Break up and mental issues

[Sweetgirl28]

So, I have posted my story in this thread: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/breaking-up-reconciliation-coping/breaks-breaking-up/598478-blindsided-sudden-breakup

 

Before the comments start, I would like to add that I know what incompatibility means and I have experienced that before too. The fact is that he has been pushing for a commitment, a relationship, more dates, etc. He has told me numerous times how I am "different" from all the women he has dated before and how I am a breath of fresh air because I'm not clingy nor needy. We agree on many things in life; politics, family life, how we see ourselves in the future, career ambitions, etc. Sex is great too. In fact, I don't think I have ever had such great sex in my life. All went really well. And then the break up out of the blue.

 

He has a history of depression. He even dropped out of college because of that. He had to go see a therapist, take anti-depressants, etc... This period lasted for about 1.5 to 2 years. He only recently went back to school while combining that with a fulltime job.

 

Around the time we started dating, his family moved away from him, leaving him alone. He also moved to an apartment of his own after having spent the past few years with his family. I assume they wanted to make sure he was ok and keep a close eye on him.

 

During the "break up call", he sounded very emotional. It wasn't sadness or anything, but more like an emotional meltdown. As if everything had become too much suddenly. This is also in line with his behavior that day. He became enraged because I hadn't texted him yet. My last text was at 8 pm the night before, and it was "already 2pm the next day" when I finally got back to him. I fell asleep at 8:30 that night and had been working all day since 7 am without having had time to go to the bathroom, let alone text him. That triggered him to suddenly break up with me.

 

He reached out to me in a text yesterday; it was a simple "how are you?". I didn't respond until today. Have not heard back from him yet.

 

Does anyone have any thoughts on this? I am starting to get worried about him.

Edited October 15, 2016 by Sweetgirl28

[Sweetgirl28]

Day 4 after the break up. He texted me two days ago. I responded yesterday because a friend urged me to (totally regret it now). Have not heard from him since.

 

I don't know what his deal is. I guess I'll have to accept it's over.

[ExpatInItaly]

Yes, I think it's best if you close this chapter for good.

 

He's obviously not able to have a relationship right now, and it's keeping you in a loop that will only hurt you.

[Sweetgirl28]

Yes, I think it's best if you close this chapter for good.

 

He's obviously not able to have a relationship right now, and it's keeping you in a loop that will only hurt you.

 

I'm trying to but it's hard. Unexpected breakups are the worst.

 

He is definitely mentally challenged the more I look back on his past behaviors. It also reminded me of a few instances where I had to walk on egg shells as to not upset him. I guess he was emotionally abusive but I didn't see it.

[ExpatInItaly]

I'm trying to but it's hard. Unexpected breakups are the worst.

 

He is definitely mentally challenged the more I look back on his past behaviors. It also reminded me of a few instances where I had to walk on egg shells as to not upset him. I guess he was emotionally abusive but I didn't see it.

 

No, this is never a good sign.

 

It sounds like this break-up will really be a blessing for you. An ex of mine has a diagnosed personality disorder, though he refused treatment of any kind. Believe me when I say that if such a person won't help themselves, you're in for one heck of a volatile and painful experience.

[Sweetgirl28]

No, this is never a good sign.

 

It sounds like this break-up will really be a blessing for you. An ex of mine has a diagnosed personality disorder, though he refused treatment of any kind. Believe me when I say that if such a person won't help themselves, you're in for one heck of a volatile and painful experience.

 

You are definitely right. I should have seen all the early warning signs. Going cold for a week in the early dating stages, talking bad about his ex and referring to her as an abusive narcissist - actually all of his exes were bad people - complaining about his father being a narcissist who cheated on his mother, complaining about his mother being "a moody person", complaining about his brother received his grandfather's army medal while he had never served, while he had... The list goes on and on.

 

He would always become enraged whenever I had to cancel or adjust our plans, like one time a medical appointment had come up and I was unable to cancel that so I had to postpone seeing him that weekend. His reaction was very childish.

 

For some reason, he also seemed to pick fights in text conversations. My answers were too concise, I sounded uninterested or rude, etc.

 

Given these behaviors with his background having been depressed and genetic predisposition for narcissism - assuming he spoke the truth about his father - I guess he really had mental issues. I don't know much about personality disorders, but does this sound familiar to you?

