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Dating from the bottom. Does it ever work?


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Say if some guy lacks success with the opposite sex, and doesn't really score points with a lot of women. Does it ever work to aim as low as the bottom of the barrel? I get that some people say don't aim high, and if this were school, it would sometimes mean the most attractive girl like the Queen Bee or the captain of the cheer squad. I remember being given this advice in the past, and I don't always overreach. I don't mind if a woman has a little extra weight on her, as long as she has a decent face. However, I am not sure if starting with an unattractive person is a smart thing to do as practice. Wouldn't that be leading someone on?

 

Another thing that would apply is that I remember being at the age of 21 when I "dated" this one girl who liked me but I only went along with it as I thought that it was my ticket to finally getting lucky (I was in a bad place in my life at the time). It did not last long and being that she was a friend of a friend, the friend told me that I should start from the bottom as in "starting with someone who is younger and less experienced like an 18-year-old."

 

What do you think about this?

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ChickiePops

First of all, there's no such thing as the bottom of the barrel. Different people are attracted to different things, so the bottom of your barrel might be the top of someone else's. Second, if there were, and a guy couldn't find a date for an extended period of time, wouldn't that make HIM the bottom of the barrel too?

 

Yes, it is cruel to 'practice' on someone you're not attracted to. Please don't do it.

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I don't think you should aim at all, especially with people you're aren't attracted to. You should talk to everyone as an equal, get to know them, and eventually something romantic will blossom between you and someone else.

 

Keep it all natural and don't over-analyse, and certainly don't lead anyone on that you don't intend to date, that just makes you a horrible person.

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GoodOnPaper

LS's conventional wisdom in this area is rather schizophrenic: struggling guys are supposed to aim low to get dates but are villains if they pursue or go along with relationships with women they are not head-over-heels for. (For some reason, players are allowed to get away with the latter - I haven't figured out why.)

 

If you truly view a girl as "bottom of the barrel", I don't advise dating her, but I do advocate dating for practice. There's just too much stigma attached to guys who have too little experience. Find a girl who you think is at least kind of cute and who may be at least kind of cool and see what happens as you get to know her.

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SwordofFlame

OP, I'm in the boat that says you should get out there and get as much experience as you can.

Edited by a LoveShack.org Moderator
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Say if some guy lacks success with the opposite sex, and doesn't really score points with a lot of women. Does it ever work to aim as low as the bottom of the barrel?

 

You've gotta do what you've gotta do.

 

Yes, it works.

 

However, I am not sure if starting with an unattractive person is a smart thing to do as practice. Wouldn't that be leading someone on?

 

At some point or another, you'll realise that you come first in life. Until you do, you'll be screwed over.

 

What do you think about this?

 

When I started out in the dating scene, I listened to the guys that were experienced. And, it served me well.

 

There's something called 'social proof'. Women want a man that is wanted. When you get more experience, you'll realise that there is no such thing as 'leagues' for a man. If women are having sex with you, other women will want to have sex with you. Women are natural followers.

 

Momentum is everything for a man. You'll get one girl, then another, and another. If you don't give 'exclusivity' to the first girl that reciprocates your interest, you'll be shocked what you can achieve ;)

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Momentum is everything for a man. You'll get one girl, then another, and another. If you don't give 'exclusivity' to the first girl that reciprocates your interest, you'll be shocked what you can achieve ;)

 

I think "momentum" happens for women too, it always seems when you have one man interested, others follow.

I guess it is due to the confident, sexy vibe you have around you when you feel wanted and desired.

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I think "momentum" happens for women too, it always seems when you have one man interested, others follow.

I guess it is due to the confident, sexy vibe you have around you when you feel wanted and desired.

 

Quite possibly. But there is a huge difference between men and women on this subject that can't be ignored.

 

A simple example would be to point out the difference in opinion between a male virgin, and a female virgin. Men value a female virgin. Women devalue a male virgin. There's a very real reason for that.

 

Another example is that an ugly guy walks into the club with the hottest chick, and all the women take notice. An ugly women walks into the club with the hottest guy, and none of the men care.

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Well, what's your end goal here?

 

Are you looking for experience and think that dating people is like training for something? If that's the case then I wouldn't like it if I was some guy's "training wheels" cuz I'm gonna have my heart and mind invested in him.

