Another moving on thread

[blakelively]

Hi guys,

 

New to this forum, just thought i'd share my recent experience and see what others make of it, a bit of advice perhaps as my confidence has taken a bit of a knock!,

 

So I'm 26, a pretty ambitious student with high goals, I've had a couple of relationships in the past, none of which mounted to anything. Last year around Sept I met this girl online, she seemed nice, everything was going great. She seemed hugely insecure about going into the relationship, telling me she was scared that she's falling for me etc etc and how badly her exes have treated her etc. Unfortunately I fell for it, I felt like I was going to be the one to show her guys are different etc (you know the score), it kind of worked, She constantly mentioned i'm the nicest guy she's ever met etc etc, I would bring her chocolates every time we met, and generally made her feel special. We had some pretty incredible times. Few months pass and lots of little arguments start to kick in, about how i'm not doing this, not doing that, basically nagging me around everything. She would jokingly remind me that i ticked none of her boxes she was looking for in a guy before she met me and she only started talking to me because I dressed well and quite good looking, she would say that she was looking for a guy with his own house, job etc, even though I was projected to be on a high salary not too far in the future.

 

We went on some pretty lavish holidays all in the space of about 8 months, she enjoyed expensive things, taking pics, uploading them to instagram etc. As the "honeymoon" period faded, She would then begin to moan about me not having enough money to do things, When an argument kicked off she mentioned once or twice that I hold her back financially. But then she would tell me she loved me the next day. I worked part time whilst I was studying, so I was paying my half of everything. As the relationship wore on she would begin to criticise me for having "no life skills", "no common sense", "she thought i was perhaps arrogant because of my intelligence". But she would then occasionally show loving emotions, asking me to not leave her.

 

The arguments were getting worse and worse through the summer, one time she shouted and threw a tantrum that I was going to wear a pair of swimming shorts to this farm (even though they looked like normal shorts), my other shorts were dirty (yes, this is what many of our arguments were like). I would always tell her my mind in these arguments, tell her that she's out of order. But in the end i would apologize just to try and get things back to normal. I felt like an intruder in her house, walking on eggshells, attending to her every need so she didn't get upset about something. Everything seemed to revolve around her, even when I was doing my final exams she never even asked how they went, and would begin to talk about her day at work. I called her most days to see how she was, it would be a 50 minute phone call about how she hates this person, that person and why can't people be as good as her. She was a strange girl, very insecure also, she used to mention she wanted breast implants, this, that and the rest. She doesn't have that many friends, I don't think many people like her to be honest because of her constant negative attitude. She would say that she gets depressed if we don't have something to look forward to like a holiday or a weekend away, We did a lot of these, I told her all the time that she can leave anytime she wants if I can't offer what she wants, and that she knew i was a student going into this, but we would just shout, make up and go back to normal until the next argument.

 

It's probably good to mention it was a distance relationship, probably around 30 km between us, we seen each other every weekend.

 

After we got back from our last holiday in july ( a holiday that I could barely afford, but did it to appease her) we had a couple of really bad arguments (about money, shock) and decided to mutually call it a day. It was definitely the right decision and I honestly don't look back and hope we were still together, she's a nasty piece of work. I think she's even dating someone else 1.5 / 2 months on. We literally just said goodbye, all the best and it's been No contact since. So the relationship was just short of a year I guess, maybe 9/10 months, not that long but long enough to generate love!

 

So I'm quite a confident person generally, very upbeat, positive. The reason I'm writing this is that since we broke up I've taken a bit of a confidence knock, and have been feeling a little down for quite a while which is unusual for me. I keep knocking myself for not having X, Y and Z and my life in generally good shape, comparing myself to guys she would go for! I was wondering if anybody else has had a similar experience to this? I would love to hear from it!

 

Cheers,

Blake

Edited October 22, 2017 by blakelively

[Downtown]

Blake, welcome to LoveShack. The behaviors you describe -- i.e., insecurity, verbal abuse, controlling actions, temper tantrums, black-white thinking, always being "The Victim," and rapid flips between Jekyll (loving you) and Hyde (devaluing you) -- are some of the classic warning signs for BPD. Importantly, I'm not suggesting that your exGF exhibits full-blown BPD (only a professional can determine that). Rather, I suggesting she might be exhibiting moderate to strong traits of BPD.

 

I felt like an intruder in her house, walking on eggshells.

The #1 best-selling BPD book (targeted to the abused partners) is titled, Stop Walking on Eggshells. BPDers (i.e., those on the upper third of the BPD spectrum) are so emotionally thin-skinned that you never know what minor comment or action will trigger their fears and anger. The main reason is that they are too emotionally immature to regulate their own emotions. The result is that they frequently experience feelings so intense that they distort their perception of your intentions and motivations. Hence, you never know what harmless action (e.g., wearing shorts to the farm) will set them off.