[Downtown]

He would always become enraged.... His reaction was very childish.... I guess he really had mental issues. I don't know much about personality disorders, but does this sound familiar to you?

Sweetgirl, it may be worth your while to take a quick look at my list of 18 BPD Warning Signs. You've already mentioned a few behaviors on that list. Importantly, I'm not suggesting your exBF has full-blown BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder) but, rather, that he might exhibit moderate to strong traits of it or another PD.

 

I caution that BPD is not something -- like chickenpox -- that a person either "has" or "doesn't have." Instead, it is a spectrum disorder, which means every adult on the planet occasionally exhibits all BPD traits to some degree (albeit at a low level if the person is healthy). At issue, then, is not whether your exBF exhibits BPD traits. Of course he does. We all do.

 

Rather, at issue is whether he exhibits those traits at a strong and persistent level (i.e., is on the upper end of the BPD spectrum). Not having met him, I cannot answer that question. I nonetheless believe you can spot any strong BPD warning signs that are present if you take a little time to learn which behaviors are on the list. They are not difficult to spot because there is nothing subtle about behaviors such as always being "The Victim," lack of impulse control, and rapid event-triggered mood flips.

[Sweetgirl28]

1. Black-white thinking, wherein she categorizes everyone as "all good" or "all bad" and will recategorize someone -- in just a few seconds -- from one polar extreme to the other based on a minor comment or infraction;

2. Frequent use of all-or-nothing expressions like "you always" and "you never;"

5. Flipping, on a dime, between adoring you and devaluing you -- making you feel like you're always walking on eggshells;

6. Frequently creating drama over issues so minor that neither of you can recall what the fight was about two days later;

12. Complaining that all her previous BFs were abusive and claiming (during your courtship) that you are the only one who has treated her well;

13. Mirroring your personality and preferences so perfectly during the courtship period (e.g., enjoying everything and everyone you like) that you were convinced you had met your "soul mate;"

16. Having many casual friends but not any close long-term friends (unless they live a long distance away);

 

These all ring true. As for the other bullets on that list, some of them are also true but only to some extent. He would get mad for making a change in plans but at the same time he would suddenly get sick of me being in his apartment. He wouldn't verbalize that but I could always tell how his demeanor changed. For no apparent reason.

 

Fact is that I believe that this guy has some kind of mental issues. I mean, he used to be on anti-depressants before. He stopped taking them because "they change who you are".

 

I just wonder to what extent this break up was my fault.

[Downtown]

As for the other bullets on that list, some of them are also true but only to some extent. He would get mad for making a change in plans but at the same time he would suddenly get sick of me being in his apartment.

The key behavioral trait for BPD is inability to regulate one's own emotions, resulting in emotional instability. Whereas a narcissist or sociopath typically is stable, a BPDer is unstable. This means that, for a BPD trait to be considered "strong," it doesn't have to be continual and uninterrupted from day to day. Rather, it only has to be strong in comparison to the behavior of most other adults.

 

Hence, you might want to reconsider the relevance of warning sign #8: Verbal abuse and anger that is easily triggered, in seconds, by a minor thing you say or do (real or imagined), resulting in temper tantrums or cold sulking that typically start in seconds and last several hours. It may be consistent with your statement, "Going cold for a week in the early dating stages.... He would always become enraged whenever I had to cancel or adjust our plans.... His reaction was very childish. For some reason, he also seemed to pick fights in text conversations."

[Sweetgirl28]

The key behavioral trait for BPD is inability to regulate one's own emotions, resulting in emotional instability. Whereas a narcissist or sociopath typically is stable, a BPDer is unstable. This means that, for a BPD trait to be considered "strong," it doesn't have to be continual and uninterrupted from day to day. Rather, it only has to be strong in comparison to the behavior of most other adults.

 

Hence, you might want to reconsider the relevance of warning sign #8: Verbal abuse and anger that is easily triggered, in seconds, by a minor thing you say or do (real or imagined), resulting in temper tantrums or cold sulking that typically start in seconds and last several hours. It may be consistent with your statement, "Going cold for a week in the early dating stages.... He would always become enraged whenever I had to cancel or adjust our plans.... His reaction was very childish. For some reason, he also seemed to pick fights in text conversations."

 

You are definitely right about warning sign #8. I didn't include it in my list because he would always do it very subtle.