 

Actually I was watching a show last night. Seen it over and over, especially with doctors and attorneys (even some military). They date Plain Jane while studying and interning. They may even marry and have kids with her, but as soon as they "make it" they chuck Plain Jane for someone who's more at their "level" - intellectually, physically, etc. And IMO, that's not cool. Plain Jane stuck by you at your lowest, you owe her. People aren't disposable like razors.

 

Now, is your end goal that you think you have to lower your standards cuz you'll settle for "whatever", fear being alone forever? Well, I don't know..we've all messed with people who we really wouldn't want permanently (lagoon creatures per Dane Cook), and yes, if you get lonely enough, just like a person in the desert, any drop of liquid will do...Also, if someone is treating you right, who's anyone to tell you that you need x, y, or z instead?

 

My issue is when people intentionally aim low...there was a Seinfeld where George was running around with a picture of a model that he was showing hot chicks and the chick were ino him cuz he claimed his ex was that hot model. Now I hate when guys try to pull that crap..they try to surround themselves with hotties to attract women.

 

But yes, you can't help but to form your attraction on what a guy can land. So, if you're dating down and other chicks find out, I think it'll hurt your chances to attract an "upgrade"...

 

I crossed paths with my neighbor's wife recently and (again) I was repulsed. She is so off putting. Overweight, terrible tone of voice/demeanor, I have to wonder how he gets a hardon for someone who at barely 30 resembles a cafeteria server at a public school and I don't want a guy who wants that to touch me...ewww. I mean she won't even put on some nice make-up and stuff and she's just gross. She sounds and carries herself like bleh...Like that Rachel Dratch character on SNL with Jimmy Fallon, the gross Boston chick in an oversized jersey and they would be like all over each other :sick:

 

Sometimes I feel bad for him cuz his mom raised him to be scared of women and he probably jumped on her cuz he was lonely and she sorta has acute face, but part of me is turned off on him thinking so little of himself to lower himself to marry and make a kid with that. Chicks like her you hook-up with at closing time at a bar or something...not much to be proud of.

 

So, it's up to you to figure out what your goal is in dating down.

Edited by Gloria25
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I think you should start learning how to see women as people, not objects! I know a guy who dated a woman he thought was not physically attractive but fun to spend time with. Then she dumped him. He has been grief-stricken ever since. He found out that how you feel with a person matters far more than scales of looks. We all look the same in the dark.

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Well, what's your end goal here?

 

Are you looking for experience and think that dating people is like training for something? If that's the case then I wouldn't like it if I was some guy's "training wheels" cuz I'm gonna have my heart and mind invested in him.

 

Actually I was watching a show last night. Seen it over and over, especially with doctors and attorneys (even some military). They date Plain Jane while studying and interning. They may even marry and have kids with her, but as soon as they "make it" they chuck Plain Jane for someone who's more at their "level" - intellectually, physically, etc. And IMO, that's not cool. Plain Jane stuck by you at your lowest, you owe her. People aren't disposable like razors.

 

Now, is your end goal that you think you have to lower your standards cuz you'll settle for "whatever", fear being alone forever? Well, I don't know..we've all messed with people who we really wouldn't want permanently (lagoon creatures per Dane Cook), and yes, if you get lonely enough, just like a person in the desert, any drop of liquid will do...Also, if someone is treating you right, who's anyone to tell you that you need x, y, or z instead?

 

My issue is when people intentionally aim low...there was a Seinfeld where George was running around with a picture of a model that he was showing hot chicks and the chick were ino him cuz he claimed his ex was that hot model. Now I hate when guys try to pull that crap..they try to surround themselves with hotties to attract women.

 

But yes, you can't help but to form your attraction on what a guy can land. So, if you're dating down and other chicks find out, I think it'll hurt your chances to attract an "upgrade"...

 

I crossed paths with my neighbor's wife recently and (again) I was repulsed. She is so off putting. Overweight, terrible tone of voice/demeanor, I have to wonder how he gets a hardon for someone who at barely 30 resembles a cafeteria server at a public school and I don't want a guy who wants that to touch me...ewww. I mean she won't even put on some nice make-up and stuff and she's just gross. She sounds and carries herself like bleh...Like that Rachel Dratch character on SNL with Jimmy Fallon, the gross Boston chick in an oversized jersey and they would be like all over each other :sick:

 

Sometimes I feel bad for him cuz his mom raised him to be scared of women and he probably jumped on her cuz he was lonely and she sorta has acute face, but part of me is turned off on him thinking so little of himself to lower himself to marry and make a kid with that. Chicks like her you hook-up with at closing time at a bar or something...not much to be proud of.

