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So We're Separating


dreamingoftigers

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dreamingoftigers

He' told me in no uncertain terms that we are over.

He has agreed to three final sessions of EFT therapy but mostly to emotionally prepare our daughter (who is 5). He might be open to working on things if we aren't living together. But he has to think about it. I'll be honest, that was after some cajoling.

 

Among the reasons listed:

Our increasingly volatile conflicts

My relentless drive to "interrogate" him and fix the marriage

He is sick of hurting me. He feels guilt and shame everyday he sees me and says he "only wants to hurt me once" by leaving.

My depression.

The mean things I say to him.

He's not attracted to me.

He's "tried for five years.'

He feels trapped.

He resents me.

I was make him feel wrong or like he's not good enough.

I am "loud" and he is "quiet."

I am too negative.

I seem fed up with him anyway.

He's is sick of therapy (we haven't been in awhile) because it's just a list of "more stuff that is wrong with him that he needs to fix."

 

He's got some points.

I don't know about advice.

I am just gutted.

I don't even know how to show him that I actually do love and appeeviate him without seeming "dependent on him" or "depressed" or like I am trying to " trap and control" him.

 

I don't know how to connect to people.

I feel so lost and I miss him terribly.

I always just assume people can see how much I care about them.

Then I just behave "low and helpless."

It is so hard to accept that I cause him to feel these things about him and us.

I don't even know where to start.

 

And yes, I've begged him to please not give up on our family.

But he's not having it. The tone he uses with me now is the same tone my ex used with me when he was done with me.

 

I love my husband so so much. I wish he felt the same way. I thunk he used to. I think he could again if he would let his guard down. But I can't do anything about that.

He tells me he loves me and misses me. I have a eeling he just doesn't want to hurt my feelings or feel guilty anymore.

 

For all the things we struggled through and all of the issues we both have and had, the fact that he stuck it through and was willing to try meant a lot to me.

 

And I know people on here may scoff. But everyday I was with him, even when I was frustrated I felt like he was a Superhero to me. I loved coming home to him. I lived talking with him on the phone and texting with him. And laughing with him. And holding hands and cudfling with him. And the way he interacted with our daughter.

 

Most of our arguments were when I felt rejected. And I felt rejected a lot.

But I feel like no one wants to be around me ever. And some of his issues compounded that.

 

But talk is cheap. I still yelled. I still said negative crap. I still let him know his efforts weren't enough. And for a man I accused of ignoring me and not listening. He heard that. And it hurt enough to make him go........

........gutted.

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dreamingoftigers

Oh yeah....he's been gone for ten days now.

 

Not just talk. He has taken action and backed it up.

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But everyday I was with him, even when I was frustrated I felt like he was a

Superhero to me. I loved coming home to him. I lived talking with him on the

phone and texting with him. And laughing with him. And holding hands and

cudfling with him. And the way he interacted with our daughter.

 

 

 

(((((HUGS))))) Oh, Sweetie I'm so, so sorry this has happened to your family. Have you told him the above? I don't have any advice right now except to let him know how much he means to you. We are here for you so vent all you want. (((HUGS))).

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dreamingoftigers
(((((HUGS))))) Oh, Sweetie I'm so, so sorry this has happened to your family. Have you told him the above? I don't have any advice right now except to let him know how much he means to you. We are here for you so vent all you want. (((HUGS))).

 

I haven't told him in those exact words.

 

But I can tell he's so sick of my words.

 

I've asked for so many last chances then gotten so frustrated feeling like I am the onky one that really cared.

 

He's just so sick of my negativity.

I just felt like I couldn't handle all of the stress and rejection.

He probably felt pretty rejected too.

 

We fought a lot this summer.

I don't even know if he remembers good stuff about us or not anymore.

 

I just wish we could watch Modern Family and cuddle.

Or go for a walk.

I miss him kissing and hugging me too.

He gives THE BEST hugs EVER. Like irreplacable hugs.

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Oh Dreaming, I am so sorry. I know this isn't what you wanted. Wrap yourself up with family and/or friends honey.

 

I want you to remember this, "You can handle this", you don't have to like it & it hurts worse than anything BUT You will be alright. You have to be. For your daughter and yourself.

