Separated and scared to ask for divorce

[Kiki123]

I need help, encouragement, or both.

 

I have been with my spouse for 13 years....married for 7.5, September will be two years separated. Before the separation, we were in couples counseling for 8 months. We have continued counseling throughout the separation.

 

As I know there are two sides to the story; I know I can only give mine. My husband is a pathological liar. He lies about everything, no matter big or small. He has told me so many lies, I never know when he is being truthful. He lied about going to college, to opening (and maxing out) credit cards without my knowledge, to why he recently lost his job, to the most recent of being placed in the hospital for 6 days (with no insurance because he lied about having insurance) due to a major illness that he was diagnosed with over two years ago and never told me he had (first it was that he knew about the illness only a year ago, then after pleading with him to tell me the truth, he said it was two years-but it could be up to five or six, who knows?) These are only a few, because there are honestly just too many to name. When we went to counseling, he would sit in counseling and just lie to the therapist. I just didn't think he was taking the therapy seriously, so I asked him for a separation so he knew I was serious. I wanted it to work, but absolutely nothing has changed. I'm constantly finding him telling lies, either through omission, or outright to my face lies. When confronted, he gets defensive and blames me for not believing him. He has gone days without speaking to me. Our therapist recommended we both see individual therapists; I have been going religiously since, he has said he's gone "a couple of times," but never seems to know what they talk about or says they didn't have "time to talk about the marriage." Every single one of my sessions are how can I be a more supportive/better wife and I tell him this, but he doesn't even bring up our marriage in his sessions.

 

He lost his mother tragically last year, but refused grief counseling and instead opted for medication. He didn't go to work for over a month and was fired. He states it was because he applied for another job (non-competitive clause), but I'm just not super sure because he was on a professional development plan for poor performance before the accident and with missing work so frequently, I assume they just fired him and he made up the story to blame his company for letting him go. He just refuses to take responsibility for anything. He now works part-time at a minimum wage job and finds excuse after excuse why he can't find another job. I am not greedy, or looking for someone to support me, but I have shouldered the financial burden of our household since day 1 of our marriage. I work super hard and even went back to school (while working full time) to get my Master's degree so that I could get promoted. While he is just complacent in his part time job constantly not paying his bills (that he incurred from irresponsible spending.). I live in our house, so I pay all of the bills (like I've always done.)

 

I don't feel like any strides have been made for him to start communicating, stop lying, or becoming a team player in this marriage. I am now ready to pursue a divorce. I have struggled so much with this (cried daily, and contemplated suicide at one point-I have gotten help for that and am no longer at that point). But, now, I'm honestly so scared to tell him I want a divorce. I don't even know how to begin the conversation. My biggest problem is that no matter how horrible his lies, he's not a bad person. If he beat me, or cheated on me, I wouldn't think twice. I'm supremely religious and have had the hardest time getting over the "feeling like a failure" in letting God down. But, I am so miserable being married to someone I just don't trust. He's not a bad person, he's just a really bad husband. I have prayed for over four years for God to fix my marriage, but feel that maybe He is saying my husband has to fix himself and he's just not doing that.

 

So, how do I start a conversation and ask for a divorce? Part of me wants to talk about it in a therapy session, but no matter how bad he is to me, I want to respect his feelings and not embarrass him. But, even trying to bring up the conversation at home ends with him yelling at me and storming out and not speaking to me for days. I just don't know how to proceed because I can't talk to him like adults speak to each other. He is accusatory, then shuts down and walks out.

 

Please help with suggestions, encouragement, or thoughts. I welcome anything. And prayers are always appreciated. I'm just ready to be happy again. I'm completely alone and miserable. Being with someone and feeling completely alone is literally the worst feeling ever.

[StalwartMind]

First of all, it is regretful that you are experiencing this, both of you. Some people are not inherently bad, but they do have disadvantages that make them fall into the same category. This is due to many reasons such as we as a society have grown custom to labeling things to simplify matters that often are more complex.

 

With that said, I wonder how your early years with him actually were. Typically you would from an early point pick up, if someone has a character traits that are questionable. This is not an accusation of having believed in the wrong man, but rather just wondering if he with time developed his pathological lying.

 

It's difficult to see someone you once cared for or still do, lose themselves to a disorder. From what I understand treatment success varies, and you've already faced through your attempts that he is not doing as you would of hoped. To make matters worse, you don't even have the ability to communicate with him, as he'll get upset and not speak to you for days. When there is such a breakdown in your relationship, progress is outside your control. In theory, he could keep doing this forever which is far from ideal. Neither you or he deserve to be living through such complications.

