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Packing, what now?


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I am in the middle of packing my bags. My H and I have been talking about divorce and seperation for a few months. It started again today, we were at the zoo and feeding the Girraffs, and my H wanted to get it on video, so I thought he was ready so I fed it and then video taped him. He said he did not get me and that I was rude for not asking if he was ready. I said I was sorry but that was not enough, he left the zoo. Luckily we took our scooters so I was able to get home and was not stranded. This felt like it was it, the last argument. So when I got home I asked my H to leave so I could pack my things. About 10 min later I called him saying this is too big of a decision to just make, that we needed to talk. I still love my H, but we just can't seem to make things work. We both mention the D word when we fight (most likly to manipulate the other) and both agree we are not sure if this will last.

 

So my questions, is what now? I mean I really love him, but this has gotten so hard.

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So I am finished packing and my H is still gone, I called him because I needed to make sure he was safe. He said he was and is very depressed and he has thought about killing himself (which he could do, we have four guns in the house). I don't know if he would, he is very smart and even said his inteligence tells him not to.

 

He is mad because I have not been picking up more around the house like I said I would. I told him it's because I am depressed and have not felt like doing much, but spend time with him.

 

I think I may have given up because for so long everything was my fault, I was too emotional and had to get over my H and his porn. Then one day I did get over it, all of it. I was told for 5 years, I was to sensative and it's all my low self esteem, my lack of trust that was ruining our relationship. Then, I just realized that I did not want to live like this anymore. That I did not want our intimacy to come 2nd. So when I finally said it was over and he said he was willing to work on it, I guess I did not know what to do. I thougt I did, I thought I was giving it 100% but he made me realize that I really wasn't. Now, I was the one not trying! I guess I stopped caring, not for him because I do love him, but about trying to make it work, I just gave up.

 

I feel aweful, I love him, but we are making each other unhappy. We fight all the time and make the other person feel like we don't care anymore. But we do! We really love each other we just can't seem to be nice to each other. We were having a great weekend, minus a few arguments about small things and now I am packing up my things. We even talked about how excited we were to have the day off together tomorrow.

 

My H is on his way to his brothers and I am just sitting here with a bad heahache from crying feeling guilty. I want to leave, but I want to stay. I want to leave because I don't want to cry anymore, or feel guilty or depressed. I also don't want to hurt my H. However, I love him. As he said we are waiting for the straw to break the camels back.

 

I would feel better if I knew he was going to be okay. I could leave thinking I did what was best for both of us if I knew he would be okay, safe!

 

I could really use some advice. Please!!!!

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Did I read that correctly? Your husband left you at the zoo because you didn't ask him if he was ready for you to videotape him? Whaaaaa?

 

And then you went home and packed?

 

If I read that right...wow. What a big baby he is. Frankly, not to be rude but you both sound much to immature for marriage. How old are you both?

 

Marriage is for mature people. It just doesn't work if you're both childish.

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Just curious as to how long you both have been together?

 

I mean if you're both fighting about the timing regarding videotaping feeding the giraffe at the zoo how are you going to handle more serious issues like child-rearing, finances, family issues, etc. etc.

 

Anyway, why not wait until you both calm down and discuss things? Make some changes in yoru relationship or end it. Talk about specific things you will each do and DO them...or else end it.

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I guess I should have included some more information. I have actually posted here a few times, mostly as a guest about the issue my H and I are having. The two main issus I have with him are: Porn and communication. The main issue with me is that I am messy, which I guess sometimes I am, especially lately, bur normally, I am the one who does most of the house work.

 

I am 24, he is 30, we have been toegther 10 years in septemper and married 7 years in June. Maybe we are immature, maybe we have just had enough. In my eyes, living and working on the said issues for 6 years is a long time.

 

We have both talked about it and neither of us can come up with a solution. He is getting better about masterbating, while I have not gotten better about cleaning. I know this is wrong of me and I do not want pitty on this issue, but advice. I stopped caring enough to put effort into it.

 

Below are my other threades so you can have some more info:

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t110783/

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t110985/

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Maybe you two need some time apart right now. I don't know, but why not go to a hotel or friends for a few days until you both calm down and can talk rationally. I don't know your story, but it seems to me you both might benefit from counseling, both individually and marriage.

 

So sorry you're going through this, and I don't really have any wonderful words of wisdom for you. Just wanted to let you know we're here for you.

 

(((hugs)))

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Touche I should have also replied more directly. Yes, I have refused to even consider kids until I knew we my H and I were in a place where our relationship was going to work out. Since things have been rocky, ro me anyways, for a while I put having kids on the back burner. Other decisions though we are fine on, we have great credit a house nice cars. We are very responsible with those things. We just each have issues we are having a hard time getting over.

