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My Brother's Wife is a Serial Cheater


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Old 19th July 2017, 12:19 AM   #31
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Sorry but I have to agree with Elaine. Sometimes it takes people a bit of time to process things so when you first told your brother you would rather his wife not come he may have seemed okay with it but after giving it some thought realized he didn't think it was right to go somewhere where his wife isn't welcome.

And I agree that adding in that she could come if your brother really wanted her to, meant nothing. If someone invited me somewhere, saying they would rather I not bring my partner but then added they would tolerate my partner coming if they really had to, I would consider my partner unwelcome and I would not bring my partner, nor would I attend myself.

I'm not saying you're wrong in how you feel, but you have to decide what is more important to you. If maintaining a relationship with your brother is important to you than you pretty much have to accept his wife. If you can't accept his wife then you pretty much have to accept that your brother won't be attending events at your house.

There have been a couple of people who have been brought into my family through marriage who I didn't like and who I don't or didn't consider good people. One of them caused a lot of problems and pain. I accept that I can't choose my spouses for my family and I accept that they cannot put my feelings or wishes above my spouse. This woman isn't just your brother's wife, she is the mother of his children. If she is going to be excluded from family gatherings it's understandable that her husband and children will choose her over you, regardless of how awful and evil you believe her to be.
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Old 19th July 2017, 8:07 AM   #32
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Denison...I can see your hurt and disdain for your SIL....this is fully understandable. I also see that you're not wholly religous however something from the Bible might paint an interesting and self reflecting image for your...Let he that is without sin, cast the first stone...ironically this is referring to a woman caught in an adulterous way, about to be stoned for her sin by the towns "Elders". They all backed off and left her alone.

I am not preaching to you, I only want you to know that what your SIL has done is between her and your Brother and her and your parents. From what i have read, the actual impact to you is disdain and disapproval on your part and in essence judgement. You know only what you know and not what may be the full story...not justifying anything but you are judging, not your job.

You asked your brother to chose between your family and his....IMO, he made the decision that a man should have made (BTW, you're making excuses for him i.e. laziness). He, his wife and children (all that she is) is his family and if he had chosen you over that, there would have been greater ramifications.

You're looking at this from your POV not his. He needed to and had every right to make the decision he did. I'll bet that had you expressed your angst about what she did but extended the invite to her, they would have been there. This is telling in that he was unwilling to split his family for a birthday party on your terms.

Now, you get to chose, do you want your Brother and his family or not....he has communicated to your the terms, it is now your choice.
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Old 19th July 2017, 8:51 AM   #33
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I understand and appreciate all of your responses...and as to the "he who is free from sin shall cast the first stone," I agree. For me to sit here in judgment and make her wear a Scarlet Letter indefinitely might seem totally unfair, especially given the potential repercussions (effect on my relationship with my brother and nephews, etc.) But I can't stress enough the history of what this woman has done. If this was a simple matter of infidelity (albeit repeated, reckless and frankly dangerous infidelity when you factor in the potential of spreading STDs to my unknowing brother), that would be one thing. If someone cheats, even in abhorrent and repeated ways, it's up to the couple how they move forward. I just want to be clear (not that it will change any of your minds), that this is far from simple adultery. I honestly think that if she was otherwise a tolerable person, I would let my brother's wishes lead the way.

By way of background, she has been milking my parents for money for about a decade, not to mention their hard earned free time. Yes, I get it, that's my parent's choice, and I've long since given up on trying to get them to say "no" once in a while. But what is now clear, given her recent actions, is that she's simultaneously reaping the benefits of being in my family, without accepting any of the responsibilities of being a mother, wife, daughter-in-law, etc...i.e., don't sleep with strange men in your marital bed while your husband is out working and your in-laws are watching your children. Also, while pregnant with their first daughter (about 7 months pregnant, in fact), she was caught by my brother on a "fetish" website arranging to meet up with someone who had a sexual fantasy to have sex with a very pregnant woman. There are many other similar incidents like this before the "big revelation" from a few months ago.