 

She would begin to criticize me for having "no life skills", "no common sense"... "arrogant because of my intelligence".... But she would then occasionally show loving emotions, asking me to not leave her.

The #2 best-selling BPD book is titled, I Hate You, Don't Leave Me! BPDers have a strong need to validate their false self image of being "The Victim" by blaming every mistake and unhappiness on their partner. They nonetheless are reluctant to leave the partner because this "validation" of their false self image is so important to them.

 

During the courtship period, a BPDer will receive that validation from her view of you as the rescuer who has arrived to save her from unhappiness. Because you are "The Rescuer," the implication is that she must be "The Victim" you are so intent on rescuing.

 

Following the courtship period -- when her infatuation no longer holds her two fears at bay -- a BPDer will start perceiving of you as "The Perpetrator,"

i.e., the cause of her every misfortune. Regardless of whether you are "The Rescuer" (her perception when splitting you white) or "The Perpetrator" (her perception when splitting you black), you are satisfying her deep need for validation of being "The Victim."

 

It would be a 50 minute phone call about how she hates this person, that person and why can't people be as good as her.

BPDers can flip -- in less than a minute -- from Jekyll (adoring you) to Hyde (devaluing you). And they can flip back again just as quickly. These rapid flips arise from "black-white thinking." Like a young child, a BPDer is too emotionally immature to be able to handle strong conflicting feelings (e.g., love and hate). A BPDer therefore has great difficulty tolerating ambiguities, uncertainties, and the other gray areas of close interpersonal relationships.

 

She therefore will categorize everyone close to her as "all good" (i.e., "white" or "with me") or "all bad" (i.e., "black" or "against me"). And she will recategorize someone from one polar extreme to the other -- in just ten seconds -- based solely on a minor comment or action. This B-W thinking also will be evident in the frequent use of all-or-nothing expressions such as "You NEVER..." and "You ALWAYS...." Because a BPDer's close friends eventually will be "split black," it is unusual for a BPDer to have really close long-term friends (unless they live a long distance away).

 

She would say that she gets depressed if we don't have something to look forward to like a holiday or a weekend away.

Most depressed people do not develop a persistent problem with BPD. It nonetheless is very common for BPDers to suffer from a lifetime problem with depression. A recent large-scale study found that, of the women suffering lifetime BPD, 80% have a co-occurring lifetime mood disorder and 81% also have a lifetime anxiety disorder. See Table 3 at 2008 Study in JCP. One reason for this connection is that, because BPDers have only a fragile sense of who they really are, they frequently feel very empty and directionless on the inside.

 

I was wondering if anybody else has had a similar experience to this? I would love to hear from it!

I was married to a BPDer for 15 years. Yet, because I've never met your exGF, I cannot tell you whether my experience was similar to yours. I must leave that for you to decide. I caution that BPD is not something -- like chickenpox -- that a person either "has" or "doesn't have." Instead, it is a spectrum disorder, which means every adult on the planet occasionally exhibits all BPD traits to some degree (albeit at a low level if the person is healthy). At issue, then, is not whether your exGF exhibits BPD traits. Of course she does. We all do.

 

Rather, at issue is whether she exhibits those traits at a strong and persistent level. As I said, I cannot answer that question. I nonetheless believe you can spot any strong BPD warning signs that are present if you take a little time to learn which behaviors are on the list. They are easy to spot because there is nothing subtle about behaviors such as always being "The Victim," verbal abuse, cold withdrawal, and temper tantrums.

 

Of course, learning to spot these warning signs will not enable you to diagnose your GF's issues. Although strong BPD symptoms are easy to spot, only a professional can determine whether they are so severe as to constitute full-blown BPD. Yet, like learning warning signs for a stroke or heart attack, learning those for BPD may help you avoid a very painful situation -- e.g., avoid taking her back or avoid running into the arms of another woman who is just like her.

 

I therefore suggest you take a quick look at my list of 18 BPD Warning Signs to see if most sound very familiar. If so, I would suggest you also read my more detailed description of them at my posts in Rebel's Thread. And Sal provides a concise and insightful account of what it's like to live with a BPDer for 23 years in his 3/16 post. If those descriptions ring many bells and raise questions, I would be glad to discuss them with you. Take care, Blake.

