Thoughts on Singleness

[Abhainn]

As I am a somewhat older single, I've gone through many stages of how I think about my singleness. And definitely affected later on by Barbara Feldon's Book, Living Alone and Loving It.

 

For a long time, after the end of my 13 year relationship, I thought of singleness, much like she describes. A holding pen until "real and meaningful life" could "truly begin" with a significant other, of course really beginning when marriage happened.

 

There comes a point, where one must recognize that one may always be single. Not that one completely gives up, despairs of, or turns away from opportunities for romantic relationships, just that one has to make a choice at some point either to continue to view relationships and marriage as the start of "real adult life" and thus accept living a half-life, a life that is not full, or one has to redefine what living a full and happy adult life actually means.

 

There is definitely nothing lonelier, as the author points out, than living as half of a failing or failed relationship where emotional intimacy is no longer there.

 

But the author also makes a really good point, that I am contemplating at the moment, and was curious on your thoughts (actually I'm curious about any related thoughts, thoughts about anything else I've written, or indeed really any thoughts this brings up for you) And that is, that that dream we have, when we think of a relationship with someone else, from the standpoint of singleness, we dream of this perfect unity, this perfect understanding, this perfect balance of merging and separateness of identity. We think of this ideal thing out there that is actually achievable.

 

But that ideal is not possible. It is not feasible. What we are longing for when we singles idealize and think about relationships is not the reality, rather some overarching ineffable pipe-dream. I think Sting's song Desert Rose--I tried to discern from the rules whether it was okay to post Youtube links to music and to be honest I am still not sure but think its probably okay, so moderators, please correct me if I am wrong to do so--which you can find here really gets to the heart of this fundamental human dilemma. That we have this longing for something to fill some fundamental need, hole, wanting, or desire within us, and that is always seems so elusively beyond our reach. But that is true, even when we are in deep relationships, even when we have the thing that we think when single will fill that.

 

 

This ideal of perfect acceptance and complete perfect unconditional love does not exist. And that seems to make the idea that I might never find the kind of deep intellectual and emotional connection that I am searching for much easier to bear.

 

And also makes it easier to begin to think about strategies to make my life even more meaningful and while not turning away opportunities for romantic relationships, simply just giving up the expectation that I will have that, or that my life is missing something or has not really started yet without it.

 

Anybody else up against this and have thoughts to share?

Edited February 26, 2017 by Abhainn

[preraph]

I mean, I'm 64 and though it didn't really occur to me that I'd be okay just being single forever, I have been. I realized it was probably the best path for me by the time I was in my 40s. But the stimulus for me and why I was not focused on trying to marry was I was living my dream career for 20 years and I wasn't giving it up for anyone, and it was a 24/7 thing pretty much, a lifestyle more than just a job.

 

I didn't want kids ever, though I never realized how bad I didn't want them until my friends started having them.

 

I never was going to be very domestic, certainly not while I was young. Love usually just made me crazy and didn't turn out right or was unbalanced.

 

I always was fine being autonomous as a child, did many things alone, entertained myself and was an animal lover, roamed the countryside on horses and scooters and boats. So I was kind of made for this. I have had very social times in my life, but I have always been someone who also needed space and downtime.

 

It's a very personal thing. Like my best friend is not happy without living with someone. I'm not happy living with anyone. We're all different. Just keep it in your mind as an option. Always try to have some goals you want to meet, whatever that may be and work towards them. Always follow your passions and interests, and I think doing that is the key to happiness alone and also your best avenue to find the right person who might be on that same path.

 

Good luck.

[Timshel]

My opinion on this subject will not be popular. I don't get it, I really do not understand the obsession with romance, finding the perfect one, the need to have another person in harmony/sync., the 'forever' partner.

Whether it's the dating threads endlessly seeking OLD or the infidelity threads never being satisfied/needing a fix like a junkie to the I'll never find the 'one' threads....I don't understand.

 

I'm being an *ss in a way, i realize, because I can count on one hand my relationships (including sexual) and I never went looking or pondered if he would ever come. He did and it got worked into the fabric of day to day life.

I may be an outlier in that regard, yet I can't help having a perspective that maybe people in general are a tad too preoccupied with the notion of having a romantic partner, or another one when the one they have is not satisfying the seemingly bottomless ego.

 

It was never difficult to turn away someone who made my inner alarm say no. I just did. When someone came along who intrigued me and did not have me in any way second guessing, being unrealistic or confused, I'd give it a go. I never wondered if I shouldn't say no, or was ever fearful of being without a man in my life and magically....there always was.

