how do men feel about women who don't raise their kids?

[fire575]

This is a question for men... guys, how do you feel about women who aren't parents to their children? I have a general curiosity about this because I have a good friend who hasn't found Mr. Right yet and I know there are a ton of reasons why that might be, though I can't help but wonder if her lack of maternal responsibility is part of it.

 

We're both in our mid-thirties and my friend is a ton of fun and very attractive (men practically drool over her). When I met her, she had just moved away from her 2 year old daughter to pursue a college education. She finished school long ago, but never made an effort to move back near her daughter and help raise her. She still makes the 4-hour drive every few months to see her daughter, but is otherwise largely absent from her life. Since I've known her, my friend has been in a few long term relationships. She's one of my best friends and I love her dearly so I don't want to seem critical or judgmental, but if I'm being completely honest she does tend to be kind of selfish/self-absorbed (she's an only child so that could be a contributing factor) and the fact that she isn't helping to raise her own child emphasizes those attributes. She's very active on social media and often posts selfies, changes her profile pics a lot, and posts photos of fun times w/friends, traveling, etc... and she only posts a photo of her daughter just a couple times a year. I know my description of her paints her in a bad light and doesn't quite justify her good nature.. we all have aspects of ourselves that need work/improvement so for the record: she's a GOOD PERSON! I just feel bad for her daughter because she's at the age now (13) where she's questioning and wondering why her mom chose a life of fun with friends (including me!) rather than caring for her own flesh and blood.

 

So with all that said ^^^^ even though men flock to her for her good looks and fun-loving nature, I wonder if the attraction wears off after they realize she selfishly left her child behind to live it up and party. I know that sounds harsh but at a fundamental level, it is what it is. I wonder because (most) men have this biological and instinctive attraction and need for a partner who is maternal, caring, loving, etc. She doesn't really fit that bill. So I'm wondering if that could be why she hasn't found Mr. Right. She wonders why she hasn't settled down and married yet (she wants to) and I can't help but think it's due to her motherhood shortcomings and general selfishness, but I just don't have the heart to tell her because I don't want to hurt her feelings.

 

 

P.S. I'm happily married and I don't have kids so I'm not speaking from a preachy motherhood POV.

[mikeylo]

She has abandoned the child.

 

Enough said.

[GorillaTheater]

I'd literally take a bullet for my kids, so no, I'd suspect I'd be wholly incompatible with someone like your friend.

 

 

I'd say her general selfishness may be a bigger barrier to relationships, though.

[Imajerk17]

I don't have kids, but I'd put her firmly in the "No way" pile. If a friend started dating a girl like your friend I'd do what I could to talk him into dumping her.

 

And no, someone who passes over raising their own flesh and blood to lead a life of fun is NOT a good person.

[SunnySide0418]

I don't see how you can say she's a good person. She's abandoned her child!! Is the child with her father? I would never ever ever leave my children. I'm divorced and miss them so much when they have to see their dad. She's a selfish loser. Sorry.

[TheWoman]

If you reversed the genders on this would it be quite the same issue? I have come across many men who have done similar and it's not considered to be that big a deal. It's not something I could do, but society certainly comes down harder on women who abandon their kids, than the men who do it. I think judging people says more about the judge than the judged.

[fire575]

I don't see how you can say she's a good person. She's abandoned her child!! Is the child with her father? I would never ever ever leave my children. I'm divorced and miss them so much when they have to see their dad. She's a selfish loser. Sorry.

 

You're reading a statement about someone without personally knowing them.. so naturally it's harder on my end to view a friend as objectively as you are. Bottom line is that she's fun, I have a lot in common with her, and I simply enjoy her company.. maybe that's not enough to make her a "good person" but either way, she's still one of my good friends.

 

To answer your questions, yes - the father was raising the daughter. But he actually passed away a few months ago so now her daughter is living with his parents, further complicating things. My friend told me that her daughter has started to kind of shut down from her and has started to question her absence all these years..which I think it only natural.