 

Since he referred to his father as a narcissist - I have never met the man so I can't tell - I assumed he might exhibit some traits of that. Then again, he isn't very stable. At first sight, he seems as if he has got his stuff together but deep down he is very immature;

 

He thinks he dresses well vs. He thinks a dress shirt will automatically make him shine; he doesn't know how to fold a shirt properly, how to tie a tie, how to find dress shoes in his size (he has unusually big feet)

 

He comes across as nice and charming vs. He is always unsure as to how people perceive him, yet he finds himself to be a very likable person. He tries adhere to certain social rules and skills that he acquired in high school, i.e. maintaining a certain level of status and behaving accordingly.

 

He pretends to be ambitious vs. He had to drop out of college, go back to college with a different major. He feels frustrated for not being able to find a job that he wants since he doesn't have a college degree yet.

 

He presents himself as experienced with women/dating vs. He has never been in a mature relationship before. He still adheres to these strange rules from high school, as in having to ask someone to be their gf before it is considered "official", holding entire conversations - especially fights - through text messages, etc. He would often say "I don't know what I'm doing" whenever I questioned strange behavior to that respect.

 

Not sure if this is narcissism, bipolar, borderline, commitment phobia or something else, but fact is that something is off. I mean, he just texted me again. I haven't opened the message yet since I don't want to read it nor deal with it at this point.

 

The abovementioned list is interesting for future reference if I happen to meet a new man who acts the same way.

 

Any thoughts on this?

[Downtown]

Not sure if this is narcissism, bipolar, borderline, commitment phobia or something else, but fact is that something is off.... Any thoughts on this?

Because you are unable to diagnose his issues, you cannot expect to be certain or "sure." To protect yourself, however, it is prudent to learn the warning signs because they are not difficult to spot. If you're interested in the distinction between the red flags for BPD and bipolar, for example, I list them at 12 BPD/Bipolar Differences. That list is based on my experiences with a BPDer (my exW) and a bipolar-1 sufferer (my adult foster son).

 

As to the 10 PDs, please keep in mind that these are not descriptions of ten different identifiable diseases. Indeed, nobody has yet proven that any of them arise from an identifiable disease. Instead, the 10 PDs are simply ten different patterns of behaviors that all human beings exhibit to some degree. Moreover, the vast majority folks exhibiting one full-blown PD also exhibit one or two others as well. Nearly 40% of BPDers, for example, also exhibit full-blown narcissism.

[Redhead14]

Diagnosis is completely irrelevant . . . he is not exhibiting behaviors that show he is relationship material for her PERIOD. Nothing else matters. Whatever he's dealing with is his problem, not hers, and she shouldn't try to make it hers as well.

 

Some people feel the need to be able to diagnose a partner/understand it so that they can try to do things that they feel will help the person become the person they want them to be or become the person they think the other person needs.

 

It doesn't work that way.

[Downtown]

Diagnosis is completely irrelevant.

Redhead, nobody on this thread has attempted to diagnose anything. What we've been discussing is spotting warning signs. There is a world of difference between the two.

 

Nothing else matters.

I disagree. It is important to learn from one's own failed relationships. Otherwise, you are at risk of leaving one dysfunctional person only to run right into the arms of another person just like him.

 

Some people feel the need to be able to diagnose a partner/understand it so that they can try to do things that they feel will help the person become the person they want them to be or become the person they think the other person needs.

All human knowledge is subject to misuse. Hence, "some people" will misuse knowledge, no matter what it is. This is not a justification, however, for discouraging the pursuit of knowledge and understanding. Nor is it a reason to discourage Sweetgirl's efforts to better understand what may have gone wrong in her failed relationship.

[Redhead14]

Redhead, nobody on this thread has attempted to diagnose anything. What we've been discussing is spotting warning signs. There is a world of difference between the two.

 

I disagree. It is important to learn from one's own failed relationships. Otherwise, you are at risk of leaving one dysfunctional person only to run right into the arms of another person just like him.

 

All human knowledge is subject to misuse. Hence, "some people" will misuse knowledge, no matter what it is. This is not a justification, however, for discouraging the pursuit of knowledge and understanding. Nor is it a reason to discourage Sweetgirl's efforts to better understand what may have gone wrong in her failed relationship.

 

Nothing I said was intended to discourage her from getting a little educated. It was a statement of fact.

