Need desperate engagement broke off

[Lifesaver]

Hi everyone

 

I am hoping to get some advice on whether my break up (engagement) was valid in that we both parted ways.

 

A bit about me. I met my ex fiance when I was 25 online. She lived closeby. I had just withdrawn from medical schools overseas, because my sister passed away. Shortly after my sister died, I sort of ignored her for a few weeks (3) since I didnt want to be lovey dovey and what not. But I came around and said Im sorry and hope you understand.

 

Things were decent afterwards, we would get into arguements over trivial things. Her history is that, sadly she was coming off from somethnig disasterous in that, her sisters husband actually came for her intially showing interest, however after meeting the older sister, he fell in love with her so hence she was broken for a while before me. Basically her sister married my ex fiance's initial guy. I know sounds disgusting.

 

Moving forward, I decided I still wanted to do medical school. I started to study for my MCAT. She supported me when she could. But then there were times when she questioned me. How her friends husband failed their board exams, and now the girl is working full time with a baby, and the guy just sits at home studies. The first I explained it that dont worry itll be alright for me. But then it became a pattern. I felt her sister, whos marriage ironically was messy, was fishing. INitially she would buy me things, all the time, take me out. I would too, I got her a lot of things overtime, samsung watch, necklaces, take her out to very expensive places, just to show her she is my one and only queen. But i noticed when our families got introduced, she started to not show her side in getting things for me, come valentines day, or other important events, she would not do anything. My birthday was probably the only time. But in return she expected EVERY small present, New Years, Valentines, like "I want to go here or there". Overtime I noticed, and I never said anything, and we would get into arguements over things like, who will get to name our first kid (i would say, ofcourse you, but lets also share it with our parents and see what they think). She would fight, I would retaliate, there would be cursing. Its almost as if she went into a different mode. Then in one instance, she would talk about pregnancy, (mind you, I am studying for my MCAT to get into medical school and only 27). She would say how if I dont allow her to go to her moms house for >3 months during the pregnenacy, this relationship is over. This came during the time when her sister was pregnant and would have fly from overseas since she lived there. Its almost as if she was applying what she learned from her sisters failing relationship on me. I ofcourse never said anything to begin with, I would say, I too would have some right over my future kid, and taking care of you, so I would think I want to be around when you are pregnant.

 

We finally got engaged, but not without drama. Im not rich by anymeans, neither is she. However, we decided to buy rings based on what we show eachother. I showed her a picture, and she did too. We both liked what we saw. We got engaged, and a week after we did, she asked me if she can return the ring for something else. I said "No" because we took pictures in it, it held a sentimental value. After talking, I said, dont worry, we'll keep this, but go out and buy something you like if you dont like this, Ill pay for it. I did exactly that. My thought is, her sister probably said something to her about the ring because she was ecstatic about it before.

 

The good news now was, I got into a very good medical school near home (hers and mine) about 3 hours away. It was perfect. I was excited. Getting admission into medical school is very hard.

 

Then come forward to picking the banquet hall. We looked at a few places, we decided we can have our parents help us. The parents agreed. During this time, I was medical school, I was doing extremely well, top 20% of the class. I always reported my grades to her to ensure transparency. Yes it got stressful at times, but I thought my success meant her success. She would always complain how I dont make her my priority. And I did my best, I would order her food during class, pick her up when I Could, drop her off when I could because it too hot or cold and didnt want her to walk the long parking lots alone. I would send her to sephora shopping sprees when she would have a bad day, and then even bring her medicine with soup on days when she was sick.

 

Again, I was not perfect, in that, when we would have childish arguements, she would say stuff, I would say stuff, it would get ugly. But everytime we made up very well and everytime we said sorry to eachother and I would remind her, that we are a team and we need to be strong. She agreed.

 

But I still tried to show her shes my everything. During the time when I was medical school I began to get sick, I got pneumonia, and had to go to the ER. Obviously she was worried, but then doctors saw more issues, and with my heart.

 

Long story short, I needed some procedure done. At first they thought open heart surgery, but then later said we can probably change your heart valve with a catherization (Non invasive). She was very worried in the sense that, me being 30 now, and her 25, she wanted to have kids soon, and she was worried moreso it seems about the "timeline" of things incase I needed to take a leave because she would say "Ever since I met you, we never had a easy road, your medical school, God I hate it, I dont know how you do it". Then a few months later, I got admitted for pneumonia again, and at first I didnt tell her all day but later I did. When I did, she replied "Oh I knew it was something like this, you probably got sick".

 

Eventually I got a date for my catherization, I had it done, it was a failure. So then I was looking at the prospects of open heart surgery.

 

My ex fiance went on vacation with her family and me having heart surgery soon had asked her to call me as I was down. Her reply? "No i cant call you, not even for 5 min, it doesnt work like that, you have continual issues, first medical school and now health issues, i need to relax". I had it coming, I mean I got her two engagement rings simply because she didnt like the first one, but I still got her what she liked. She had two rings and yet she had the nerve to call first one a "piece of ****" in a fight we had once. Heart surgery went fine, thankfully my heart didnt leave me like she did. But I learned it the hard way, her only excuse was how I was too invested in medicine, being a physician is difficult, and I always thought my success meant "our success". I wanted to furnish a life where she can live comfy, but in the end I got tarnished. You name it, I did it, if she was sick Id bring her soup and meds, Or Id pick her and drop her off from work when it would snow or it be too hot. If she bad a off day, Id be in class and surprise her with a sephora shopping spree or simply order her lunch from class. Id drive 30 minutes just to see her for one our and in the end I got screwed as she said "you never loved me". Im going to go back to medical school soon and live out my dreams. In the end the way I see it is that, Ive lived 30 years of life, Ive been hurt, Ive been stabbed, Ive been happy and Ive been sad, yet instead of rebandging each wound, I performed open heart surgery and faced every fear I had been running away from. A part of me died that day, the part that ran after the wrong things in life that held no value such as the fakeness of people that often blinds us. The part that remains alive has a wound. Its the truthiness of my wound that has kept me alive. The wound was the portal that led to every answer I had been seeking. It was the portal that opened me to the light of God that has enlightened me, saved me, and most importantly purified my soul in guiding me to my dreams and goals.