[fire575]

If you reversed the genders on this would it be quite the same issue? I have come across many men who have done similar and it's not considered to be that big a deal. It's not something I could do, but society certainly comes down harder on women who abandon their kids, than the men who do it. I think judging people says more about the judge than the judged.

 

Exactly! I'm not trying to start a gender war here.. but like I said, she's a guy magnet, always getting tons of "you're beautiful" comments on social media, guys hitting on her in person, etc..... but still can't seem to find true long term happiness with a man. And so I wonder if the main reason is because she abandoned her child... even more so than the self-absorption. There are plenty of self-absorbed selfie takers who are happily married. People find life partners regardless of faults.. nobody is perfect. But a woman abandoning her child is not your run of the mill personality flaw, it speaks to a much deeper issue that I'm assuming most men can't quite wrap their heads around. And so even though she's fun and very attractive, my guess is most men aren't interested in longevity with her once they find out about her daughter.

[GunslingerRoland]

I can hardly speak for other men and whatever goes on in their heads. But this thread makes me physically angry. Not someone I could date at all. I could see a lot of people having that reaction even those who don't want to have kids themselves.

 

And yes lots of guys won't care at all, but those are mostly the guys who probably aren't that interested in settling down to get married in the first place.

 

Also how do you separate her self absorption from this? She is so self absorbed that the idea of leaving her daughter to go on and do whatever else she felt she wanted to seemed like a perfectly good idea to her. How do you be in a serious relationship with someone like that... you know where all of her priorities from day 1 and they aren't on you.

[thefooloftheyear]

If you reversed the genders on this would it be quite the same issue? I have come across many men who have done similar and it's not considered to be that big a deal. It's not something I could do, but society certainly comes down harder on women who abandon their kids, than the men who do it. I think judging people says more about the judge than the judged.

 

 

The reality is that while things have changed to some degree, men make on average FAR more than women do for the same work...So then it just becomes a matter of what's best for the child and the finances...

 

Additionally, even though I am a dedicated father that would give my life for my kid, there is something really wrong with a woman that actively brought a child into this world, and has no motherly instinct...It goes against everything I can think of..

 

TFY

[mikeylo]

The ' attractiveness ' turns her 'ugly ' , after her the fact.

 

She is targeting the wrong guys. There are plenty of deadbeat mothers and fathers. She will find her own kind.

[stillafool]

I have a cousin who is also gorgeous, the oldest of 6 girls and she hasn't raised either of her daughters but left them with their Dad. My cousin is a party girl as well. I once asked her if she felt bad not being their for her daughters and she said it was as much their Dad's responsibility as hers so no she didn't feel bad at all. She has had a lot of men and been engaged twice since her divorce. Sadly, I don't think men mind at all because of the way she looks.

[fire575]

I can hardly speak for other men and whatever goes on in their heads. But this thread makes me physically angry. Not someone I could date at all. I could see a lot of people having that reaction even those who don't want to have kids themselves.

 

And yes lots of guys won't care at all, but those are mostly the guys who probably aren't that interested in settling down to get married in the first place.

 

Also how do you separate her self absorption from this? She is so self absorbed that the idea of leaving her daughter to go on and do whatever else she felt she wanted to seemed like a perfectly good idea to her. How do you be in a serious relationship with someone like that... you know where all of her priorities from day 1 and they aren't on you.

 

Thanks for your honesty...

 

The reason I separate her self-absorption from the issue surrounding her daughter is because even though I realize her self-absorption is correlated to her abandoning her daughter, there are a lot of self-absorbed people out.. some more self-absorbed than others.. but not all of those people leave their kids. So yeah, truth is she is self-absorbed.. but self-absorbed people can work through those issues if it's something they want to change about themselves. This is why I separate the two. Her issue is that she left her kid behind and she can't take that back. But run of the mill self-absorbed people can become more selfless if they work toward personal change/growth. In my friend's case, she can't make up for lost time.. but I guess she *could* do a 180 and move back to her hometown and try to make up for lost time in some attempt to redeem herself... if she wanted to. So it goes back to my original question being: is the main reason she can't find Mr. Right because she left her kid?

