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My story in a nutshell was that my wife left me in August because I was "not there emotionally for her." She wanted to initially separate and that led to her coming forth with feelings for a mutual friend of ours and began to date him. I lost my mind. She asked for a divorce, but never did anything to actively pursue this wish. I finally asked for papers to be signed, and she agreed. Until the next day when she asked if we could try to be friends to see where things might go. And still date other people. I was weak and agreed. That was 3 weeks ago.

 

I am going to be out of the country for 2-3 months, but came back for T-giving. During the first 2 weeks I was gone, we emailed regularly, and she actually got jealous, and we actually were able to communicate and tell each other how we felt for the first time in a long time. Things seemed to be going well, but I still didn't like the situation. We met for lunch today. We talked about us, and she basically told me that she didn't know if she would ever be able to trust me again (the person who is dating someone else while we are married is telling me this). I told her I did not see this going anywhere, even though my biggest fear would be to lose her for good. I then told her that I needed to end this for my own well being. She agreed, and told me that she has never been happier, and that she couldn't jump back into a relationship with me. Then she gave me a mix-CD that she made and labeled it herself, and the title translates from German into "necessary distraction." I buess I finally decided I don't just want to be a distraction anymore. Hurts like hell, but who needs someone who would treat them with such a lack of disrespect. Now the question is...will she get scared like she did before, now that I'm no longer the pursuer?

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Zetter - what was the basis of her saying that she couldn't trust you? That does seem a strange statement from someone who wanted to date while still married...

 

I don't know what she might do, but I do know that you will start to feel better once you start to exercise some control and strength. Instead of living in fearful anticipation of what might happen to you, you can start to live in enthusiastic anticipation of the future you are going to build for yourself. This is an attitude shift that made a huge difference in my outlook.

 

I finally asked for papers to be signed, and she agreed. Until the next day when she asked if we could try to be friends to see where things might go. And still date other people. I was weak and agreed.

 

See, it seems to me like you showed some power and control for yourself (a good thing, and probably scary, but how did it make you feel?), and it kind of freaked her out a little bit, then she sucked you back in, on her terms again (ohhh, a bad thing, and how did that make you feel?)

 

I'm sorry, Zetter - I'm trying to think of a tactful way to say this, but I can't sugar coat it... Let's pretend we're a couple of good old friends working out in the gym or something, and we can be blunt with each other. I think she's walking all over you, man, and you don't have to - you shouldn't - stand for it... If she wants to date, she should get a divorce.

 

Show some control and some personal power: tell her if she has any hope for your marriage, no dating. If she insists on dating that tells you what you need to know about her commitment to the marriage, and there's no reason to hold off getting that paperwork moving.

 

And maybe after that blunt advice, you wouldn't want me as a friend to work out with in the gym any more ;) . I usually bend over backwards to try to see all sides of a discussion, but I just can't see "Let's stay married, but I want to date other people". You deserve more respect than that...

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You know, I have to apologize, I got so wrapped up in my indignation that I don't think I really answered your question:

 

Now the question is...will she get scared like she did before, now that I'm no longer the pursuer?

 

Heck, she may well, but the question is how will you feel? If you've gotten to the point where you are fed up with her lack of respect, then you need to do this. If she turns out to be indifferent, then that shows you that she wasn't invested in the marriage any more anyway. On the other hand, if she gets freaked out again, it seems like she is just playing games with you, having her cake and eating it too, etc... The games need to end. This is serious stuff here...

 

Again, I say, take control over your life, and start deciding what you are going to do with it next... The feeling of control over your destiny will gradually replace the fear of being without her, and it will make you strong.

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Without knowing why she cant trust you, we dont really know the real issues why you two broke up. But Trimmer said it nicely. Try and gain some of your control back.

 

I wont answer your specific question because your post is mixed with acceptance and denial. (Which is perfectly normal. Everyone flip flops between all 5 stages of grief, even within seconds). Part of you wants to throw in the towel, but the other is still hoping if you do THAT, she'll come back to you. She may or may not come back, but you know what you have to do to keep your self respect. You cant continue wooing and chasing her. You cant continue begging and pleading for her to come back. The only logical choice is to go on with your own life, focus on yourself, get your self esteem back (which we all lose when our spouses leave and cheat on us). The more energy you focus on yourself, the less pressure she will feel, and hopefully the less pressure she'll feel will help her to really think about the situation. She cannot think about her actions if she constantly feels pressure from you to change her actions. She's just going to act defiantly. But if you start focusing on yourself, you'll gain your control back, feel better about doing it, and maybe by that time you wont even care if she comes back or not.