If there had not been, that would be ok also, but there was and there may be a correlation.

 

As much as I love and have loved the men in my life, they are always a compliment, a blessing, gift. I have never, I mean never, thought that my life would not be complete or not whole....boring or without purpose if I was a single woman.

 

Ok, unconditional love does exist, perfect unconditional love does not. As you know OP, no one's fart's smell like roses and as much as we may pretend our SO is the safest driver Ever.....the imaginary brake exists.

 

I don't believe that in embracing being single, you would be simultaneously shunning a relationship. The two aren't mutually exclusive imo and even more so, my opinion is that needing an SO before they materialize is similar to watching water come to a boil or paint drying.

 

My .02

[carhill]

As an adult, I've lived alone for about 30 years in total, about seven after my divorce. I don't think I was really at peace with living alone until I got divorced. For a man it's easy to be alone; all I need to do is not ask women out on dates. Basically, be neutral and friendly and engaging but not overt. I kind of like this. Women are a lot of fun. Probably very similar to how they viewed me when younger; had a lot of fun times but knew I meant nothing to them beyond that. In that regard, they and my exW were good teachers.

 

I kind of chuckle a bit when remembering meeting the mail lady on a rainy day at the Oregon place to pick up a package. I was setting up the Christmas lights and she was beat from a long day navigating the storm but we had this nice conversation about all kinds of things and I found myself looking to excuse myself to get back to my decorating One would figure she'd want to get home and out of the yucky weather but that's how things go sometimes. I enjoy them for what they are and go back to my solitude. Hopefully the last 20 or so of life will by more peaceful than the first 58. Enough of society and dealing with others and their stuff. The chuckle part was when that native Oregonian opined Californians were snobs and I found myself agreeing with her and I'm a native one.

 

Good luck in your pursuits. Make it count.

[Abhainn]

Before I respond to each of you individually, I think I need to clarify something.

 

It is not that I don't have a very meaningful lovely life on my own. I do. It is filled with really interesting hobbies, lots of research, work, and learning, and a few close friends, as well as volunteering.

 

What it is, is that I have this deep yearning to be really known and really understood. Not just understood, but that my thoughts, feelings, everything even those things that I don't quite know and understand are understood themselves, but even more so, the implications and implicit materials are understood too. And not just that someone understands me in this deep way, that I have someone with similar convulted thinking patterns and pathways who I can understand as deeply.

 

It is not that I ever put my life, work, learning, or hobbies on hold necessary while single. Just that this yearning is there. It is a deep part of me that I cannot deny. I don't think it is maladjustment, unhealthy, or anything like that. I think that some people, many even, would not, could not, and probably given their personality structure, should not have this or understand it. But I also think that coming from the perspective of "make it go away" or "that's unhealthy, change it" would rip a vital thing that is important to who I am away, in a way that is really difficult to define or clearly express.

 

Preraph Perhaps you had your dream lover, in your job. I agree that following passions and interests is key, and what I have done since I was a child. You sound like you're pretty independent and feisty in your own way.

 

Timshel Being plainspoken as you are is not the same thing. Its a little different. Because when I think of actual relationships (singular, monogamous, romantic types) I don't need those. I can live quite happily without them, and even when I'm in them this need this yearn to be so known (its the best word I can think of or find) is still there. Its just somehow when I'm single, that need to be so known gets tied in with the idea of relationships and then that strange human longing for something that doesn't quite really exist comes in (and I'm sorry if I sound like I'm contradicting myself this is really difficult to explain).

 

You sound like you had a good start, good attachment, and were just pretty well temperamentally suited. I'm glad it worked for you!

 

Carhill When you say its easy to be alone as a man, I think there is some kind of societal pressure in that regard that men do not experience as keenly, though for my individual experience, societal pressure doesn't play into it so much. Awww, I think that mail lady might have wanted you a little. Good thing (from your perspective, I guess ) that you cut it short.

 

Any other singles out there with similar or wildly different experiences?

Edited February 26, 2017 by Abhainn

[The_Dork_Lard]

I've got a love-hate relationship with being single.

 

I love it because I love working night shifts, coming home, having a beer, and getting in and out of bed when I want (usually 6am-2pm everyday). I love doing exactly what I want, when I want, and with who I want. I love it because I use swingers' clubs and have been known to have sexual encounters of one kind or another with up to 10 women in one night, and there is no jealous wife stopping me. I love singleness. I love considering only me. I love wondering what to do, and then delving into books, poetry, and film... all night if I want to. I love browsing cars knowing there is no reason not to indulge in something exciting.