 

So, it's up to you to figure out what your goal is in dating down.

 

I only asked hypothetically, and was curious about this. I will not deny that I had led some girl on in the past because I was rather lonely and desperate, despite that I was not attracted to her. Of course, I learned the hard way that I was wrong for what I did because throughout the time the girl thought I really liked her. It was a bad thing that I did and I owned up to my error. However, the aforementioned girl in the OP was someone who I talked to on a friendly level and the mutual friend noted that the girl liked me, despite not getting vibes of it until maybe a day later. This all happened many years ago, by the way.

 

I am not sure if Jabron1's philosophy is valid. It seems like typical alpha male BS.

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I am not sure if Jabron1's philosophy is valid. It seems like typical alpha male BS.

 

It's good that you don't fall for that type of BS. Here is feedback from a women who felt she could have any man she wanted and was never dumped by a guy in her dating years.

 

Each interaction/attraction is individual. When you meet a guy that interests you, you don't think, "how many women has he been with in the past?" However, if he does act like a bumbling idiot that has no clue what to do, that would be a total turn off. And trust me, men with lots of experience can act like total idiots.

 

Attraction is in the eye of the beholder. Research shows that couples rate their partners higher on the attractive scale. Meaning when you like somebody, you find them more attractive. But also don't be fooled by silly Hollywood movies. Our eyes don't fly out of our sockets when we see somebody attractive or fall head-over-heels immediately. Actually, you can meet somebody that doesn't physically attract you at first, but you can develop those feelings over time. I have known many people who were friends for a long time before they became lovers. Originally, that sexual attraction wasn't there. But as their friendship developed, the romance and sex came with it.

 

Like another poster said, there is no barrel to aim for. You meet different people and you have your own preferences. Thinking that people are on a scale is very sophomoric. There is only scum you don't want to have anything to do with and humans that may or may not peek your interest.

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I think you should start learning how to see women as people, not objects! I know a guy who dated a woman he thought was not physically attractive but fun to spend time with. Then she dumped him. He has been grief-stricken ever since. He found out that how you feel with a person matters far more than scales of looks. We all look the same in the dark.

 

Uh, I don't have sex in the dark....maybe dim the lights a little, but the "visual" is a turn on for me.

 

To each their own, but why would I wanna date someone that the only way I can have sex with them is in the dark? :confused:

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You don't have to go to extremes. Here's where you aim: If there are any women who seem to make a point of talking to you or seem to put themselves by or in front of you, those are the ones you should be chatting up. A lot of guys make a huge mistake (especially in bars). They're all watching the same pair of hot girls in the room, no matter if they have a fly's chance in hell or not, and they're missing any girls who might be noticing them.

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I don't think getting involved with women you aren't attracted to will achieve much. You'll disappoint two people that way instead of just one.

 

 

LS's conventional wisdom in this area is rather schizophrenic: struggling guys are supposed to aim low to get dates but are villains if they pursue or go along with relationships with women they are not head-over-heels for. (For some reason, players are allowed to get away with the latter - I haven't figured out why.)

 

If you truly view a girl as "bottom of the barrel", I don't advise dating her, but I do advocate dating for practice. There's just too much stigma attached to guys who have too little experience. Find a girl who you think is at least kind of cute and who may be at least kind of cool and see what happens as you get to know her.

 

Well said!

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However, I am not sure if starting with an unattractive person is a smart thing to do as practice. Wouldn't that be leading someone on?

 

She may also be accepting a date with someone less attractive than she'd prefer. Are you ok with that?

 

 

I would advise not getting serious with someone you aren't attracted to, but a few dates is ok. Try a kiss. You may be surprised what attraction stirs. If not, gently tell her you don't feel a connection and move on and date someone else.

 

and now I have a Drake song in my head....

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JustGettingBy

Don't go 'bottom of the barrel', but be realistic. An average woman (as far as looks, finances) who you have compatibility and chemistry with and is your 'type could build into something serious, and as long as she's not toxic, could be the best thing that ever happened to you.