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What2donow, that is kindof my thinking. I told my H my packing does not mean forever, that I still love him, I just don't know what else to do. I don't want to fight so leaving seems like a way to fix that.

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LakesideDream

It happens. On Memorial Day six years ago my ex (25 year marriage, raised two good kids) and I went to the local theater to see "Pearl Harbor" with M-a-t-t D-a-m-o-n.... we missed the movie start by a couple of minutes, it was my fault. While on the way to grab lunch (matinee) she said in a normal tone of voice "I'm moving out... need space" etc. Pretty Wierd.

 

Of course she didn't mention the boyfriend part (20 year on and off affair I didn't know about).

 

I'd give it a little more time to see if any other footwear falls.

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Obviously you two need a "time out" from one another. A sepearation doesn't mean you're seprating forever,

 

And, you need to get some education about how to be married, contrary to popluar belief ~ we're not born with it?! Wheather you get it through IC or MC, or through reading ~ you azz doesn't need to move forward unitil you get it ~ however you get it.

 

So, for the time being you need to go to your repsective corners, and behave yourseleves. For you, you should get into individual conuseling and martial counseling, while telling the DH to just chill and do the same.

 

Its time to adapt and overcome, re-adujst you attitude and perspective,

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I mean if you're both fighting about the timing regarding videotaping feeding the giraffe at the zoo how are you going to handle more serious issues like child-rearing, finances, family issues, etc. etc.

how would you like it if you invited me to dinner and i showed up at your house wearing a monkey mask?

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Sweetie, you are only 24. If you've been with him for ten years... then you've been with this guy since you were FOURTEEN YEARS OLD. You don't know anything different than how you're treated in this relationship. But I'm telling you that there's better to be had out in the world. ;)

 

When I read through your other threads... it's easy to see that this guy is pretty much a meathead. He's given you quite a bit of lip-service about "working things out"... but what has he actually DONE about it? ...Besides letting you find your own way home from the zoo. :rolleyes:

 

Every problem you've had with him has pretty much been blown off or turned back around so that YOU can take the blame for it. His biggest action toward marital recovery is "not masturbating quite as much"??? :rolleyes:

 

You had a problem with porn use and it's effects on intimacy. Has he addressed that any better than last time you posted, where his solution was to tell you to "get over it"???

 

 

Look, you don't have a bunch of kids to hold you back. Why not just go ahead and get out of this toxic relationship. There are LOTS of good things to be had in life. You could go to college, change careers, travel... whatever you want. And once you've achieved a certain amount of independence, you'll begin to look at potential partners in a different way. It won't always be about what YOU bring to the table... but also what they bring to you.

 

It's a scary thing to strike out on your own. But, the longest journey starts with just a single step. And you won't know what you're capable of unless you set some goals and shoot for them.

 

If you have a place to go, consider going there. Get yourself an attorney and file your paperwork so you're free from this mess in the shortest order possible. And if your husband starts calling you with suicide threats... turn those over to the police. If he means it, they'll make sure he gets the help he needs, and if he doesn't... he'll stop doing it.

 

IMPORTANT: If he's got a bunch of guns, make sure you keep yourself safe. Contact your local domestic abuse center if he threatens you in ANY way.

 

 

Bottom line...

 

Words + Action = The Truth

 

Words - Action = Bullsh*t

 

He hasn't put his money where his mouth is. How long has it been since he actually delivered on his promises? If you say "Next to Never".... there's your answer.

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redfathom,

 

Please listen to Ladyjane. She doesn't tell just anybody to leave a relationship.

 

What is stopping you from leaving? Probably the same things that were stopping me from leaving my abusive husband. You love him, you feel guilty, and you fear you may be doing the wrong thing.

 

LOVE: First of all, you have been with your husband since you were 14. You never had the opportunity to be loved and cherished by a respectful, mature man. You probably love your husband because you've invested so much time into the relationship. Yet he doesn't fulfill many (if any) of your emotional needs or desires. You are still very young! There are men in the world who don't fixate on porn, who will communicate in an open and healthy way, and work to fulfill your emotional needs. Once you meet one of these men, I'm sure you'll realize how little your husband deserved your love. Being alone is also better than being with someone like your husband.

 

GUILT: Your husband doesn't seem to feel guilty about not fulfilling your needs. In fact, it sounds like he is completely self-centered and concerned about fulfilling only his own needs. On top of all that, he tries to control you with threatening suicide. He has had 10 years to learn how to treat you right. It's time for you to feel guilty about not doing what's best for YOU and not worry about what he wants. If you have trouble overcoming the guilt (I did!), a therapist can help a lot.

 

DOING THE WRONG THING: At this point, it sounds like staying in the marriage would be the wrong thing for you. Can you see yourself growing old with your husband? If the answer is no, then you know it's time to go.

