How to establish standards when dating someone and after accepting less in the past?

[turningpoint]

Okay so I WAS seeing this guy for almost 2 months. He ended things with me almost a month ago out of nowhere, citing that he didn't feel strongly enough about me. Anyway, after an emotional goodbye we stopped talking for 2 weeks. So now we've started talking again. He wrote me a few lengthy and emotional emails asking to see me. We met up last week and spent 6 hours together and it was romantic. We texted afterwards, but it took him 3 days to respond to my last text. After texting me again, we somehow both agreed to go to see a broadway musical together in July (he took 24 hours to respond about his schedule). The tickets are booked and I told him I'm leaving the city for a week next week, and it would be nice to see him before I depart. This was yesterday and he hasn't responded.

 

So here's the thing... this guy has been nonresponsive with texts ever since the day I met him. Even when we were seeing each other, there was only 1 week where he responded to each of my texts within 24 hours. When he responds, his response is thoughtful, enthusiastic and full of questions for me... but a 1-3 day wait time defeats the purpose of texting. I brought this up to him about a week and a half ago and he was surprised, since he feels this is normal for him and didn't get why I brought it up. So he was very responsive after I brought it up (responding within an hour), but then stopped after 2 days, and took 3 days to respond again.

 

This bothers me because I'm trying to play it cool and not be impulsive but it's hard to not be offended when someone is unresponsive, especially since he ended things with me and suddenly wants to be in my life again and going on these dates with me. I mean we just booked tickets to a big musical and no response at all. After him ending things with me a month ago, I don't like the feeling of messaging him and not knowing if it'll be an hour or 3 days till he responds. But again, the issue is, he's been like this since I've known him. I'm just not sure how to establish these standards with him at this point? I just know that if we are starting over, it's important for me to not have to wait days to hear back from someone.

[Raena]

You probably should tell him that directly then. It sounds like you might be better off having a phone conversation with him rather than texting.

[Fondue]

If he doesn't reply to your texts as soon as you'd like, start using the old fasion phone call.

 

As far as his texting responses go. It seems like he has been doing that since the very beginning. Maybe that's just who he is. He likely isn't playing any games with you or anything, that's just his means of communication. He obviously is sending you long, thoughtful things... So it's not like he simply ignoring you.

 

I am not much of a texter myself. Doesn't mean I dislike anyone. Just don't feel the need to do it, or do it quickly.

[preraph]

Yep, phone him and see if he answers on a regular basis. Of course, obviously, he could be seeing more than one woman, but even that shouldn't keep him from texting back even if he has to do it from the men's room!! I say if they're aggravating in the beginning when they are the most gung ho about winning you, they're only going to go downhill from there. People are usually their best in a dating situation.

[turningpoint]

Yep, phone him and see if he answers on a regular basis. Of course, obviously, he could be seeing more than one woman, but even that shouldn't keep him from texting back even if he has to do it from the men's room!! I say if they're aggravating in the beginning when they are the most gung ho about winning you, they're only going to go downhill from there. People are usually their best in a dating situation.

 

I'm really glad you mentioned this. Especially how people go downhill from the beginning. I forgot this fact. I guess because now he's going on dates with me again, I guess I thought he'd put more of an effort in with the texting. After our 2nd date he didn't respond to a message for 3 full days, and his response was saying how he'd be busy for a week. If it started out like that, I'm not sure why I'd expect it to be better this time. I have phoned him in the past and he picks up straight away, so maybe I'll do that once we go out again. It's been one date since he ended it, so I'd rather let him do more of the chasing than try to get into the habit of calling him at the moment.

[Baller25]

It sounds like he wants you back after overestimating his 'grass is greener' opportunities.