 

((HUGS)) Dreaming,

CIH*

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DoT, I am so sorry you are hurting and I am so sorry that he has said such things to you. You have posted before how you have fought for your marriage and worked at it and you really don't deserve this treatment.

 

But you are a strong, fabulous, loving woman and you will get through this one way or another. Maybe at first you will just go through the motions for the sake of your daughter but in time you will find yourself again.

 

 

(((hugs)))

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DoT,

 

First, I'm sorry to hear it. Ugh.

 

Perhaps more importantly, you're being a bit rough on yourself. You've highlighted your issues and minimized his. Quit doing that, please.

 

Wish I had more words for you at the moment. :(

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I'm not up to posting replies...only two and that's me done!!...But your story isn't a good one!

 

I'm not offering any magical insights into the successful marriage reconciliation as I don't have any. Our story like is similar, mine not as extreme, and we also have much in common with 80% of other users...so we're not alone!

 

But...A true story.

 

3 years ago, and out of the blue I got an email from a very close female friend who told me that she and her husband of two years were 'going their separate ways' ! I had know them for 18 years and to me they were the perfect couple. I immediately called and got the story, which the upshot was they had just drifted apart. She had lost much of her feeling towards him, he had responded by feeling the situation was helpless, she was nagging him, putting pressure on him, pretty much normal there then!

 

Although they didn't have any children, they lived apart, but kept in touch. She admittedly was the main one keeping in touch. She said to me they had been friends at school, lovers at uni, partners in travelling the world for years, so what was all this marriage stuff about anyway? She mean't their relationship was deep and old and worth something. After almost a year, she told me they had been texting everyday lately and were planning to go to the pictures plus...they had been meeting up for coffee on a regular basis....little things they had not done for so many years...tiny things that make someones day...not flowers...not big gestures..just the little things we take for granted!

 

They're not together again...yet...but maybe! But it goes to show, relationships sometimes change, intensity of feeling sometimes diminishes, but friendships endure if they are true.

 

Instead of struggling with a troubled and possibly ended marriage, try to get back to what brought things together...things that are often taken for granted and forgotten....then....who knows.

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DOT,

Firstly, you and I know the Dreaming of Tigers is a Godin Brilliant Woman, OK!

 

Honey, you have been through so much with this man, the marriage, rear thereto, your health, and, most painfully, the temporary loss of your child. Which was worst? So, count your blessings, and kiss the child's head this moment.

 

That took one second to get priorities straightened out, right? Yas might be a little wacka-wacka (Korean for you know what), but she knows something smart once in awhile!

 

NOW, the big advice comes.....

 

You and me know too much about therapy. We need to can it. Let's start that today. I challenge you. I also see myself in you, perhaps not to the degree, but I certainly can find fault, and talk, talk, talk, talk, talk.

 

In my case, this is a symptom of bi-polar 2 called hypo-mania, which I hate, and am recognizing more and more. But before I developed full blown BI-POLAR 2, I had the classical diarrhea of the mouth syndrome. I'm trying to stop my mouth, and focus on listening in my therapy. I'm trying to stop the record in my from from playing over and over everything I know (which no one has the balls to dispute), and LISTEN - cause I don't learn anything anywhere if my jaw in running full speed. I don't know if this helps you or not.

 

if I had it to do over again, I would be a silent, mysterious woman. Instead of presenting an outline of my reseach, and a plan, blah, blah...., today, I would simply say, "that does not make me happy." And walk away. Do nothing else. Expend no more energy. That's it.

 

it is too late to try that strategy now. In fact, it is really the only strategy I even have the energy for anymore. I'm tired. I'm done. I do not plan to ever explain to any other person how to properly conduct themselves. It is simple life for me here on out:

 

Observe, contimplate, keep or delete. That's it. So easy.

 

Honey, try on the silence for size. Or as we call it here for everyone else, NC. Do it for yourself. Live in silence for awhile. Learn not to speak for awhile. Just a suggestion for you to even out. My thought and love is with you. My PM is open 24/7 for you sweetheart. Yas

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dreamingoftigers
Oh Dreaming, I am so sorry. I know this isn't what you wanted. Wrap yourself up with family and/or friends honey.