 

But I hate it because deep down I'm a very lonely person, and I do almost everything on my own, which I don't always like. I hate it because I crave mutual romance and intimacy, and would give the swingers' club up in a heartbeat if they came along. I hate it because it feels permanent.

[Abhainn]

I've got a love-hate relationship with being single.

 

I love it because I love working night shifts, coming home, having a beer, and getting in and out of bed when I want (usually 6am-2pm everyday). I love doing exactly what I want, when I want, and with who I want. I love it because I use swingers' clubs and have been known to have sexual encounters of one kind or another with up to 10 women in one night, and there is no jealous wife stopping me. I love singleness. I love considering only me. I love wondering what to do, and then delving into books, poetry, and film... all night if I want to. I love browsing cars knowing there is no reason not to indulge in something exciting.

 

But I hate it because deep down I'm a very lonely person, and I do almost everything on my own, which I don't always like. I hate it because I crave mutual romance and intimacy, and would give the swingers' club up in a heartbeat if they came along. I hate it because it feels permanent.

 

Which is more important to you?

[The_Dork_Lard]

Which is more important to you?

 

Good question. I spend way more time than I should daydreaming about having a girlfriend, and the rest of the time luxuriating in the bosom of my own soul. They're as important as each other.

[Mumbles]

OP, what you are describing is a universal longing. For many, most even, we submerge that in favour of constant busyness. Whether that busyness comes from servicing a family or friends, or work, or hobbies, or whatever, doesn't matter, for most, the longing is pushed under the rug.

 

As someone who for most of my life was a deep, deep thinker, I recognise the language - a conversation like this, conducted around the coffee table late at night with a glass of brandy and like-minded friends will quickly extend into the universal truth of 'being'.

 

I'm convinced that everyone suffers this, but for those of us innately satisfied with our own company (as you say, often from childhood), the notion gets plenty of opportunity to formulate and expand inside our minds.

 

The trouble is, and you have identified it already, no such utopia actually exists in the physical world that surrounds us. You can't ever get inside the mind of your lover, nor she yours, you are always at arms length, no matter both your desires.

 

 

For a long time, after the end of my 13 year relationship, I thought of singleness, much like she describes. A holding pen until "real and meaningful life" could "truly begin" with a significant other, of course really beginning when marriage happened.

 

I haven't read the book, but I recognise the language.

 

I married for the first time quite late in life, as compared to my colleagues and friends. 33, not a big stretch by todays standard, but I'm a bit older, most of my peers had LTR's in their late teens and early twenties and almost all were married by mid twenties.

 

I remember quite vividly thinking, as above, that I was in some sort of holding pattern waiting for my real, adult, life to begin, with a partner and shortly thereafter (presumably) marriage and then family.

 

There comes a point, where one must recognize that one may always be single. Not that one completely gives up, despairs of, or turns away from opportunities for romantic relationships, just that one has to make a choice at some point either to continue to view relationships and marriage as the start of "real adult life" and thus accept living a half-life, a life that is not full, or one has to redefine what living a full and happy adult life actually means.

 

Yes, this is true. But an even 'harsher' reality awaits. More in a moment.

 

But the author also makes a really good point, that I am contemplating at the moment...

 

... And that is, that that dream we have, when we think of a relationship with someone else, from the standpoint of singleness, we dream of this perfect unity, this perfect understanding, this perfect balance of merging and separateness of identity. We think of this ideal thing out there that is actually achievable.

 

But that ideal is not possible. It is not feasible. What we are longing for when we singles idealize and think about relationships is not the reality, rather some overarching ineffable pipe-dream.

 

Yes, this.

 

Its a cliche now, but still holds true. We're alone, in the universe.

 

The ideal and the longing and desire for "perfect unity, this perfect understanding, this perfect balance of merging and separateness of identity" doesn't actually exist and can't exist within the limits presented us by physical reality.

 

 

... This ideal of perfect acceptance and complete perfect unconditional love does not exist. And that seems to make the idea that I might never find the kind of deep intellectual and emotional connection that I am searching for much easier to bear.

 

I had to suffer a divorce to finally slap me awake in relation to this realisation. Whilst the reason for divorce and the final wake up to reality were not related, it caused me to have an "enlightenment" moment, and not in a good way - though ultimately its been helpful.

