Am I blind?

[damagedheart]

Hi Everyone,

 

I've been a lurker here for a long time. I’ve wanted to ask for help before but part of me was hoping I could fix the problems with my marriage on my own.

 

I'm not looking for people to feel or side with me. I am looking for impartial advice. This will be a long read but I hope someone out there can help. Here is my story.

 

In 2000 I met Steph through a friend, we immediately hit it off. We were both young, she was 19 and I was 20 at the time. Things just clicked and we couldn’t get enough of each other. At the time, she had a boyfriend of 4 years. She told me, that he did not treat her well but loved him. Her relationship with him had alienated her friends and her mother. Her mother would not speak with her and she moved out at 18.

 

Our relationship quickly progressed and we were intimate within a few weeks of meeting each other. She led him to believe we were just friends for a while but eventually the truth came out and she was forced to make a decision. She chooses him and screamed at me to leave her alone. I did and we stop all communication. I was heartbroken for months. Over the next little while I had 2 short term relationships but nothing meaningful because I was still in love with her.

 

It was maybe 9 months since our last encounter and by chance we were at the same club together. We flirted and I offered to give her a ride home. She resisted at first but we ended back up at my place and we slept together. We both confessed how much we had missed each other and wanted to be together. So for the next year she worked on getting away from her ex-boyfriend. He was abusive and threatened her family and her if she left. I knew he was always going to be a problem for us so in 2004 we moved to another city.

 

Things were great for the first little while but she wanted to get married. I saved up for a year until I could afford to buy her the ring I felt she deserved. We were engaged. Around the same time, I began playing an online game that basically engulfed my life for a year. I was not a good fiancé and I was ignoring her. During this period of time, she had made new friends from work. One of these friends she tried to integrate into our lives. He wanted to play this online game with me, he wanted to chat on the phone with me and wanted to be my friend. Weeks before we were to be married, I learned that she had been cheating on me with this person for more than half a year. I was furious, I was going to call off the wedding and leave her. She had said it was a mistake and that she really wanted to be with me. She told me that they did had kissed but swore to me that they had not had sex.

 

I took time to think about this and realized that I had been ignoring her for months and I was partial to blame for pushing her away. I loved her so much and decided I would marry her. We married in the summer of 2006.

 

In 2007 I was suspicious of her activities. When I confronted her about them, she confessed that she had gone over to a male coworker’s home after work to “hang out”. She said she didn’t tell me because nothing happened and they were just friends. Not much later, that coworker had left the company and she hated him. Based on my past experience with her, it was hard for me to let this go.

 

Then again later in 2007, I learned she had another relationship with her boss. She told me she had dinners together and she had kissed him. I found text messages on her phone asking her to come see him privately in his office. She ended that relationship and switched jobs.

 

She was unhappy with her work and her life. I suggested that maybe we both needed some time away, so from 2009 to 2010 we spent about 2 years travelling the world. I work mainly remotely and she did not need to work. Things seemed to be really good between us. Toward the end of our trip, she kept bringing up wanting to have a child. At the start of our relationship, neither of us wanted children. I did not want children at that time so it caused conflict for us.

 

At the end of our trip in 2010, we settled in a small town. She got a fresh start and started a new career. The first year was ok but by year two I was miserable. I told her constantly how unhappy I was living in this town. I had no friends and all I did was work. She made new friends and her family were only an hour drive away. The topic of children kept coming up more and more. Between me hating living there and her wanting children, there was constant conflict in our marriage. She felt that I should be happy with what I had.

 

In October 2012, I discovered that she had an affair with someone. She told me that she was looking for her options. She wanted to be happy, to have a family and to live near her family. This affair didn’t last long as I discovered it within a few weeks of it starting. Basically she called an ex and slept with him the same day. They had not had contact in 10 years prior to that. When I confronted him, he said she had told him that she has been wanting to leave me for months.

 

I was devastated. I left and moved out back to the city I wanted to be in and tried to be happy. Meanwhile, she BEGGED me to stay. I agreed to go to some couples counselling sessions with her. I think she felt the councillor was bias against her and stopped going. In the spring of 2013, she moved back to this city where I was happy to try to rebuild our relationship. She took her old job back and we tried to work things through. She is not happy living here and I don’t think she likes her job either.