 

I want you to remember this, "You can handle this", you don't have to like it & it hurts worse than anything BUT You will be alright. You have to be. For your daughter and yourself.

 

((HUGS)) Dreaming,

CIH*

 

Friends, yes.

My family is completely insane. Completely.

And this is one of those times I really wish that they weren't.

TY CIH.

 

I am just sick to death of "handling things." Ugh.

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dreamingoftigers
DoT, I am so sorry you are hurting and I am so sorry that he has said such things to you. You have posted before how you have fought for your marriage and worked at it and you really don't deserve this treatment.

 

But you are a strong, fabulous, loving woman and you will get through this one way or another. Maybe at first you will just go through the motions for the sake of your daughter but in time you will find yourself again.

 

 

(((hugs)))

 

TY Anne.

 

It has been a really long fight.

I am so tired.

But the way that we split was pretty traumatic too.

So traumatic that I have had trouble tracking the days.

I am glad I have some supports though.

 

The whole thing really blows my mind.

 

My daughter is very precious though.

Nail polish and ballet shoes and ponytails are really necessary during all of this.

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dreamingoftigers
DoT,

 

First, I'm sorry to hear it. Ugh.

 

Perhaps more importantly, you're being a bit rough on yourself. You've highlighted your issues and minimized his. Quit doing that, please.

 

Wish I had more words for you at the moment. :(

 

Thanks Betrayed H.

 

And the supports I have talked to this week.have said the same thing.

 

I def. Am minimizing his issues here.

But as well, I realize NOW, too late.....

It isn't a competition.

 

He HAS VALID POINTS. Regardless of how valid(er) mine are.

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dreamingoftigers

Thank you Yas.

 

Yes, that's me.

I can't shut up.

And I can't get the wheels to stop turning.

They just turn and turn and turn

 

I realized a long time ago, the more I opened my mouth, the more ground I lost.

 

Ugh.

I can talk for HOURS.

I didn't realize it was a symptom of anything but frustration

DOT,

Firstly, you and I know the Dreaming of Tigers isa Godin Brilliant Woman, OK!

 

Honey, you have been through so much with this man, the marriage, rear thereto, your health, and, most painfully, the temporary loss of your child. Which was worst? So, count your blessings, and kiss the child's head this moment.

 

That took one second to get priorities straightened out, right? Yas might be a little wacka-wacka (Korean for you know what), but she knows something smart once in awhile!

 

NOW, the big advice comes.....

 

You and me know too much about therapy. We need to can it. Let's start that today. I challenge you. I also see myself in you, perhaps not to the degree, but I certainly can find fault, and talk, talk, talk, talk, talk.

 

In my case, this is a symptom of bi-polar 2 called hypo-mania, which I hate, and am recognizing more and more. But before I developed full blown BI-POLAR 2, I had the classical diarrhea of the mouth syndrome. I'm trying to stop my mouth, and focus on listening in my therapy. I'm trying to stop the record in my from from playing over and over everything I know (which no one has the balls to dispute), and LISTEN - cause I don't learn anything anywhere if my jaw in running full speed. I don't know if this helps you or not.

 

if I had it to do over again, I would be a silent, mysterious woman. Instead of presenting an outline of my reseach, and a plan, blah, blah...., today, I would simply say, "that does not make me happy." And walk away. Do nothing else. Expend no more energy. That's it.

 

it is too late to try that strategy now. In fact, it is really the only strategy I even have the energy for anymore. I'm tired. I'm done. I do not plan to ever explain to any other person how to properly conduct themselves. It is simple life for me here on out:

 

Observe, contimplate, keep or delete. That's it. So easy.

 

Honey, try on the silence for size. Or as we call it here for everyone else, NC. Do it for yourself. Live in silence for awhile. Learn not to speak for awhile. Just a suggestion for you to even out. My thought and love is with you. My PM is open 24/7 for you sweetheart. Yas

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Oh no, DoT....... :(

 

Massive, but gentle hugs coming your way.

I've been reading your posts since you joined, so I'm aware of a lot of the history of your marriage & (and FOO) ---I know you've made huge efforts to make your marriage work.

 

And there were definitely times where you were the one doing all of the heavy lifting, to keep it together. So I also want to echo what BetrayedH said--please don't go down the road of self-blame.