 

 

And also makes it easier to begin to think about strategies to make my life even more meaningful and while not turning away opportunities for romantic relationships, simply just giving up the expectation that I will have that, or that my life is missing something or has not really started yet without it.

 

Anybody else up against this and have thoughts to share?

 

The problem, at this level of deep thinking is this: "make my life even more meaningful"

 

What does that even mean? More meaningful?

 

If its a simile for "happier" or "more content", than I'd subscribe, because ultimately, in the sort of ethereal mind space we're veering towards, nothing has any real meaning, at a universal level (ie; the universe, not simply meaning worldwide or family-of-man levels)

 

Alan Watts, in one of his lectures puts forward the idea:

 

"The meaning of life is just to be alive. It is so plain and so obvious and so simple. And yet, everybody rushes around in a great panic as if it were necessary to achieve something beyond themselves."

 

Those words are just another way of stating that its the journey thats important, not the destination.

 

Likewise, I think its important that we find a way to take real pleasure from life ... hobbies or other distractions should bring real satisfaction and not simply be a way to fill the void whilst waiting for 'real life' to begin.

Edited February 26, 2017 by Mumbles

[Sweetfish]

Learning to love your self and your very being. Learning to live alone and be content. Is the most powerful tool in the relationship game.

[todreaminblue]

when i was young teachers told me i was destined for great things.......that i could be anything i wanted to be.......the navy did the same thing...but instead of telling me privately decided to do it in front of the whole intake......and i cringed......first off when teachers told me this i thought ok they are doing this because they feel sorry for me.....the teachers who told me this were normally teachers knew my private history......i never wanted greatness....still dont.....

 

love and closeness was always key for me...to help others....feed kids....make a difference

 

NOW

 

i just want to be with people i love, who honestly love me back and do the things i love to do touch a few hearts along the way.....make a difference that way.......be there for others......

 

there is perfect love......unconditional and present in this universe....(one of many) we are not alone....werent meant to walk alone either.....god walks with us...he used to in the flesh......he will never leave us...never.....even when we go astray.....or dont believe in him doesnt matter...he believes in us....thats unconditional.....thats perfection...humanity is only 25 per cent perfect...... in my eyes of perfect love....we need those three other entities for perfection....

 

with love...i miss having that special someone.......loving him.....having him love me....really know me .me really know him...so words arent needed....silence can be golden...even sometimes i dont have to say whats up with me or explain in words what i feel......because the guy i am with already knows.....i miss that....that honesty....i miss makign love the same way..raw honesty......on how i feel...raw emotions shared...vegan love...lol...ahem...sorry i was trying to be serious....

 

 

i feel missing.......that's what i feel.......my ex is back.....single now..... and we are talking about what could be........we split ten years ago.....its not unusual i have had more than a couple exes come back looking for me.

 

...my first ever contacted me last year...i thought i treated him rather badly..when i apologized he said i didnt have to all he can remember was how much fun we always had together.....

 

i know what i miss...its closeness....someone really knowing how i feel....me being able to be completely honest....and understood..i miss the late night whispers that keep going to one of us fell asleep..dreams... hopes...what was for brekkie......who was going to parent teacher meetings(always me anyway)..i miss the little things...the kiss hello at the end of the day...the goodbye morning hug.....the soft caress hidden because the kids were watching...fighting over the toothpaste tube in the bathroom.....(kids dont fight fair...my ex always gave me the tube...lol)

 

if i were to go to morrow to my blue skies......i know how much happiness i have had some awesome memories....i dont know if my ex and i will end up back together...feel pretty confused about it.....

 

but i feel like i have lived five lifetimes......maybe my life looks like a mess to most people..looks liek a mess to em on a good day......but i have met some amazing people done some pretty amazing things.and i wouldnt be who i am now.......i have loved...and i have been loved in return...

 

 

every one....has a right to feel that love......and not be ashamed to want it.....or miss it....or look for love.........its human to miss love ...we are made by a loving being.......its human to want love...and its human to seek it.....its human to want to have that bond in matrimony too.....we were made human to love...to experience humanities greatest gift...the capacity to share love emotionally and physically......because god so loved us/......the world changes views every ten seconds...gods view for us...never does....his timing though.....

