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TIME CRITCAL: Meeting wife for first time tommorow, need guidance!


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Hello,

 

Thank you for those that are taking the time to read & perhaps, contribute any guidance to my dire time of need. I just found this community yesterday which may be a little too late, but hopefully I'll have a good blueprint on my next steps.

 

I will be upfront in letting you know, I'm working on a relatively abbreviated time frame, where I will be meeting my wife tomorrow for the first time after 3 weeks of separation. As such, I think tomorrow's face to face meeting will be critical point that may dictate the rest of my life, our lives. So I really need any help & thoughts on my approach.

 

I really don't know how to keep this short, but I'll try my best. We have been with each other the last 15 years, five of which, has been marriage. That said, we're both young. I'm 32 and she's turning 30 in Dec. (so yes, I've been with her since I was 17 & she 15.) I've been with her half of her young life. Since the very beginning, she was very controlling & a jealous type of person. We've had huge arguments/fights/breakups so many endless times throughout our whole relationship, but the last few years has been deteriorating rapidly. Most of the trouble started when she discovered I had online exchanges w/ women (dating websites, etc.) It was my fault. I was curious & trying to find a short term escape & break from our everyday fighting. I never met these women, but in a weird twisted way, I was getting short term satisfaction that women wanted to engage with me, were pleasant, & found me attractive. It was more of a game to me at the time & selfish/cheating, I know. But I never met any of these people. This terrible activity lasted for years and she discovered it while we were engaged. Our wedding was almost called off, but after pleading/crying with her, somehow, I moved it past us. But she never forgave me, forgotten, & trusted me again. In fact, any of our fights would always end up bringing up my issues from before.

 

In the past year, I had troubles with work & was terminated. And the termination was my fault, which led us to a short term horrible financial place. Specifically, we just purchased a brand new house 3 months before & had to sit through the ambiguity of not knowing how we would afford to stay and pay our mortgage. Luckily, in the last 12 months I recovered & I'm making more money than my last job (which I quickly learned did not solve any our emotional problems).

 

Since the separation of my last job, we had a down spiral & tremendous fights...yelling & my W crying & she has been physically lashing at me (hitting/slapping). She was verbally destructive to me (cursing, demoralizing, attacking my manhood). In exchange... I was cold to her, unemotional, and unrespomsive to her crying. Sadly, I was used to it and numb/desensitized to a degree. I was intermittently sleeping on the couch for a few days at a time. The last critical fight came to a point where she asked me to leave to my parents house & I obliged (three weeks ago). That same day, she called crying b/c she rummaged through my things & found a personal journal that I wrote 13 years ago when I was 19/20 years old. In short, I was very detailed about a girl I dated at the time while I was with her and my compulsive lying I exhibited in our relationship (going to parties in college, etc.). It was my fault, she was my gf & I was messing around with someone else (this relationship lasted maybe 2-3 months tops) Though it was years ago, this new information was a fresh blow to her at a very fragile time in our marriage. It compounded our problems when she had such a distrust in my honesty and faithfulness from my previous online escapades. At the time, she reasoned that it wasn't physical infidelity, but this new information validated a physical betrayal. As such, I think it may be the tipping point where we may divorce because of it.

 

I know to an outsider, you may question why would any of us want to stay in such a marriage of disarray. But there's good history which I won't explain in detail & personally, I do want to fight to salvage our marriage so we can be happier together. She, on the other hand, I believe does not. These last 3 weeks is the LONGEST we've had apart in our 15 years together w/ little to no communication. She text me yesterday saying, "we need to talk" & I'm guessing she will detail her ambition to begin divorce proceedings. In fact, these last 6 months during our fights she's showed me she printed divorce paperwork & splitting up assets, etc. but I foolishly dismissed her actions as ridiculous and ignored the clearly bold warning signs. I promised to be better, we moved past it for a short time, & our fights continued (she btw, has not been a saint by any measure either.)

 

Finally, my questions for tomorrow... I know that I shouldn't plead/cry as I will turn her off. I know personally saying I love you/miss you pushes her farther away. If she's not pushing for a divorce, but a separation, I don't know if I should give in to her demand that I continue to leave the house. I've read here or somewhere else that if I leave my home this will almost certainly get worse & be a prelude to the imminent divorce. Do you agree? Should I be pleasant, agreeable, take ownership of my past faults, but hold firm on remaining home? I don't know what the balance I should have b/w being agreeable, but setting my foot down & creating the boundary that I want to live at my house (w/ my intention of reconciling, albeit, slowly at home).