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You've gotta do what you've gotta do.

 

Yes, it works.

 

 

 

At some point or another, you'll realise that you come first in life. Until you do, you'll be screwed over.

 

 

 

When I started out in the dating scene, I listened to the guys that were experienced. And, it served me well.

 

There's something called 'social proof'. Women want a man that is wanted. When you get more experience, you'll realise that there is no such thing as 'leagues' for a man. If women are having sex with you, other women will want to have sex with you. Women are natural followers.

 

Momentum is everything for a man. You'll get one girl, then another, and another. If you don't give 'exclusivity' to the first girl that reciprocates your interest, you'll be shocked what you can achieve ;)

 

Oh, yeah...there are leagues. You are very wrong to think there aren't.

 

It always amuses me when men 10 years or more younger than I am message me on OLD. I have no doubt they think I'm only average looking and I will jump at the chance to be a cougar because they are so young and virile.

 

Yet, I'm out of their league. Maturity, education and income are qualifiers. A guy can be super handsome and have a ten inch penis, but if he's living with his parents, barely graduated high school and working a minimum wage job, he's not going to get sex from me - largely because I doubt his ability to give me an orgasm. He may be physically appealing, but if he doesn't have more going than that, there won't be a lot of chemistry or interest on my part.

 

OP, I'm not sure I know what your end game is. Do you just want casual sex with a lot of people? Do you want a girlfriend? Do you want a wife and partner.

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Date people you like and don't date people you don't like.

 

What's the point of seeking people you don't like and aren't attracted to, I don't understand the goal of that. That's like going to a restaurant and ordering and paying for stuff you don't want to eat...why?

 

I also find it odd when people date but only talk in terms of looks....how is that possible? I don't seek "the best looking" people to date. I seek people I like and am attracted to physically. They don't need to be the best looking people in all the world or based on other people's opinions, I just need to find them appealing. That's how I date.

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Date people you like and don't date people you don't like.

 

What's the point of seeking people you don't like and aren't attracted to, I don't understand the goal of that. That's like going to a restaurant and ordering and paying for stuff you don't want to eat...why?

 

I also find it odd when people date but only talk in terms of looks....how is that possible? I don't seek "the best looking" people to date. I seek people I like and am attracted to physically. They don't need to be the best looking people in all the world or based on other people's opinions, I just need to find them appealing. That's how I date.

 

Agreed...

 

Some guys I've been with, people are like "wow, he's handsome", and some were like "meh"...But all these guys "I" found were attractive to "me" and until all these people with opinions begin to pay my mortgage, then their opinion doesn't matter.

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Im 35 an never been on a date and I still can't date a women I'm not physically attracted to.. Id rather be alone the rest my life..

 

Doesn't mean I'm only attracted to so called hot women far from it I have a diverse taste.. But if a women turns me off physically I can't be attracted I would just be wasting both our times even going on a date.

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You most definitely shouldn't be practicing on people you aren't attracted to :confused: If you want to get experience, seek out "promiscuous" partners that are looking for sex instead of a relationship. Ask for screening results and get yourself screened too.

 

Practice doesn't need to result in broken hearts and STDs, and many seem to disregard that so make sure you mind it.

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todreaminblue

i think its cruel to categorize any person and or treat a person like a crash test dummy.......its not cool.....its just not right......you date when you are into the person...not into yourself with stepping stones...peoples hearts are not steps......deb

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I agree with what has been said here, because I did try practicing with a woman in the past. As stated before, a girl liked me, I was flattered, thought it was my ticket to get lucky. I was bitter and lonely and thought that any girl who liked me, I would likely return the favor. It didn't turn out that way and I learned the hard way. Of course, this was not as bad as the girl who I led on sometime after that.

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I wouldn't say date from the bottom but you need a start. Women like men other women see as attractive. You need a woman that validates that so other women see it. You ever watch Buffy the Vampire Slayer TV show. Xander was a geek and when he hung around Buffy he got to date Cordelia the cheerleader. Buffy validated him and made him seen as dateable. It doesn't mean you have to go to the bottom but as a former person that struggled it takes a start. Once the ball gets rolling you become more confident and attract more women. Another way to look at it is you need your perverbial Jericho.

 

As a man its hard to get off the bench and in the game.

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