So, you can all tell me how unfair I'm being, how I'm sitting in judgment when it's none of my business, I'm the one who has sacrificed my relationship with my brother for my own pride, etc. But what I'm NOT hearing from any of you are what HER responsibilities are. She has not ONCE reached out to any of my other siblings, or me, and simply said, "I know I screwed up. I'm working hard to make amends and to be a better person. I know you might need time and space, but I'd like us to move on from this." Or something to that effect. I have NEVER said anything to her directly, and the one or two times I have seen her since, I was cordial, if a bit distant, and absolutely not nasty or dramatic. The ONLY decision I've made is to finally draw a line in the sand after a decade of unsafe, unsavory, and now flat out betraying behavior, and not (at this time), let her into my home.

In sum, there's a difference between casting judgment on others, and finally reaching a point where you say, "enough is enough" and making someone feel the repercussions of their poor and reckless decisions. At some point, it crosses the line from being loving, flexible and forgiving in to flat out enabling. After 10+ years of bending over backwards to make this woman comfortable and not "rock the boat," I'm done. I'M not the wrong doer, and I refuse to be treated like one.
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Old 19th July 2017, 9:15 AM   #34
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I guess my question is...do any of you have a line in the sand with siblings, in-laws, etc? Is there no behavior where you throw out your "move on and accept her" and "it's none of your business" advice, and say, "OK, it's time I cut this person out of my life for the time being", regardless of the temporary repercussions? I mean, what would it take for any of you to decide that you've spent enough time and energy accepting a reckless, immoral person, and just cutting ties? Drug use? Criminal behavior? Actual physical or emotional harm to your children caused by that person's reckless behavior?
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Old 19th July 2017, 9:17 AM   #35
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Maybe he didn't come because he's too ashamed.
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I will not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. I will face my fear. I will let it pass through me. Where the fear has gone, there shall be nothing. Only I will remain." - Litany Against Fear
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Old 19th July 2017, 9:21 AM   #36
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I guess my question is...do any of you have a line in the sand with siblings, in-laws, etc? Is there no behavior where you throw out your "move on and accept her" and "it's none of your business" advice, and say, "OK, it's time I cut this person out of my life for the time being", regardless of the temporary repercussions? I mean, what would it take for any of you to decide that you've spent enough time and energy accepting a reckless, immoral person, and just cutting ties? Drug use? Criminal behavior? Actual physical or emotional harm to your children caused by that person's reckless behavior?
My siblings have much drama. My brother is a serial cheat who has 3 kids with a woman who is also a serial cheat. My sister is a manipulative drama queen who has 6 mini-drama queen teenagers who stir the pot to amuse themselves. I don't speak to either sibling but maybe once or twice a year.

It's gloriously drama free and I love it.
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Old 19th July 2017, 9:36 AM   #37
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I've been angry at sister-in-laws for various reasons. For years in one case. My brothers are still married to the same women. All I did was waste unnecessary time and emotion for 20 years.

You sister-in-law cheated on her husband. Not you and your other brother. It's not your place to hold her accountable because she's not married to you. Or your parents.

Your parents are older and wiser. Apparently having seen this before in other situations. They know her infidelity is not about them.

You and your brother need to wake up and do the same. Mind your own relationships and let all of that other stuff that you don't control go.
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Old 19th July 2017, 10:55 AM   #38
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We all get that she is a very bad person with little to no morals. You have every right to feel as you do. You also have every right to choose whom you will invite to parties and whom you will allow into your house. Your brother has every right to his feelings and he has every right to choose not to attend gatherings where his spouse isn't welcome. This isn't about being right or being wrong. It's about making decisions and accepting the outcome of those decisions. By essentially telling your brother that his spouse is not welcome the logical outcome is that your brother chose his family over you. You seem to be having a hard time accepting the results of your decision. You're not wrong in how you feel but your brother isn't wrong either. It just is what it is.