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Thanks guys. I appreciate the honesty, and would go to the gym with you anytime Trimmer. She doesn't trust me because she feels that I was careless with her heart. Examples include teasing her (very gently) in public, and I stopped that. Not putting her first (she is severely delusional on this point). Not telling her the full truth (she had extreme anger issues, and it made me leave out parts of my feelings to avoide conflict). Not being a "team" - she felt I was controlling. This issue was one of perception - she filed for bankruptcy, and didn't have a great sense of spending - and when she wanted to spend money like we were the Hiltons, I pulled back on the reigns, and she would see me as controlling the finances. I was trying to protect us, and we still went in debt for no reason. I'm not trying to paint myself as the good guy, but the issues that we had would not have been the cause of destruction for most healthy relationships.

 

When she did move out, she told me that I pushed her into another relationship and she wasn't to blame for any part of our divorce, or for her to go find emotional needs elsewhere. I have been seeing a counselor, have read every book written on relationships, have talked to friends until they think I'm crazy. I get confirmation from every person I know that knew us together, and they try to be as unbiased as they can. And not a single person tells me that I should try to work it out. Each person has a story about when they saw her go haywire on me for literally no reason at all. They all say that no matter what they will support me in whatever happens, but that there is literally nothing I can do to make her happy.

 

I do still obviously have mixed feelings, but I'm sick of being number 2. As much as I want to believe it, I can't force myself to completely accept that I want and need to end this. I did tell her that I wanted the paperwork signed, knowing full well that I have to move on without her. I am prepared to do that, but in the back of my mind I don't know what I'd do if she asked to come back, and there is the part of me that hopes she does have a change of heart. I would definitely make it on my terms, i.e. no more dating, marriage counseling, seeing each other regulary, etc. And this is part where I am weak and just hope I don't have to make that decision, and that she will sign the papers so I can move on.

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Zetter, I can relate to parts of what you wrote about yourself and parts of what you wrote about your wife. The thing is, your issues with your wife is based on perception. If you were to reconcile, then I would take her concerns about being controlling and not being there emotionally for her to heart. It doesnt mean you were controlling and not there, it just means she FELT that way. Part of a marriage is to make sure the other doesnt FEEL bad about themselves and you both should work together to make sure those feelings are not there. If you havent already, read The 5 love languages. It illustrates how, although you show how much you love her in your way, she might not have noticed because she speaks a different love language. Vice versa.

 

However, since she's checked out, you really dont need to worry about what you'll do if she'll come back. You can deal with that when/if the time comes.

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zetter, i hear you when you said that your wife could not trust you, ( please read my posts)

my wife also said this at the MC last night and i know my mouth dropped when she said "i dont know if i can trust him anymore". i think it may be their guilt of what they have done and are trying rationalize their actions up to now, i dont know,i really cant give any advice as today is day 7 for me and im really a mess but was the first post i'd read that was similar what i was hearing to, anyways keep looking up, dennis

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Now that you seem to have grown a backbone she might just come crawling back. Mt ex wife still begs me to take her back after I stopped blaming myself for her cheating and just went through with the divorce. I decided I was happier without her and it wa sa blow to her ego. Your wife sounds like one of those women who can never be satisfied and it is pointless trying to figure out what you did because you could be the best husband in the world and it still not be good enough. Women like her are just screwed up and have the mind of a little girl. They approach relationships like they are still back in high school. You would be happier without her.