 

Please advise & again, I appreciate all of you extending your time to read & perhaps, contribute.

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Does she work and contribute to the household expenses?

 

Dude your marriage sounds like a piece of crap. She never forgave you and she doesn't trust you and she smacks you.

 

Please...you can do so much better than her. You know it too. You put out your feelers and although you never acted on anything you know there are women out there who see you as worth their time.

 

And don't leave your house. Just don't.

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Hi Amaysngrace - Thanks for your response, much appreciated. It's a little complicated, but for 3 years I was supporting most of us while she was getting her masters in the health field. I was finding moderate income in my line of work and any shortfall to pay for our rent, we took from her school loans. After she graduated, she did contribute a solid amount to cover our mortgage for 8 months. Once I found a new job, I doubled my income (I know this sounds dramitic) but it was enough where I have been paying our entire mortgage for the last 10 months & 80% of our bills. My goal was for her to use her excess income to pay off her 100k+ in student loans.

 

She has held a grudge and brought up many times that if it wasn't for her income (during the time of my unemployment) that we wouldn't be able to survive & she's right, but she wasn't humble about it.

 

Again, I know this marriage is extreme, but theres a lot of dynamics I didn't include. Some of what I read indicated that I should just move out to respect her space & give her time. Is that crazy?

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Do not leave your home under any circumstances. It's your house too.

 

Listen, you need to divorce this woman. She's toxic. And it's much better if divorce is your idea because it sucks to be dumped.

 

So you should do the dumping.

 

Does she even make you happy? Do yourself a favor and sit down with a pen and a piece of paper and list her pros and cons.

 

Do that tonight before you meet up with her tomorrow.

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Understood. Thank you for your advice, I will reason with her to allow me back home. Though, I do expect high resistance and the potential of, "you're being selfish by asking this of me & not respecting me to have this time alone."

 

Just curious about your reasoning, why do you feel it's important for me to remain home beyond the fact that I'm legally entitled to being there? What are the positive outcomes for this? Of course, I'd much rather prefer being in my own house as I'm dreading staying at my parents. My work is such that I can telecommute from anywhere so, geographically I'm not handicapped by working from another house.

 

Thanks again for your help

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I will also take your advice in writing the pros/cons tonight.

 

Btw, she txt me now and asked me if I took the journal back. I did, however, visit my house to take my things one day and found it. I felt that was was just hurting herself too much reading it and I was curious to what I wrote (as I forgot, its been too long). I'm planning to throw it away.

 

But somehow, I think she text me about it b/c she was planning to use it against me..my own words tomorrow. Or perhaps I'm overthinking it.

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You answered your own question...you belong in your own home because it's your own home as much as it is hers and it's more convenient for you.

 

You don't need to bargain with her to go home. Just go.

 

You should also go home because I'm thinking that's where the jar that she put your balls in is on a shelf there somewhere. So go back and get them.

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You should also go home because I'm thinking that's where the jar that she put your balls in is on a shelf there somewhere. So go back and get them.

 

^^ This ^^

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I will also take your advice in writing the pros/cons tonight.

 

Btw, she txt me now and asked me if I took the journal back. I did, however, visit my house to take my things one day and found it. I felt that was was just hurting herself too much reading it and I was curious to what I wrote (as I forgot, its been too long). I'm planning to throw it away.

 

But somehow, I think she text me about it b/c she was planning to use it against me..my own words tomorrow. Or perhaps I'm overthinking it.

 

Don't throw out your journal. It's written documentation from the events that occurred. You may need that when you write up your complaint for divorce.

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GirlStillStrong

There's nothing in your old teenage journal that can be used against you in divorce proceedings. Divorce is No-Fault anymore.

 

It sounds like there is a lot of dysfunction going on, on both your parts. I suggest both of you see your own counselor. With all of this dysfunction between you, why would you want to go back and live there? Why do you want to try again on something that sounds like doesn't work?

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If I were you I would write up a list of assets and liabilities, both individual and shared/marital, so that you’re familiar with them in case she wants to discuss that. Then I would listen to what she has to say. There’s no requirement that you respond to anything, really. You can tell her that you are thinking about things and want to know what she has been thinking. It’s best not to make promises or decisions when feeling emotional.

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Well...Thanks for the input everyone.