I have a younger brother whom I haven't seen or spoken to in the last 7yrs. There is something wrong with him, he most likely has a personality disorder or mental illness of some sort. He is selfish, entitled, uses people, lacks empathy, and he has a nasty temper. I only ever tolerated him for the sake of my mom. Since my mom went into assisted living and my other brother took over her finances and bill paying, my younger brother could no longer use her for money and a rent free place so nobody has seen him, not even my mother. That's what disgusts me the most. My mom spent years letting him use and abuse her always believing that deep down inside he loved her and just needed someone to show him unconditional love but the second he could no longer milk her for a free ride he completely washed his hands of her. I'm fine not seeing him. On occasion I feel guilt but then I remember that my little brother does not care about anyone, he doesn't form emotional attachments or feel hurt like normal people. He has no love in his heart for anyone in our family so my feeling guilty for being relieved that he is out of my life forever is pointless.

Now my other brother, I love him to the moon and back. I would not let anyone drive a wedge between us. If he married the biggest sex addict on the planet I would still welcome her into my house and treat her kindly for the sake of keeping my brother and his kids close to me.

Last edited by LoveShack.org Moderator; 23rd July 2017 at 7:44 AM.. Reason: language~T
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Old 19th July 2017, 12:11 PM   #39
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Actually, my family is full of similiar drama...between one brother sleeping with another brother's wife, prison for another for drug sales, to multiple suicides, yes actually.

i have all but removed most of my family from my life however, I have accepted that their spouses may and in my mind, have loyalty to them. I expect my wife to stick by me until we are no longer man and wife....it appears that is what your brother has also done. You drew the line, he simply did not cross it to join you. He has stayed on the side with his WW....that is his right.

I fully understand what you're saying and you're having trouble both accepting and comprehending the decision. Albeit, it appears your choice is to either suck it up and accept them as a unit or be prepared to live with either of them in your life.

Sorry but it is that way sometimes....
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Old 19th July 2017, 4:02 PM   #40
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Honestly, if I had a SIL like that it would be in her best interest NOT to be in the same place as me. I don't think I could tolerate her either. So my comment is not about whether you are right to be disgusted about her. Honestly, I think it would be abnormal NOT to be disgusted by her behavior and angry on your brother's behalf.

Here's the thing, for whatever reason (that like you, I cannot readily fathom) your brother has chosen to stay. Maybe it's because of the kids. maybe he hopes to fix her. Maybe she has threatened to fight for full custody if he files. maybe she has worn his self-esteem down to the point he feels powerless.

But I can suggest one thing with almost absolute certainty: he feels terrible shame. He is ashamed of HER for being a cheater. He is ashamed that his family is not the picture of a perfect family. And most of all he feels shame that he has not been "man enough" (whatever that means) to kick her to the curb. He probably doesn't talk about it for the same reason abused spouses don't talk about the bruises.

So even though it sounds irrational to US, when you told him she wasn't welcome, he HEARD an unspoken "I can't believe you are with her you weak coward." You didn't say that. But he heard it. Disappointment and rejection. And more shame.

That is probably why he didn't come to the party. That and the fact that people might ask where she was. And even if he made up an excuse he would worry that they KNEW.

So I would encourage you not to think of this as okaying HER. Think of it as loving HIM...the way a brother is supposed to.
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Old 19th July 2017, 4:09 PM   #41
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Honestly, if I had a SIL like that it would be in her best interest NOT to be in the same place as me. I don't think I could tolerate her either. So my comment is not about whether you are right to be disgusted about her. Honestly, I think it would be abnormal NOT to be disgusted by her behavior and angry on your brother's behalf.

Here's the thing, for whatever reason (that like you, I cannot readily fathom) your brother has chosen to stay. Maybe it's because of the kids. maybe he hopes to fix her. Maybe she has threatened to fight for full custody if he files. maybe she has worn his self-esteem down to the point he feels powerless.

But I can suggest one thing with almost absolute certainty: he feels terrible shame. He is ashamed of HER for being a cheater. He is ashamed that his family is not the picture of a perfect family. And most of all he feels shame that he has not been "man enough" (whatever that means) to kick her to the curb. He probably doesn't talk about it for the same reason abused spouses don't talk about the bruises.

