Stupid for so long? Staying close after separating?

[stoopidinlove]

(sorry in advance for an incredibly long post)

 

I fell head over heels for my wife almost 20 years ago when we first started dating. We took it slow and married two years later when we were both in our early 20s. We're now both around 40.

 

She had a few casual relationships, nothing too serious, before ours. One thing that took me a while to notice was that she was not at all affectionate unless she had been drinking.

 

She did share with me that she had intimacy issues and always assured me that it had nothing to do with me specifically. We drank often early on and she seemed to enjoy sex although foreplay was never her thing.

 

Intimacy was our only major issue the first few years of our marriage & as lonely as I was for her at times, I felt that the love we had for eachother was more important and the intimacy issue would get better with time or I would get used to it. Occasionally out of frustration I would watch porn alone or very rarely flirt online with someone, but I have always been faithful and love her so much I have never been tempted to seek anything outside of our marriage.

 

There was a brief period four years into our relationship when she was pregnant with our first child that she wanted sex - but it was just that - sex. she wasn't intimate with me in any other way and it just totally turned me off - part may have been the pregnancy but it was more her aggressiveness about sex without showing any signs of affection otherwise.

 

About a year after the birth of our first child she began drinking again - not all that often but heavily when she did. That was the beginning of her drunken verbal abuse. She would get plastered and want sex but would be staggering drunk and would hurl horrible insults at me, initiate sex and then pass out - sometimes she would stop during sex and say really awful hurtful things to me. If I tried to talk to her at all she'd just accuse me of not wanting to f*ck, call me names, etc.

 

This was the beginning of my doubts about her love. In between drunken nonsense she would tell me she wasn't attracted to me, that I didn't f*ck like a man, that I smelled bad, awful things. I'm an attractive, fit guy and a very good lover. She swore she didnt even remember what she said and when I confronted her she'd break down and say she didn't mean any of it.

 

Ugh this sounds awful as I type it now & it sounds like I was a doormat.. but aside from her drinking problem and lack of intimacy, we have always gotten along really well, rarely argue and never fight. We share many of the same interests and passions in life and truly are each others best friends.

 

I enjoyed drinking a couple beers or a couple glasses of wine, but I so rarely got drunk and never would pass out or behave badly. She on the other hand, would always binge drink given the opportunity.

 

She has her own business and brought the kids to work with her when they were little. I worked in a high pressure job with typical long hours. After we had our second child we had a couple years where things were better. We moved to the country, had our business next to our home and she stopped drinking while she was breastfeeding and was very active with the kids. She has always been selfconcious about her body a bit, but she seemed more comfortable with herself and life in general. She began to show more affection towards me (usually as a way of intiating sex) and we had better and more frequent sex (more than once a month!).

 

I was busy with my job, my wife was working part-time and spent way more time with the kids than I was able to. I know it wasn't easy for her working with the kids and although she loves the country, she spent all of her free time keeping the kids busy. I was a great dad, always patient with the kids and loved spending my weekends with her and the kids. I was so proud of her as a mother - she was affectionate and loving and really engaged with the kids.

 

Once the kids were old enough to go to preschool, I drove them to school in the mornings (long commute) and really relished having the extra time with them.

 

Once she was no longer breastfeeding, the drinking returned. By the time I came home from work the kids would be in bed and she would have started with beer and would move on to wine with me. I'd usually have a beer (two at the most), and a couple glasses of wine. She would sometimes polish off two bottles of wine and several beers. Sex became a drunken activity for her and her verbal abuse became more frequent when she was inebriated.

 

In 2006 I started having some health problems. By 2007 I started working part-time and was dealing with muscle weakness and severe pain. As my health began declining, I became irritable at times and had difficulty sleeping and a hard time living with pain. While I was still a loving father and husband I was now limited somewhat in what I could do with my wife and kids and was less patient, less engaged with them. Depsite spending more time at home I wasn't necessarily more engaged with my wife and kids.

 

The stress of dealing with my health situation and raising the kids took its toll on her. Raising the kids had always fallen mostly on her shoulders. I had a good job and money was never an issue. We had a gardner and a housekeeper, but the kids and household stuff had been mostly her responsibility.

 

Now that I was home more I think she started to resent that I wasn't able to do more around the house and do more with the kids. We had rarely let the kids watch TV but they were a bit older now and I would end up turning on the TV more because I didn't have the energy to keep up with the kids. I stopped bringing beer and wine home, but she kept buying it along with the groceries.

 

My health issues became more serious (something akin to MS, with lots of pain, muscle fatigue and a possible terminal diagnosis. I stopped working altogether but had extreme difficulty with pain, sleep, moodiness. I wasn't quite the happy easy going guy I had always been.

 

As my health declined and I became less engaged with the family, my wife began to binge drink almost every night. She went from curvy every overweight.

 

She found a gal friend who liked to go out and drink and would be wreckless with her (drinking and driving) and would come home late in the evening or early morning.