 

Things seemed pretty good between us for the most part for the rest of the year. She still kept pushing to have children. I just don’t know if I could have children with a woman that could so easily give up on me. She started feeling like she was making all the concessions in our marriage now. She was living somewhere she did not want to be, I did not want to have children, and she was working at a job she did not find fulfilling.

 

So here we are in January 2014. Out of the blue while I was planning a trip for us, she tells me that I should stop. She wants to separate. I was surprised but I agreed that if that’s what she needed then I’m ok with that.

 

I started digging and discovered a credit card in her purse. I confront her about the card and she reluctantly tells me truth. She tells me for the past few months, she has been getting closed to another ex-coworker. He is having problems with his marriage and what started out innocent is now very grey.

She tells me that he cares very much of her and just wanted her to be ok which is why he got her the credit card. She confessed they kissed but stopped it at that point because he has kids and she wasn’t sure what she wanted. When I confronted this person, he tells me he was just being her friend. He was telling her to stay and try and work things out. To not walk away from a 14 year relationship. He also said that she has been wanting to leave me for months. I'm not sure what to believe.

 

We are still living together right now; she tells me that she loves me. We are still intimate and I still care for her very much. This weekend she will be moving into her own apartment. She has now finally told me the truth about everything. She slept with the man she cheated on me with before we got married and she also slept with the coworker after we were married. So in total she has had 3 sexual affairs and 2 more emotional affairs. She wants a separation to decide if she wants to be married or single and if she can be devoted to me.

 

Obviously there is always two sides to every story. I tried to be fair.

 

Can anyone help me understand why I am still fighting for this marriage?

How do you walk away from someone that you've spent half of your life with and still love.

 

Am I just blind?

 

Help

Edited January 30, 2014 by damagedheart

[RuralGuy]

Thankfully you don't have any kids together.

 

 

She's admitting to having 5 affairs while you've been together, 3 of them sexual?

 

 

Get out while the getting is good.

 

 

This woman is not going to stop having sex with other men.

 

 

This woman is not going to stop hurting you.

 

 

If you do have sex with her again, make sure that you use condoms. Aside from making sure that you don't have children with her (which will make everything that much worse), you don't know if she's picked up any STDs from all her sleeping around on you.

 

 

BTW, studies show that up to 30% of the children that men think are biologically their children, are not.

[damagedheart]

Thanks for you response.

 

You're absolutely right about being thankful for not having children. It would only make things worst.

 

I made her go get tested after her last affair.

[RightThere]

I can tell you my story is very similar. Multiple affairs, wanting to leave for a long time. Only big difference is you've know about the affairs as they've come up. My STBXW's were all discovered at the same time.

 

To answer your question, why do you you want to fight for your marriage? Because you love your wife, but you also love what you "think" she is. You're not actually seeing who she really is.

 

She is someone who wants to have the excitement of affairs, but wants you around as her safety net for all the difficult parts of life.

 

She can't have both unless you're willing to let her. She needs some time to herself to realize that without her safety net, life requires her to make some choices.

 

I'm sure you've got very mixed emotions right now. But don't sit on the fence. You and your wife either need to get all in on your marriage (both of you) or you need to get all out of it.

 

Good luck.

[Yasuandio]

Let me answer your question aprori:

 

Yep, you're blind alright. Blinded by, and addicted to love chemicals.

 

Now, let's get down to brass tacks. You are an excellent writer, and have posed the scenerio quite susinctly. Your situation is fairly easy to diagnose.

 

1. Firstly, you are married to a serial cheater.

 

2. She wants to hook you up with a child so to keep a financial and emotional leech around your neck whilst serial cheating on the side.

 

3. Many people might agree that serial cheaters are not the best role models for children.

 

4. Since it appears that your wife is a serial cheater, there is a good chance a divorce might be in your future. Should you have a child or children, you must consider the ramifications of your offsprings' time spent with you wife. It entirely possible your kids may meet your wife's multiple partners over the next 18 years. This situation won't only antagonize you, but could cause the kids confusion.

 

5. Therefore, I am strongly warning you right now, to keep a big stock of raincoats on hand, dude. And do not allow her access to them. I would not put it past her to punch tiny needle holes thru the packages.