[todreaminblue]

I think ignorant, thoughtless men are very hard to get to know, I feel that they often don't consider your thoughts and feelings to be of value so they never listen when you are honest with how you are and what you expect.....seeing i want to be valued and respected I do not have time for unresponsive or ignorant men, nor should I

 

in saying that if a man were to change and show a bit of personal fortitude in expressing himself the same way i do with honesty and respect i would be forgiving.....I would forgive him if he didn't change at any rate, but if he didn't change he is not the man for me and i would limit contact to a friendly nature and consider anything intimate to be void...I dotn care i fhe has problems communicating because i can carry conversation adn am adept at bringing out the best in someone,i can relate to mst men across the board, i dotn need clever conversation all the time, i will make a man think though, i always have,, i just need communication adn effort with a time and practice , i can adjust to how they speak and communicate, but, if he doesnt make an effort why should I make more of an effort it is obvious he doesnt have enough interest in me to continue..

 

 

do not settle for less than you feel you need to communicate and if the effort you make is always more,then, communicate less, if he communicates more communicate equally men deserves chances for sure but men do not deserve to make less effort than they should to keep your interest and happiness in mind,with them knowing we do not deserve to treat them less well, or should we ever or would we ever, consider less of them for trying

 

we as women dont have to keep them interested in communicating they have to be interested in communicating with us....we dont deserve less because of apathy or laziness, blase attitude or inability to listen to what we honestly need

when we are forgiving and understanding and just plain hopeful, that they are willing to give more than they would normally,more communication than just a friend and in responsive ways, i dotn care if it is a one word text or a smiley face,(might frustrate me into strangling them next time they see me but i woudl smiel whiel doing so) simply because they would like us to be happy and trust that their feelings for us are true and they are interested in trying to make an effort not just for anyone but for us they would try.......and I wish you well.deb

Edited June 12, 2014 by todreaminblue

[turningpoint]

I think ignorant, thoughtless men are very hard to get to know, I feel that they often don't consider your thoughts and feelings to be of value so they never listen when you are honest with how you are and what you expect.....seeing i want to be valued and respected I do not have time for unresponsive or ignorant men, nor should I

 

in saying that if a man were to change and show a bit of personal fortitude in expressing himself the same way i do with honesty and respect i would be forgiving.....I would forgive him if he didn't change at any rate, but if he didn't change he is not the man for me and i would limit contact to a friendly nature and consider anything intimate to be void...I dotn care i fhe has problems communicating because i can carry conversation adn am adept at bringing out the best in someone,i can relate to mst men across the board, i dotn need clever conversation all the time, i will make a man think though, i always have,, i just need communication adn effort with a time and practice , i can adjust to how they speak and communicate, but, if he doesnt make an effort why should I make more of an effort it is obvious he doesnt have enough interest in me to continue..

 

 

do not settle for less than you feel you need to communicate and if the effort you make is always more,then, communicate less, if he communicates more communicate equally men deserves chances for sure but men do not deserve to make less effort than they should to keep your interest and happiness in mind,with them knowing we do not deserve to treat them less well, or should we ever or would we ever, consider less of them for trying

 

we as women dont have to keep them interested in communicating they have to be interested in communicating with us....we dont deserve less because of apathy or laziness, blase attitude or inability to listen to what we honestly need

when we are forgiving and understanding and just plain hopeful, that they are willing to give more than they would normally,more communication than just a friend and in responsive ways, i dotn care if it is a one word text or a smiley face,(might frustrate me into strangling them next time they see me but i woudl smiel whiel doing so) simply because they would like us to be happy and trust that their feelings for us are true and they are interested in trying to make an effort not just for anyone but for us they would try.......and I wish you well.deb

 

You are very right Deb. I hate communicating less than what I want but it may be necessary in this situation, since it feels like I'm making more of an effort in terms of daily communications whereas he does not. I'll tone it back and be way less responsive. For instance when he takes 3 days, I always respond normally, within several hours, but perhaps I need to be way less responsive so he can realize he needs to make more of an effort or at least communicate with me on what actually works for him.