 

My husband and I don't want kids for a number of reasons. We're both very happy in our childless marriage. Kids just aren't for everyone and people should respect that. So I don't think it's as much about lacking a desire to have and care for children as much as how sick the thought is of ABANDONING you own child. Big difference between the two.

 

Anyway, I've always kind of wondered about this with her knowing how much attention she gets from men... but never took the time to put the question out to men until now.

[fire575]

The reality is that while things have changed to some degree, men make on average FAR more than women do for the same work...So then it just becomes a matter of what's best for the child and the finances...

 

Additionally, even though I am a dedicated father that would give my life for my kid, there is something really wrong with a woman that actively brought a child into this world, and has no motherly instinct...It goes against everything I can think of..

 

TFY

 

My friend's reason/excuse for leaving was so her daughter would be better off. The dad had a stable job and was financially able to care for their daughter (they split up when their daughter was a baby). My friend just wanted to get out of her crappy hometown, get her degree, get a good job, etc.. and she's accomplished all of those things. When I met her, I just thought she'd go back to her daughter or see if her daughter would be interested in living with her... even during the summer break or something. But nope.. she didn't/doesn't make much of an effort to be a part of her life. It's really sad.

[SwordofFlame]

My friend's reason/excuse for leaving was so her daughter would be better off. The dad had a stable job and was financially able to care for their daughter (they split up when their daughter was a baby). My friend just wanted to get out of her crappy hometown, get her degree, get a good job, etc.. and she's accomplished all of those things. When I met her, I just thought she'd go back to her daughter or see if her daughter would be interested in living with her... even during the summer break or something. But nope.. she didn't/doesn't make much of an effort to be a part of her life. It's really sad.

 

Now that you've divulged that info, how is this different than a woman who gave up her baby for adoption? It sounds like she made a mistake of having the kid in the first place.

[stillafool]

Exactly! I'm not trying to start a gender war here.. but like I said, she's a guy magnet, always getting tons of "you're beautiful" comments on social media, guys hitting on her in person, etc..... but still can't seem to find true long term happiness with a man. And so I wonder if the main reason is because she abandoned her child... even more so than the self-absorption. There are plenty of self-absorbed selfie takers who are happily married. People find life partners regardless of faults.. nobody is perfect. But a woman abandoning her child is not your run of the mill personality flaw, it speaks to a much deeper issue that I'm assuming most men can't quite wrap their heads around. And so even though she's fun and very attractive, my guess is most men aren't interested in longevity with her once they find out about her daughter.

 

Maybe it's not that she can't find long term happiness with a man; but maybe she likes her life the way it is. I don't think it's a good idea to judge her.

[fire575]

Now that you've divulged that info, how is this different than a woman who gave up her baby for adoption? It sounds like she made a mistake of having the kid in the first place.

 

Hmm.. I personally wouldn't frame it that way since it sounds like you're saying that the kid is a mistake. No kid should be labeled as a mistake. But yeah, I understand what you're getting at... she probably should have put more thought into it when she found out she got pregnant. Coulda woulda shoulda...

[fire575]

The ' attractiveness ' turns her 'ugly ' , after her the fact.

 

She is targeting the wrong guys. There are plenty of deadbeat mothers and fathers. She will find her own kind.

 

I don't think she's "targeting" any type of guy in particular. She's not like a gold digger or anything like that. She's a typical single thirtysomething person who's looking to make a lifelong connection with someone that shares her passions, hobbies, interests, life goals, etc. In fact, one of her long-term relationships was with a man who had a daughter of his own. And the man she's currently dating has two children from his ex-wife. So it's not like she's a child-hater.

[thefooloftheyear]

My friend's reason/excuse for leaving was so her daughter would be better off. The dad had a stable job and was financially able to care for their daughter (they split up when their daughter was a baby). My friend just wanted to get out of her crappy hometown, get her degree, get a good job, etc.. and she's accomplished all of those things. When I met her, I just thought she'd go back to her daughter or see if her daughter would be interested in living with her... even during the summer break or something. But nope.. she didn't/doesn't make much of an effort to be a part of her life. It's really sad.

 

She's putting the cart before the horse.....