 

6. You can be confident, that what you know thus far, is only a portion of the story. Furthermore, for your saftey and that of the affair partner, the stories has been probably been re-told to you with a less than a "PG" rating. Be advised the reality of the ratings are probably closer to "R" or more likely "XXX."

 

7. You cannot change the character or conduct of a serial cheater (as you've come to find out).

 

8. Serial cheaters are more likely to bring home an STD than a monogomous, trustworthy partner.

 

That is just off the top of my head. I bet I could come up with many more reasons why you need to eliminate this serial cheater from your life. Since you are addicted, (and I totally get that), you have to go cold turkey NC. It is the only way, period. And this NC is not to try to get her back, or get her to miss you, or try to change her, none of that. You have to quit her like a bad habit. NC. Cold Turkey. Disappear yourself and your stuff. Change your number, etc.

 

Get an attorney to handle everything. Do not even try mediation unless it is required by the court, If so, you are in a different rooms and there is no way to run into her - and make sure she has left the building before you exit. I'm telling you this because she is a drug of choice for you and you cannot lay eyes on her.

 

When you think of her, imagine her bending over the boss' desk, and getting it from behind, and her moans and groans heard in the office corridors by other personnel. Sickening, huh? You want your child to come from that canal? Really? Those are the images you need to plant in your mind. Porn images of what she really did. Get real man. I can get real. I can get real graphic if you need more visuals. But you can do it yourself until the drug makes you want to puke. Just trying help you. Yas

Edited January 30, 2014 by Yasuandio
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[damagedheart]

I know she is a serial cheater.

 

Last weekend we calmly worked out a separation agreement. A divorce would not be messy.

 

She tells me that she wants some time before either of us makes any rash decisions. That is why she is moving out this weekend. So she can have time to herself, to reflect on what she has done, if she can be faithful and if she wants to stay in this marriage.

 

Is it ok to give her the time to decide on what she wants before I decide?

[RightThere]

Is it ok to give her the time to decide on what she wants before I decide?

 

Totally. But don't base your decision on what she decides to do.

 

You need to decide what is best for you. Even if you are choosing to reconcile, you need to have guidelines as to what you will need from her in order to make that happen. If she can't do them, then you need to be able to say that you have decided to separate then.

 

And yeah, it's a lot to process, so no need to make quick decisions. But make sure you are looking after yourself.

 

My STBXW is a serial cheater as well. The fog that they live in is so strong, reality cannot penetrate it. You need to understand that. Because if you're hoping she'll "come to her senses" it is not that easy. They can go years after something like this before they even start to get a clue about what they've done and how it's impacted you.

[Yasuandio]

I know she is a serial cheater.

 

Last weekend we calmly worked out a separation agreement. A divorce would not be messy.

 

She tells me that she wants some time before either of us makes any rash decisions. That is why she is moving out this weekend. So she can have time to herself, to reflect on what she has done, if she can be faithful and if she wants to stay in this marriage.

 

Is it ok to give her the time to decide on what she wants before I decide?

 

It is OK for you to do whatever you want to do.

 

But if you think you have a marriage when your wife is a serial cheater you are dreaming, man. And some reflection time ain't gonna change her spots.

 

I feel real sorry for you. I hope you wake up. Yas

[damagedheart]

It is OK for you to do whatever you want to do.

 

But if you think you have a marriage when your wife is a serial cheater you are dreaming, man. And some reflection time ain't gonna change her spots.

 

I feel real sorry for you. I hope you wake up. Yas

 

 

 

What you say is probably right, it is just difficult to hear and face. Thank you.

[damagedheart]

Totally. But don't base your decision on what she decides to do.

 

You need to decide what is best for you. Even if you are choosing to reconcile, you need to have guidelines as to what you will need from her in order to make that happen. If she can't do them, then you need to be able to say that you have decided to separate then.

 

And yeah, it's a lot to process, so no need to make quick decisions. But make sure you are looking after yourself.

 

My STBXW is a serial cheater as well. The fog that they live in is so strong, reality cannot penetrate it. You need to understand that. Because if you're hoping she'll "come to her senses" it is not that easy. They can go years after something like this before they even start to get a clue about what they've done and how it's impacted you.

 

 

RightThere: Thank you for your words. You probably understand what I'm going through better than most. Did you try to reconcile or did you just walk away? How did you do it if you don't mind sharing?