[todreaminblue]

You are very right Deb. I hate communicating less than what I want but it may be necessary in this situation, since it feels like I'm making more of an effort in terms of daily communications whereas he does not. I'll tone it back and be way less responsive. For instance when he takes 3 days, I always respond normally, within several hours, but perhaps I need to be way less responsive so he can realize he needs to make more of an effort or at least communicate with me on what actually works for him.

 

 

I feel so to turning point, it isnt a ncie way to feel to wait on the end of an unanswered message and i have myself often been guilty of such,normally when i thas been unwanted communication on behalf of another that was crass or thoughtless, i wish not to continue so i dont respond as to not hurt their feelings, but i know i do hurt people, it cant be helped, that really makes me feel doubel at any point in my dealings with others, add empathic abilities and i can be a mess quite quickly.

 

 

 

i hurt a little more when someone does that sameness to me, feeling not only my own hurt but the hurt i might have caused another previously in my life by exhibiting traits of ignorance.....inspires me to be true, never ignorant and more honest when attention is unwarranted and communication is no longer pleasant for me, i hope i do this in a gentle compassionate manner i will not leave someone to hang on an unanswered message from me, that is my resolve.....and i will be forgiving as i wish to be forgiven by others for many things and many hurts unintentional or intentional,

 

in saying that i do not deserve to be treated that way anymore by somone i feel intimately about, in ignorance and or unresponsiveness or pure lack of effort which is apathy, if i make a concerted effort to not be that way myself i deserve the same.......i wish you well and i do feel you have a turning point and a resolve to be had by you.......smilin atcha.....deb

[Smthn_Like_Olivia]

You are very right Deb. I hate communicating less than what I want but it may be necessary in this situation, since it feels like I'm making more of an effort in terms of daily communications whereas he does not. I'll tone it back and be way less responsive. For instance when he takes 3 days, I always respond normally, within several hours, but perhaps I need to be way less responsive so he can realize he needs to make more of an effort or at least communicate with me on what actually works for him.

 

I honestly don't understand why you feel the need to make so much of an effort. Be honest with yourself. This guy is mildly interested in you. He's already proved that once by breaking it off with you. I dated a guy like him once, that would take hours or even days to respond. He wasn't worth my time and we never went further than the first date. I like a man that loves to hear from me and engage with me. My guy has a VERY busy job during the day, but if he gets even a breather, he'll send me a "Hi baby" just to let me know he's thinking about me.

 

Setting standards for yourself is about finding someone you're compatible with and with all the bumpiness in this relationship thus far, I think your efforts could be better spent elsewhere.

[myothernic2]

I honestly don't understand why you feel the need to make so much of an effort. Be honest with yourself. This guy is mildly interested in you. He's already proved that once by breaking it off with you. I dated a guy like him once, that would take hours or even days to respond. He wasn't worth my time and we never went further than the first date. I like a man that loves to hear from me and engage with me. My guy has a VERY busy job during the day, but if he gets even a breather, he'll send me a "Hi baby" just to let me know he's thinking about me.

 

Setting standards for yourself is about finding someone you're compatible with and with all the bumpiness in this relationship thus far, I think your efforts could be better spent elsewhere.

 

 

Exactly. You're going to respond slow to him in response to him responding slow to you? Is that something that will make you feel better in this situation? Is it even worth all of this anguish for a guy that's very mildly interested?

[Gaeta]

..... but perhaps I need to be way less responsive so he can realize he needs to make more of an effort or at least communicate with me on what actually works for him.

 

Ridiculous, he takes 3 days to respond, you will take 3 days to respond, where is that going to take you? Your instinct is telling you something is off, listen. He is taking his sweet time to respond to keep you at a distance. He wants you but under the same terms as first time around. With all the men available to you why put your effort in someone that has something else on his mind than you.