 

When she wasn't out with her friend, she would go out in the garage and talk to her on the phone while they both drank - for hours. If she wasn't ready to pass out, she would sometimes initiate sex.

 

Sometimes I was lonely for her, sometimes I had enough to drink to tolerate her drunked advances, and other times I just didn't want the verbal abuse that came along with not having sex with her. During these awful drunken nights she would say the most ridiculous things, mumble incoherently and swing from affectionate to rebuffing me, one second being playful the next angry and crying. She would say very hurtful things- I never loved you.. I married you because it was convenient. If it weren't for the kids I wouldn't be here with you -- or she would badger me and say I didn't love her. She'd even accuse me of being gay and taunt me about it, etc.

 

I'd rarely confront her with the details of exactly what she said but she would often be hungover and apologetic the next morning and would swear off of drinking (so much) or drinking (for a few days).. etc.

 

-- again, during all of this we had a very good relationship during the days when she was sober. We get along fabuluosly well and always have - our kids are beautiful, super smart, creative, well adjusted kids. We have been able to travel a lot as a family and spend a lot of time together.

 

By 2009 her drinking, verbal abuse, and her own health and gotten so out of control I seriously thought about taking the kids and leaving her. I felt like we were trapped in a hopeless situation. This continued for two more years, with her promising "to be good" but continuing the behavior.. I'd find empty wine bottles and beer bottles all over the garage, she would lie about how much she had to drink when she went out, etc.

 

I put up with this for another two years. ugh. Her drunken behavior began to spill over to her interactions with the kids. The kids were staying up later and she would get drunk earlier. They could tell her behavior was different and it scared them - they didnt always understand what was going on. At one point she slapped my daughter in a drunken rage. I almost took the kids that night and left - I'm in a wheelchair by this point and she is a good mom except for the rare moments she is drunk in front of them.. and I love her and want her to get help.

 

The final straw came in 2011 when she drove home staggering drunk and incoherent with the kids in the car. I even got a call from the lounge she had left that they were concerned about her driving and concerned about the kids and wanted to make sure that she got home ok. I was seconds away from calling 911 when she came in the door. I told her that if she didn't get help I was going to take the kids & that if she ever did anything like that again I would call the police and CPS.

 

That was the last time she had a drink. She finally got help and has been sober since then- Thank god. I am so proud of her - she is herself all of the time now. She threw herself into the kids school, volunteering 4-5 days a week, after school activities, entertaining them with activities after school and on weekends, driving them all over the place, etc.

 

I'm not physically able to do those things and the kids are harder to engage with at the house now that they are older and into video games, shopping, going out, etc. A lot of the time my wife keeps the kids out with her until dinner time and then we end up just watching tv for a couple hours before the kids go to bed.

 

When I am able to, I do go out with her and the kids once or twice a week. On one hand she understands my limitations but she resents that I can "decide to do or not do whatever I want, whenever I want" and all of the kid stuff falls on her. She is a super mom now and I really respect her for it.

 

-- wow typing this all up has been theraputic in and of itself and makes me realize how unhealthy some big parts of our relationship have been for so long-- If you've made it this far in my post, my apologies.

 

Since my wife has been sober, affection has been non-existant and I can count the number of times we've had sex on my fingers. She has talked to me about this a few times and says she wants sex, but doesn't want the touching, kissing, hugging, caresses, sweet words, etc not just before sex - she just doesn't want to be affectionate ever.

 

A few months ago she had a serious talk with me and said she couldn't handle us living as "friends and roommates" and thought we should separate for a month.

 

I love her, I'm in love with her, she's a fantastic person in so many ways. I know living with someone who is disabled, especially in pain, can be difficult. After talking it through, she decided shortly after our talk that she didnt' want to separate, reassured me that she loved me and that we'd work through things. I pushed myself to be more active with her and the kids.. I kept my pain more to myself. I was more persistent with very small affectionate gestures. For a very short while she was also more affectionate, giving me an unexpected kiss or hug (that really only lasted a week or two).

 

Since she stopped drinking, I resigned myself to mostly giving up on sex and affection from her. I still love her, am attracted to her, and get along with her very well. As a side effect of medication my testosterone is much lower now and I don't physically need sex and can deal with the lack of affection more effectively.

 

A few months ago we had a difficult family vacation together where I was in a lot of pain and had uncomfortable muscle contractions and spasms in my back. It was a laid back tropical vacation where normally I'd be able to go along with my wife and kids for a lot of their activities.. hanging out at the beach, watching them swim, swimming a bit myself now and then.

 

This time was different and I was only able to participate with my wife and kids about a third of the time. My son who is hooked on video games often wanted to stay "home" with me and play his video games rather than going out with his mom and sister.

 

I probably pushed him a little too hard to go out and enjoy the vacation rather than stay in with me and play his games. Somehow my wife and kids started talking about how they wanted a break from me and thought it would be good if I spent some time alone visitng a friend out of state or on a vacation of my own.

