Passive aggressive

[Shocked Suzie]

I've put these in the pinned section too, but wanted to share this as its really thrown some light on my personal situation and how I feel emotionally about myself. I'm a little angry with myself for not noticing/identifying this before and within my relationship...but as they say love is blind and he was very good at the below...such is life, he's the OW problem now thankfully.

 

 

I'd seen these behaviours in his brother "probably as he was more openly aggressive' than my ex...but had never put a label on it, just though his brother had a few mental issues.

 

 

Anyway it has also shed some light on myself which is a good start point for future relationships...enjoy the read and hope it helps others living with or separated from a PA person

 

 

The Boomerang Relationship: Passivity, Irresponsibility and Resulting Partner Anger - article by Dr. Lynne Namka

 

 

Divorcing a Passive Aggressive Spouse - Passive Aggressive Spouse

[RightThere]

I am a recovering passive aggressive person, and I can tell you I made my STBXW's life miserable from it.

 

It is an amazingly manipulative tool that is hard to notice until it is way too late.

[Shocked Suzie]

I am a recovering passive aggressive person, and I can tell you I made my STBXW's life miserable from it.

 

It is an amazingly manipulative tool that is hard to notice until it is way too late.

 

 

 

Wow that's something that you have recognized this and hopefully putting a handle on it now (which is a good/positive thing) in the second site it states what type of person marries a PA...so I too need to do some personal ground work, so I don't walk straight back into the same relationship style again...I will be honest he has left me with self esteem issue and self confusion...

 

 

putting myself back together again...sadly his PA behaviour and manipulation is showing when he is with my kids (my 16 yo) has stated she feeling guilty about standing her ground on how she feels...that's so wrong!

 

 

I'm lucky I can cut him out of my life...they cant

 

 

Good for you for seeing this issue, I know it will be hard to correct but at least you have identified and own it!

 

 

SS x

[RightThere]

I will be honest he has left me with self esteem issue and self confusion...

 

It does. It has the same effect as "gas-lighting" but I think is much more crippling to the person who is subject to passive aggressive behavior. The calmer I appear, the more aggravated you'll become.

 

Good for you for seeing this issue, I know it will be hard to correct but at least you have identified and own it!

 

Although my STBXW did some terrible things to me, this was something I recognize as a terrible thing I did to her. It damaged her and our relationship. Probably beyond any repair.

 

But I do own it. Many passive aggressive people will use it as their crutch forever. It's an easy tool for me to use, but it's not fair for me to do so.

[Shocked Suzie]

It does. It has the same effect as "gas-lighting" but I think is much more crippling to the person who is subject to passive aggressive behavior. The calmer I appear, the more aggravated you'll become.

 

 

 

Although my STBXW did some terrible things to me, this was something I recognize as a terrible thing I did to her. It damaged her and our relationship. Probably beyond any repair.

 

But I do own it. Many passive aggressive people will use it as their crutch forever. It's an easy tool for me to use, but it's not fair for me to do so.

 

 

would you highlight your PA to a future partner if you know the relationship could go the distance or try to not allow yourself to behave this way 'if that's possible' would be difficult to do.

 

 

Think if I had recognised it in our very early days I would have been happy to work with him...a lot of his issues are from his child/home life, although this is a joint thing that I also allowed...probably from my childhood of my mum being a bit of a doormat.

 

 

Its funny cause I haven't let anyone else treat me in this way...quite the opposite! just him...thing is HIS was a gradual chipping away. His brother is in your face with it, that's why I though my ex wasn't that way.

[RightThere]

would you highlight your PA to a future partner if you know the relationship could go the distance or try to not allow yourself to behave this way 'if that's possible' would be difficult to do.

 

It's pretty cliche for me to say it, but I don't think I'll be getting into another relationship. I'm still relatively young (under 40) but I think I'm going to be hung up on my STBXW for a while.