[Michelle ma Belle]

True. Men are like salivating puppies the first month or so...if they are really into you. My experience is that they will do anything to be with you. It's all part of male/female dynamics that go back to cavemen. We women today check are cells every 5 minutes yearning to see his name...yearning so much it almost hurts. When my phone pings and I see my boyfriends name it's a bigger high than winning the million dollar lottery.

 

LOL!!! Oh my goodness, THIS had me in stitches!!!! :laugh:

 

Eau Claire, you hit the nail on the head for many women with this singular line. How true it is. I've been here and STILL am and I'm 45 freakin' years old, lol!

 

Ah, if men only knew how excited we get to hear from them. Maybe they'd make more of an effort.

[Kid_Charlemange]

Ah, if men only knew how excited we get to hear from them. Maybe they'd make more of an effort.

 

Trust me -- it works both ways

[d0nnivain]

Texting is such a ridiculous way of trying to communicate or get to know someone. The fact that he sends these long throughtful responses full of Qs makes me want to scream. If he has that much to say, call or set up face to face. Texting should be reserved for pick up milk, I'm running late or where r u? If it's longer than a tweet verbalization is preferred.

 

You both need to talk about the mediums you use to communicate. Stop having long discussions via text & all should get better.

[laurelin]

I've been in this boat before, too, and it is agonizing and stressful! In some ways, texting is awesome because it allows you quick contact for chats and little things, but, in other ways, it's very detrimental to relationships because it creates expectations and mixed messages. You expect the other person to answer quickly and, when they don't, you jump to one of two conclusions:

 

1. They're super busy and haven't looked at their phone

2. You're not a priority for them

 

The longer the wait for a reply, the more it starts looking like you're not a priority. Then, by the time they do make contact, you've spent hours/days agonizing and worrying and gathering advice about what to do, etc. And 9 times out of 10, they're oblivious to the meltdown that occurred while they procrastinated and/or crafted their response. What they don't know will continue to hurt you.

 

I started dating my boyfriend about a month ago. Needless to say, we're still in that "honeymoon phase", but at the moment, he gives me no doubts about where I stand with him. We don't text all day long, but he does call me in the evenings and he sends me articles and shares things via email. If he doesn't call, we'll text back and forth some and he'll usually end with "I'll call you tomorrow night".

 

When we were first getting to know one another, I told him I don't need constant reassurance of his commitment level or the status of our relationship, I just like to have something to look forward to. He gets that and provides it consistently. Should that change at some point, I'll probably take issue with it because the standard has been set and consistently maintained.

 

The important thing to note, though, is that it's not a standard I'm imposing upon my boyfriend. It's a standard I've set for myself so I know when a person is or isn't worth my time. It doesn't stress him out to meet that standard because his commitment to our relationship meets it naturally. If the commitment isn't there, the standard doesn't get met and that's when I know it's time to address the situation and/or make my exit.

[ktya]

I agree and disagree with some of the previous posters.

 

First

I dont mind getting to know someone by text and having conversations that way. If I'm doing something else, or listening to music, or typing, it allows me to keep the communication flowing on a regular basis without stopping what I'm doing.

 

I like to glue it together with regular phone calls though, because intonation and hearing the voice inflection is a lot better.

 

Of course face to face is fine.

 

Second

One girl I'm seeing is really busy with work. I send her a text each day or so asking how it's going, she takes forever to get back to me. When she's not so busy I'd often just call her. She has a huge phablet and the battery is always dying on her so often her phone is off.

 

Sometimes too when girls I'm talking to are texting me my phone can hit an alarming rate as high as 4 texts per second during prime time when they're all done work at the same time and wanting to talk to this guy they're seeing. I have a Blackberry 10 and it's wicked fast so I can keep up pretty easily.

 

However even when its not that nuts, sometimes I just want to put down my phone and do something other than stay glued to it.

 

One text every 24 hours isnt that bad. I wouldn't put too much stock in it if hes responding with something more thoughtful than just a happy face.