 

 

Basically because her dad was involved, I had actually called him to speak to him, that if she is okay? I didnt expect this from her, he turned back around and blamed it on me, on our trivial fights.

 

I think her issue was her insecurity, she was extremely insecure as she always said, the only thing I have is marriage, you have an entire medical career. During our banquet hall search, we looked at a lot of different places, but she and I agreed on a specific 5 start hotel. We loved it, and then later 4 days later, she had started to fight with me how, I made all the decisions (not true, as I asked her permission, and my dad asked her several times, as did her dad). She continued on to say, "how dare you call the shots, marriage is all I had and you took it away". I feel because her sister had a controlling somewhat abusive husband, she casted that shadow on me. When we got into our petty fights, she would sort of make fun of me "hahaahhaha" "youre just clingy", "you are just afraid of being alone". I supposed she used it against me?

 

Im currently okay healthwise, my surgery went well, but Im heart broken, here I was going to walmart buying things for our apartment, and then all of a sudden she did this.

 

In the end I did try to explain and tell her "please think it through, you are making a mistake, we spent a lot of time together". Her reply was "so this is how much you respect me? You cant respect me, if maybe you had a sister you'd know" This she was talking about my dead sister.

 

Thats when I said, okay I cant take it anymore.

 

So here I am heart broken, depressed, and just waiting for my medical school to start again......

Edited May 24, 2017 by Lifesaver
Forgot information

[preraph]

I think you're well rid of her. No, you are not perfect, but she doesn't appreciate anything. And blaming you for her only having marriage. Whose fault is that? It's her own fault. It's her life. She could do anything she wanted with it. And how petty about the ring.

 

Honestly, she sounds high maintenance and like she will never be satisfied. Once you are a doctor, you will have women running out of your EARS. So kiss her goodbye, get through your studies and take care of your health. She's selfish and possibly narcissistic. You being a doctor might know that better than me.

[anduina]

She's a horrible spoiled princess. You poor guy.

 

It sounds like there was good reason why her ex chose her sister over her. Thank god you weren't tied to her through marriage. Med school, here you come!

[Lifesaver]

I think you're well rid of her. No, you are not perfect, but she doesn't appreciate anything. And blaming you for her only having marriage. Whose fault is that? It's her own fault. It's her life. She could do anything she wanted with it. And how petty about the ring.

 

Honestly, she sounds high maintenance and like she will never be satisfied. Once you are a doctor, you will have women running out of your EARS. So kiss her goodbye, get through your studies and take care of your health. She's selfish and possibly narcissistic. You being a doctor might know that better than me.

 

Thank you for your reply. You are right. I am only human, def. not perfect. I am working to make myself better.

 

However I also know my parents raised me a certain way in that we believe you fall in love with the person you intend to marry, and I tried my best to work it out. Fact is, she came from a somewhat broken house, where her mom, sister, and dad all broke their initial engagements. So this was no different for her. I mean I can go on and on, for instance, during our arguements, her go to thing was hanging up the phone, blocking me on FB, etc. I at times would have to call her mom. This specifically happened, the very first day when I moved into medical school when I started to study with my friends, and I forgot to tell her. Her response was, "so youre just going to let me sit here and burn while you do your studying, NO I WILL NOT LET YOU DO THAT"

 

My profession means the world to me, I came from a 3rd world country on a medical mission for a rare heart disease, and America saved me. I owe it back now, and this is my time to shine and I need someone to understand that medicine is my passion. Her complaint was, "when will I be your number 1 priority". I mean Idk how to explain that medical school is hard and expensive ($300K), so I need to focus, yet here I was top 20% of my class. I was trying to furnish a lavish life for my family. Not sure what happened.

[Lifesaver]

She's a horrible spoiled princess. You poor guy.

 

It sounds like there was good reason why her ex chose her sister over her. Thank god you weren't tied to her through marriage. Med school, here you come!

 

Thank you for your reply.

 

I am naturally an extrovert in a good way, and she was a introvert (an extreme kind). Yeh after being a Ebola consultant for a few years, I want medicine and want to focus on cardiology. I want to learn how to cure "broken hearts".

 

It just sucks right now because I cant think of a single place where I havent taken her or bought her something she laid eyes on. The biggest thing her mom and her worried about was, "so hows your weight loss going". God is my witness, I am not overweight, maybe I plump by 5 poounds here and there, but not obese. Thats all their worry was.

[preraph]

Thank you for your reply. You are right. I am only human, def. not perfect. I am working to make myself better.

 

However I also know my parents raised me a certain way in that we believe you fall in love with the person you intend to marry, and I tried my best to work it out. Fact is, she came from a somewhat broken house, where her mom, sister, and dad all broke their initial engagements. So this was no different for her. I mean I can go on and on, for instance, during our arguements, her go to thing was hanging up the phone, blocking me on FB, etc. I at times would have to call her mom. This specifically happened, the very first day when I moved into medical school when I started to study with my friends, and I forgot to tell her. Her response was, "so youre just going to let me sit here and burn while you do your studying, NO I WILL NOT LET YOU DO THAT"

 

My profession means the world to me, I came from a 3rd world country on a medical mission for a rare heart disease, and America saved me. I owe it back now, and this is my time to shine and I need someone to understand that medicine is my passion. Her complaint was, "when will I be your number 1 priority". I mean Idk how to explain that medical school is hard and expensive ($300K), so I need to focus, yet here I was top 20% of my class. I was trying to furnish a lavish life for my family. Not sure what happened.

 

You show a lot of insight. Her family upbringing did shape who she is. All this fighting and demanding and chaos is probably what is normal to her because she grew up with it.

 

Yes, it is your time to shine and you will be a great asset to the medical profession because you have a passion for it.

 

Take a break from dating and get yourself established and then you will meet maybe another doctor or medical professional who is more your equal. She comes from chaos and that is normal to her. You don't need that.

[Lifesaver]

You show a lot of insight. Her family upbringing did shape who she is. All this fighting and demanding and chaos is probably what is normal to her because she grew up with it.

 

Yes, it is your time to shine and you will be a great asset to the medical profession because you have a passion for it.

 

Take a break from dating and get yourself established and then you will meet maybe another doctor or medical professional who is more your equal. She comes from chaos and that is normal to her. You don't need that.