 

 

i dont think whinging helps...but to find love and to get married should bee seen as an honorable and just dream.....a beautiful hoped for.... ..not one where you think a person cant live on their own.....and is pathetic...because they want love...and that person sees a glass half empty..if i see a half empty glass ill tip it down the sink and fill it up again chuck some ice in with it.....till it overflows when i go to take a sip and i end up dribbling it down my shirt so everybody knows debs just had water....my family always say dont fill it up so much......haha...says me...lol........we all need love..its necessity....even if we dont admit it....deb

[PrettyEmily77]

Albeit in the low single digit figure, I've experienced enough kinds of relationships to appreciate being on my own.

 

I find the idea of deliberately, actively and meticulously looking for a life-partner to be off-putting and I'm a total subscriber of the 'things happen for a reason' line of thought. Most of my close friends and family members seem to be in fulfilled, well-matched relationships and OLD is still a bit of a last resort or something people use as a tool to avoid the feeling of loneliness around my parts.

 

I have good friends, I live in a close-knit community and I have a healthy, happy relationship with my family so in that sense, I don't feel like I'm 'missing out'. I've been at my most serene when single - I don't know if it's a phase in my life or if it'll be that way for good, but I'm fine with it either scenario.

 

Good luck finding your own way, OP.

Edited February 26, 2017 by PrettyEmily77

[Eternal Sunshine]

I have always been a loner. Even as a kid, my mum told me that I always preferred my own company to anyone else's. I would sit by myself and read books for hours.

 

Very rarely, I would come across a person to whom I would find a deep connection to. I mean more in a platonic sense. My best friend from primary school is still one of my closest friends today, 30 years later and few continents away.

 

I have never been able to find a romantic relationship where I felt that deep connection. I always found them to be full of stress, drama, trying to be something I am not. I never enjoyed the "highs" of in love feeling either. It robbed me of inner peace and introduced so much instability and chaos into my life. I have often had fantasies of living on a deserted island and not having to deal with people at all.

 

I function at my absolute best when I am single. I struggle with this since the society makes me feel that I am abnormal. That's an inner struggle that I have had for decades and I have forced myself to do OLD for many years.

 

I never wanted children, and the more I see my friends have them, the more I am sure of this. I sometimes worry if I will get too lonely once I am older and my parents are no longer around. But, I can't make decisions in my present life based on what my future self may or may not want.

 

I could possibly see being in a relationship with someone who is as non-mainstream and eccentric as myself, but that's incredibly rare to find.

 

I still need to reconcile what I want vs the need to be accepted by society.

[thefooloftheyear]

Many of us don't need it.....Heck...I could spend days at a time in my fully equipped shop. without a single person in my presence working on a project or invention, and be completely at peace..

 

But when it works out as it should....then there probably isn't anything in life that compares...

 

So I guess that's what keeps people in the hunt....

 

TFY

Edited February 26, 2017 by thefooloftheyear

[Ariadne]

I have often had fantasies of living on a deserted island and not having to deal with people at all.... I struggle with this since the society makes me feel that I am abnormal.

 

Haha! Me too! Either that or live on the top of a mountain where they build those monasteries in a place where it snows...all by myself (pic). Maybe with a dog or a cat because they don´t talk.

 

I don´t care about society, but the only thing I see about couples is that they work as a "team". And I think life is easier as a team.

 

As an example, there is a grocery store nearby that is owned by a couple. They are very successful, the store thrives, but there is no way that that woman could make that store run by herself! The guy brings the merchandise in the truck, unloads, they take turns running the place, etc, etc. Also, one is there to take care of the other for any mishap, if one gets sick, or whatever the case. Power in numbers.

[preraph]

 

What it is, is that I have this deep yearning to be really known and really understood. Not just understood, but that my thoughts, feelings, everything even those things that I don't quite know and understand are understood themselves, but even more so, the implications and implicit materials are understood too. And not just that someone understands me in this deep way, that I have someone with similar convulted thinking patterns and pathways who I can understand as deeply....

 

 

Preraph Perhaps you had your dream lover, in your job. I agree that following passions and interests is key, and what I have done since I was a child. You sound like you're pretty independent and feisty in your own way....

 

YES! Exactly. And my animals.

 

I'm not sure I ever met someone who totally understood everything about me. Certainly not the loves of my life. It's more like each one appealed to a facet of myself. I remember after a traumatic breakup, 4 men I already knew started coming around and I got something different from each of them that helped me through that horrible time. Not one of them was right for me entirely. But one supported me with employment advice, one made me laugh, etc. I do think we all want someone who really gets all of us, but that isn't always a lover.

[Abhainn]

I want you all to know that I'm reading and appreciating all of your responses. There have been some really thoughtful and insightful posts. It may take me awhile to get back to you all because I've got a lot of work and reading to do in the next few days!