 

Conclusion

Roll with it dont read too much into it

[KathyM]

The guy is showing very minimal effort and very minimal interest. He broke it off with you once, saying he doesn't think you're a match (or words to that effect). His behavior shows that he still is not that interested. Time to end it and find someone who appreciates you more and wants more interaction.

[Gaeta]

I think everyone understand that not everybody has the type of work that allows them to check their phone during work hours. I think everyone also understand that while life is happening we cannot always get a hold of our phone right away like while we are driving, showering, having visitors, etc BUT all this does NOT excuse replying after 2-3 days.

 

No matter how busy we are we all look at our phone before going to bed or when we get up in the morning.

 

If his boss text him I bet you he's on it right away.

 

You really think that there are people out there not looking at their phone for 3 days? They don't get ANY calls for 3 days, or any other text for 3 days!

[Poppygoodwill]

So he dumped you then came back sniffing around to get back together.

 

Did he adequately explain why he broke it off? Did you push for a full understanding to satisfy yourself that he's not going to do it again?

 

It seems to me that you're in a position now to tell him what you want, and what you expect of a bf. He already broke it off iwth you once; he can't do worse to you than that. But yet he's come back, so presumably he wants to make it work.

 

Sit him down and tell him what you want and need - a phone call at the end of the day..whatever. If you make it clear to him and he doesn't come through, then at least you'll know that it's because he doesn't want to. Becuase if he did want to keep you, he would do it.

 

Also - forget the texting. Make this a phone and face to face relationship.

[todreaminblue]

I honestly don't understand why you feel the need to make so much of an effort. Be honest with yourself. This guy is mildly interested in you. He's already proved that once by breaking it off with you. I dated a guy like him once, that would take hours or even days to respond. He wasn't worth my time and we never went further than the first date. I like a man that loves to hear from me and engage with me. My guy has a VERY busy job during the day, but if he gets even a breather, he'll send me a "Hi baby" just to let me know he's thinking about me.

 

Setting standards for yourself is about finding someone you're compatible with and with all the bumpiness in this relationship thus far, I think your efforts could be better spent elsewhere.

 

 

the beauty of two words that let someone know you are in their thoughts with a "hi baby" while they are busy is such a delight, is often irreplaceable and remembered above all as it is a take the time to care thing and make someone feel of worth...so thoughtful....smilin.....deb

[turningpoint]

Thanks everyone. All this has helped substantially and I think many of you are right about him needing to meet my standards and not being in a place where he's willing to do that right now. He did send me an email last night venting about how overwhelming his life has been recently and how he feels like theatre is getting in the way of his personal life. We are both part of this theatre group (I help with backstage work but never see him) and he is acting and dancing in the play. It's about a month until the play begins and they are now requesting for the performers to be present for rehearsals 5 nights a week (if he chose not to go it throws everything off). He works full-time... and work ends at 6 and the rehearsals run for about 3-4 hours each night (starting at 7). He also is taking a class to become an interpreter which is 2 nights a week for several hours. Again, I'm part of the group and know there are rehearsals 6 days a week and already commit almost 10 hours of my off time helping with backstage work.

 

When he ended things with me the first time around, he also felt overwhelmed (we began dating during a couple of holiday weekends where rehearsals weren't happening and were only a 2 day a week commitment; I also joined the group then and had no idea how much of a time investment it was) so it was easy for him to fit me into his week... and see me a couple of times a week. His term for class had also ended during that time we were dating, and he ended things with me about a week after class started up again. Like I said his reasons is he didn't feel as strongly about me as he wanted, but he also added that he felt constantly tired. We'd talk when he was done with class or rehearsal and he'd talk to me while doing chores around the house. And we are both introverts so he'd want at least a few hours to himself during the one day he has off.