 

To be fair, they didnt seem like they "fought" traditionally like yelling and screaming. But from what I can tell, the mother, sister, and herself were feminists. Now there is nothing wrong with that, BUT, if you use that to victimize and coercive certain actions out of the other party, then it becomes wrong. And sadly she does do that, she would say "you are the guy, you are supposed to do this for me, do that for me". For this reason, I think she was very insecure. Narsassitc? Im not sure, but selfish? Hell yes.

 

I would always look into her eyes and ask her "can you live without me", she would look and kind of just hug away the moment and never answer. My parents raised me into a passionate person, that love someone and something to your fullest, be it career or whatever.

 

Im just sad because I really had taken her for my wife, planned kids, thought where theyd go to school, what they would wear etc. I mean even something as simple as kids name were argued, she wnated for control over the names. My thing is, lets get your input and also our parents input, they are iimportant too. She threw a tantrum on me. That only she gets to name the baby.

 

Just very sad overall, not sure how to go about life at the moment. Lucky thing is, Im off from school, and in cardiac rehab after my 10 hour open heart surgery.

 

Something my surgeon told me that hit me hard...."we stopped your heart and put you on bypass, sometimes we need to give your medication to restart it, and shock it. We did none of that for you. The second I we warmed your heart up your heart was beating ready to go. So live for your heart, it didnt let you down even after 2 open heart surgeries (yes Ive had two). Its beating fine, and its beating for a reason because it wants to, you should too.

[d0nnivain]

So here I am heart broken, depressed, and just waiting for my medical school to start again......

 

I'm glad your health is better.

 

You dodged a major bullet. This woman sounds horrible. Here you are with health issues, studying your tail off & she says she can't call you, her FI, to tell you her plane landed safely because she's too stressed. What a jerk! What kind of woman does that? You can't possibly want her to be the mother of your children. What example will she set?

 

Avail yourself of whatever mental health services your medical school offers. Deal with your situational depression. Find a cute nurse or fellow medical student to occupy your time & go get that M.D.

[Lifesaver]

I'm glad your health is better.

 

You dodged a major bullet. This woman sounds horrible. Here you are with health issues, studying your tail off & she says she can't call you, her FI, to tell you her plane landed safely because she's too stressed. What a jerk! What kind of woman does that? You can't possibly want her to be the mother of your children. What example will she set?

 

Avail yourself of whatever mental health services your medical school offers. Deal with your situational depression. Find a cute nurse or fellow medical student to occupy your time & go get that M.D.

 

To be fair, she DID text me when she landed, in fact she had bought WIFI on the plane to chat to me. Its when her idiotic sister came and met her up there at the vacation spot did she change quite a bit. I mean She didnt really call me just texted me. I caught her lying once, where she said shes going to sleep, but she was online talking to her other siblings back home in the USA. She is scared of her sister to show her that shes not too "attached" to me, because her owns sisters marriage is a wreck. Her sister is constantly fighting with her husband. I mean every night I stared at my reports and then waiting for her to come on. I would stay awake till 3-4 am just so she can wake up so I can chat with her (thats when she woke up since it was a different time zone).

 

To be honest, Im a medial professional, I firmly believe she has some internal demons she was fighting. What kind of person says this? "You are sick, I should be worried about you, but I am not, I dont know why".

 

Again, my parents have seen rough times together, my dad had to work 3 jobs once, my parnets got into fights, but they stuck through.

 

I just need to get over this heart break, because it is starting to consume me. I have dreams about her, shes crying, she wants to work it out and I wake up tearing up. That yes I was not perfect, yes we got into fights, but when I made it up, I was always there for her in her time of need. The day of my surgery, I kept checking my phone thinking maybe she had a little bit of humanity that shed text to check up on me. But no.

 

Towards the end she got evil, she was NOT evil before. Her claim is I made her this way, but thats not true, its her damn sister who constantly brain washed her. She made fun of me how "hahahaha youre just afraid you will loose me, you clingy mess"

 

Youre right I am def. going to be a physician, in fact I want to go into Adult Congenital Cardiology so I can ensure no parent has to go through what my parents did when I was a baby.

Edited May 25, 2017 by Lifesaver
Missed info

[mightycpa]

Her idiotic sister isn't going anywhere, so that will be a source of trouble for you. Her father, who would rather heap blame upon you than help you mend the difficulty, isn't going anywhere either. Your ex, for whom thoughtfulness seems to be a one way street, seems more suited to be a Doctor's wife than a medical student's wife.

 

It's funny. I don't really like her, and my dislike is based solely on the description of the man that loves her. That's never a good sign.

 

Get both rings back and move on.

[Lifesaver]

Her idiotic sister isn't going anywhere, so that will be a source of trouble for you. Her father, who would rather heap blame upon you than help you mend the difficulty, isn't going anywhere either. Your ex, for whom thoughtfulness seems to be a one way street, seems more suited to be a Doctor's wife than a medical student's wife.

 

It's funny. I don't really like her, and my dislike is based solely on the description of the man that loves her. That's never a good sign.

 

Get both rings back and move on.

 

I tried to be honest as possible in my description, including that I wasnt perfect either. I had flaws too which Ive highlighted.

 

You are right, getting into medical school AGAIN after my sister dying was very hard. I was lucky to get 3 acceptances. I did my best as we lived away from eachother as Ive written. Ordered panera almost everyday for her (i.e. Tomato soup, tomato motz panini, and green tea). When I would drive back home, I would often come straight to her work to pick her up to take her out. Take her out for shopping sprees. I dont get it. I know us men arent perfect, but isnt that what a lady wants? Have a sense of chivalry, have a sense of belongingness.

 

My mother says, there was something more going behind the scenes, that jealousy took over her sister and she brainwashed her. Her sister did at one point say "hes such a nice guy, even I would wait for him and marry him". Her sister lives overseas whereas she would have lived 5 minutes away (my ex fiance). My mother said, jealousy kicked in. Her sisters marriaged ceremony wasnt glamerous. Mine would have been at a top area hotel at Marriott. Again, my mom said jealousy kicekd in.

 

Shes heartless, and not passionate at all. I am a passionate, and my passion has always been to save lives, I used to be a EMT a long time ago and my EMT chief told me, "you are going to do something that very few people dream of doing".