Fear of the unknown is strong...I know. But, you don't have kids and you are only 24! Take some time for yourself. In a very short period of time, I think you'll realize that doing what you want to do without having to deal with your husband's tantrums and guilt trips is wonderful.

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redfathom,

 

Please listen to Ladyjane. She doesn't tell just anybody to leave a relationship.

 

This is true ~ LJ, seldom if ever encourages anyone to leave, or file for divorce.

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Hi all, thanks for the replies. We do need time out! I have tried to talk to my H and he just won't listen for more then 30 min. It was weird, I went home this morning, we agreed to meet at 10am to talk. I was there about 30 min when his brother called...this was the convo:

 

B - hey whats up

H - not much just chillin

B - Want to go to breakfast

H - sure give me a little bit and I will call you back

 

Just like that H said he was going to breakfast, needed some time to relax and left. So I came on here read your posts, thanks again, and headed back to my dads. I don't know what to do. I miss my home and my cat and my H very much. I want to work on this, but I don't think we can.

 

I asked my H why for the past three -four years when I asked him to go to marriage counsoling with me he said no and now he is okay, but it had to get to this for that to happen. He said, maybe I thought you were overreacting. Which I knew was the answer to that questions. So why does he say I am giving up, when I have tried to get him to work on this with me.

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RF,

 

Your husband wants to place all the blame on you for ending the marriage - that's why he says you're giving up. I've read your other posts and this guy sounds abusive to me. He blames you for everything, talks badly about your family (is he trying to isolate you?), only allows you to have conversations that interest him, cuts you off when you're talking, and threatens to commit suicide when things aren't going his way. Does he also call you names for no reason and talk badly about your friends?

 

Any guy who would rather go have breakfast with his brother than talk to his wife who has just left him is certainly the one who doesn't want to work on the marriage.

 

I know you're probably really sad right now, but please know that the way your husband is behaving is not the way a man who truly loves his wife behaves. This guy thinks of only one person: himself.

 

I know you miss your house and your cat and your husband (I thought it was interesting that you wrote husband last). In time, you will miss your house and husband less and less. Can you keep the cat?

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RF,

 

Your husband wants to place all the blame on you for ending the marriage - that's why he says you're giving up. I've read your other posts and this guy sounds abusive to me. He blames you for everything, talks badly about your family (is he trying to isolate you?), only allows you to have conversations that interest him, cuts you off when you're talking, and threatens to commit suicide when things aren't going his way. Does he also call you names for no reason and talk badly about your friends?

 

Any guy who would rather go have breakfast with his brother than talk to his wife who has just left him is certainly the one who doesn't want to work on the marriage.

 

I know you're probably really sad right now, but please know that the way your husband is behaving is not the way a man who truly loves his wife behaves. This guy thinks of only one person: himself.

 

I know you miss your house and your cat and your husband (I thought it was interesting that you wrote husband last). In time, you will miss your house and husband less and less. Can you keep the cat?

 

Agreed.... on all counts. The part in bold is just one more example of words not equal to action again. He says he WANTS to work on the marriage, and then goes to breakfast with his brother instead. Like THAT's more important???

 

I think you'd be SHOCKED by this guy's behavior, Red... if you understood what it is to be treated well by a man. :(

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When my H and I were talking about what we each wanted the other do to in the relationship to make the other person happy, he kept trying to make what I was saying an ultimatum. This was about four weeks ago and what I said I wanted was that when he was about to look at porn to just think about us before he did and hopfully that would make him change his mind. He kept telling me that was not what I wanted and to tell him what I wanted. So I said "if you want me to tell you to stop completly I will not! For two reason, 1. I don't want that because it would not be fair and 2. if I said that you would tell me I was being unrealistic and that it would never work. When I asked my therpist what that meant she said he seemed like he was trying to make it my fault that if I had given an utlimatum like that it would never have worked so it would have been my fault because I asked too much.

 

I am so sad. I really want to call him and say, I am sorry I just want to come home but I know that if I did things would be the same and we would end up back here again. I just really want him to hold me and tell me everything will be okay. I want to feel safe. That is why I miss my home not just because of him, but because it is safe.

 

He did call me three hours a go to say that he needed space and was going to run errands with his brother and would call me later. I told him I was going to buy a few things and he said, what do you need to buy that we don't have at home. I said, well if you need space, I am not sure if that is for just today or maybe longer and I need a few things to live on. I told him I was going to take $500 out of the bank account and he said, Why, you have a bank card you don't need to go to the ATM. Then he told me he loves me and that he would call me later.

 

I am not sure what to think about that. Any thought?