 

I want you to know---and to take this to heart---You are held in very high regard here, by many---you will have support here , you're not alone.

 

I"m so sorry you're having to go through this hurt.

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SummerDreams

I'm shocked, I had no idea. I'm so sorry. :(:(:( I send you all my care and support.

 

Other than that, it seems that your marriage has come to a dead end and in my humble opinion it's better that you take some time away from one another to just think and evaluate stuff. A relationship should not be so hard. It should be mainly easy going, or at least in the process of becoming easy going. It seems you are trapped in a complicated situation and your H does not want to make any effort anymore. I really really believe that it will be good for you to be alone for a while, focus on your daughter and on yourself, go to therapy, try to "find yourself". I know that a separation hurts like hell, but I'm sure you realize yourself that what you have right now is not a way a relationship should be, and even more when there's a kid involved. I'm sure you will be strong, and we're here to help as much as we can. I very consciously am not advising you to try to convince him to keep the family together cause I see this relationship destroys you little by little. It's better, in my opinion, for you to hurt much but for less time than little for more time. I'm 110% sure you'll survive cause you are a strong sensitive woman. I believe in you. We are here for you.

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I'm really sorry to hear this Tigers.

 

I sometimes think the people we have relationships with are like stepping stones to help us climb to a place we want to get to.

 

They're important because they help you go someplace higher but they're beneath you just the same.

 

In time I hope you see him that way too.

 

(((thinking of you)))

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Honey, I meant "hypomania" is just a symptom in my case, since I developed this messed up dis-order. But it came on after an enormous shock to my system, brought about by the actions of abusive former H.

 

Doctor explains it like this, and I think in theory, this applies to your situation too, I'll explain. So, I challenge doctor, stating, how the heck did I get thru my entire life, a professor a school teacher with a Master's degree, that eventually went on to Ohio State University to earn the Toughest Doctorate (Ph.D., in my field, teach and am well published, and now suddenly, I am disabled completely w kith a mind -fugue Bi-polar 2 complication, and have to undergo massive drug treatment, like forever?!?!?! (In my head, I'm thinking, I get the severe depression, insomnia and anxiety issues, but this diagnosis seems like the "New ADHD" - with sarcasm).

 

Doctors explanation and example: 2 people, same family, both have exact strong propensity towards heart deserve in the family. One person has a religiously non-stressful lifestyle and a happy marriage, the other, is a high profile trial attorney with marital problems - drinking a bit too much, and eating out frequently due to business and demands to be at office (years of phoning in pizza and Chinese take out). Ok - trial attorney drops dead at 50 from massive coranary, yet the sibling lives a long life with not any cardiac issue at all.

 

so, I my case, my aunt Libbey had manic depression. Under a certain condition, sick as "shock," symptoms of bi-polar desease, (if there is a propensity for such), can begin to appear. That is what happened to me. My former husband (for a second time) abandoned me while on vacation in his Greece - a foreign country to an American like me. First time in the airport on arrival. But the second, near the end of what I believed was a wonderful trip, he left me in the middle of nowhere. It was on the seaside, he was screaming at me, took the rental car and left me there in this little tourist town, without my medication, glasses, without enough euro money to make my anywhere at that moment, 6th at night, no bank in the little town. My iPhone half working, about to break down too.

 

I had prepared myself with credit cards - but they were useless to me were I stood at that point. Complete utter shock. Once I got my act together I didn't come back to US for 4 months, and that was only cause I saw my name coming off money. My personality and disposition completely changed, as did my character and my appearance. I did things I would never do in a million years - like jump off a cliff head straight, naked, into the ocean. High cliffs in Mikinos. I cannot believe the things I did, it scares me.

 

ok, in you case, your issues may never have come on if you had not been confronted with your husband's problematic behavior's. You went into a survival mode, whatever name there is for it, "fix - it syndrome," WHATEVER, these instincts to talk, and talk, and resolve and resolve, and plan and over plan, are symptomatic only of a woman desparately trying to preserve some semblance of a normal household that has been turned on it's head by bizarre and alarming circumstances for God's sake. Of course you have done the only thing you know to do, talk it out, therapy for other of you, trying to fix you and him.