 

I'm a little suspect as to how this really came about and how much of this was suggestion by my wife. I do have a shorter temper now than I did in the past but compared to most parents I'm very soft spoken and respectful in how I deal with the kids when they are disobeying or have behavioral issues. Like everyone, I do sometimes lose my temper and raise my voice but not disproportionately - I never use derogatory terms towards my kids and I have never hit them or threatened to. That said, my wife is more permissive than I am and seems to always want to jump in and calm the kids if they are upset for being punished, video games restricted, etc. I've become the bad cop.

 

-- in typing all of this out, I'm beginning to realize my love for my wife and desire to be with her has led me to accept far too much crap for too long --

 

Fast forward to a few days ago, my wife leaves me a note saying she wants a one month separation. She points out a few of my flaws, reminds me that the kids want a break from me, but mostly says it's her fault and she's a horrible person. In the letter she reaffirms that she loves me, cares for me deeply and will always be there for me.

 

In talking with her in person afterwards I had a hard time getting her to express her feelings and what she wanted from this separation and what she wanted to have happen afterwards. Finally I ask her if this is a test for her to see how she feels about me - she nods her head yes. So I ask her if she loves me and is in love with me.. she basically says she loves me but isn't in love with me.

 

I haven't had the courage to ask her how much of the hurtful things she said when she was drunk were truly from her heart & whether she ever was in love with me - or if she was in love with me when we were married, when did she fall out of love with me.

 

I accepted her one month separation and made plans to travel and spend part of the time alone and part of the time with old friends.

 

Since then she's been upset, crying often, telling me she's confused and afraid she's making a huge mistake, etc.

 

I am so hurt & she has shattered all trust I've had in her love, I can't be the one to console her. I wish I could leave right now but there are things I want to do with the kids before I leave and I don't want to tell the kids what is going on at this point and have them worry while I'm gone.

 

So I'm stuck sleeping in the other room and keeping our conversations mostly to lighter topics right now.

 

The one thing I really want from her right now is the thing I feel now in retrospect I've never gotten from her - absolute honesty.

 

I have sort of justified living through the difficulties she's put me through by figuring that she would have the same difficulties with anyone she was with and that I love her, she loves me and so we adjust to eachothers needs to make things work. But now I just don't know if she can even really express honestly to me how she feels.

 

I know I've said it several times, but we do get along very well on a day to basis and enjoy eachothers company and care a lot about eachother.

 

I am leaning towards keeping our finances together, supporting her and the kids as much as I can and renting or buying a modest home within walking distance of the kids if possible. I would continue to rely on her for some things due to my health (although I could always hire someone to do my shoping and occasionally cooking, cleaning, etc) and we would share custody of the kids in a casual way and continue to spend time together in a platonic way.

 

Am I crazy? Has anyone been in a very similar situation? Were you able to maintain a close non-marriage relationship? If either or both of you ended up dating other people was it difficult to maintain a close, financially linked relationship with your ex?

 

Please share if you can - I need to hear from people who have gone through something like what I'm dealing with right now.

 

Thanks!

 

-Stoop

(sorry for the incredibly long post - I needed to get everything out!)

[Mr. Lucky]

I am leaning towards keeping our finances together, supporting her and the kids as much as I can and renting or buying a modest home within walking distance of the kids if possible. I would continue to rely on her for some things due to my health (although I could always hire someone to do my shoping and occasionally cooking, cleaning, etc) and we would share custody of the kids in a casual way and continue to spend time together in a platonic way.

 

Very tough situation for both of you.

 

What you're proposing sounds good on paper but would probably collapse under the pressure of the expectations of any 3rd party entering the picture. A new BF isn't going to want to share her with you, platonically or otherwise.

 

Is she open to MC? Lot's of history together...

 

Mr. Lucky

[starglider]

I think you can be creative in mapping out your lives together as supportive people who don't live under the same roof.

 

I've been separated from my H for about 3 weeks now. We have a daughter together and we also own a business 10 minutes from our home. I'm living in our home with D and pets and he lives at the business and has stepped up to run it practically full time during our separation - this is a good thing.

 

We are doing MC together and I do IC and he wants to do IC too. The more we talk to other people about being separated, the more we learn of stories of amicable and creative separations where both people are still involved in each other's lives. In our case, this may transition into divorce.

 

It is too soon in my case to know what will happen, but he's come over for dinner and does laundry at our house, I can drop off our D with him at the last minute if I have a meeting that has come up, and for now the plan is to keep running the business together, regardless of our future. MC is good in some ways, showing how we are supportive to each other, and painful in other ways, showing the resentment and "deal breakers" that seem to show the writing on the wall for us both. Even after a terrible MC session, I can see him at our business late in the day and tell him about some frustrating encounter in my day, and he'll give me a big hug and I know that he's still got my back and cares, even if we don't stay married.

 

So ask around, be open, and see that you can create your own reality, to a degree. Things could change and the amicable relationship may fall apart when one of you partners up again, or over money, or who knows what, but I think you should go into it believing you can find a solution for happiness for the two of you and your kids.