So even though it sounds irrational to US, when you told him she wasn't welcome, he HEARD an unspoken "I can't believe you are with her you weak coward." You didn't say that. But he heard it. Disappointment and rejection. And more shame.

That is probably why he didn't come to the party. That and the fact that people might ask where she was. And even if he made up an excuse he would worry that they KNEW.

So I would encourage you not to think of this as okaying HER. Think of it as loving HIM...the way a brother is supposed to.


This is the key in my mind right here....if he divorces her, she then will be exposing the kiddos to every Tom, Di@K and Harry she meets....this is an absolutely great reason for him sticking closely to the family. Additionally, any time he is not with her, he doesn't know who is....

Also, maybe try to love him more that you hate her?????
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Last edited by kgcolonel; 19th July 2017 at 4:10 PM.. Reason: adding key input
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Old 19th July 2017, 4:20 PM   #42
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Again, thanks to everyone for their responses, even those who have been rather harsh. Clearly, as you can all presumably tell, this whole situation has upset me. I'm not a perfect person, by any stretch of the imagination, and if I made a bad mistake, I'd hope that others would have forgiveness for my behavior. But I do have my limits, and I personally think that I'd cross the line from being a forgiving and loving brother-in-law to an enabler if I followed the lead of my brother and parents and pretended nothing happened (which is, at this point, how they're all behaving). It will never stop upsetting me that they both (and it's my brother as well, I'll be clear on that) take advantage of my parents financially and otherwise, and that she appears to have convinced at least some of my family members that what happened was no biggie. I'm not there yet, and if not wanting her around me or my kids right now means I don't get to see my brother or his kids, then that's how it has to be right now.

As I've explained earlier, I'm not judging my brother or my parents for their decision to let her back into their lives so easily, and have long since stopped trying to even discuss the situation with them. Regardless of why my brother decided not to show up without any warning (I honestly don't think it was anything other than pure laziness), I just want them to respect my decision to NOT let her back in my life right now. If that means when I visit my parents, or other siblings, I don't even bother reaching out to my brother anymore, fine. If a serial manipulator and cheater is so easily forgiven and accepted, I'd think that my stubbornness and pride on this issue can also be accepted.
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Old 20th July 2017, 9:35 AM   #43
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It will never stop upsetting me that they both (and it's my brother as well, I'll be clear on that) take advantage of my parents financially and otherwise
Somehow I missed this. Yeah, if your brother is taking part in hurting your parents, that puts a different spin on things
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Old 22nd July 2017, 12:32 PM   #44
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Again, thanks to everyone for their responses, even those who have been rather harsh. Clearly, as you can all presumably tell, this whole situation has upset me. I'm not a perfect person, by any stretch of the imagination, and if I made a bad mistake, I'd hope that others would have forgiveness for my behavior. But I do have my limits, and I personally think that I'd cross the line from being a forgiving and loving brother-in-law to an enabler if I followed the lead of my brother and parents and pretended nothing happened (which is, at this point, how they're all behaving). It will never stop upsetting me that they both (and it's my brother as well, I'll be clear on that) take advantage of my parents financially and otherwise, and that she appears to have convinced at least some of my family members that what happened was no biggie. I'm not there yet, and if not wanting her around me or my kids right now means I don't get to see my brother or his kids, then that's how it has to be right now.

As I've explained earlier, I'm not judging my brother or my parents for their decision to let her back into their lives so easily, and have long since stopped trying to even discuss the situation with them. Regardless of why my brother decided not to show up without any warning (I honestly don't think it was anything other than pure laziness), I just want them to respect my decision to NOT let her back in my life right now. If that means when I visit my parents, or other siblings, I don't even bother reaching out to my brother anymore, fine. If a serial manipulator and cheater is so easily forgiven and accepted, I'd think that my stubbornness and pride on this issue can also be accepted.
You have every right not to want her around but every action has a reaction. Her actions caused you not to want her around & now your action may cause your brother not to want to be around.