 

The only warning signs anyone needs is that a dating partner is not dating you properly, isn't making you feel comfortable, isn't consistent, etc. The reasons behind the lack of those things just don't matter in the decision process for ending a relationship.

 

Otherwise, you are at risk of leaving one dysfunctional person only to run right into the arms of another person just like him. -- It's about the OP knowing herself and being a completely functional person herself. Knowing what she wants and identifying whether or not a dating partner is showing her enough to demonstrate that they are good relationship material.

 

Sure, there's nothing wrong with getting a little educated but the fact is there is no way she can use that information effectively or objectively for evaluating a new dating partner based on that kind of analysis. It actually clouds the ability to be objective. Little missteps interpreted as signs of a big issue, focusing on those things and it creates anxiety that doesn't necessarily need to be there.

 

It's a slippery slope even with the usual signs let alone getting too deep into other things. If you're dating a narcissist, you're going to feel it. You're going to be uncomfortable, etc. You don't need to know he's a narcissist, you feel it before you KNOW it. And, not everyone who makes you uncomfortable is a narcissist . . . so does it matter why the person makes you uncomfortable? Nope.

[Downtown]

...the fact is there is no way she can use that information effectively or objectively for evaluating a new dating partner based on that kind of analysis. It actually clouds the ability to be objective.... It's a slippery slope even with the usual signs....

Redhead, hundreds of mental health centers disagree with your view that learning how to spot the warning signs for personality disorders is somehow dangerous, i.e., that doing so "actually clouds the ability to be objective" and is "a slippery slope." That's why they are educating the lay public about these behavioral symptoms by posting them on their public websites.

[Redhead14]

Redhead, hundreds of mental health centers disagree with your view that learning how to spot the warning signs for personality disorders is somehow dangerous, i.e., that doing so "actually clouds the ability to be objective" and is "a slippery slope." That's why they are educating the lay public about these behavioral symptoms by posting them on their public websites.

 

I don't disagree with being educated or hundreds of mental health centers . . . I'm just saying a lay person needs to be careful about assigning diagnoses to people they are dating. It's not dangerous at all except for the fact that they may be entirely incorrect about their assessment/diagnosis when in fact they are seeing something that can be attributed to all kinds of things and not an indicator of a disorder in and of itself. All they need to know and understand is that that behavior is not acceptable to them and need to move on. Yes, if a person exhibits a number of behaviors that are indicators of a disorder, the other person should back off.

 

If they start dating armed with this information and actively looking for signs and symptoms, etc. they often get a little caught up in that and start seeing things that aren't really there . . .

 

Use the information objectively and, absolutely, use the information when they see the signs clearly.

[Downtown]

I don't disagree with being educated or hundreds of mental health centers . . . I'm just saying a lay person needs to be careful about assigning diagnoses to people they are dating.

Redhead, thanks for your clarification. Of course, I agree with you that people should be careful when evaluating the intentions and motivations of the people they are dating. But, again, I disagree with your use of "assigning diagnoses" to refer to what Sweetgirl and I have been discussing on this thread -- i.e., spotting warning signs for BPD and narcissism.

 

All they need to know and understand is that that behavior is not acceptable to them and need to move on.

Your simple "unacceptable behavior" test may well be sufficient when dating mature and healthy partners. Yet, when dating a BPDer, narcissist, or sociopath, that simple test is woefully inadequate.

 

The reason is that a large share of the abused partners become so utterly confused they cannot see that it is their PARTNER'S behavior that is unacceptable. Instead, they blame themselves. They mistakenly think that, if they can only figure out what THEY are doing wrong, they can restore their relationship to the bliss and passion experienced at the very beginning.

 

With BPDers, this confusion arises because BPDers usually are convinced that the absurd allegations coming out of their mouths are absolutely true. Because this sincere conviction is so obvious, the abused partner concludes that he MUST have done something wrong or his loved one would not be so angry and hurt. In contrast, with the narcissists and sociopaths, the confusion arises not from sincere conviction but, rather, from deception and manipulation (i.e., "gaslighting").

 

The result is that, of the 157 mental disorders listed in the APA's diagnostic manual, BPD is the one most notorious for making the abused partners so confused that many feel like they may be losing their minds. To a lesser extent, narcissism and sociopathy have the same reputation for making abused partners feel like THEY are the source of all the fighting and hurt feelings.