 

Everytime I woudl tell her, I could do my rotations at this institution or that, in 2 years or so. Her answer was great, and she would joke "then we can have a baby". That was her thing, she only wanted to have kids, no ambititon, no career, just have kids. Thats all her mom did, as she was a house wife. Which again Im not being judgemental, I was willing to provide in due time, but atleast support me during this tough time you know?

Edited May 25, 2017 by Lifesaver
Missed info

[preraph]

To be fair, they didnt seem like they "fought" traditionally like yelling and screaming. But from what I can tell, the mother, sister, and herself were feminists. Now there is nothing wrong with that, BUT, if you use that to victimize and coercive certain actions out of the other party, then it becomes wrong. And sadly she does do that, she would say "you are the guy, you are supposed to do this for me, do that for me". For this reason, I think she was very insecure. Narsassitc? Im not sure, but selfish? Hell yes.

 

I would always look into her eyes and ask her "can you live without me", she would look and kind of just hug away the moment and never answer. My parents raised me into a passionate person, that love someone and something to your fullest, be it career or whatever.

 

Im just sad because I really had taken her for my wife, planned kids, thought where theyd go to school, what they would wear etc. I mean even something as simple as kids name were argued, she wnated for control over the names. My thing is, lets get your input and also our parents input, they are iimportant too. She threw a tantrum on me. That only she gets to name the baby.

 

Just very sad overall, not sure how to go about life at the moment. Lucky thing is, Im off from school, and in cardiac rehab after my 10 hour open heart surgery.

 

Something my surgeon told me that hit me hard...."we stopped your heart and put you on bypass, sometimes we need to give your medication to restart it, and shock it. We did none of that for you. The second I we warmed your heart up your heart was beating ready to go. So live for your heart, it didnt let you down even after 2 open heart surgeries (yes Ive had two). Its beating fine, and its beating for a reason because it wants to, you should too.

 

I think what you are describing with her is also something she learned in her family, and that is to take advantage of men. Now, that to me is not feminist, but more golddigger in a way. But I see what you meant. Her family has an aggressive sense of entitlement and getting what they want from men. It sounds like she is trying to be a "diva" or a "queen," and is willing to cause a lot of discord to get it. I believe her family is like that too and that's where she got that. It's not good for you. Because you are once again right: She is very selfish and it's all about "me, me, me" with her. What can you do for me? And I'm afraid it's NEVER going to be enough. I just think you need someone more professionally minded and deserve not to just be the one who gives and bows to her.

[preraph]

I don't think you'll ever get those rings back because I think she's too materialistic to give them back, and that it would only prolong your misery trying to get them. I think to get away, you will have to block her so you can move on and concentrate on more important things.

[Lifesaver]

I think what you are describing with her is also something she learned in her family, and that is to take advantage of men. Now, that to me is not feminist, but more golddigger in a way. But I see what you meant. Her family has an aggressive sense of entitlement and getting what they want from men. It sounds like she is trying to be a "diva" or a "queen," and is willing to cause a lot of discord to get it. I believe her family is like that too and that's where she got that. It's not good for you. Because you are once again right: She is very selfish and it's all about "me, me, me" with her. What can you do for me? And I'm afraid it's NEVER going to be enough. I just think you need someone more professionally minded and deserve not to just be the one who gives and bows to her.

 

B-I-N-G-O

 

WOW, you literally just wrote what my father and brother said to me. You are right, her father did tell me when we were going back and forth that, "you should be listening to her because.....". Sense of entitlement.

 

Could I ask, why does one say "well you never loved me". Is it to make me feel guilty? Because if so, she did a damn good job of it.

[Lifesaver]

I don't think you'll ever get those rings back because I think she's too materialistic to give them back, and that it would only prolong your misery trying to get them. I think to get away, you will have to block her so you can move on and concentrate on more important things.

 

I actually did get them back, and she gave hers back. My parents got them back for me, and returned hers. My parents are old school, so they felt it was important to let go when there is nothing left to salvage.

[Lifesaver]

Bump. Curious to hear other's honest thoughts. Would really appreciate it.

[preraph]

B-I-N-G-O

 

WOW, you literally just wrote what my father and brother said to me. You are right, her father did tell me when we were going back and forth that, "you should be listening to her because.....". Sense of entitlement.

 

Could I ask, why does one say "well you never loved me". Is it to make me feel guilty? Because if so, she did a damn good job of it.

 

Yes, it's to deflect blame on to you. It's sometimes called gaslighting. The person doing the worst offence finds some way to twist things around to be the other person's fault. It's narcissistic and it's manipulation.

 

I am so glad you got your rings back. I never thought she'd let them go! Well, your parents and everyone here pretty much agree, and you know it yourself.

 

Look beyond her. Think how nice it would be to have a sweet woman who appreciates every little thing you do for her and doesn't keep asking for more, who also works and makes her own way and what a much better partner that would be. Once you are at work, you will meet some very nice ladies in that profession much better than this one.

[Lifesaver]

Yes, it's to deflect blame on to you. It's sometimes called gaslighting. The person doing the worst offence finds some way to twist things around to be the other person's fault. It's narcissistic and it's manipulation.

 

I am so glad you got your rings back. I never thought she'd let them go! Well, your parents and everyone here pretty much agree, and you know it yourself.

 

Look beyond her. Think how nice it would be to have a sweet woman who appreciates every little thing you do for her and doesn't keep asking for more, who also works and makes her own way and what a much better partner that would be. Once you are at work, you will meet some very nice ladies in that profession much better than this one.

 

That was my thing. I mean I was never the person to like someone for how much money they made, or what career they did. She worked as a administrative assistant and dreaded her job at times, refused any career advancement, and always just wanted to come home and be home. She had friends, but dreaded hanging out with them and avoided them when she could.

 

Im a bit different in that, I run a online health blog talk radio show, I always have played as an actor in a movie recently, and I love what I do in medical school. I want to be out there and tell my story to give hope. So you are right, I need someone who are professional in their mindset.

 

Her biggest thing was convenience in that I was nearby and that was big for her and her family. In the end she made it seem like "you made into this person, you monster" when she herself said very recently before our break up "my sister does have a negative impact on me" - this came after her sister and her husband had a big fight.