[Chilli]

Never thought l'd be single at this age, 53. And l'm a really young 53 to and different to most anywhere near my age which makes it even weirder.

l knew l'd marry my ex w the day we met, But l avoided 2 or 3 others before her so it's not like l was looking to get hitched.

We were together 20yrs and most was good or better but in the last 3 or 4 life turned and for a lot of reasons, we wound up splitting.

 

That was the hardest thing l've ever been through and it's never felt right being single again even though at times married l'd have killed to be single again for awhile.

l spent 2-3yrs very very miserable, although l did meet a few girls in that time no one spesh though. Then l became friends with one, zero attraction as a gf but l liked her as a friend. 5mths later she got drunk and tried all night to get into my pants so that was pretty well the end of the friendship. By now 3yrs alone basically.

 

Then l met someone on a forum. It was instant, insane , just like when l met my ex. That's been 3/4 LDR though and we've only manged a few mths in person together. She's in another country but wanted to move here with me since a few weeks after we met.

l still love her insanely and l know she does me and it's been the bizarrest most intense thing l've ever been in yet, l don't think it's gonna work bc she has things in her nature that effect me a lot and after 12mths of wrestling with them l just don't think we can get on top of them.

Doesn't feel right for us not to go on yet l'm not sure how we can go on. And so again, it looks like l'm gonna be single again and tbh , l have no idea wth is going on it all feels weird , wrong.

l sort of feel like l've been single 4yrs now which is the longest n my life , and at this age, wtf ????? , but really l haven't . There's been my new love butttt, then maybe not from here.

 

l like friends but only when it suits me and my whole life best friends one of us has always wound up moving a way, it's happened every time. So a single with friends, not really my thing.

So it's been a confusing ride this 4yrs and many times l wonder if l will be alone forever now and just wth life holds for me, how l feel about it.

With gf and me not looking like it can work out, yet with this insane thing we found and felt since day one, just like ex w, it feels as though l've had 2 bizarre amazing and mind blowing loves in my life now and that often seems 2 more than a helluva lot of other people l've discovered since hanging out on forums a lot through this past 4yrs. l feel as though l've been so lucky in love to have known those 2 , how could l possibly expect another chance now if gf and l don't work out. How ?

That would be asking too much, surely.

 

So this last few wks l'm back to thinking maybe l spend my life alone from here now and l must admit , it doesn't feel right to me , it doesn't feel as if that's who l'm meant to be and with me in any feelings like that they usually wind up meaning something. So maybe something happens yet, l can't work it out as this isn't feeling right. Yet how could l possibly expect to get lucky a 3rd time from here.

Maybe it's about gf , maybe somehow we do work it out, l just can't tell. But nothing feels right being single again and tbh l find the thought pretty depressing and scary too.

Maybe in time l adjust , l even like it , if it works out to be that way long term from here , but l do know something isn't right in my life right now and in how l'm living and back to being alone.

Weird, but apart from women in my life , l've always been a bit of a loner, friends are only ever in spats and l keep them at a distance or kiss it goodbye if they get too much, or one of us moves.

So it's always been l either be alone or with a partner .

 

Sorry if this goes around in circles or doesn't make sense . It doesn't t me either. 4yrs now and l'm still wondering just wtf is going on

Edited February 26, 2017 by Chilli

[Popsicle]

Sometimes I'm so happy and relieved that I am single and free, and sometimes being single sucks because I miss all the good parts of being in a LTR. So it's always a double-edged sword for me and I imagine it will always be that way for me.

[Mr Scorpio]

And that is, that that dream we have, when we think of a relationship with someone else, from the standpoint of singleness, we dream of this perfect unity, this perfect understanding, this perfect balance of merging and separateness of identity. We think of this ideal thing out there that is actually achievable.

 

I can speak only for myself obviously but this is not what I dream of. I'm thinking only of someone with whom I can share understanding, compassion, and affection. Someone to take out on the town for sushi and symphony. Someone to take home for a back rub and a "Stranger Things" marathon. That will do nicely.

 

No one who has been in a relationship should be concerned with "perfect".

[Chilli]

I can speak only for myself obviously but this is not what I dream of. I'm thinking only of someone with whom I can share understanding, compassion, and affection. Someone to take out on the town for sushi and symphony. Someone to take home for a back rub and a "Stranger Things" marathon. That will do nicely.