 

But to answer your question, my goal would be to not allow myself to behave this way. When I did it, I always knew what I was doing, so recognizing it is easy. And me putting a stop to it will be work, but it's something I want to make happen.

 

Think if I had recognised it in our very early days I would have been happy to work with him

 

I think that is part of the problem in mine (and many such relationships) is that it's hard to identify what's being done to you. Being passive aggressive is totally manipulative, but it makes the other person do all the work and change without really knowing what is happening. It's like a jedi mind trick. Only problem is that the other person is not in a trance, they are building resentment.

[Zahara]

I am a recovering passive aggressive person, and I can tell you I made my STBXW's life miserable from it.

 

It is an amazingly manipulative tool that is hard to notice until it is way too late.

 

Righthere, I'm curious. I used to experience the silent treatment everytime my ex-husband and I had a spat. Sometimes even for the smallest of things that weren't exactly in the form of an attack (as he would describe it) but just a disagreement i.e. he didn't do something that he said he was going to do and just being asked why or when, would send him into silence.

 

When we dated, if we had a disagreement, he would go days without talking to me and I, 99.9% of the time had to break the ice and when I did he pretended as if nothing ever happened. He could sometimes go for weeks with zero contact. Yes, I married him

 

What is going on in the mind of a PA, when they inflict the silent treatment? It is to punish? Or is it because they are finding it difficult to feel their emotions therefore articulate a resolution?

Edited January 31, 2014 by Zahara

[RightThere]

What is going on in the mind of a PA, when they inflict the silent treatment? It is to punish? Or is it because they are finding it difficult to feel their emotions therefore articulate a resolution?

 

If I'm being passive aggressive, I'm giving you the silent treatment as punishment. I want to force you to come to me asking "What's wrong" so I can unload on you about it. If I'm a real jerk about it, a "What's wrong" will result in a "nothing" from me coupled with some evil eyes to make you crazy thinking it's something really wrong.

 

My goal is to make your mind race about what I'm thinking or planning. In reality, I'm probably not even that bothered by it, or may have forgotten what I was mad about. But I'll keep up the ruse so as not to appear weak and maintain control.

 

But it's fair to say I was very detached from my emotions while being passive aggressive. But that is not the reason I'm giving you the silent treatment.

[Zahara]

If I'm being passive aggressive, I'm giving you the silent treatment as punishment. I want to force you to come to me asking "What's wrong" so I can unload on you about it. If I'm a real jerk about it, a "What's wrong" will result in a "nothing" from me coupled with some evil eyes to make you crazy thinking it's something really wrong.

 

My goal is to make your mind race about what I'm thinking or planning. In reality, I'm probably not even that bothered by it, or may have forgotten what I was mad about. But I'll keep up the ruse so as not to appear weak and maintain control.

 

But it's fair to say I was very detached from my emotions while being passive aggressive. But that is not the reason I'm giving you the silent treatment.

 

Thank you for this, RightThere. I did the "what's wrong", "please talk to me", "why are you being silent" everytime he would punish me, especially when we were dating. Especially hard for me when we weren't living together because as the days would go by without him uttering a word, it would drive me insane. And out of desperation I would have to break the ice. I remember crying for days and after a week of silence, I went by his house. The music was blasting, I could hear him singing in the garage. When I walked in, eyes swollen, heart thumping...he came to the door in a happy mood, "Hey there, what's up...come in." Continued doing what he was doing like nothing ever happened. And there I was suffering for a week. I kept asking myself, "How come he's normal about it and I was so devastated worrying about the relationship."

 

He gave me the silent treatment mostly when I voiced out my displeasure over something he did, voiced my needs and expectations, voiced my disagreement over how he handled his finances -- things that for some reason in his mind he perceived as an insult, a demand or an attack. At some point I was afraid to say anything because I didn't want to upset him, and therefore receive the silent treatment. I used to tell him that I would rather him yell and cuss at me than give me the silent treatment. Say something anything. He would do it once, twice and then go back to his usual.