Edited May 26, 2017 by Lifesaver
missed info

[Tiga]

Wow I gotta say she was a ****. My ex fiance needs someone like her in his life so he can see what he lost. That is terrible! You actually put up with a lot.

 

One thing I can say is try your best to put this behind you. I feel your pain. My ex's parents were projecting their problems/relationship issues onto our relationship. He started to believe them and eventually got sucked in. Her sister is manipulative as well as her. She seems unstable. I understand when small arguments occur, that is normal. But for her to raise a fit over everything and instead of supporting you in medical school she just made you feel like ****.

 

I am sorry. I hope you heal from this, i know it hurts and we all wish there was a cure for broken hearts. We all need it.

[preraph]

Whispering: (I wish Tiga and Lifesaver lived in the same area.)

[Lifesaver]

Wow I gotta say she was a ****. My ex fiance needs someone like her in his life so he can see what he lost. That is terrible! You actually put up with a lot.

 

One thing I can say is try your best to put this behind you. I feel your pain. My ex's parents were projecting their problems/relationship issues onto our relationship. He started to believe them and eventually got sucked in. Her sister is manipulative as well as her. She seems unstable. I understand when small arguments occur, that is normal. But for her to raise a fit over everything and instead of supporting you in medical school she just made you feel like ****.

 

I am sorry. I hope you heal from this, i know it hurts and we all wish there was a cure for broken hearts. We all need it.

 

"UnstAble" is the word. I mean after choosing the same banquet hall as me. A top class banquet hall, she cAme around a few weeks later saying "marriage is all I had, how dare you make the decision on it" when i clearly didnt. I worked with her input. It was her sister who manipulated her. Im very confident.

 

Like her mom, she had no career ambition or passion. It just sucks becUse after loosing my sister, my parents treated her like a daughter, taking her to dinners, dinner cruises, buying her presents on special occasions or if we traveled as a family we got her something from london or amsterdam.

 

I hope I cAn heal, I really hope i can let go of this misery of missing her. It really sucks.

 

I wanted to be gym buddies with her so I got her a samsung smartwTch and she only used it two three days.

 

Im just hoping i can forget this, move on, be a doctor and find someone who will appreciate my noble profession and my passion.

 

She was great with words but when it came to being a "team" she passivly made it a challenege of checks and balances. Youre the guy you have this I SHOULD have this.

[Downtown]

"Unstable" is the word.

Lifesaver, when emotional instability lasts for only a year or two, the two most common causes are a strong hormone change and drug abuse. However, you apparently are not talking about a temporary instability but, rather, a persistent lifetime instability that you believe may have originated in her childhood, i.e., in her unhealthy family environment. The two common causes of lifetime instability are BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder) and bipolar disorder. Significantly, you are NOT describing a pattern of bipolar symptoms (if you're interested, see my explanation at 12 BPD/Bipolar Differences).

 

I therefore suggest you consider whether BPD traits may apply. Many behaviors you describe -- i.e., irrational anger, controlling actions, easily triggered temper tantrums, lack of impulse control, low self esteem, and always being "The Victim" -- are some of the classic warning signs for BPD. Importantly, I'm not suggesting your ex-fiance has full-blown BPD but, rather, that she may exhibit moderate to strong traits of it.

 

I caution that BPD is not something -- like chickenpox -- that a person either "has" or "doesn't have." Instead, it is a "spectrum" disorder, which means every adult on the planet occasionally exhibits all BPD traits to some degree (albeit at a low level if the person is healthy). At issue, then, is not whether your ex-fiance exhibits BPD traits. Of course she does. We all do.

 

Rather, at issue is whether she exhibits those traits at a strong and persistent level (i.e., is on the upper end of the BPD spectrum). Not having met her, I cannot answer that question. I nonetheless believe you can spot any strong BPD warning signs that are present if you take a little time to learn which behaviors are on the list. They are easy to spot because there is nothing subtle about behaviors such as always being "The Victim," lack of impulse control, icy withdrawal, and temper tantrums.

 

Narcissistic? I'm not sure, but selfish? Hell yes.

I agree with Preraph that the selfishness, lack of empathy, and feeling of entitlement are classic symptoms for NPD (Narcissistic PD). Her exhibiting strong traits of BPD would not rule out narcissism. On the contrary, a recent study of nearly 35,000 American adults found that the vast majority of people diagnosed as having one PD had one or two others as well. About three-fourths of the full-blown BPDers had at least one or two other PDs too. For example, 32% of the female BPDers had co-occurring lifetime NPD and 41% of the female narcissists had co-occurring lifetime BPD. See Table 3 at 2008 Study in JCP.

 

Her history is that, sadly she was coming off from something disastrous in that... her sister married my ex fiance's initial guy.

Disastrous? What disaster? The vast majority of adults remain emotionally stable after having been rejected by many ex-partners. If your ex-finance suffers from a persistent lifetime instability, it is highly unlikely that the problem originated in her late teens when a guy left her to marry her sister -- a guy who has made the sister's life miserable ever since. Lifetime instability typically originates in early childhood when heredity and/or parental abuse prevent the child from developing a stable, integrated sense of self identity.

 

During our arguments, her go-to thing was hanging up the phone, blocking me on FB, etc. I at times would have to call her mom.

The repeating cycle of push-you-away and pull-you-back is one of the hallmarks of a BPDer relationship. It occurs because a BPDer's two great fears (abandonment and engulfment) lie at the opposite ends of the very same spectrum. This means that it is impossible to back away from triggering one of her fears without starting to trigger the other fear.

 

As you draw close to assure her of your love, for example, you will trigger a BPDer's engulfment fear because, although BPDers crave intimacy, they cannot tolerate it for very long. Due to a BPDer's fragile, weak sense of self identity, she will quickly feel like you're trying to control her -- and she will get the scary feeling of being suffocated or engulfed. She therefore will create a fight -- over absolutely nothing -- to push you away.

 

Yet, as you back away to give her breathing space, you unavoidably will start triggering her abandonment fear. Hence, if your exGF is a BPDer (i.e., has strong traits), you were always in a lose/lose situation. You lost no matter what you did. Due to this push-away and pull-back cycle, BPDer relationships are notorious for having numerous breakups.