 

Basically if he is interested in me, this is probably just bad timing and you all are completely right, there are other things more on his mind than me. His email vented to me, and it was clear he was trying to squeeze me in somehow this week before I fly off to another city for work (wont be back till July). Fitting me in Sunday morning for brunch seems to be all he can do for this week and that's the reality for a month until the production ends.

 

He did ask me a few questions in his email, but I just responded being comforting and giving him advice on how to deal with being overwhelmed. I want to get out of this habit of having these conversations via email and your responses have given me loads to ponder. I get that he's busy and nothing excuses a 3 day response time to texting, but it's possible this is just really bad timing for him and maybe it's good for us both to keep a distance, until he has more time to commit to actually seeing and talking to me if he's genuinely interested in doing so.... since at this point it's too difficult for me to know if this is him being lukewarm, just too busy to spare time or a combination of both. I am still going on dates with other guys and keeping my options open. I'm certainly not waiting around for him, it's just hard since we really had a strong connection and at this point, I feel like I am just making assumptions about how he feels. I believe actions over words matter the most, and right now, it's clear he can't really show me through actions for one reason or another how he feels about me.

Edited June 13, 2014 by turningpoint

[writergal]

His disinterest has nothing to do with bad timing. "Bad timing" is one of the most commonly used excuses that people use when they want to avoid telling the person the truth that they have lost interest and no longer want to see that person. It's lame sure, but people use it to avoid confrontation.

 

The thing is OP, it's all about time management and prioritizing. I spent 3 years going to grad school full-time in the evenings, working two to three part time jobs during the day which I had to juggle with classroom field experiences and then with two semesters of student teaching. Add lesson planning, reading, writing research papers and I barely had time to sleep let alone date. But, I did date, and I did see friends and family because those relationships were a priority to me. I managed my time and prioritized my relationships. I think it's a good habit to get into.

 

A full schedule does not a good-excuse make, when it comes to dating. It just doesn't cut it for me. There are plenty of people who work full-time during the day and have obligations after that (raising kids, hobbies, a 2nd job, etc.) and they make it work to fit in time with people they care about, because they 1) manage their time and 2) prioritize.

 

All I hear is him giving you excuse after excuse and whining a lot. He sounds really immature for someone who wants a career in theater as an actor. I mean, I know actors and actresses here in the Twin Cities who are married with kids, hold down jobs, and meanwhile manage to act in theater productions without ever dropping any balls because they manage their time and they prioritize.

 

I think if your guy really wanted to prioritize you into his life again he would have. But he hasn't, he's just giving you excuses and can't be bothered to even call you. And he offers you a breadcrumb brunch before you leave? Wow, how generous of him.

 

I agree with the others here who've pointed out that he's barely making any effort to have a relationship with you.

 

I'm certainly not waiting around for him, it's just hard since we really had a strong connection and at this point, I feel like I am just making assumptions about how he feels. I believe actions over words matter the most, and right now, it's clear he can't really show me through actions for one reason or another how he feels about me.

 

Actions over words. Exactly. This is key. His actions contradict his words. Since he can't meet your emotional needs (or chooses not to, depending on how you look at it), then I think you may want to consider downgrading him to just an acquaintance and make yourself free to date other guys who will prioritize you and show you that they want to fit you into their busy lives.

Edited June 14, 2014 by writergal

[Simon Phoenix]

I concur. There's no such thing as "too busy" when you are really into someone. Everyone is busy. I just think you are incompatible -- he doesn't value the regular communication you do. You're better off finding someone who is more compatible in that way -- or you need to just pick up the phone and call him.

 

Honestly, I hate having text conversations that last more than five texts. Texting is for quick questions and confirming plans, not to chit-chat. If someone has a lot to say to me, I'd much rather talk on the phone or meet up or, if i'm unavailable to do either one of those things, to delay the conversation until I can. But that's just me.

 

You can't force this guy to text and communicate in the way you see fit. You either deal with it or (preferably) let him be and find someone whose philosophy on text messaging and communication is congruent with yours.