 

He once told me he shut people out and he can make himself not feel, therefore not feeling affected by anyone. He would especially get annoyed if I cried about something. You could see the annoyance build up in his eyes.

 

Again, thank you for enlightening me. This is such an eye-opener.

Edited January 31, 2014 by Zahara

[Yasuandio]

I really enjoyed reading these articles SS, and appreciate your contribution to the Critcal Readings Thread. Thank You Hon! Yas

[Yasuandio]

Thank you for this, RightThere. I did the "what's wrong", "please talk to me", "why are you being silent" everytime he would punish me, especially when we were dating. Especially hard for me when we weren't living together because as the days would go by without him uttering a word, it would drive me insane. And out of desperation I would have to break the ice. I remember crying for days and after a week of silence, I went by his house. The music was blasting, I could hear him singing in the garage. When I walked in, eyes swollen, heart thumping...he came to the door in a happy mood, "Hey there, what's up...come in." Continued doing what he was doing like nothing ever happened. And there I was suffering for a week. I kept asking myself, "How come he's normal about it and I was so devastated worrying about the relationship."

 

He gave me the silent treatment mostly when I voiced out my displeasure over something he did, voiced my needs and expectations, voiced my disagreement over how he handled his finances -- things that for some reason in his mind he perceived as an insult, a demand or an attack. At some point I was afraid to say anything because I didn't want to upset him, and therefore receive the silent treatment. I used to tell him that I would rather him yell and cuss at me than give me the silent treatment. Say something anything. He would do it once, twice and then go back to his usual.

 

He once told me he shut people out and he can make himself not feel, therefore not feeling affected by anyone. He would especially get annoyed if I cried about something. You could see the annoyance build up in his eyes.

 

Again, thank you for enlightening me. This is such an eye-opener.

 

Zahara,

 

Your post was very insightful to me in a strange way. While my former husband had many of these same traits, I felt your same frustrations all the time. SS's articles really hit home. I was punished in every possible way with former husband's Passive-aggressive behavior. The worst was to be rejected as a woman - intimately, for years at a time (there is a link to an article about that very topic in SS's citations).

 

However, now that it is all over, and we've been apart five years, and finally divorced, I strangely feel much like how your boyfriend descibes himself in the bolded/underlined portion above. I feel stone cold. I have dropped probably my final friend last night - and I feel nothing. At my Mother's funeral, during same month of trial in August 2012, I felt nothing, and still feel nothing. I don't know what has happened to me. But it is real.

 

I used to be known as the kindest, sweetest person, with a very good heart. I think I still am. But you would never know it if you saw how cold I can be. I'm going to have to talk this over with the therapist. Thank you for telling your story, and giving me something to reflect upon. Yas

[RightThere]

The music was blasting, I could hear him singing in the garage. When I walked in, eyes swollen, heart thumping...he came to the door in a happy mood, "Hey there, what's up...come in." Continued doing what he was doing like nothing ever happened. And there I was suffering for a week. I kept asking myself, "How come he's normal about it and I was so devastated worrying about the relationship."

 

I will bet you that he was totally playing the game. He really was fine because whatever ticked him off before was long since forgotten. It was all about the control at that point. Seeing you in the state you were in was considered "success."

 

He once told me he shut people out and he can make himself not feel, therefore not feeling affected by anyone. He would especially get annoyed if I cried about something. You could see the annoyance build up in his eyes.

 

That is interesting. I don't know if that is a trait of passive aggressive people, or if it's just an interesting coincidence, but I can totally relate to that statement. And when people around me got emotional, like my STBXW, it made me totally uncomfortable.

[Zahara]

Hi Yas,

 

It was my ex-husband that behaved this way and I did date a guy that presented the same traits as well.

 

The sad part about it all is that most of the time, I would beat myself up so badly because 1) I didn't know what I did wrong 2) I desperately felt the need to fix it 3) I felt diminished and beat down. I felt crippled by my need to feel validated by him.