 

A BPDfamily survey of about 460 such relationships found that nearly a fourth (23%) went through 10 or more complete breakup/makeup cycles BEFORE finally ending for good. About 40% of the BPDer relationships experienced at least six breakup/makeup cycles before eventually ending. And 73% had three or more breakup/makeup cycles before finally ending. See "Results" at BPDfamily Breakup/Makeup Poll.

 

I mean after choosing the same banquet hall as me. A top class banquet hall, she came around a few weeks later saying "marriage is all I had, how dare you make the decision on it" when i clearly didn't.

If your ex-fiance has the engulfment fear mentioned above, she won't think to herself "I feel so engulfed during intimacy." Rather, she will get a scary, uncomfortable feeling that she is losing her identity in your strong stable personality -- and she will feel that you somehow must be controlling her. The result is that, with BPDers, it is impossible to give her anything -- no matter how generous -- without her feeling that YOU make all the important decisions and control everything.

 

With my BPDer exW, I learned that it was impossible to give her anything as a gift without her feeling controlled. If I bought a surprise gift, for example, she resented the fact that I had been the one to decide WHAT had been purchased. Yet, if I bought something that she had already said she wanted, she resented me for being the one to decide WHEN it was purchased. I therefore stopped giving her presents and, instead, gave her a very generous monthly allowance that permitted her to buy whatever and whenever she wanted to.

 

Of course, then she resented me for being the one to decide HOW MUCH is budgeted for each month -- never mind that it was 3 times what I ever spent on myself. I note that, although BPDers feel very controlled by their partners, the BPDers are the ones doing nearly all the controlling. To protect their fragile egos, their subconscious minds project that hurtful feeling onto their partners. At a conscious level, then, a BPDer is absolutely convinced that the controlling efforts originate in her partner's mind.

 

Her response was, "so you're just going to let me sit here and burn while you do your studying, NO I WILL NOT LET YOU DO THAT."

Like I said, BPDers are very controlling. It is their way of dealing with their abandonment fear (by keeping you from absent for too long) and their engulfment fear (by keeping you from being close for too long).

 

Her complaint was, "when will I be your number 1 priority?" ...why does one say "well you never loved me?"

If your ex-fiance really is a BPDer, it will be impossible to convince her that you truly love her (for any extended period) until she first learns how to love herself. Because a BPDer is filled with self loathing (carried from early childhood), she may be convinced for a few days that you love her but she cannot sustain that belief. She lives in fear that, once you discover how empty she is on the inside, you will promptly abandon her.

 

The result is that she will administer a series of tests designed to determine whether you still love her. Of course, passing a test does not settle the matter at all. Instead, it simply means she will raise the hoop higher the next time she demands that you jump through it.

 

A week after we [bought the ring she approved], she asked me if she can return the ring for something else.

If she is a BPDer, I'm surprised you didn't get TWO weeks before she changed her mind. Because BPDers are unstable and have a fragile sense of self identity, they typically are happy with a new purchase or gift for a few days before losing interest. Yet, if you spend the big bucks, the happiness period should last longer.

 

My exW, for example, would be pleased with a moderately expensive gift for a week and then it would disappear into a drawer. For a major purchase like her engagement ring, however, she was thrilled for two weeks. Then she wanted me to take it back and have the diamond reset in another band -- never mind that SHE had been the one to pick out the first setting.

 

I wanted to be gym buddies with her so I got her a Samsung smartwatch and she only used it two three days.

As I noted above, my exW likely would have worn the smartwatch for a week. Her mother had been the same way. When I gave her mother an expensive coat, she was thrilled for two weeks. Then it was "too small" and she exchanged it for something else. Similarly, when I bought her mother a sofa, she was thrilled with it for two weeks, at which point she realized it was the wrong color.

 

I firmly believe she has some internal demons she was fighting.

Perhaps so. I therefore suggest you take a quick look at my list of 18 BPD Warning Signs to see if most sound very familiar. If so, I would suggest you also read my more detailed description of them at my posts in Rebel's Thread. If that description rings many bells and raises questions, I would be glad to join Preraph and the other respondents in discussing them with you.

 

Significantly, learning to spot these warning signs will NOT enable you to diagnose your ex-fiance's issues. Although it is easy to spot BPD and NPD symptoms, only a professional can determine whether they are so severe and persistent as to constitute a full-blown disorder. Yet, like learning warning signs for stroke and heart attack, learning those for BPD and HPD may help you avoid a very painful situation -- e.g., avoid taking her back or avoid running into the arms of another woman just like her. Take care, Lifesaver.

[Lifesaver]

Lifesaver, when emotional instability lasts for only a year or two, the two most common causes are a strong hormone change and drug abuse. However, you apparently are not talking about a temporary instability but, rather, a persistent lifetime instability that you believe may have originated in her childhood, i.e., in her unhealthy family environment. The two common causes of lifetime instability are BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder) and bipolar disorder. Significantly, you are NOT describing a pattern of bipolar symptoms (if you're interested, see my explanation at 12 BPD/Bipolar Differences).

 

I therefore suggest you consider whether BPD traits may apply. Many behaviors you describe -- i.e., irrational anger, controlling actions, easily triggered temper tantrums, lack of impulse control, low self esteem, and always being "The Victim" -- are some of the classic warning signs for BPD. Importantly, I'm not suggesting your ex-fiance has full-blown BPD but, rather, that she may exhibit moderate to strong traits of it.

 

I caution that BPD is not something -- like chickenpox -- that a person either "has" or "doesn't have." Instead, it is a "spectrum" disorder, which means every adult on the planet occasionally exhibits all BPD traits to some degree (albeit at a low level if the person is healthy). At issue, then, is not whether your ex-fiance exhibits BPD traits. Of course she does. We all do.

 

Rather, at issue is whether she exhibits those traits at a strong and persistent level (i.e., is on the upper end of the BPD spectrum). Not having met her, I cannot answer that question. I nonetheless believe you can spot any strong BPD warning signs that are present if you take a little time to learn which behaviors are on the list. They are easy to spot because there is nothing subtle about behaviors such as always being "The Victim," lack of impulse control, icy withdrawal, and temper tantrums.