 

So much has changed in the last few hours, I don't know where to begin. I decided to txt my wife back to answer her that I took the journal b/c she would only hurt herself over and over again re-reading the hurtful entries & horrible mistakes I made. Right after, she called me right away.

 

This is the first time we talked in weeks & she began calling me a coward for trying to get rid of the "evidence". That, I was avoiding revisiting the entries I put of the betrayal I displayed while we were with together. She said I didn't want to be called out on all my lies and deceit. She began a very intense, angered, & emotional outcry of how I stole her life, ruined it. She was faithful to me. I was not. I was a compulsive liar. And I was.

As I process everything, in the end, I believe she is right. As much as I see that she was controlling, abusive, & destructive to me throughout our relationship, I shouldn't have coped with these issues by my deceit.

 

During our exchange, it was very emotional for me. I held strong for the first 30 minutes being calm/logical, but broke down as I truly saw my life crashing down at that moment. I am devastated. Without any doubt, this moment created the worse day in my life so far. Mainly, I noticed right away by her tone & comments, this may be the end. By nature & all my years in this relationship, I always manage to see hope for compromise. This time, this time she did not allow it. She is so full of rage & distrust at this point (even though it's real & fresh) says she'll never be able to trust me anymore. Had she known that I cheated on her before our marriage, she would not have married me. So she wants to move on with her life & be happy. That if I truly loved her, I would sign the divorce papers, move on with my life so I can improve myself. Let her have an opportunity to be happy. This really hurts.

 

She says I'm selfish not to allow her the freedom to leave this marriage. And perhaps I am. I know people can change, albeit with much time and absolute commitment. But I do believe I can change myself, that she can change her position, we can start a new marriage & terminate the old one.

 

In the end, it doesn't seem like she's opposed to me living in the house after she seeks her own arrangements to leave (which is not what I want obviously.) After being entirely firm on her pursuit of a divorce, she offered a slim slim slim chance of reconciliation. She said she doesn't want to drag out a divorce if I remain an unwilling party. So her compromise is that we both sign the papers immediately, we can do so w/ the understanding that after 6 months of separation there may be a chance to start anew should she see improvement on my end. That, if that improvement doesn't exist, she'll finalize the divorce. Is this just a bait for me to sign? I know I can't hold her hostage nor do I want to. But I feel maybe she just offered this to give me brief comfort to allow me to begin the proceedings. Your thoughts?

 

Thanks again in advance

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Get a lawyer. And listen to everything they tell you.

 

You have to be smart. So you cheated before you were married...it doesn't mean that you're destined to pay for it every day for the rest of your life. Marriage is for life.

 

File for divorce.

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You guys need to just file and get it over with. Trust me, this relationship is broken. Hopefully, you can both pick up the pieces and move on with some life lessons. Otherwise, you will waste many more precious years fighting and it will end anyway. I hope you will both find love and happiness in your future. The trust breaking continuously is something I don't think she'll ever get past.

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DivorcedDad123

"Is this just a bait for me to sign?"

 

Yes,and this is a "rest of your life" changing event. Don't rush into anything without good legal representation. Don't let her goad you into signing without a lawyer and DON'T use the same attorney she chooses. And, get back into the house while the divorce is ongoing,and until your attorney tells you it's ok to leave.

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There is a book that I recommend you purchasing tonight and get through as much of it as possible before you meet your wife - Love Must Be Tough: New Hope for Marriages in Crisis by Dr. James Dobson. The truth of the matter is that this marriage has needed help for a very long time. Counseling would be very beneficial to you no matter what your wife says during your meeting. If she is open to reconciling though, I would recommend an organization called the National Institute of Marriage which does intensive counseling for couples just like you. The vast majority of people who go to them are separated, divorced, or on the brink of splitting up. Their success rate is phenomenal. You can Google their name and you will find their website. If you want additional information feel free to send me a private message. My thoughts and prayers are with you.

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GirlStillStrong

Once everyone lawyer's up, it turns into a fight. You have to determine how well each of you can cooperate with one another. You can use the same lawyer. Many people go this route.

 

Why do you want to torture her further? Just let it go. It sounds like you are being honest with yourself; that is good. It's unhealthy to live in a state of denial. I think there has just been way too much water under the bridge. It's scary to let go of someone like a spouse but you are capable of standing on your own two feet (without her).

 

Why do you have to make things difficult for her? You lied to her, you have never been monogamous, you've deceived her for years. Just accept that that's what you did, make your vows to change to your SELF, and let her go. But do it peacefully. Look inside your heart, say you are sorry, save the proclamations and drama, take responsibility for your bad choices, and communicate nicely (even when she loses her own head). Be kind.

