is much more interesting. If for some reason I were challenged in a way that someone demanded for me to take a poly for, and I knew I was in the right, I would point out to them beforehand that these things are not trustworthy and it's a waste of money, but I'd go through with it, to find out what it would say if nothing else. Straight-up refusing is suspicious unless you've made a big deal that there will be definite, irrevocable consequences if they fail. Because I know it's not reliable, I'd be scared to take it if it were guaranteed that I would be horribly punished if I failed. But I wouldn't be dating anyone who wasn't intelligent enough to understand the nuances of the results. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Space Ritual Posted July 17, 2017 Author Share Posted July 17, 2017 You really can't believe a poly's results, but the threat of getting one and what that makes people do is much more interesting. If for some reason I were challenged in a way that someone demanded for me to take a poly for, and I knew I was in the right, I would point out to them beforehand that these things are not trustworthy and it's a waste of money, but I'd go through with it, to find out what it would say if nothing else. Straight-up refusing is suspicious unless you've made a big deal that there will be definite, irrevocable consequences if they fail. Because I know it's not reliable, I'd be scared to take it if it were guaranteed that I would be horribly punished if I failed. But I wouldn't be dating anyone who wasn't intelligent enough to understand the nuances of the results. You would be surprised at the number of people that do NOT understand those nuances. I think they watch too much Steve Wilkos and Maury Povich Link to post Share on other sites
drifter777 Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 I would never accept the results of a "lie detector" anyway so would never allow my WW to actually take one. Way to many false positives and, frankly, I don't believe the technology exists for one that is reliable. However, the threat of being caught by the polygraph is the true power. The guilty conscience fuels paranoia and, with a little manipulation by the BS, the WS would likely spill much of the truth. Fear, guilt, and manipulation are the keys. That's how the cops use them and a BS should take a queue from this. Link to post Share on other sites
preraph Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 I've had a few polygraphs, and I did well on most of them, but on one of them it said I was lying about what my name was, so I never would take one again after I knew it could fail on me. A sociopath can often pass a polygraph test because they are stone cold. I think if it will get a spouse off your back about something you didn't do, it would be worth it but there is room for error. And are you going to take one every time they get paranoid? Link to post Share on other sites
wmacbride Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 Lately I have been reading in this and other forums about people who scheduled a polygraph for their wayward spouse or partner. In a few cases the wayward either did not think that the betrayed would go through with it and schedule it, or knowing the jig was up, gave their spouse a confession in the parking lot of the Testing site. In many cases the polygraph went through and came back "inconclusive", thus letting the Wayward off the hook temporarily Anyone here ever taken one, scheduled one, or gotten a parking lot confession before one? I find it interesting as having some experience with them in my legal past, and being in most if not all States they are inadmissible, that people would rely so heavily on them. I have taken them before, for legal reasons and passed when I was lying my ass off...so I don't have a lot of faith in them, regardless of how they are administered. Polygraphs are crap, and the only real value they have is in scaring people into confessing if they are afraid thy won't pass ( food for thought...most people with anti social personality disorder pass them easily). personally, if my relationship has gotten to the point whee a polygraph needs to be involved, what's the damned point in being with that person anyway? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
wmacbride Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 It's not just sociopaths that fool the machines, many experts have proven they are easy to fool. Innocent people also get called "lairs" by these machines (that use 1920 science). They aren't admissible in court, they aren't allowed to be used in the course of employment any more. Listen to Douglas Williams talk about them, he is very convincing and has taught many people simple methods that baffles this "machine". I work never agree to take one of these tests, even for something I knew I was innocent of. I had a prof. who brought one in to class and had us all give it a try. Mind you, this was a long time ago ( I won't say how long:D:laugh:) but almost all of us were able to beat it. I don't know a lot about them, but he did say that he would never trust one. Link to post Share on other sites
umirano Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 The National Research Council dismissed polygraphs in the early 80s as unreliable. Scientists (psychologists, doctors) deny that human emotions produce consistent physiological responses. There is no way to scientifically determine whether someone is lying. Polygraphs measure heart rate, blood pressure and conductivity of the skin. These parameters can change for any reason (stress, exhaustion, physical activity, the regular physiological daily cycle, medication, (recreational) drugs, etc.). Polygraphs are easy to deceive, in short you end up with plenty of false negatives and false positives and very little accurate tests. Polygraphs serve injustice rather than justice. Polygraphs are woo-hoo and a relict of the early 20th century pseudo science. It's quite amusing that some of the worlds leading countries in technology innovation still rely on them so heavily in their judicial system. They're inadmissible in pretty much all european courts. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
knabe Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 It's my opinion that the kind of person who insists on a poly won't believe if their spouse passes. So it's moot. If my spouse insisted on one I would gladly take it. Then I would file for divorce. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Mrs. John Adams Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 It's my opinion that the kind of person who insists on a poly won't believe if their spouse passes. So it's moot. If my spouse insisted on one I would gladly take it. Then I would file for divorce. yep...100% agree Link to post Share on other sites
jah526 Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Another point to ponder... if your WS passes with flying colors, you may not only have a cheater on your hands, but also a sociopath! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
LurkerXX Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Nervousness alone can cause your results to indicate lying, whether truthful or not. And with calmness you can beat the test. It is more a stress test than an indicator of veracity. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
knabe Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Another point to ponder... if your WS passes with flying colors, you may not only have a cheater on your hands, but also a sociopath! You just made my point for me. Thank you Link to post Share on other sites
Redhead14 Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 A person who has completely dissociated from their conscience/emotions, can pass a lie detector test. If they are still somewhat in touch with all that, the test will come back inconclusive at least. If a person can do this and the test is administered by a professional, there are some significant issues with the person being tested. If there is so much empirical evidence and suspicion and the test was inconclusive, I would require a second test. If that one came out inclusive as well, I would assign guilt and err on the side of caution and move on from the offending partner. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
drifter777 Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Right. But the "average" WS might break down under fear that he/she is going to be busted. I think BS can facilitate a "parking lot confession" with the right approach. Like "all is forgiven if you tell me the truth right now but it's divorce if you fail this test". It's worth a try if WS is stone-walling completely. Link to post Share on other sites
Cookiesandough Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 It doesn't surprise me though, people go to all sorts of lengths to figure out if their partner is cheating - getting into their accounts, sneaking in their phone, hiring a PI to stalk them. They either have been cheated on before so they distrust by default or there are red flags but it's seriously sad...just leave, that obsession isn't healthy Link to post Share on other sites
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