 

The guy I dated a few years after my divorce was married to a woman that cheated and did some horrible things to him. There was a high degree of emasculation in the marriage and for some reason I think he used to treat me that way because that was his way of controling me and securing a position of power that he once lacked. I can see how one can repress their emotions to such a point whereby all they feel is a sense of numbness. Unfortunately, I had to take the brunt of his past.

 

I can safely say I was emotionally empty and it took a few years for that to change. Like you, people used to say that I was a sweet, loving and generous person and that it was a shame that I was not wanting to go out and meet people. Little did they know, I had nothing to give. I'm better now and while I am still single, I'm finding that eventhough I am open and would welcome the idea of loving again, I'm securely happy and content with just being by myself.

[Zahara]

I will bet you that he was totally playing the game. He really was fine because whatever ticked him off before was long since forgotten. It was all about the control at that point. Seeing you in the state you were in was considered "success."

 

 

 

That is interesting. I don't know if that is a trait of passive aggressive people, or if it's just an interesting coincidence, but I can totally relate to that statement. And when people around me got emotional, like my STBXW, it made me totally uncomfortable.

 

I felt that "success" vibe from him whenever I would reach out. There was only one time that he reached out to me after spat when we were dating. Silence that lasted for nearly 5 weeks. He reached out. I have a feeling at that point he knew he was losing control.

 

Yes, he hated it when I was emotional. His eyes would go all funny and he would ask me why I'm crying with contempt or just shut me out.

[MsOptimist]

Very helpful thread for me too, both the articles and conversation. The first article could have been written about my exH and his dynamics with his parents.

 

Zahara, your exH sounds very much like mine was. He got very annoyed and uncomfortable when I'd cry.

 

He always made me feel like I was weak for being so emotional. It wasn't until we separated that I realized just how much I was walking on eggshells so as to not upset him and get the silent treatment. At the end of our marriage he really had me questioning if I really was the crazy one. I definitely played into the dynamics of a dysfunctional relationship and was codependent, but I wasn't crazy. Most of the time I was simply hurt.

 

One thing I hated the most was his lack of eye contact. If he was annoyed with something he'd not look at me at all and just give off a stone cold vibe. Or just give me a quick steely glance and continue whatever he was doing.

[Zahara]

One thing I hated the most was his lack of eye contact. If he was annoyed with something he'd not look at me at all and just give off a stone cold vibe. Or just give me a quick steely glance and continue whatever he was doing.

 

Yes, when my exH was in his state of PA, he would never make eye contact. When we would argue, he'd either stare at the TV, nod his head staring elsewhere or mumble a few words and walk away while I was talking. Even after the conversation, if everything settled, he wouldn't come and hold me, apologize (hardest most difficult thing for him to do) or get close. He'd just sit there motionless.

 

I'm not sure if this is relevant or a trait, but when we were intimate, he couldn't make eye contact. I am not sure if that was a way to stay disconnected as well. And after intimacy, there was no affection. He'd go to sleep with his back facing me, he'd either tap me on the arm and say goodnight or he'd turn his back. It was between two extremes because then there would be times he would want to cuddle and be all cute and sweet.

 

My god, I was starved for affection. So sad.

[MsOptimist]

Yes, when my exH was in his state of PA, he would never make eye contact. When we would argue, he'd either stare at the TV, nod his head staring elsewhere or mumble a few words and walk away while I was talking. Even after the conversation, if everything settled, he wouldn't come and hold me, apologize (hardest most difficult thing for him to do) or get close. He'd just sit there motionless.

 

I'm not sure if this is relevant or a trait, but when we were intimate, he couldn't make eye contact. I am not sure if that was a way to stay disconnected as well. And after intimacy, there was no affection. He'd go to sleep with his back facing me, he'd either tap me on the arm and say goodnight or he'd turn his back. It was between two extremes because then there would be times he would want to cuddle and be all cute and sweet.