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RF,

 

1. I agree with your therapist. It seems like your husband wants you to take the blame for that - and many other things.

 

2. You're sad and you want to be comforted. Is there someone else who can hold you? Your mom? A good friend? I know it is not the same as being held by a man, but it may help. Try to be strong. If you really need human touch right now to help you feel better, get a massage.

 

3. Your money belongs to you and to him. Take out what you need. Are you sure your husband won't clean out the bank accounts? Make sure you have a printed statement just in case he does.

 

What do I think about your husband calling you and telling you he loves you? I think he wants to keep his cozy relationship with you - with a woman who puts up with all of his crap and doesn't leave him (up until now).

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BS! Its like LJ said, you've never had a REAL man!

 

Porn? A real man wouldn't think twice about chossing between you and the two?!

 

A real man would be respectual of you, your wants. your needs as a person! Who'd HONOR you, and RESPECT you! For the persion you are, as you are! And be damn grateful for it!

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Moongirl,

 

I am staying at my dads right now, he has been great! He got me all setup in the spare room but of course nothing feels like home.

 

My H would never do anything like that, but I will print out a statement tomorrow at work and also keep track of my spending.

 

My H texted me to see how I was doing so I called him. He wanted to make sure I have everything I need and said he would bring me anything I needed from the house. He is trying to make sure I am comfortable since he know he can't ask me to come back.

 

I know you all will not understand this, but I really want things to work out. He agreed to go to MC with me while we are apart. I told him my leaving is not forever, we just need time to figure out what we need and want. Basically I have changed, I am getting older and wiser (I can tell a difference between when I was 20 and now at 24) and I told him we have not adjusted to the change. I told what I need to do is figure out what this all means to me and try to understand this change then when I do I will be able to tell him specifically what I need. All I know right now is what I don't need or want. I know I want to be respected more then I have been, I know I deserve it.

 

I am a great person, I know this and somewhere he knows this, but I am a great person as I am today, not just five years ago and I think he is still expecting me and wanting me to be the person I was five years ago and I can't and won't. In time I will know what I want and what I expect from him and I will clear about it, I will tell him what I need and if he can't meet those needs then we will have to go our separate ways. I hope it does not come to that, I hope MC will help us become stronger people and a stronger whole.

 

I really appreciate your support. It's great to know I can always count on LS and the wonderful people on here to offer objective and honest advice and yet be kind. I am glad that while I am going though this there are people who can listen and understand.

 

Thanks so much!!!

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Gunny, I should have also mentioned, I think he is finally going to start "manning up" as you would say. He finally admited that he does have a problem maybe even an addiction to porn and he is finally understanding that he needs to be in control of it. I hope once we go to MC they will be able to suggest some options for him to get help. I always appreciate your advice, it's been very helpful and entertaining when I need it.

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RF,

 

I don't blame you for wanting to try to work things out with your husband. But please make sure you have a set list of your needs and desires. Make sure that this is the man you want to have children with and spend the rest of your life with, and that he is not just wasting your time dangling empty promises in front of you. I believe that some people can change, but when someone is so profoundly self-centered at the age of 30, I am not really sure if they can change. I speak from experience - it is a nightmare to have children with a childish, selfish man.

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Okay I'm no marriage counselor but I've had my share of petty fights.

 

If you are fighting over things like this you both need to take a step back.... you're really fighting over something else. These are not reasons to pack your bags and leave, walk out, or commit suicide (there's never a reason to commit suicide).

 

First of all packing your bags and leaving is immature - been there and done that. You'll never solve anything by running from it.

 

Second - think about the conversation with your husband before he left to have breakfast with his brother. Was the conversation in the direction of only putting him down or where the two of you actually talking and making progress.

 

You both obviously love each other and want to work out your differences. Instead of you both walking away when things get to heated go to seperate rooms, maybe agree to a 10 min time out then come back together and hearing each other out. A few minutes of silence can do wonders.

 

When you do come back together only one person talks at a time, maybe let him start, let him get it all off his chest. Men don't talk nearly as much as women so it won't take that long. Make sure you repeat back to him what you think you heard him say, make sure you understand his point of view before you respond to him.

 

Then it's your turn and he listens.

 

God gave us one mouth and two ears for a reason, listen more and talk less. But, don't just leave and run from the problem or you'll run from all your problems.

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Hi JNB, I am in the middle of reading your post and wanted to say that while we might be fighting over something petty now, it is just frustration from bigger issues. This is basically "the straw that broke the camels back". I have to say that my H actually does more talking them me and basically makes it all my fault. He gets very defensive and immediatly blames me. During the conversation before he went to breakfast, he basically was saying he felt that I was inconsiderate of his feelings. I think he is upset about the situation and does not know how to handle it. later that night he said "it takes two in a marriage and everything is 50/50".

 

I can't talk much so I will reply more later. Thanks!

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