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Dgiirl, I completely understand what you are saying about perception. I do not discount her feelings, and do not think that they are invalid whatsoever. That being said, I don't think I was always to blame for how she felt. I pissed her off one time by asking her if i could get her a Coke. "That is something that you just do...you don't ask if I want one, you just bring it to me!" She told me that she felt trapped by me and annoyed with me at that point. This was not an isolated incident. I threw her a surprise party for her birthday, but called it off when she found out about it and got pissed at me. "You should know I hate surprises. I just feel like you don't know me." Only to be depressed and sad on her birthday because she really did want to have the party. I got a golf cart for us when we were supposed to play 18 one day. "Why the hell would you just get us a cart and not ask me? We are not a team!" And then she walked 5 miles home in the rain. And I drove around for and hour and a half looking for her, and when i finally found her she lit me up for not finding her earlier. We went to a party and an ex-girlfriend was there - en route to the bar we were going to run into her, and to avoid any weird situation I grabbed my wifes hand and took a different route. That got me a punch to the face and a bloody nose for making her look like a fool in front of everyone. I have a story for every day of our marriage. And she has rationale for every action that only i can understand and believe, and I end up being apologetic every time. I can honestly tell you how many times she came to me and admitted that she was wrong in 2.5 years of our marriage - the number just below one. I beat myself up for 3 months thinking i did everything wrong, and that her perception was reality but that i just could not see it. If we ever were to try again, which you are all asking why i could even consider it most likely, I feel like I would have to change my perception of reality to be able to communicate effectively with her.

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Zetter, I have similar stories in my own marriage. I dont think anything you said was bizarre or out of the norm. I think it's very typical relationship problems (except for the punch to the nose, not cool). Obviously there was a lack of communication on both sides, and part of communication involves listening to each other and making the other understand and coming up with solutions to resolve the situation.

 

I'm reading "Uncoupling". It's a very interesting read and will show you some insight on why certain things took place. The jist is, they were unhappy for a very long time, and instead of understanding THEY were unhappy and communicating it, they tried to resolve the problems on their own. They try to change our behaviours in hope that it will make them happy. But it never does, and so they start to pull away. They start to become independent from the relationship, they start to explore what life will be like without us, and stop working on the relationship, and once they get the confidence that life without us will be better (and by this time, the relationship is getting worse and worse), they split.

 

I sympathize with you. My exh too has never once appologized for anything in 10 years of knowing him. Never ever have i heard the words "I'm sorry". I dont think it's part of his vocabulary. Everything was always MY fault and everything I did was wrong. And if it was his fault, he sulked around the house and made me feel guilty for being upset. I was never allowed to be upset. I also beat myself up for months afterwards and confessed all my sins to anyone who would listen. I still do from time to time. But it does take two. Because he did this, i did that, and because i did that, he did this. We both made mistakes. But as i'm getting further away from this relationship, i'm starting to see clearer. He was very manipulative and selfish, and I have a hard time placing these words on him because he would tell me constantly that he wasnt, that he treated me like a queen, that he did everything for me. And only now am I realizing he's a pompus ass.

 

Dont worry about the future at the moment. She's made the decision, let it rest on her shoulders. Until she wants to come back, you dont NEED to make any decisions. Let the guilt rest on her shoulders. Of course, this is assuming you dont want her back. If you DO want her back, then I would atleast once tell her what you are willing to do to resolve the issues and fix the marriage. After you've told her how you feel and what you are willing to do, there's not much else you can do.

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I do still obviously have mixed feelings, but I'm sick of being number 2. As much as I want to believe it, I can't force myself to completely accept that I want and need to end this. I did tell her that I wanted the paperwork signed, knowing full well that I have to move on without her. I am prepared to do that, but in the back of my mind I don't know what I'd do if she asked to come back, and there is the part of me that hopes she does have a change of heart.

 

I went through (am still going through) much the same process. What helped me is changing my thinking a little bit to take it in slightly smaller steps. Instead of directly working on "I have to move on without her", I focused strictly on "I have to move on." This helped me see that whichever way it goes, the future will be different than the past; even if we got back together, things would have to change. I have to move on, and I have to get stronger and more confident for myself, no matter what happens. That just becomes a given, without any consideration or confusion.

 

Accepting this premise is easier and more fulfilling, and becomes a source of strength. Then, after buying into this idea, then honestly the other questions of "will she or won't she" become just a little easier to bear, and they don't chip away at the basic premise that you will become stronger and more confident either way.

 

You are right - you don't have to be #2 any more, and that starts right now.

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Excellent advice once again Trimmer. I am going to make a conscious effort to figure out what I need and work on those things now instead of dwelling on what might have been if only I had _____. I've spent enough time figuring out how I hurt her enough to leave, and she knows that and knows how bad I feel and have learned a great deal and would take it all back if I could. But i can't and there is no reason for me to dwell and waste more energy on that and relive the pain every day.

 

It seems that we all forget that there are other people to have loving relationships with out there in times like these. I mean, if I had never met her I'm sure I'd be with someone else. It is just the pain of memories and what ifs that keep each one of us from being whole again right away.

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