 

My god, I was starved for affection. So sad.

 

I was so starved for affection too. Everything you said was how my exH acted. He could NEVER apologize, he could never hug me or comfort me when I was upset (whether it was over an issue between us or, say, a family matter I was dealing with). He would stare at the TV or computer or a book and basically act like I wasn't even there.

 

My parents had major communication issues and growing up I'd remember arguments where everyone went silent for hours/days and suddenly acted like nothing happened. I hated that.

 

When my exH and I would argue and he'd withdraw I'd take a step back to think about the situation logically (something he can identify with), and eventually try to talk things out with him, and apologize for anything on my end. In the end I did WAY too much apologizing. He'd continue the PA attitude and act like I was wasting his time, that he was over it, and that I was way too emotional. But clearly nothing had been resolved and I tried so hard to communicate with him.

 

He never gave me affection outside of the bedroom, and even then it was limited. Sure we'd cuddle on the couch or in bed at times, but mostly it was me begging for affection.

 

I am so very thankful for my boyfriend who is very in tune with his emotions and my emotional needs. We are both naturally affectionate people and wow it is amazing to be able to share my emotions and affections freely. I was so disgusted with what I put up with in my marriage that if any man comes along with these PA traits I will run for the hills.

[Zahara]

The guy I dated years after my divorce, couldn't comfort me, whether it was not knowing how or if he just didn't want to be bothered. I remember losing a loved one when we were dating and I sent him a long text, just rambling about my hurt and sadness, feeling alone in my apartment -- it was a long text and he replied with just two short sentences. And he never checked on me until the following day, going on about his plans for the day. Emotionally detached.

 

My parents were like yours. They would fight and retreat in their corners for weeks without speaking to each other. I was the go between. Go and tell/ask your father. Go and tell/ask your mother. I hated it. I'm sure I've picked up on a few traits..."nothing" being one of them when I am clearly upset about something. After reading the links, I'm now trying to see if I've behaved in worse ways.

 

I apologized way too many times, in my marriage and in that relationship. Most times when it wasn't even my fault. And when I did, just like you experienced, they'd look at me as if I was harping on it when what I wanted was to talk about it and find ways to resolve our issues so that it doesn't happen again. That was just their way of not wanting to deal with it because all they ever cared about was control...it was never about change or the need to strive for a healthy relationship.

[RightThere]

I'm not sure if this is relevant or a trait, but when we were intimate, he couldn't make eye contact. I am not sure if that was a way to stay disconnected as well. And after intimacy, there was no affection. He'd go to sleep with his back facing me, he'd either tap me on the arm and say goodnight or he'd turn his back. It was between two extremes because then there would be times he would want to cuddle and be all cute and sweet.

 

My god, I was starved for affection. So sad.

 

It wasn't part of my gameplan for being passive aggressive, but this was often how I was as well just because of my level of comfortableness with that intimacy and connection.

 

My STBXW was also starved for affection. One of the reasons she started looking outside of our marriage for it.

[MsOptimist]

Thanks for being so honest, RightThere. It's very interesting hearing from someone who recognized that in himself. I'll have to go and read more of your story, but have you begun to make any noticeable changes to your communication style?

 

My current bf thus far has been great with showing affection and taking my emotions into consideration. I also closely watch how he relates to his kids and he's very emotionally connected and affectionate with them, which is really nice to see.

 

I feel like sometimes I'm on guard for those PA red flags to appear, but it's actually been the opposite so far. We've had a couple disagreements where I used a PA phrase or attitude on him and he called me out on it immediately. I'm glad he did and we talked through it. His directness is helping me to be less conflict avoidant.

 

It's a welcome change in what I believe is a much healthier relationship. Time will tell, but this time I am prepared to walk from anyone who seems emotionally disengaged. That's a big change from how I used to be. No more putting up with a lot less than I deserve.