 

I agree with Preraph that the selfishness, lack of empathy, and feeling of entitlement are classic symptoms for NPD (Narcissistic PD). Her exhibiting strong traits of BPD would not rule out narcissism. On the contrary, a recent study of nearly 35,000 American adults found that the vast majority of people diagnosed as having one PD had one or two others as well. About three-fourths of the full-blown BPDers had at least one or two other PDs too. For example, 32% of the female BPDers had co-occurring lifetime NPD and 41% of the female narcissists had co-occurring lifetime BPD. See Table 3 at 2008 Study in JCP.

 

Disastrous? What disaster? The vast majority of adults remain emotionally stable after having been rejected by many ex-partners. If your ex-finance suffers from a persistent lifetime instability, it is highly unlikely that the problem originated in her late teens when a guy left her to marry her sister -- a guy who has made the sister's life miserable ever since. Lifetime instability typically originates in early childhood when heredity and/or parental abuse prevent the child from developing a stable, integrated sense of self identity.

 

The repeating cycle of push-you-away and pull-you-back is one of the hallmarks of a BPDer relationship. It occurs because a BPDer's two great fears (abandonment and engulfment) lie at the opposite ends of the very same spectrum. This means that it is impossible to back away from triggering one of her fears without starting to trigger the other fear.

 

As you draw close to assure her of your love, for example, you will trigger a BPDer's engulfment fear because, although BPDers crave intimacy, they cannot tolerate it for very long. Due to a BPDer's fragile, weak sense of self identity, she will quickly feel like you're trying to control her -- and she will get the scary feeling of being suffocated or engulfed. She therefore will create a fight -- over absolutely nothing -- to push you away.

 

Yet, as you back away to give her breathing space, you unavoidably will start triggering her abandonment fear. Hence, if your exGF is a BPDer (i.e., has strong traits), you were always in a lose/lose situation. You lost no matter what you did. Due to this push-away and pull-back cycle, BPDer relationships are notorious for having numerous breakups.

 

A BPDfamily survey of about 460 such relationships found that nearly a fourth (23%) went through 10 or more complete breakup/makeup cycles BEFORE finally ending for good. About 40% of the BPDer relationships experienced at least six breakup/makeup cycles before eventually ending. And 73% had three or more breakup/makeup cycles before finally ending. See "Results" at BPDfamily Breakup/Makeup Poll.

 

If your ex-fiance has the engulfment fear mentioned above, she won't think to herself "I feel so engulfed during intimacy." Rather, she will get a scary, uncomfortable feeling that she is losing her identity in your strong stable personality -- and she will feel that you somehow must be controlling her. The result is that, with BPDers, it is impossible to give her anything -- no matter how generous -- without her feeling that YOU make all the important decisions and control everything.

 

With my BPDer exW, I learned that it was impossible to give her anything as a gift without her feeling controlled. If I bought a surprise gift, for example, she resented the fact that I had been the one to decide WHAT had been purchased. Yet, if I bought something that she had already said she wanted, she resented me for being the one to decide WHEN it was purchased. I therefore stopped giving her presents and, instead, gave her a very generous monthly allowance that permitted her to buy whatever and whenever she wanted to.

 

Of course, then she resented me for being the one to decide HOW MUCH is budgeted for each month -- never mind that it was 3 times what I ever spent on myself. I note that, although BPDers feel very controlled by their partners, the BPDers are the ones doing nearly all the controlling. To protect their fragile egos, their subconscious minds project that hurtful feeling onto their partners. At a conscious level, then, a BPDer is absolutely convinced that the controlling efforts originate in her partner's mind.

 

Like I said, BPDers are very controlling. It is their way of dealing with their abandonment fear (by keeping you from absent for too long) and their engulfment fear (by keeping you from being close for too long).

 

If your ex-fiance really is a BPDer, it will be impossible to convince her that you truly love her (for any extended period) until she first learns how to love herself. Because a BPDer is filled with self loathing (carried from early childhood), she may be convinced for a few days that you love her but she cannot sustain that belief. She lives in fear that, once you discover how empty she is on the inside, you will promptly abandon her.

 

The result is that she will administer a series of tests designed to determine whether you still love her. Of course, passing a test does not settle the matter at all. Instead, it simply means she will raise the hoop higher the next time she demands that you jump through it.

 

If she is a BPDer, I'm surprised you didn't get TWO weeks before she changed her mind. Because BPDers are unstable and have a fragile sense of self identity, they typically are happy with a new purchase or gift for a few days before losing interest. Yet, if you spend the big bucks, the happiness period should last longer.

 

My exW, for example, would be pleased with a moderately expensive gift for a week and then it would disappear into a drawer. For a major purchase like her engagement ring, however, she was thrilled for two weeks. Then she wanted me to take it back and have the diamond reset in another band -- never mind that SHE had been the one to pick out the first setting.

 

As I noted above, my exW likely would have worn the smartwatch for a week. Her mother had been the same way. When I gave her mother an expensive coat, she was thrilled for two weeks. Then it was "too small" and she exchanged it for something else. Similarly, when I bought her mother a sofa, she was thrilled with it for two weeks, at which point she realized it was the wrong color.

 

Perhaps so. I therefore suggest you take a quick look at my list of 18 BPD Warning Signs to see if most sound very familiar. If so, I would suggest you also read my more detailed description of them at my posts in Rebel's Thread. If that description rings many bells and raises questions, I would be glad to join Preraph and the other respondents in discussing them with you.

 

Significantly, learning to spot these warning signs will NOT enable you to diagnose your ex-fiance's issues. Although it is easy to spot BPD and NPD symptoms, only a professional can determine whether they are so severe and persistent as to constitute a full-blown disorder. Yet, like learning warning signs for stroke and heart attack, learning those for BPD and HPD may help you avoid a very painful situation -- e.g., avoid taking her back or avoid running into the arms of another woman just like her. Take care, Lifesaver.

 

You know I had to read this a few times. Not because I was confused but because I was shocked at what you wrote and the similarities I could draw from them. It was a bit terrifying at times to read because I am very convinced on what you were saying regarding her BPD or NPD. I firmly believe she had some degree of it on the spectrum you were talking about. I did take a look at the list, and I can count up to half atleast of those things mentioned.

 

Of the many you wrote about, extreme language (you always, you never), a VERY strong sense of entitlement, always being the victim, we would have fights and they would lead to tantrums, taking on the personality she was talking to.