[RightThere]

RightThere: Thank you for your words. You probably understand what I'm going through better than most. Did you try to reconcile or did you just walk away? How did you do it if you don't mind sharing?

 

My thread is here:

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/breaking-up-reconciliation-coping/separation-divorce/413444-here-goes

 

If you've got lots of time, I've tried to keep it as a chronicle of everything I've gone through from the start.

 

The short version of it was yes, I did try to reconcile with her. But it was really just a "fake" reconciliation because I tried to commit myself 100% to reconciling while she was only partially in. It does not work.

 

As hard as it was (and still is) I finally decided to "set her free" because she wouldn't actually decide one way or another. It has allowed me to grow tremendously and also learn from my mistakes throughout our marriage and afterwards.

 

I still have the door open to reconciliation a "tiny, tiny" bit, but I know what I need to make it possible to work and I can't accept anything less than that.

 

And it's OK to still love the thought of what your wife was. But you have to realize it is not who she truly is. Accepting that is hard, but anything you try to do with her going forward is going to be with the real person your wife is, not the image of her that is in your head.

[Smthn_Like_Olivia]

Damagedheart -

 

I truly feel for you and your pain and struggle. I was married to a serial cheater for 10 years. You've been living in this cloud of lies and infidelity so long that it's become easier for you to just sweep it under the rug and try to hold on to this farce of a marriage.

 

It took me 10 years to realize that you cannot change or make better someone or a situation where that person does not have a full grasp of what it means to truly love someone. This is NOT her decision to make. It is yours.

 

No one here can convince you of what you need to do, but I will tell you this. When you finally decide to let go and walk away, when the fog finally lifts, you will view all of this in a completely different light. There IS a woman out there for you that understands what love and devotion means, and when you find her, you will regret the years you wasted in heartache and misery.

 

For the first time in my life, I am experiencing a relationship of true love and devotion and I can't even explain how foreign, yet peaceful it feels. I truly hope that you can someday experience the same.

[No Limit]

You are not happy with the idea of being with a serial cheater. And yeah, thank God you two don't have kids together, though you should not immediately expect to become a father should she suddenly tell you she's pregnant.

 

And she isn't happy either. Not happy where she lives, nor' where she works.

She's just glad she's found someone who tolerates her behavior.

 

Best of luck, although all signs lead clearly to only one direction.

[damagedheart]

Damagedheart -

 

I truly feel for you and your pain and struggle. I was married to a serial cheater for 10 years. You've been living in this cloud of lies and infidelity so long that it's become easier for you to just sweep it under the rug and try to hold on to this farce of a marriage.

 

It took me 10 years to realize that you cannot change or make better someone or a situation where that person does not have a full grasp of what it means to truly love someone. This is NOT her decision to make. It is yours.

 

No one here can convince you of what you need to do, but I will tell you this. When you finally decide to let go and walk away, when the fog finally lifts, you will view all of this in a completely different light. There IS a woman out there for you that understands what love and devotion means, and when you find her, you will regret the years you wasted in heartache and misery.

 

For the first time in my life, I am experiencing a relationship of true love and devotion and I can't even explain how foreign, yet peaceful it feels. I truly hope that you can someday experience the same.

 

 

 

 

Thank you for sharing. It is difficult to see any light at the end of the tunnel right now but your words are encouraging.

I am happy to hear that you've found love again. It gives me hope.

[Trep]

May also want to keep in mind that having her own apartment is going to make it all that much easier to cheat on you.

[Yasuandio]

What you say is probably right, it is just difficult to hear and face. Thank you.

 

When someone gave me the straight scoop, I didn't want to believe it. So you are much smarter than I am. Besides the mistreatment I endured, I wasted a five years snooping around (like an amature) in all the wrong places. Then I spent the next year completely depressed from his obvious cheating, and it took four more years to get divorced from him because he was completely uncooperative. It is a year past the divorce, and I am still dealing with aggravation. That sir, is a decade. I didn't have a marriage then and I certainly don't have one now.

 

I applaud you. You can face the facts. You know what is true in your brain and heart - you are not really wondering when it comes down to the brass tacks. That is clear from your response to my post. I wish I could go back in time and use my common sense, but it is too late. It is not too late for you though! Good luck. Yas

[RightThere]

May also want to keep in mind that having her own apartment is going to make it all that much easier to cheat on you.