[blakelively]

Thanks Downtown,

 

Yeah she did exhibit all of these characteristics with me. And I assume she will with all of her future partners right? (once that honeymoon shine has worn off), I guess I want it to be that way as I wouldn't enjoy the thought of me being the only one she's been like this with and she just wanted to get out and find someone "better"!,. We eventually split and noted the reason as incompatibility (she kept saying this). After doing a bit of moping around the web it did dawn on me that she behaved very odd. I would be here all week if I had to write down things which happened showing BPD symptoms. Huge argument that I wanted to use a lower factor suncream and she wanted me to use a higher one example, lots of examples like this, everything had to be done how she wanted it. She was a very jealous person, slagging off other women if they wore revealing outfits. To be fair any minor inconvenience from a person would set her yelling expletives most times, and being in the car with her was a dire experience, yelling a lot of the time. As for me, she never really appreciated the small thoughtful things I did. The morning of an exam I once spent revising, and she caused an argument that I'm not making time to reply to her. But yeah, most of the arguments were money related, me saying to her that I had to watch how much I spend because I don't have a lot would trigger her off big time! In fact, she recommended me asking my parents for a bit more money to take to this festival we attended - I told her that I'm not doing that, he's already helped me financially in the past and it's the principle, I don't want to ask him for anymore money and that I'd be fine on what I am bringing. She told me to get off my high horse and that this is what parents were there for.

 

She has had a pretty rocky upbringing, that being she doesn't speak to her own sister because she hates her with a passion and anything her sister would receive from her parents she would also want, her mother and father's relationship is unusual - her mother seems to be the dominant one, making fun of her husband, joking around, calling all the shots! (I assume she inherited this mentality). They almost divorced when she was young I believe, but continued to stay together for the benefit of the her sister ill health at the time. When she met my parents she would be quiet as a doormouse, never spoke unless spoken to, an angel.

 

Hope this has given more insight for others who have had the misfortune to cross paths with such personalities!

 

Anyway I guess it's time for me move on and leave specimens like that in the past, where they belong

 

Cheers

Edited October 22, 2017 by blakelively

[Downtown]

Yeah she did exhibit all of these characteristics with me. And I assume she will with all of her future partners right?

Yes, if she exhibits strong BPD traits as you believe. Although most major cities offer excellent treatment programs that can teach BPDers how to manage their emotions, such training typically requires several years to make a substantial improvement. It is rare for a high functioning BPDer to seek such training, much less stay in it long enough to make a real difference.

 

 

I guess I want it to be that way as I wouldn't enjoy the thought of me being the only one she's been like this with.

Hold onto that angry feeling and, for a few months, use it as a crutch to walk away and stay away from your exGF. Anger serves a useful purpose in that way. After you're safely away, however, you should kick that crutch aside. At that point, your intellect should override the anger you feel so as to recognize that anyone exhibiting persistent, strong BPD traits suffers tremendous emotional pain. While you're able to walk away from this sad condition, she cannot. If your exGF is a BPDer, she likely will suffer from it throughout her life, absent years of treatment. It is a condition I would not wish on my worst enemy.

 

She was a very jealous person.

I was wondering why you had made no mention of intense jealousy. A BPDer's greatest fear is abandonment -- a fear that typically is manifested in frequent occurrences of irrational jealousy. A BPDer is so fearful that she will see abandonment threats where they don't even exist, e.g., your looking at another woman for a full second instead of a half second.

 

Any minor inconvenience from a person would set her yelling expletives most times, and being in the car with her was a dire experience, yelling a lot of the time.

High functioning BPDers generally get along fine with casual friends, business associates, and total strangers. None of those people pose a threat of abandonment or engulfment. There is no close R/S that can be abandoned and no intimacy to cause the suffocating feeling of engulfment. Hence, road rage and anger at complete strangers generally is not a warning sign for BPD but, rather, for IED (Intermittent Explosive Disorder).

 

Significantly, having strong BPD traits does not rule out IED or any other disorder. On the contrary, the vast majority of BPDers also suffer from one or two other PDs (e.g., narcissism or OCPD) and one or two clinical disorders (e.g., depression, bipolar, or anxiety).

 

She never really appreciated the small thoughtful things I did.

If you truly mean "never," you are describing a characteristic of narcissism or sociopathy. However, if you mean "her appreciation lasted a few hours and then disappeared entirely," you are describing a BPD symptom. My BPDer exW, for example, was very appreciative for a few hours when I would surprise her with a gift. And, if I spent over $4,000 on the gift, she might be appreciative for a week or two -- at the very most. Then we were always back to "What have you done for me lately?"

 

If your exGF is a BPDer, it is impossible to build up a lasting sense of appreciation on which you can later draw during the hard times. The reason is that a BPDer typically has the emotional development of a four year old. This means that, whenever you make sacrifices for her, any appreciation she feels will be washed aside by the next tide of intense feelings flooding her mind. Hence, trying to build up a store of good will or lasting appreciation would be as foolish as trying to build a lasting sandcastle on a beach beside the sea.

 

Hope this has given more insight for others who have had the misfortune to cross paths with such personalities!

Probably so. Your thread has already attracted more than 130 views in less than 10 hours. Thanks for sharing your experiences with us, Blake. Edited October 22, 2017 by Downtown