 

I understand when you are of very religious beliefs that all of this must weigh very heavily on spirit and mind. Perhaps another member who has gone through something similar can give you some concrete advice of how to go about presenting the desire of a divorce. I could imagine bringing someone from the outside might be an idea, because if he is just with you, then he will react the same way every time. While it is ideal to solve all things gracefully, sometimes we are left with no other choice, especially when things are out of our control. Praying you should always do as it is a part of you and can grant you hope as well as relief.

 

We all deserve to be happy and even if question yourself and feel like a failure, that couldn't be further from the truth. You've endured more than others ever will, even if life is not a comparison contest. Regardless of where anyone's faith may be, going through suffering to the point where you no longer feel joy, I doubt is the plan for any of us. Testament to this is that we all have the capability to make things better, but many simply choose not to for whatever reason.

 

Find strength in your faith and yourself. Even if you currently are physically alone, there's support and energies to be found everywhere, among places right here on this forum. The locations where you'll find compassion and kindness should never be underestimated.

 

My apologies if you feel this is completely misplaced, but as the dear actor Robin Williams once said “I used to think the worst thing in life is to end up all alone. It's not. The worst thing in life is to end up with people who make you feel all alone.” There is so much truth to this, and while I do not disagree that being alone can be very depressing, you DO have the ability to change that situation if your desire and will is strong enough. I believe in you and that you'll get through this. Assess the best way to go about this, even if there will be more pain to come, you can do it but it will require action.

[Mr. Lucky]

He's not a bad person, he's just a really bad husband.

 

Don't think anyone answering your post could put it any better than you already have.

 

There are 3 kinds of people out there:

 

1). Those that aren't meant to be in a relationship

2). Those that aren't meant to be in a relationship - with you

3). Those that can make you happy

 

Marriage to a 1) or 2) is simply not sustainable long-term, at some point the dynamic destroys the bond.

 

Time for both you and your husband to be free to look for a 3)...

 

Mr. Lucky

[oldshirt]

Why do you think so lowly of God that you think he would want you to be yoked to such a pathological lier and chronic deadbeat??

 

But regardless of religious views, you do not need to "ask him" for a divorce. Nor do you need his consent, buy-in or cooperation.

 

It takes two people to have a healthy successful marriage and he's completely dropped the ball and blown it there. So luckily it only takes one person to end the legal contract (you already do not have a real marriage so I won't use that word any more)

 

See a lawyer and work with him/her to draw up the papers and file it with the court. He will be served and will be required to give the court his response.

 

As stated earlier, he does not need to consent to the divorce. It will occur with or without his consent and agreement. It will go more quickly and less expensively if he agrees to everything so you can hope for that. But in the end the divorce will go through as long as you don't call it off.

 

Divorce him, be done with it and move on without him dragging you down and holding you back from living your life.

[oldshirt]

.....and during hat whole process, you really don't have to speak a word to each other if you don't want. All communications can be through your attorneys if that's what you choose.

[darkmoon]

yelling is a silencing tactic, and now you are cornered into venting here

 

divorce law can be bizzare

 

please find out if you will have any liabilty to him or any kids he has later, i am sure i read something, while you are emotional here, you paid for most of the house, see a lawyer please, do not move out before you do, protect yourself

[Kiki123]

Thank you all for your kind words.

 

I was really scared to even post because the guilt I feel is so overwhelming. I was so scared that everyone would feel I was being selfish, but I honestly have tried pretty much everything I can possibly imagine-I would like to point out that I do not feel that I am wholly without any blame in this marriage not working because I know it takes two. But, I really have tried to listen to his needs and accommodate them, with the exception of the ones where he just wants someone to do everything for him and he contributes nothing and lies about everything. I am still in therapy and take every single piece of advice given (I think both therapists think I should leave-our MC and my IC, even though our MC tries to stay impartial.)