 

Perhaps your only mistake is that you are too generous too sweet too kind too loving. You cannot repair him and create a lovely normal nest. It must be his choice to search methodology to create a functioning mind that is workable in the family. Trying to write theraputic prescriptions for him just failed. That is like telling the attorney to stop your line of work, eating/drinking habits and apply some attention to your wife or you will be dead next year. In general, is that personality type going to believe and act on that advice? He'll no.

 

Can we act on that advice, and shut it? Now that I see my talking problem and denial issue, I know I can do much better. Will that fix anything? Probably too late, and too much water under the bridge from my losing control and loaded mouth. All we can do is go forward, and practice listening. That is what I have leaned.

 

there is nothing you can do about where your propensities have left you - no matter if your husband was the driving force to bring on these propensities. All you can do is go forward with much the advice we give others here.

 

Do not believe his angry words. You are beautiul. You are loved. The most important person in your life in the child. NC, focus on yourself. Happily give him what he asked for. Focus on what areas you believe you can improve on a person. That is all we can do.

 

my goal was to explain how I got this desease and to clarify that I was not saying you had symptoms of this desease. I hope I did that OK. We love DOT. Yas

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Firstly , I'm so sorry. I can empathize with you .

 

When you love someone and you feel like it's not reciprocated in a similar way, it's frustrating. You react, sometimes badly bad end up feeling guilty. When your in the middle of the situation, it's hard to see it with impartial clarity .

 

I know you love him, maybe though, he's just not right for you . You come across as a warm , loving , empathetic woman . You deserve someone who can love you fully.

 

To my dismay I also sometimes have a lot of words when I'd really prefer only a few. Unfortunately? When I try to curb it I end up saying nothing. (Workingon that one)

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lollipopspot

I'm sorry. This sounds like a very hard time for you.

 

I agree with others here - I am only reading the things that you think that you did wrong, and while it's important to look at yourself, a relationship is a co-creation.

 

I don't know what to say, but just be easy on yourself now. The most important things you have to do now are to take care of yourself and your daughter, and he can make his choice if he wants to come back and try to work on the family.

 

You're very smart, insightful, and have a lot of strengths. You'll get through this.

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dreamingoftigers
Oh no, DoT....... :(

 

Massive, but gentle hugs coming your way.

I've been reading your posts since you joined, so I'm aware of a lot of the history of your marriage & (and FOO) ---I know you've made huge efforts to make your marriage work.

 

And there were definitely times where you were the one doing all of the heavy lifting, to keep it together. So I also want to echo what BetrayedH said--please don't go down the road of self-blame.

 

I want you to know---and to take this to heart---You are held in very high regard here, by many---you will have support here , you're not alone.

 

I"m so sorry you're having to go through this hurt.

 

TY.

 

I know I made big efforts.

But I have my responsibilities too.

 

Everytime he wants to go theres something else I realize that I am doing to damage things.

 

He knows he's done pretty damaging things.

It doesn't change things like the fact that often I connect to people by being somewhat helpless against my overwhelming feelings.

 

When I met him I was severely depressed and crying all of the time over my ex.

He helped me through that.

But he did WAY more than that.

He showed me I didn't deserve what I got and that I was smart, special beautiful and fun.

 

All of that fell out the window for me when some of his issues became apparent.

 

I believed it was because I wasn't smart special beautiful or fun.

My insecurities became unmanageable.

I felt it was his job to build me back up considering he did before and I felt he tore me down.

I sought reassurance constantly.

Any time he would reassure me, I would argue with him.

I let him know over and over and over and over that his behaviour was untrustworthy and I didn't think he really loved me.

He started disappearing. And drinking.

He wanted to leave.

I would talk him into staying. Promising we would get him help.

We couldn't really afford it.

I burned through a lot of resources.

Neither one of us manages money well.

Stress was sky-high.

There were periods where he would try.

But I found his investments small considering how devastated I felt.

If I pushed, he would leave or blow up.

When he would try to go I would stand in front of the door.

I would beg and plead.

He felt trapped and controlled.

I felt insecure and scared. And fearful of the outcome.

Abandonment trigger and all........

 

It just felt like he was the only answer and he was withholding us having any kind of happiness.

 

Like if he would just try without assuming "it would always fail" then maybe we ciould have been happy.