 

but hey, I'm good so.....*shrug*..

 

 

TFY

[Gloria25]

Believe it or not, while my favorite podcaster is adamant about sacrificing for kids and not dumping your kid off in daycare/relatives/etc....she's a strong advocate for adoption and once I was amazed to hear her say daycare/a relative/father being the primary caretaker for a child is better than the child suffering from a bad mother.

 

Look, some people just don't have it in them to be "mothers" or "fathers". Having a child is a biological act...it doesn't make you capable of parenting.

 

I have days I wonder if it wouldn've been better that I didn't have parents cuz although they were present "physically" - no parent/child relationship between us was there. They were like roommates. Thank God for my dad's Mum...she came and rescued us on/off for years - while dad trotted the globe and my Mum worked long hours.

 

I knew from my tweens that I didn't want kids. Each of my sisters are/were the most selfish people ever - who put everything they wanted above their kid's needs. I look at my brother's wife and when she sees a kid, she gets all mushy...not me. I just don't feel it. When she had my niece (I had to do all the "daddy" stuff when she gave birth and they like handed me the baby ), I had a sorta "what am I doing with my life" moment where I cried after my annual Obgyn visit...but nah, I'm back to being content as a childless woman. My doggies are enough and I get to be a "part-time" nurturer when I cook and care for my neices/nephews.

 

My thing is this...if you don't have it in you to be a parent and "ooppsed" a kid, better you leave it where it is loved (adoption, relatives) than have the kid with you and blow it off. Yes, like Casey Anthony, I know of women who had/have no shame in partying, dragging men in front of their kids, etc....for that, put your kid up for adoption, leave it with a loving relative, or leave it with the parent who wants to parent.

[Lady2163]

I realize I'm a woman, not a man. But, if your friend recognized she wasn't mother material or that the father could give the child a better home, then good for her.

 

What a double standard. A friend figured it out that her ex husband spent 71 days a year with his kids. He thought he was a great dad because of that.

 

Why is it all right for men to essentially abandon their kids and not women?

 

Because women *should* be more nurturing since they carry the baby? Well, geez, then men *should* step up and marry the mother and be better providers....because that is what they are supposed to do and how they are supposed to think.

 

Another telling point with your friend is that she gets plenty of attention from men and probably plenty of sex. Yet, she hasn't had another child. She is showing some responsibility. From what I have seen in my life, there are too many mothers who have no business having kids....and then having more kids.

 

I'm guessing your friend made the best choice she could at the time.

 

But, it is a touch alarming she isn't more involved now.

 

I'm also single with no kids and around 50. I am a bit self absorbed. I am a bit immature and I know it is because I never had to make those kinds of sacrifices. That doesn't mean I'm not a kind person, it just means

[BluesPower]

I raised my 3 alone for the most part...

 

Sorry to say that if I was with a girl and found out about this I think I would end it.

 

I agree with lady that if she knew she would not be a good mother and left her to the father to raise, I might understand. A lot of men abandon their children she we can't say the it is worse for a female than a male. I could just never do it.

 

For me, I took care of my STBXwife and my kids and doing that was a huge part of my life and took a huge sacrifice.

 

I never thought about it much because it was just something that I did.

[Weezy1973]

So often the qualities that make one a good parent are the same qualities that make one a good partner. Apparently she has neither.

[mikeylo]

What is it that makes her attractive ? A Barbie body? Big boobs ? That's it. Right? A sensible man , looking for relationship,needs more than that.

 

There are unwanted pregnancies every second, all over the world. They are for many reasons. And this woman fills the unfit woman for whom the child was a mistake.

 

The child will find her own answers as she grows. Heartbreaking to say the least. There are many deadbeat mothers and fathers who live separately but across the street and don't care. Nothing unique though.

 

An average looking woman becomes hot and sexy if she is a good mother. It comes down to beauty lies in the eyes of ....

[Popsicle]

I don't have much respect for mothers who've abandon their kids, but I know 3 of them. None of them had any problems whatsoever getting boyfriends or husbands. They just make some sob excuse and the guys buy it.

 

(btw, same is true for men who abandon their kids)