 

These were the big ones. She def. had all these signs. If anything her mother was sort of like this. Its becuase she always told me, her mother and father had no relationship whatsoever. It was moreso, "ok we got married, we are supposed to have kids now, and now we have live in the same house". Heck she told me they didnt even sleep in the same room. She used to fault her own mother for not being social with people hence she came out to be a outcast of sorts too because though she had friends, she was never enthusiastic about hanging out with them.

 

You are right about the smartwatch, she wore it for a few days, after that, I never saw it. I got her a very expensive mother of pearl skagen watch, I saw it a few times, after that never.

 

Again I want to reiterate I am not perfect, I too was tensed at times, taking exams to get into medical school, but I always made up for it. Always went above and beyond. Whatever Holiday came, I remembered dates, times, etc. Had edible arrangements sent, for her, for her family. But like you said, it was never going to be enough.

 

You are right, now that I think, with the ring, I got her one, she came back around and declined it, with the banquet hall, we signed the papers, she came back around and declined it.

 

My family and I are VERY VERY close. Like we are a typical "Italian" family of sorts in that, yes we get into arguements like anyone, but we are passionate for eachothers well being, we are there for eachother. My sister in law wanted to help come with my mom to take care of me when I was sick in school. My ex fiance questioned that, saying, do you expect the same of me for your brother as well?

 

Her father said at the end, that she said "oh well I gotta get married to someone, so might as well". I mean before she left on vacation, she was into me, she was physical with me. And yet when I spoke to her last, I told her "calm down youre making a mistake, we spent a lot of time together, and we are like man and wife". She said "oh so this is what respect you have for me? You cant respect anyone, if only you had a sister, youd know". This she was talking about my dead sister.

 

She also claimed to her father, that I feel he will hit me one day. Which NOT true. I am not like that, yet it was her father who used to abuse her. This is what she told me when things were good. That her father used to hit her for the faults of her other siblings

 

Yes part of me did feel bad for her, I knew she had demons, but I wanted to help her, be her savior, but she kept crossing the line. I did the best I could. I dont know why she said "I feel he could hit me". That is not true at all. See Im a passionate guy, I am very spirtitual and thought with my sister passing, and me having to get into medical school, she met me around that time, and I thought maybe this was some sort of plan from life for me to meet her? I dont know, I thought it would have been a perfect thing to have, that with her in my corner, I got into med school and it would have been beautiful.

 

She would sorta times make fun of me, since I grew up in NYC, I would post pictures of NYC on my FB all the time, writing poetry, and different writings, since that was my childhood time. I loved it, it was a time when my sister was alive. In our fights, she would make fun of me saying "all your fake love is in your writing, you're not even the **** of those actors in the movies you follow".

 

I dont know where I went wrong, or why I feel this sense of guilt? But now I am on anti depressants, and trying to gather myself in the next two months to go back to school.

Edited May 27, 2017 by Lifesaver
Missing info

[Captivating]

I am sorry that you feel heart broken.

I hope that really soon you will see things more clearly and conclude that the breakup was a blessing in disguise.... from what you wrote, this is what I gathered:

 

--- You were a very caring, thoughtful, kind boyfriend who bent backwards for her, you did a LOT for her, you basically spoiled her

---- She barely did ANYTHING for you, belittled the first engagement ring you bought for her, mocked you called you clingy, you seem to be an annoyance for her with trying to make something out of yourself by pursuing medical school, annoyed by your sickness !!!!! MAJOR RED FLAG !!!!

Basically expecting everything from you, doing NOTHING for you.

She was not there to support you when you were sick !

This is TERRIBLE !

 

In my opinion, she is a spoiled brat who way overestimates herself. FOR WHAT ? How is she in the position to be such an arrogant butthole?

What did she achieve in life ? Nothing !

 

She is inconsiderate, selfish, lack compassion and class.

Very immature emotionally and SHALLOW ! Who wants to be around this woman for the rest of his life ? NOT YOU !

 

You are way better and deserve way better than be treated like this, don't you think ?? Find a like minded lady, who is sweet caring and loving.

Please move on and NEVER look back. You are so lucky that this is over !

What she said here..... is evil :

 

Her reply was "so this is how much you respect me? You cant respect me, if maybe you had a sister you'd know" This she was talking about my dead sister.

(who says something like that ?? )

[Downtown]

I don't know where I went wrong, or why I feel this sense of guilt?

Lifesaver, you are wise to realize you were a part of the problem. It takes two willing participants to make a toxic relationship last five years. The toxicity, then, is not something SHE was doing to you. Rather, it is something you BOTH were doing to each other. Of course, her contributions (e.g., the selfishness and temper tantrums) are easy to see. Your own contribution, however, is far more difficult to see because -- after all -- you feel you were only trying to help her.

 

Yet, your willingness to remain in a toxic relationship for nearly 5 years indicates that you almost certainly are an excessive caregiver -- just like me. Our problem is not wanting to help a loved one but, rather, our willingness to keep doing it even when it is to our great detriment to do so -- and even when we are not really helping.

 

As I understand it, we keep repeating that behavior -- as I did for 15 years -- because our desire to be needed (for what we can do) far exceeds our desire to be loved (for the men we already are). This is why, when we are out looking for a partner, we keep walking right on past all the healthy, emotionally available women (BORING!) until we find one who desperately needs us. The chances of our finding a BPDer-type woman are very high because BPDers are masters at projecting vulnerability, which is "catnip" to us caregivers. If you want to see how instantly and intensely you are drawn in by vulnerability, all you have to do is watch 20 minutes of any Marilyn Monroe movie.

 

We apparently got to be this way by growing up too fast, becoming "the fixer" and "little man" of the family. The best explanation I've seen of how this likely occurred in our childhoods is Shari Schreiber's blog article at Core Injury. Although I don't like Schreiber's description of BPDers (she confuses them with narcissists and sociopaths), I nonetheless find this blog article to be very insightful in explaining our caregiving nature. I suggest you read it because, once you understand how you're harming your GF -- not helping her -- you will start to free yourself from the terrible guilt that makes it so painful to walk away from her.

 

To a caregiver, the notion of walking away from a sick loved one is anathema, even when we can see that our attempts "to fix her" are not working. We mistakenly believe that, if we can only figure out what WE are doing wrong, we can restore our partners to those wonderful people we saw at the very beginning.