 

One poster asked about any inklings I had before we got married. He painted a pretty elaborate web of lies that I did not know anything about. Being fairly religious, we didn't live together before marriage, and living almost an hour apart, I guess it was fairly easy for him to keep up his lies. I started finding out about the lies little by little after we married, because I guess it got pretty hard for him to keep them covered up. He started buying elaborate gifts, for me and himself, and knowing that he was barely making above minimum wage, I asked him where he got the money to buy the stuff. He made up pretty believable lies about saving up or selling old stuff. Come to find out, after pulling our credit reports (which I did every year to make sure there were no identity theft issues, and to prepare for us to buy a house AND that I told him I would be doing for both of us), I found out that he had NUMEROUS delinquent accounts. One was a high interest rate credit card that he had maxed out-with a very high limit. This credit card he had opened after we got married and never told me anything. To make matters worse, he wasn't paying the payments and was over 120 days delinquent! I was mortified because I knew that now, I was also responsible for this debt. I had worked so hard to never owe money for anything (no cc's, student loan completely paid off before marriage, car paid off, etc.) and now here I was with a husband who had tens of thousands of dollars worth of debt. Maybe I should have been more diligent in looking into this BEFORE the marriage, but I trusted him. That was my fault; my character flaw for believing people at their word. Maybe I was naive. That incident led us to our first "real" fight. I told him then that I expected him to be honest and open from there on out because a marriage wouldn't be successful with deception and lies. He agreed and I believed him. People mess up and I took vows that said "for better or worse." But, things didn't get better. They got worse, much worse. The lies and deception continued and would only come to light when he got caught. He would lie to cover his lies until he had no alternative but to be honest. He did so begrudgingly and his apologies were half-attempts and seemed to only be given to appease me. It was more "I'm sorry you caught me." And the most horrible thing ever was that they continued and he literally thinks that I should just keep forgiving him. He said this to me....that, as his wife, it was my obligation to forgive because I was expecting perfection, which was my fault. What? He started blaming me for every lie he told. It was my fault for having unrealistic expectations. He even accused me of cheating with a friend of mine that I have known for over 20 years! I would never cheat on anyone! That hurt me most of all. I waited until my wedding day to have sex and had plenty of opportunities to engage in sex before marriage, but chose not to due to my beliefs. So, now that we were separated, I was just going to wantonly have sex with everyone? He never apologized for the accusation either. It was horrible and incredibly embarrassing to have him sit in our counselor's office and say that.

 

As I write this, it seems ridiculous that I have put up with this for so long. I don't understand his power over me. Even as I read this, I see that much of this was due to his own insecurities or out of anger, but I still don't hate him. I love him very much, but I also know that this is an extremely unhealthy relationship. I have developed very unhealthy emotional issues that I can see as I write this out and make excuses for his behavior. I'm getting help, but I'm hoping I can get strength to move forward because I feel paralyzed at the moment. I wish I could just file and be done, but I have a crippling fear. Not of being alone, because I enjoy that part the most. But, I'm so scared to hurt him even though he hurts me daily. How do I break that cycle and start to put myself first? I have no clue and feel like I'm making no progress.

 

And I appreciated your quote....thank you all for your words. I need all the encouragement I can get.

[Kiki123]

Any suggestions about how to move past the fear (maybe any similar experiences?) would also be welcomed.

Edited June 21, 2015 by Kiki123

[Yasuandio]

One of the major concerns expressed in your post (and title thereof) is that you are concerned and scared to have the divorce discussion with this man.

 

Any discussion with a pathological liar is unproductive. That could be what you are dreading, possibly.

 

You can prepare and organize yourself for a divorce without saying one word. Use his technique. "Omission."

 

Hire an attorney to direct you. Get everything in play, papers and finances organized, and a new place to live. Slowly move your stuff there, and file. Have him served at the very last second - when it is too late for him to connive and manipulate the process. It will be a done deal.

 

If you discuss this matter with him, he will do everything in his power to thwart you goal, I promise you that.

 

As a young woman, in 1985, I married a pathological liar also. They don't change, even after decades. Mine would just as soon lie about what time it is "to pull a fast one." It is all about power and control. I am still uncovering age old lies just accident. Every time I turn around something crops up. And we were separated in 2008. He stretched out the divorce 4 years. Get out while you can, and get it over with. No talk. When his lips are moving - he is lying. Yas

[Mr. Lucky]

Any discussion with a pathological liar is unproductive. That could be what you are dreading, possibly.

 

You can prepare and organize yourself for a divorce without saying one word. Use his technique. "Omission."

 

Good advice from Yas. We owe honesty and consideration to those that have shown us the same, rules out your husband. Since you know in advance he won't participate in any rational or truthful way, start without him...

 

Mr. Lucky