[RightThere]

Thanks for being so honest, RightThere. It's very interesting hearing from someone who recognized that in himself. I'll have to go and read more of your story, but have you begun to make any noticeable changes to your communication style?

 

I definitely have learned to "be in the moment" more. If I'm talking to someone, playing with my daughter, or anything, you get my undivided attention. It helps to build that connection, and I've found myself feeling much better about that relationship I've built with that other person.

 

I'm also working on saying what I want. I always thought I would say what was on my mind, but it was more opinions, and not communicating what I wanted or needed. If I communicate what I want or need, there is no need for me to play a passive aggressive game in order to get what I want.

 

And because I'm aware of it, I try to stop myself if I find I'm being passive aggressive. My STBXW and I aren't together, so I don't have anyone who I know can call me out on my B.S. So I've reliant on myself right now to identify it and stop it in its tracks.

[Shocked Suzie]

It's pretty cliche for me to say it, but I don't think I'll be getting into another relationship. I'm still relatively young (under 40) but I think I'm going to be hung up on my STBXW for a while.

 

I'm in no rush either, not because I'm hung up on my ex though, just because I'm happy as I am atm and happy thinking of me for a change...didn't realise how much I used to focus him so much.

 

But to answer your question, my goal would be to not allow myself to behave this way. When I did it, I always knew what I was doing, so recognizing it is easy. And me putting a stop to it will be work, but it's something I want to make happen.

 

 

That's good that you recognise it, I wonder if my ex does...

 

I think that is part of the problem in mine (and many such relationships) is that it's hard to identify what's being done to you. Being passive aggressive is totally manipulative, but it makes the other person do all the work and change without really knowing what is happening. It's like a jedi mind trick. Only problem is that the other person is not in a trance, they are building resentment.

 

 

 

I'm actually angry with myself for not seeing it, I usually can pick people so quickly...it's quite unreal

[Shocked Suzie]

I used to be known as the kindest, sweetest person, with a very good heart. I think I still am. But you would never know it if you saw how cold I can be. I'm going to have to talk this over with the therapist. Thank you for telling your story, and giving me something to reflect upon.

 

 

 

 

Yas...now I know what I was fully dealing with I think these links have given me something to work from...I have been left feeling so confused, trying to work out where 'I' went wrong!?! and I know that's so stupid! I know that I have to own some of the break down blame, but before he left I thought I had a good marriage...early days after he left I felt relaxed in my home, closer to my kids and didn't really miss him at all...I saw pretty quickly 'his manipulative tactics' when he made any contact, inc with the children...cant believe I never saw them before!

 

 

Its going to take me some time to want to attempt to get into another relationship purely because I'm stunned, I too feel different within myself (not necessarily in a good way either) ive always been pretty content person...not so much so now.

 

 

Did you read on the second link the part about 'what type of person marries a PA' ....something that I too want to talk through with a therapy session...glad I found this info before meeting anyone else.

 

 

SS x

[Shocked Suzie]

I'm also working on saying what I want. I always thought I would say what was on my mind, but it was more opinions, and not communicating what I wanted or needed. If I communicate what I want or need, there is no need for me to play a passive aggressive game in order to get what I want.

 

 

RightThere, in the link it says that saying what you actually want isn't done, so this is great!...I've also read that its pretty rare for a person to recognize that they are PA, so again good on you and yes thanks for your honesty

[Shocked Suzie]

I actually felt isolated in my own home, i felt like an outsider around him and my children...of course like everything whenever i said anything along the lines of this i would get the blame...he told me that i had virtually no relationship with my kids, he without doubt did this intentionally..but i believed him and again would really look at me...oh my! the list is endless, makes me feel really sad when i think back, he made me feel guilty about a lot of things and made me feel like i was a bad person...

 

 

...He's toxic, just hope i can recondition myself (i feel fine apart from the though of future relationships) hope this changes

 

 

SS x

Edited February 1, 2014 by Shocked Suzie