 

Make a list of those things that are important to you, things you would like to keep, and present that to her. Allow her to do the same. Sit down and negotiate that stuff. Give her the opportunity to say what she wants and you take the opportunity to do so too. Don't just sign your life away without reading what you're giving up and what you're promising.

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There is a book that I recommend you purchasing tonight and get through as much of it as possible before you meet your wife - Love Must Be Tough: New Hope for Marriages in Crisis by Dr. James Dobson. The truth of the matter is that this marriage has needed help for a very long time. Counseling would be very beneficial to you no matter what your wife says during your meeting. If she is open to reconciling though, I would recommend an organization called the National Institute of Marriage which does intensive counseling for couples just like you. The vast majority of people who go to them are separated, divorced, or on the brink of splitting up. Their success rate is phenomenal. You can Google their name and you will find their website. If you want additional information feel free to send me a private message. My thoughts and prayers are with you.

 

I appreciate the encouragement GoBlue. I will look into that book. I'd have no hesitation for counseling, but she seems adamant in proceeding with divorce. We've only had 3 weeks of separation & I feel like it's such a short time before proceeding with divorce. Am i wrong?

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She says I'm selfish not to allow her the freedom to leave this marriage.

This makes no sense. Nobody is forced to remain married against their will, unless you're in a very backwards country. A divorce does not require the permission or cooperation of the other spouse. If she wants to leave the marriage then she is perfectly free to file and no court in the land would deny her.

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Once everyone lawyer's up, it turns into a fight. You have to determine how well each of you can cooperate with one another. You can use the same lawyer. Many people go this route.

 

Why do you want to torture her further? Just let it go. It sounds like you are being honest with yourself; that is good. It's unhealthy to live in a state of denial. I think there has just been way too much water under the bridge. It's scary to let go of someone like a spouse but you are capable of standing on your own two feet (without her).

 

Why do you have to make things difficult for her? You lied to her, you have never been monogamous, you've deceived her for years. Just accept that that's what you did, make your vows to change to your SELF, and let her go. But do it peacefully. Look inside your heart, say you are sorry, save the proclamations and drama, take responsibility for your bad choices, and communicate nicely (even when she loses her own head). Be kind.

 

Make a list of those things that are important to you, things you would like to keep, and present that to her. Allow her to do the same. Sit down and negotiate that stuff. Give her the opportunity to say what she wants and you take the opportunity to do so too. Don't just sign your life away without reading what you're giving up and what you're promising.

 

GirlStillStrong - I understand the reasoning for everything in my head, but to answer you, my heart is holding everything back. We've had fights/arguments/break ups hundreds of times (I know, bad!) and we've always somehow recovered. I know that this isn't sustainable by any measure (and the journal discovery along w/ recent fight broke the camels back), but my experience of going through hard times to find compromise gives me hope. When you're desperate to save your marriage, your best friend & partner, you latch onto hope. Thats what I'm doing and it's entirely emotional I know, not logical. But in real time, I can't simply just call it quits and think about lawyering up or distributing assets as many of you have (logically, reasonably) suggested. Maybe I'm delusional, but it gives me hope.

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This makes no sense. Nobody is forced to remain married against their will, unless you're in a very backwards country. A divorce does not require the permission or cooperation of the other spouse. If she wants to leave the marriage then she is perfectly free to file and no court in the land would deny her.

 

Yes, you are correct. But I believe she is trying to act civil in the sense that she wants a mutual decision to divorce, which I have clearly indicated I'm not ready to do.

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Update:

 

Today, we decided to meet at our house. I drove there & brought one of my dogs as she requested (she's misses him.) I waited there for 3 hours for her as she knew I would be there at a specific time.

 

I decided that I would approach my wife with a smile & show I was happy to see her rather than act grim. When she got home, she ignored me and paid attention to our dog & kept no eye contact. I tried asking her how her work was (she was transitioning to another job) and she simply said, "don't try to act like everything is normal".

 

Then, she becomes very direct by saying, "what do you want to talk about? Why are you here?" I told her that the last 3 weeks have been eye opening to me & that I realized all the faults much more clearly than before. That, I missed such bold warning signs in our marriage. I go on to talk about these things for a bit, but forgive me b/c my mind is so cloudy at the moment I can't recall a lot of the details. The next sequence of events really had a toll on me.