 

But I wasn't happy either.

How does one convince oneself that they are lovable when they feel left behind by everyone that should have truly loved them?

 

I know I am supposed to see "his issues" as "his issues" and that he's troubled or can't manage.

 

But it doesn't feel that way at all.

It feels like he chose anything but me because I wasn't lovable enough.

 

And like instead of a wife, he views me as some kind of mother-figure

o just didn't take care of things "well enough" to make him happy.

And that I should have just "coped" with the addictions and "trusted he would handle it." When he showed me often that it looked like his real goal was trying to cover up is addictions so that I wouldn't get on his case about them.

 

I think sometimes he tried. But with the same "I am helpless and this will fail" mentality.

He says now he doesn't think he's capable of making those changes.

 

But the husband I know was capable of almost anything he wanted to be capable of.

 

I don't doubt he feels that way though.

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dreamingoftigers
I'm shocked, I had no idea. I'm so sorry. :(:(:( I send you all my care and support.

 

Other than that, it seems that your marriage has come to a dead end and in my humble opinion it's better that you take some time away from one another to just think and evaluate stuff. A relationship should not be so hard. It should be mainly easy going, or at least in the process of becoming easy going. It seems you are trapped in a complicated situation and your H does not want to make any effort anymore. I really really believe that it will be good for you to be alone for a while, focus on your daughter and on yourself, go to therapy, try to "find yourself". I know that a separation hurts like hell, but I'm sure you realize yourself that what you have right now is not a way a relationship should be, and even more when there's a kid involved. I'm sure you will be strong, and we're here to help as much as we can. I very consciously am not advising you to try to convince him to keep the family together cause I see this relationship destroys you little by little. It's better, in my opinion, for you to hurt much but for less time than little for more time. I'm 110% sure you'll survive cause you are a strong sensitive woman. I believe in you. We are here for you.

TY

 

I just wish we could've worked through our crap tigether instead of beibg emotionally exploded.

 

I am sure he feels better and more relieved right now.

But this trainwrecked my daughter and I.

 

My daughter keeps asking things that

I would have thought would be beyond her level.

Like "Daddy do you still love me? Daddy do you still love Mommy? Are you coming back?"

 

If I were him I would think my daughter is being manipulated to guilt me or something. Ugh.

It makes my stomach curdle.

My husband has a way of accusing me of things I would never do or consider. I feel like that one may be on the horizon.

Ugh.

 

I don't want my daughter to be asked things like "did Mommy tell you to say that?"

 

I am sick of "trying to find myself" at the moment.

I am right here......FOUND.

 

I am just tired from everything.

And now every responsibility just became mine with much fewer resources.

 

My family which usually throws money around like peanut shells is on the usual "kick them while their down tour."

 

My father has taken the opportunity to be extremely belligerent and explosive.

I know why.

Now the money would be a typical family obligation.

Instead of a way to control things or gain influence.

Even for my daughter's sake, solely, they won't help.

 

I am looking at losing my place and my childcare next month.

The stress is fever pitch.

 

Which means my husband will most likely back even further away as well.

I do love him but he's a Fair Weather Husband.

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GorillaTheater

Just saw this, Dreaming. I'm so sorry you find yourself in that place, and I'm sorry to realize that's probably small comfort. I'd sure take your pain away if I could.

 

You tried. You sure did try.

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dreamingoftigers
I'm really sorry to hear this Tigers.

 

I sometimes think the people we have relationships with are like stepping stones to help us climb to a place we want to get to.

 

They're important because they help you go someplace higher but they're beneath you just the same.

 

In time I hope you see him that way too.

 

(((thinking of you)))

 

I just don't think of them the same way.

 

They are supposed to be more important than anything except for sanity and safety.

They are supposed to last even if it means sacrifice.

Because the value of a loving relationship is so high.

 

I guess it only works if you both feel that way.

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I'm incredibly sorry to hear this DoT. I wish I had more to say to uplift you, but I'm hoping that things will alleviate soon.

 

Mme sends her regards :)

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Bittersweetie

DOT,

Hugs for you, I am so sorry to hear your latest news. I've always had a lot of respect for you, and the way you try to help others here. You are a very special soul. I will be sending positive thoughts your way.

BSW

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