 

No one who has been in a relationship should be concerned with "perfect".

 

 

True really. Dad always said nothing can ever be perfect and if it is then it'll probably blow up in your face. Think he was right.

Him and mum weren't perfect but they made it 56 yrs, through thick and lots of very serious thin too.

Though somehow they went full circle and were doting on each other in their 80s.

[Abhainn]

OP, what you are describing is a universal longing. For many, most even, we submerge that in favour of constant busyness. Whether that busyness comes from servicing a family or friends, or work, or hobbies, or whatever, doesn't matter, for most, the longing is pushed under the rug.

 

Why do you think we have it, what do you think it pushes us toward? (I mean, we could go simplistic evolutionary answers of togetherness, community for survival's sake...)but I'm curious if you have any deeper answers?

 

As someone who for most of my life was a deep, deep thinker, I recognise the language - a conversation like this, conducted around the coffee table late at night with a glass of brandy and like-minded friends will quickly extend into the universal truth of 'being'.

 

*sigh* I miss those! (mine didn't tend to have Brandy per se, usually a bit of wine or Irish Creme). lol. Or whether there was one, right?

 

'm convinced that everyone suffers this, but for those of us innately satisfied with our own company (as you say, often from childhood), the notion gets plenty of opportunity to formulate and expand inside our minds. The trouble is, and you have identified it already, no such utopia actually exists in the physical world that surrounds us. You can't ever get inside the mind of your lover, nor she yours, you are always at arms length, no matter both your desires.

 

As I'm a heterosexual woman, that would be he, mine, but I do take your point. And again, with no such utopia existing, not the way we imagine it anyway (yes To Dream in Blue, I'm not disagreeing with your main point, either), why do we have this longing for what can never be in the way we imagine it. Why would we adapt this way?

 

 

I married for the first time quite late in life, as compared to my colleagues and friends. 33, not a big stretch by todays standard, but I'm a bit older, most of my peers had LTR's in their late teens and early twenties and almost all were married by mid twenties.

 

I remember quite vividly thinking, as above, that I was in some sort of holding pattern waiting for my real, adult, life to begin, with a partner and shortly thereafter (presumably) marriage and then family.

 

Its a cliche now, but still holds true. We're alone, in the universe.

 

The ideal and the longing and desire for "perfect unity, this perfect understanding, this perfect balance of merging and separateness of identity" doesn't actually exist and can't exist within the limits presented us by physical reality.

 

I had to suffer a divorce to finally slap me awake in relation to this realisation. Whilst the reason for divorce and the final wake up to reality were not related, it caused me to have an "enlightenment" moment, and not in a good way - though ultimately its been helpful.

 

For me it has been more gradual, a really long relationship that never came to marriage really needed to come to an end. It was for the best, but I've come to realize how difficult it is to find even a kindred soul for friendship, much less a lover.

 

The problem, at this level of deep thinking is this: "make my life even more meaningful"

 

What does that even mean? More meaningful?

 

If its a simile for "happier" or "more content", than I'd subscribe, because ultimately, in the sort of ethereal mind space we're veering towards, nothing has any real meaning, at a universal level (ie; the universe, not simply meaning worldwide or family-of-man levels).

 

Alan Watts, in one of his lectures puts forward the idea:

 

"The meaning of life is just to be alive. It is so plain and so obvious and so simple. And yet, everybody rushes around in a great panic as if it were necessary to achieve something beyond themselves."

 

Those words are just another way of stating that its the journey thats important, not the destination.

 

Likewise, I think its important that we find a way to take real pleasure from life ... hobbies or other distractions should bring real satisfaction and not simply be a way to fill the void whilst waiting for 'real life' to begin.

 

And here is where I must disagree. Though research has most plentifully shown the effect that traumatic experiences enacted on us by others carries not just to our cells, but also through to our very DNA through epigenetics, given the immense health benefits of positive social interactions with each other, I am convinced further research will show a similarly (though in this case, positive) effect through our very cells, into our very DNA.

 

The effects we have on each other have the potential to be so powerfully positive. I cannot say that the only meaning is to enjoy things, or be happy. Not speaking of romantic relationships here, but I do believe the effects we have on each other (perhaps this is cliche, but it least it has the upside of being cliche backed by research) absolutely determines what meaning means in our world, in this context. A more meaningful life, here, is one that is devoted to doing one's best to make the world and those whom one encounters within it better for having met them. Having a positive effect, not just top down emotional and psychological, but also bottom-up physiological through to the emotional and psychological (not that these are separate, mind you, but that's a can of worms for another one of these sorts of convos!).

