OpenBook Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Warning: This IS a gender-related thread, as I have not experienced this happening with women. Only with men. What part of "No" do they not understand???? It seems politely turning down a man sometimes has the opposite effect of invigorating him to redouble his efforts at winning me over. HE WILL NOT LEAVE ME ALONE until I get really nasty with him and/or threaten law enforcement on him... or offer to introduce him to my imaginary husband/ brother/ neighbor ("His friends call him Big John"). I am currently experiencing this in the professional arena, but it's also happened often enough in the romantic realm for me to wonder WHAT IS IT ABOUT "NO" THAT TURNS SOME GUYS ON SO MUCH??? It's almost insulting that you would assume I'd be so weak-minded that I would change my mind so easily after a little pressure from you. But that would be illogical. Why would you insult the object of your relentless pursuit when you're trying to catch them?? Is this related to testosterone? Can anyone shed any light on this phenomenon? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Is this related to testosterone? Can anyone shed any light on this phenomenon? IMO, it's a combination of genetic psychology and socialization, all of which is individual, reinforced by social interaction over time. In general, testosterone levels can affect aggressiveness in males but those 'feelings' are processed at the psychological level to result in behaviors. If a woman is fortunate enough to only see the romantic side of 'assertive' behavior, IMO she should consider herself truly fortunate. The aggressive and violent side of that process is what fellow men experience. The women who have experienced violent relationships unfortunately are exposed to something they should be spared. Those men never learned, or ignored, healthy filters/controls. Document and avoid is my advice; self-defense/firearms training equalizes the rest. If encountering a man who demonstrates poor boundaries of behavior, don't second guess or give benefit of the doubt; treat them as an exigent threat. They may not be one, but err on the side of safety. On the other side of the coin, positively validate those men who do act appropriately and take 'no' as an answer. This reinforces healthy behavior. At minimum, I always say 'thank you' or 'I appreciate that' when a man respects my communicated boundaries. Link to post Share on other sites
Crusoe Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 I've known a couple of fella's like this, both very narcissitic, argumentative and competitive. In all aspects of life, they push and push and push, have to win, have to gain something, have to conquer. Even if it's just a small concession from the other person. They simply cannot walk away with nothing. For what it's worth, I once had trouble from a woman acting the same way. She took a shine and wouldn't stop. I could say nothing but "no" to her ten times in a row but she would still keep pushing. Again, she had a very narcisstic, entitled and somewhat spiteful personality. I suspect these people had parents that always caved in under pressure. "Me want wollipop! Me want wollipop! Me want wollipop!" until they got the friggin lollipop. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
KathyM Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Unfortunately, a lot of men consider no to mean maybe, and so they continue to pressure (for the date, for sex, for whatever), hoping that you will change your mind. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author OpenBook Posted January 28, 2013 Author Share Posted January 28, 2013 The aggressive and violent side of that process If encountering a man who demonstrates poor boundaries of behavior, don't second guess or give benefit of the doubt; treat them as an exigent threat. I've known a couple of fella's like this, both very narcissitic, argumentative and competitive. Again, she had a very narcisstic, entitled and somewhat spiteful personality. Whoa that is creepy. Duly noted. Now I don't feel so... inhumane in my repulsion of this kind of behavior. Reassuring to know that "fellow males of the species" also view it as a big red flag. Thanks for the reinforcement. I knew something was off. Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 WHAT IS IT ABOUT "NO" THAT TURNS SOME GUYS ON SO MUCH??? I can hear ya on that. Some men have HUGE egos and truly believe they are gods gift! They think that no woman would reject them or not desire them. Over confident, cocky and know it all. Yuck! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
todreaminblue Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 I dont know open book, I do know it gets a bit scary sometimes, and it is like they don't understand that it isn tgoign to happen, the more you say no th emore suggestive they get, have had it happen, so i dated another guy who wasn't so aggressively chasing me, ended up in a relationship with him for three years, I dotn like aggression in the chase or in a relationship....i think it is a challenge thing,competition, it isnt because i am all that....or that they are super attracted to me..could be i am easy to talk to, bit of a soft touch, that would be a nicer option......unless of course they see me as a soft touch and want to get further than my front door and first base steal second and third.....its a nah piss off.......deb Link to post Share on other sites