 

She basically tells me that she doesn't know who I am and that she married someone different than she thought b/c I lied to her so much (when I was 19, from my journal entries) I told her I haven't been a good husband at 32 years old, but I was far far from the 19 year old kid that wrote the journal. She said it didn't matter and had she known that I cheated even at 19, lied, she wouldn't have married me.

 

Moving forward, she goes on to tell me that its unfair I try to keep her in the marriage. She wants to "have an opportunity to live my life, be happy, & not be so angry all the time." She pushes that we go sign divorce papers at the courthouse next week & in 6 months time (by law in California) we can revisit the decision whether or not we finalize it. She said that during this time, "you need to go you work on yourself to be a better person & work on your issues. If I see that, then maybe, maybe we can talk about seeing each other again." Somehow, I feel she's giving me false hope just so I can agree to go to court with her. Mainly, I pressed her for the details and asked her what happens after we file the petition? She responded angrily saying, "thats the same as if you were asking me how long is it going to take for me to get over your cheating & lying all these years! I don't know! I can't forgive you. I want you to allow me the chance to find someone that may take care of me better. Yes, I deserve to meet someone" This crushed me so much. She's NEVER talked about seeing other people even when we argued while we were dating. So this is a huge shock to me.

 

I asked about the house, & she said that we can sell it now or sell it in 6 months. And I don't think I handled my next response properly but I said, "well if you're saying that you're prepared to sell it now or in 6 months, then that means that you've decided that you are going through with the divorce regardless & not really going to give it a chance like you opened the possibility of doing". She got pissed after I said that & told me that if that's the case, then I have to live my life with consequences. Btw, I know I'm not in the right & understand the situation exists b/c of the years of poor choices I made in our relationship. She is justified & I deserve this outcome. She was very cold, stern, & very angry. Seeing my whole world fall in front of me, I couldn't help it, but I broke down. It was hard. I know I shouldn't have done that in front of her & looked weak. I know it probably made it worse, but she was so forceful on divorce it broke my heart. I repent, but it's too late.

 

I told her I need time & she got very angry saying, "to the very last minute, right here right now, you're being selfish. Be a man for once & do the right thing for me, don't be selfish. Sign the papers with me so I can move on. The longer you put off this, the more built resentment I'll have for you." So I don't know what to do. I understand I'll probably need to do this, but its been 1.5 days since I found out she's truly truly moving in this direction. Is it unreasonable that I pause at this request? It's my marriage for god sakes, but she's making it seem like it's the clear choice that I shouldn't make with hesitation. The other part of me believes that I shouldn't ever give up the fight for something I value, my marriage...my wife. If I give in, then my chances are completely over since she will be enjoying her new life w/ out me. Yes, that's selfish, but she's my world.

 

What should I do? Should I just sign the petition & risk her never coming terms of reconcilling & just dating others? Or, is it wrong of me to keep fighting on, trying to salvage my marriage? Do people quit that easily? That's all I read, "just move on, let her go, find a lawyer" To me this isn't such a decision I take lightly. I feel helpless...

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If she is set on divorce then she will do it, with or without your cooperation.

 

So you might as well make things a little more amicable by cooperating with her request to sign the papers. Resisting will achieve nothing except making her hate you more.

 

Whatever you do, DO NOT sell the house without consulting a lawyer.

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DivorcedDad123

She's either seeing someone already or has someone in mind. THAT'S why she's pushing so fast for you to sign. She's manipulating you into signing your future away. If she wants to leave,let her, but you protect yourself. She's not going to do it for you and any attorney SHE hires won't do it for you either.

If she wants to sign so fast, YOU go get an attorney to draw up the papers the way YOU want and hand them to her. Watch how fast she backtracks and stalls then.

Hand em to her and tell her to "be a real woman and just sign".

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I appreciate the encouragement GoBlue. I will look into that book. I'd have no hesitation for counseling, but she seems adamant in proceeding with divorce. We've only had 3 weeks of separation & I feel like it's such a short time before proceeding with divorce. Am i wrong?

 

She is already thinking about divorce. She already brought it up so now you know how much she values your marriage as if treating you terribly and physically assaulting you weren't enough of an indication to penetrate your brain.

 

Anyway if you stay married which it seems like you are determined to do then I highly recommend seeing a counselor since you said you're more than willing to.

 

I wouldn't work on your marriage in counseling though...I'd work on you because any person who is being treated as badly as you are and allows it needs help.

 

Good luck.

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