 

when i was young teachers told me i was destined for great things.......that i could be anything i wanted to be.......the navy did the same thing...but instead of telling me privately decided to do it in front of the whole intake......and i cringed......first off when teachers told me this i thought ok they are doing this because they feel sorry for me.....the teachers who told me this were normally teachers knew my private history......i never wanted greatness....still dont.....

 

love and closeness was always key for me...to help others....feed kids....make a difference

 

NOW

 

i just want to be with people i love, who honestly love me back and do the things i love to do touch a few hearts along the way.....make a difference that way.......be there for others......

 

there is perfect love......unconditional and present in this universe....(one of many) we are not alone....werent meant to walk alone either.....god walks with us...he used to in the flesh......he will never leave us...never.....even when we go astray.....or dont believe in him doesnt matter...he believes in us....thats unconditional.....thats perfection...humanity is only 25 per cent perfect...... in my eyes of perfect love....we need those three other entities for perfection....

 

with love...i miss having that special someone.......loving him.....having him love me....really know me .me really know him...so words arent needed....silence can be golden...even sometimes i dont have to say whats up with me or explain in words what i feel......because the guy i am with already knows.....i miss that....that honesty....i miss makign love the same way..raw honesty......on how i feel...raw emotions shared...vegan love...lol...ahem...sorry i was trying to be serious....

 

 

i feel missing.......that's what i feel.......my ex is back.....single now..... and we are talking about what could be........we split ten years ago.....its not unusual i have had more than a couple exes come back looking for me.

 

...my first ever contacted me last year...i thought i treated him rather badly..when i apologized he said i didnt have to all he can remember was how much fun we always had together.....

 

i know what i miss...its closeness....someone really knowing how i feel....me being able to be completely honest....and understood..i miss the late night whispers that keep going to one of us fell asleep..dreams... hopes...what was for brekkie......who was going to parent teacher meetings(always me anyway)..i miss the little things...the kiss hello at the end of the day...the goodbye morning hug.....the soft caress hidden because the kids were watching...fighting over the toothpaste tube in the bathroom.....(kids dont fight fair...my ex always gave me the tube...lol)

 

if i were to go to morrow to my blue skies......i know how much happiness i have had some awesome memories....i dont know if my ex and i will end up back together...feel pretty confused about it.....

 

but i feel like i have lived five lifetimes......maybe my life looks like a mess to most people..looks liek a mess to em on a good day......but i have met some amazing people done some pretty amazing things.and i wouldnt be who i am now.......i have loved...and i have been loved in return...

 

 

every one....has a right to feel that love......and not be ashamed to want it.....or miss it....or look for love.........its human to miss love ...we are made by a loving being.......its human to want love...and its human to seek it.....its human to want to have that bond in matrimony too.....we were made human to love...to experience humanities greatest gift...the capacity to share love emotionally and physically......because god so loved us/......the world changes views every ten seconds...gods view for us...never does....his timing though.....

 

 

i dont think whinging helps...but to find love and to get married should bee seen as an honorable and just dream.....a beautiful hoped for.... ..not one where you think a person cant live on their own.....and is pathetic...because they want love...and that person sees a glass half empty..if i see a half empty glass ill tip it down the sink and fill it up again chuck some ice in with it.....till it overflows when i go to take a sip and i end up dribbling it down my shirt so everybody knows debs just had water....my family always say dont fill it up so much......haha...says me...lol........we all need love..its necessity....even if we dont admit it....deb

 

So beautiful! Such excellent analogies, and sense of poetry while making your point eminently clear. Excellent writing. I have absolutely nothing to add or comment, other than I really love the embodied water/glass analogy. We should all have so much that it dribbles over onto our shirts!

[Abhainn]

Since it doesn't seem like I can edit my previous message, I do want to say that I'm reading and appreciating all of your advice and real practical experiences. So many of you have posted (I will definitely forget a few, from Carhill to Preraph, to Chilli, to Mr. Scorpio to others who I am certainly forgetting) some really good concrete experiences and advice.

 

In a lot of cases, those are often the things that I am trying to do, and/or doing already. I guess, if I were hoping for something specific here, it would be a more abstract exploration of these sorts of feelings, why we have them, the things they can point us towards, maybe that some others also share this experience, and what it might say about us and our society.

 

I guess what I am most interested in, are your thoughts, feelings, and perceptions about singleness and your experiences of it.