gaius Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Some men have HUGE egos and truly believe they are gods gift! They think that no woman would reject them or not desire them. Over confident, cocky and know it all. Yuck! Works more often than not, especially on women who say yuck at first. Open, I know more than a few relationships that have started with the woman being hesitant and the guy pursuing like crazy. I'm in one right now. It's not because you think the girl is weak minded, there are just a lot of women who are turned on by a guy who isn't easily swayed or influenced when he wants something. That are looking for someone who meets the solid male role in a partner. Large and in charge. The guy you're dealing with, his tactics have worked before so he's using them again. Simple as that really. Link to post Share on other sites
Author OpenBook Posted January 29, 2013 Author Share Posted January 29, 2013 there are just a lot of women who are turned on by a guy who isn't easily swayed or influenced when he wants something. That are looking for someone who meets the solid male role in a partner. Large and in charge. And dense? I don't want a dense, angry guy on my hands. I'm fresh out of wollipops. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author OpenBook Posted January 29, 2013 Author Share Posted January 29, 2013 Works more often than not, especially on women who say yuck at first. Open, I know more than a few relationships that have started with the woman being hesitant and the guy pursuing like crazy. I'm in one right now. It's not because you think the girl is weak minded, there are just a lot of women who are turned on by a guy who isn't easily swayed or influenced when he wants something. That are looking for someone who meets the solid male role in a partner. Large and in charge. The guy you're dealing with, his tactics have worked before so he's using them again. Simple as that really. I get what you're saying, gaius. It can be a delicious scenario to woo a hesitant woman, and some guys have it down to an art form. Others however are buffoons. Scary buffoons. A firm "No" just bounces off them like Teflon. They're like a tidal wave coming at you. I don't envy you guys at all, that must be so confusing to figure out when to push and when to back off. You don't want to frighten the lady. (Or do you??) Link to post Share on other sites
chex Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 I get what you're saying, gaius. It can be a delicious scenario to woo a hesitant woman, and some guys have it down to an art form. Others however are buffoons. Scary buffoons. A firm "No" just bounces off them like Teflon. They're like a tidal wave coming at you. I don't envy you guys at all, that must be so confusing to figure out when to push and when to back off. You don't want to frighten the lady. (Or do you??) Huh, I'm thinking maybe if you say yes fast enough they'll back off. Link to post Share on other sites
Author OpenBook Posted January 29, 2013 Author Share Posted January 29, 2013 And ladies (wwiup, Kathy, deb) I'm not ignoring your posts. Your insights are the same as mine. I guess I'm just picking the male brain here a little in this thread. They've always been a baffling mystery to me. Sigh. Link to post Share on other sites
Author OpenBook Posted January 29, 2013 Author Share Posted January 29, 2013 Huh, I'm thinking maybe if you say yes fast enough they'll back off. Haha you may just be onto something there chex! Link to post Share on other sites
Eternal Sunshine Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 OMG I was going to start a thread on this. I feel really insulted because those men have ZERO respect for my wants and decisions and it's all about what THEY want This guy that I had casual conversations as friends decided that he is romantically interested and told me so. I never had any interest in him and rejected him clearly "I was never romantically interested and don't feel the same." This seemed to turn him on SO much that he started a mad pursuit for the last couple of months. Flowers, long e-mails every day, making a youtube channel of love songs dedicated to me. I ignored all contact because I thought I was clear in my rejection and nothing else needs to be said. He contacted guys that liked my pictures on Facebook and asked them if they are my boyfriends (they were creeped out). I finally blocked him on Facebook and he just made another Facebook account and tried to add me on there and sent me messages from that account I was forced to be really harsh yesterday. I finally told him "If you don't STOP contacting me now, I will get a restraining order." He responded: "You are really playing hard to get :)" I am actually going to follow through with my threat :mad: Link to post Share on other sites
Author OpenBook Posted January 29, 2013 Author Share Posted January 29, 2013 Whoa ES, that is psychopath creepy! Link to post Share on other sites
Author OpenBook Posted January 29, 2013 Author Share Posted January 29, 2013 I realize it's possible for women to act-out like that, but I personally have never known (or seen) any women who do. So I can't speak to that. I've seen women who refuse to let go of a long-term relationship, yeah... but that's not what I'm talking about here. I'm talking about launching a new relationship. I just don't get it. How does one go through life thinking it's OK to force & pressure people into relationships with you?? Link to post Share on other sites
Author OpenBook Posted January 29, 2013 Author Share Posted January 29, 2013 I feel really insulted because those men have ZERO respect for my wants and decisions and it's all about what THEY want That's it, exactly! I get the sense that they're projecting something onto me... it has nothing to do with who I actually AM. It's all about the projected... whatever. Link to post Share on other sites