Family issues are give & take. You set your boundaries, which are fine but you can't be upset if your brother chooses his wife, no matter how awful she may be...if he forgave her for all of what she has done, why would you think he won't back her when it comes to you?

Just remember, when we spend so much on what we don't like, we tend to only hurt ourselves. You're completely justified but now your dislike for things she hasn't done to you is effecting going to start effecting your kid's & brother's relationship & that will be a difficult thing to explain one day. "I don't like your aunt for things that she's done to others, yet they have forgiven her & I have not"...what is the lesson here? At the end of the day, it really is you putting your nose into other adult's life. I hate my sister Inlaw bc she mistreated my son & my whole family has now turned on her & my brother & her are divorcing. Personally everything else she did, I just stayed out of it bc it really isn't any of my business, even though I didn't like her.

Sometimes certain sins aren't ours to forgive or be a part of...she may not be a good person but you have to learn too, that others adult decisions have nothing to do with you, even if it's your family.

Every situation in life is a teachable moment, what's your goal & lesson here? What have you learned from this whole situation, does it make you feel good that you're making you family pick sides over things that really aren't your concern? Actions speak louder than words, you say you're not judging your brother & parents but your actions are saying different.

It's fine you're being judgmental but don't pretend you're not. Good luck
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Old 24th July 2017, 1:15 PM   #45
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You have every right not to want her around but every action has a reaction. Her actions caused you not to want her around & now your action may cause your brother not to want to be around.

Family issues are give & take. You set your boundaries, which are fine but you can't be upset if your brother chooses his wife, no matter how awful she may be...if he forgave her for all of what she has done, why would you think he won't back her when it comes to you?

Just remember, when we spend so much on what we don't like, we tend to only hurt ourselves. You're completely justified but now your dislike for things she hasn't done to you is effecting going to start effecting your kid's & brother's relationship & that will be a difficult thing to explain one day. "I don't like your aunt for things that she's done to others, yet they have forgiven her & I have not"...what is the lesson here? At the end of the day, it really is you putting your nose into other adult's life. I hate my sister Inlaw bc she mistreated my son & my whole family has now turned on her & my brother & her are divorcing. Personally everything else she did, I just stayed out of it bc it really isn't any of my business, even though I didn't like her.

Sometimes certain sins aren't ours to forgive or be a part of...she may not be a good person but you have to learn too, that others adult decisions have nothing to do with you, even if it's your family.

Every situation in life is a teachable moment, what's your goal & lesson here? What have you learned from this whole situation, does it make you feel good that you're making you family pick sides over things that really aren't your concern? Actions speak louder than words, you say you're not judging your brother & parents but your actions are saying different.

It's fine you're being judgmental but don't pretend you're not. Good luck
Thanks for posting. Don't get me wrong, I'm fully cognizant of the fact that, in a sense, I'm "judging" her...but I'm not judging her out of an inflated sense of morality or (to put it biblically), as if I am "free from sin" while I'm throwing stones. I'm using her past negative behavior (of which the cheating is only a portion, albeit a big portion) to predict what her future behavior will be. And right now, that type of person is not someone I want to be around, nor someone I trust. It might sound dramatic, but someone with such poor self control and risk taking tendencies is not someone I want around myself, and most definitely not around my children. So sure, I'm judging her. But it's not just for the sake of judgment. Regardless, I've accepted that my decision to (for the time being) not want to be around her has consequences.

However, I don't see this as judging my brother or my parents, at all. Sure, I feel a bit like I'm taking crazy pills when I see how they forgave her so quickly, but that's their business. I have the benefit, and frankly the luxury, of being an outsider and not being so personally involved, i.e. being married to her, or supporting her and her kids financially. I haven't tried to convince them to change their mind about her, and I don't even talk to them about it. Would I love to tell my brother that I think he's making a horrible decision and that I think it's going to happen again? Sure, but who the Hell am I to tell him that, or to make such predictions? So I don't. Virtually the only thing I can control is the relationship I have with her at any given point in time. In all honesty, I'm sure I'll move on from this and stop being so stubborn, but hey, I'm only human.
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