 

Cheating will happen regardless of them living together or separate as long as she wants to cheat.

 

Him trying the keep tabs on her by staying together will do nothing to repair the relationship, and only make things much worse.

[Chi townD]

I know she is a serial cheater.

 

Last weekend we calmly worked out a separation agreement. A divorce would not be messy.

 

She tells me that she wants some time before either of us makes any rash decisions. That is why she is moving out this weekend. So she can have time to herself, to reflect on what she has done, if she can be faithful and if she wants to stay in this marriage.

 

Is it ok to give her the time to decide on what she wants before I decide?

 

Dude, How many chances have you given her already? How many time did she beg for you back and you came back and she cheated AGAIN?!?! Giving her a chance through marriage counseling and gave up because SHE didn't like what she was hearing?

 

Dude, she's not putting in the work. She's not SHOWING you anything that she's trying to fix herself or the problems in the marriage and she's never shown you any real remorse!

 

Here's a 2x4 to the back of the head. The only person that has been in this marriage from the being is you and ONLY you.

 

Time to let her go, dude. Time to move on with your life and trust me when I say this. You're going to find a girl that is going to knock your socks off and you'll be kicking yourself in the ass for not getting rid of her sooner.

[damagedheart]

We chatted last night about the upcoming separation this weekend.

 

I told her I was angry that she had put me at risk of STDs and asked her to reflect on what she has done.

 

I asked her "what has she gained from all this infidelity?"

Some short term pleasure for what?

 

She is remorseful and we can talk calmly. I think we are both leaning toward walking away. She feels she has done too much damaged and I'm trying to let go.

 

I guess the next little while apart will make things become more clear. Thank you everyone for your words. It helps.

[beach]

Is there really any reason to stay with a serial cheater?

[damagedheart]

Is there really any reason to stay with a serial cheater?

 

 

Logically no.

 

But love and logic don't always go hand in hand

 

I'm just dealing with it one day at a time.

[RightThere]

Logically no.

 

But love and logic don't always go hand in hand

 

I'm just dealing with it one day at a time.

 

I was (and am) there too my friend. The head and the heart. They cannot want the same thing. Using one too much will betray the other.

 

No matter what anyone here tells you, all you need to do right now is take it one day at a time. No one here has the answers. They only have opinions and information. Take it all in and take your time. Just be open to accepting all the information (and opinions) and you'll make the best decision for you.

[damagedheart]

I was (and am) there too my friend. The head and the heart. They cannot want the same thing. Using one too much will betray the other.

 

No matter what anyone here tells you, all you need to do right now is take it one day at a time. No one here has the answers. They only have opinions and information. Take it all in and take your time. Just be open to accepting all the information (and opinions) and you'll make the best decision for you.

 

 

Thanks Rightthere: I've made it through 15 pages of your thread now... our story is very similar

[TheBladeRunner]

Man OP, sorry to hear you are dealing with this. Funny how the WS "needs time" decide what they need to do. I went through the same thing and she also wanted "time", a "trial separation".....a trial to have her cake and eat it too. I decided for her as at this point I was so devastated that I needed to take care of me. After DDay it was no longer her decision what happened in my life as far as I was concerned.

 

Thanks your lucky stars my friend that are are no kids. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't trade my daughter for the world, but it does make it harder as I have to see and deal with my XW quite a bit. My thoughts are that she has had multiple affairs and she will more than likely continue. I decided early on that I was not going to be second place and/or a safety net. It all sucks, everything in your life will change, but it sure beats being treated as she is treating you. Good luck, it'll all work out one way or the other.

[Oberfeldwebel]

No I don't think you are blind. You have been aware of her behavior and have explained it quite concisely. Your issue is not being blind, but what to do with the information. You don't agree on where to live, children and naturally infidelity. I think RightThere is correct that you are lamenting the relationship that you desire more than the relationship that actually exists. I don't think that she is confused in what she wants. It seems as if she was buying time to see if the other relationship developed satisfactory to make the jump. The problem with this is, eventually she will make the jump. One person can't reconcile the relationship, trust me I tried this. I'm not telling you to divorce as only you can make that decision, but you have to see the relationship for what it is in truth. The best indication of future behavior is past behavior. Her behavior has been pretty consistent, though not very promising for a relationship.