venusianx13 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Some men get really turned on by the challenge. Additionally, I think they are so infatuated by the fantasy of "what could be" that they simply cannot easily disconnect from it. It's partially psychological, partially chemical. It may be true for some that using reverse psychology may ward these guys off, but then again, that approach may backfire... Personally, I am too nice...I have a hard time with anything that might potentially hurt anyone's feelings. <<definitely not helpful in these situations. Link to post Share on other sites
Mint Sauce Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 I'm surprised nobody has hitherto dared to utter the so un-PC words: "if a woman says no, she means yes". At the risk of getting flamed, it appears that sometimes this is the case. Best example: my ex-wife, during the divorce process/counselling, saying that I shouldn't have accepted her "NOs" so easily, that I should have pushed further... So obviously, her NOs did not exactly mean YES, but I shouldn't have just accepted them as NO. Anecdotal evidence, I know, but it does prove there is some slack in the word "NO". And I do believe that idea lives among many men. It's even portrayed in romantic movies, where persistence is key: he is rejected many times, but with perseverance she falls for him. Link to post Share on other sites
Babolat Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 A little off topic, but how do woman handle this in a bar\club\party when they are out with friends and in a relationship and the SO is not present? If you have a friendly conversation with the guy and he interprets it the wrong way, asks for your phone # or makes an advance on you, how do you handle it? What if he does not "hear" you and continues? Thanks Link to post Share on other sites
Author OpenBook Posted January 29, 2013 Author Share Posted January 29, 2013 Personally, I am too nice...I have a hard time with anything that might potentially hurt anyone's feelings. <<definitely not helpful in these situations. I heard that!! I feel like I'm being punished for being nice & polite to this pushy guy I'm dealing with right now. One thing I DO admire about men is they have no qualms about turning Tough & Mean on a DIME when they feel the situation warrants it. They don't stop to think about social etiquette/"Shouldn't I be nicer about this?" like so many of us women do. They just do it. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author OpenBook Posted January 29, 2013 Author Share Posted January 29, 2013 I'm surprised nobody has hitherto dared to utter the so un-PC words: "if a woman says no, she means yes"... Best example: my ex-wife, during the divorce process/counselling, saying that I shouldn't have accepted her "NOs" so easily, that I should have pushed further... there is some slack in the word "NO". Point acknowledged. Maybe we're our own worst enemies. Link to post Share on other sites
TouchedByViolet Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 I think a little of it is cultural. In the movies the guy has to get rejected a few times before the girl finally gives in. Maybe they think it is like that in real life? Either way, just have your own healthy boundaries and don't let it bother you. If you are consistently attracting guys like this maybe it says something about you? I have seen women become very spiteful. Some women do not take rejection very well either. Link to post Share on other sites
venusianx13 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 A little off topic, but how do woman handle this in a bar\club\party when they are out with friends and in a relationship and the SO is not present? If you have a friendly conversation with the guy and he interprets it the wrong way, asks for your phone # or makes an advance on you, how do you handle it? What if he does not "hear" you and continues? Thanks I'm always nice, but I'm immediately up front that I have a SO. There are times when I've had to walk away quite deliberately. I tried getting lost in the crowd once at a club, but this guy kept making his way over to me. I eventually got tired of it and asked a bouncer to walk me to my car (it was late, anyway, and I'd had enough). Link to post Share on other sites
Els Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 I've known a couple of fella's like this, both very narcissitic, argumentative and competitive. In all aspects of life, they push and push and push, have to win, have to gain something, have to conquer. Even if it's just a small concession from the other person. They simply cannot walk away with nothing. For what it's worth, I once had trouble from a woman acting the same way. She took a shine and wouldn't stop. I could say nothing but "no" to her ten times in a row but she would still keep pushing. Again, she had a very narcisstic, entitled and somewhat spiteful personality. I suspect these people had parents that always caved in under pressure. "Me want wollipop! Me want wollipop! Me want wollipop!" until they got the friggin lollipop. This. I'm betting on the narcissistic bit. They absolutely cannot believe that someone could possibly be uninterested in THEM, so they just assume that she's playing coy. Either that or they were fed some nonsense as a kid about how 'persistence wins women over' and weren't told exactly what sort of persistence worked. Link to post Share on other sites
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